Will we see tiers within DVC?

[bwvBound]

Sometime back we discussed a potential rumor of DVC moving towards multiple tiers of member privileges. It seems that DCL will now go to tiers ... will DVC follow?? Just looking for conversation ...

Link on DLC tiers:
http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/blog.php?b=508

 

[bwvBound]

Link to our Dec 2008 conversation regarding survey for DVC "elite" club:
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2024430

 

[SuzanneSLO]

Sometime back we discussed a potential rumor of DVC moving towards multiple tiers of member privileges. It seems that DCL will now go to tiers ... will DVC follow?? Just looking for conversation ...

Link on DLC tiers:
http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/blog.php?b=508

I don't see any direct conneciton between the addition of an elite level Frequent Cruiser Club and an elite level of DVC owners. I am sure there are many non-DVC owners (and probably a few DVC owners as well) who would be happy to have Disney introduce ANY kind of frequent stay perk, with or without an elite level, for cash stays at Disney hotels. Maybe with this economy, it will finally happen.

There may be a DVC elite level for all the reason previsously discussed but an acknowledgement that all return cruisers are not the same does not make me feel that this coming soon. -- Suzanne

 

[Dean]

From a sales standpoint it makes sense for DVC to institute Premier or VIP levels. However, given they haven't yet, I doubt they will. The threads on DIS alone would make it worth it though. Can you imagine discussions around such topics as preferred reservations status, cheaper fees (or more for the rest of us), late check out, preferred unit assignments, a special number to call, and get through easier, preferred wait list, etc. Qualifying factors would likely be the number of points owned AND resale vs retail purchase.

 

[wdrl]

Sometime back we discussed a potential rumor of DVC moving towards multiple tiers of member privileges. It seems that DCL will now go to tiers ... will DVC follow?? Just looking for conversation ...

Link on DLC tiers:
http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/blog.php?b=508

As Dean points out in his post, it would be problematic for DVC to institute a tiered membership program. However, I am not surprised that the Disney Cruise Line would go that way. Most of the big cruise lines have frequent passenger programs: Princess has its Captain's Circle, Holland America has its Mariner Society, Royal Caribbean has it Anchor & Crown (or is it Crown & Anchor??). We have Elite status with Princess, so we get lots of little perks like free internet access, free laundry service, a free bar setup in our cabin, etc. We are taking a 28-day cruise next Spring, and having that free laundry service will be a HUGE perk! Frankly, I'm surprised that DCL has waited this long to roll out a tiered rewards program. If all their competitors do it, then DCL has to keep pace. Does anyone know if Marriott, Wyndham, or any of the other timeshare companies offer a tiered rewards program for their membership?

 

[bwvBound]

Does anyone know if Marriott, Wyndham, or any of the other timeshare companies offer a tiered rewards program for their membership?

Wyndham: most certainly; Worlmark: tiers are a key element in the newer "TravelShare", with a weaker tier system in the underlying Club membership; Marriott: owners with multiple qualifying weeks receive advance booking advantages; Starwood: yes; Bluegreen: yes; Hilton Grand Vacation Club: yes; Club Intrawest: ??; Monarch Grand Vacation Club: ??

As Dean points out in his post, it would be problematic for DVC to institute a tiered membership program.

I didn't read his post as indicating problematic -- only as fodder for lively discussion on this board.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

I think it should be tiered to a point.. but not to the point of elitism.
I do think it appropriate that my wife and I get a better discount on an AP than somebody with eight people in the house who owns 25 points.
Booking advantages and wait list preferences??.. I'm not sure about those, as those are directly tied to the number of points owned. APs are not tied to the number of points owned, as you could own 25 points, stay off site, and use your pass for a hundred days.

MG

 

[YourEveryDayAdam]

If you look at the "benefits" that DCL is offering to elite members, they are all marketing and promotional benefits, or benefits of negligible or questionable value.

If you are using most of those benefits, you are spending money with DCL. "Priority booking", "Advanced shore excursion booking", "Advanced spa booking", "special offer when you book your next cruise on board", and a dedicated toll free number to book future cruises. All ways to get you to spend more money.

Everything else is a special designed KTTW card, access to a special website which probably just has more promotional materials about DCL. The only real useful benefit would be priority reservations at the fine dining and child care restaurants. However, I don't know if those cost extra on DCL or not, as I haven't cruised with DCL.

One way I like to think of it as is that DVC is a tier within Disney. A very high tier that does bring some real benefits along with it.

 

[queenie82]

I think it would be nice for some DVC consideration to those with more points...as in significantly more.
Say you own at 4 different resorts and have over 250 points. This should (to me) mean something more than those with 40 or something. Perhaps there could be the AP discount at a staggered level 10-30% off??? But beyond that a few extras...

I have no idea if they will and I'm not hanging it out for it but it would be nice.

 

[bwvBound]

I think it would be nice for some DVC consideration to those with more points...as in significantly more.
Say you own at 4 different resorts and have over 250 points. This should (to me) mean something more than those with 40 or something. Perhaps there could be the AP discount at a staggered level 10-30% off??? But beyond that a few extras...

I have no idea if they will and I'm not hanging it out for it but it would be nice.

Glad to read your 'pleased' perspective. Personally, I'm thinking that if DVC went with tiers the numbers considered "significantly more" would likely be over 1000 points not 250.

 

[Dean]

I think it should be tiered to a point.. but not to the point of elitism.

Now that we've established that having a tiered system is OK with you depending on specifis, realize that if DVC were do to this, they likely wouldn't draw the line the same place as you would, likely not even close.

I think it would be nice for some DVC consideration to those with more points...as in significantly more.
Say you own at 4 different resorts and have over 250 points.

I think you miss the true nature of a tiered system and the reality that 250 points would almost certainly be in the lowest tier. It MIGHT look something like this.

• 25-499 points, no real changes but the addition of small fees for multiple reservations, cancelations, banking, borrowing and transfers. Say $30 for each.
• 500-749 maybe $15 fees, a 1 week priority on booking.
• 750-999 maybe no fees, a 2 week priority on booking, 3 transfers per UY, the ability to pay fees and tickets with points, reduced CC/DC/DCL stays.
• 1000 and above, maybe $15 fees, a 3 week priority on booking, no fees, unlimited transfers, transfer banked/borrowed points, lower points costs to pay fees and tickets compared to the above group. Priortity line for checkin, special events, the possibility of using points for a castle stay. Further reduced CC/DC/DCL stays.
  
  The possibilities are endless but all of them would require some combo of adding perks to some members while removing or keeping them away from others. It is likely they would only count retail purchases going forward but they likely (though not absolutely) would grandfather those members in already if they converted the current system. Likely they would allow anyone to be in the in group with a new purchase of say 100 points or more retail. It would be difficult to do for existing resorts (not impossible) but they could easily set it up with a new resort and create two somewhat separate systems allowing people to "convert" with a retail purchase changing all of their legalities over in the process.
  
  I'm not saying they would do this, I'm doubting they would, only explaining the concept. It seems clear some think they would dabble at it without affecting some members negatively and that would not be the case if they did it. They purpose ultimately would not be to enhance members but to sell more retail points. As noted by the OP, there are many other systems that work this way in principle. 2.5 years ago most on this board would say "DVC would NEVER do that" but giving the events over the past couple of years you've got to be wondering if they really might. Again, I don't think they will but you never know.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Now that we've established that having a tiered system is OK with you depending on specifis, realize that if DVC were do to this, they likely wouldn't draw the line the same place as you would, likely not even close.

I'm pretty sure I'm covered..

MG

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Now that we've established that having a tiered system is OK with you depending on specifis, realize that if DVC were do to this, they likely wouldn't draw the line the same place as you would, likely not even close.

I think you miss the true nature of a tiered system and the reality that 250 points would almost certainly be in the lowest tier. It MIGHT look something like this.

• 25-499 points, no real changes but the addition of small fees for multiple reservations, cancelations, banking, borrowing and transfers. Say $30 for each.
• 500-749 maybe $15 fees, a 1 week priority on booking.
• 750-999 maybe no fees, a 2 week priority on booking, 3 transfers per UY, the ability to pay fees and tickets with points, reduced CC/DC/DCL stays.
• 1000 and above, maybe $15 fees, a 3 week priority on booking, no fees, unlimited transfers, transfer banked/borrowed points, lower points costs to pay fees and tickets compared to the above group. Priortity line for checkin, special events, the possibility of using points for a castle stay. Further reduced CC/DC/DCL stays.
  
  The possibilities are endless but all of them would require some combo of adding perks to some members while removing or keeping them away from others. It is likely they would only count retail purchases going forward but they likely (though not absolutely) would grandfather those members in already if they converted the current system. Likely they would allow anyone to be in the in group with a new purchase of say 100 points or more retail. It would be difficult to do for existing resorts (not impossible) but they could easily set it up with a new resort and create two somewhat separate systems allowing people to "convert" with a retail purchase changing all of their legalities over in the process.
  
  I'm not saying they would do this, I'm doubting they would, only explaining the concept. It seems clear some think they would dabble at it without affecting some members negatively and that would not be the case if they did it. They purpose ultimately would not be to enhance members but to sell more retail points. As noted by the OP, there are many other systems that work this way in principle. 2.5 years ago most on this board would say "DVC would NEVER do that" but giving the events over the past couple of years you've got to be wondering if they really might. Again, I don't think they will but you never know.

Actually, now that I read the rest of your post in detail, your point levels are almost exactly what I was thinking.

MG

 

[Dean]

I'm pretty sure I'm covered..

MG

I was pretty sure you would not be happy with a have and have not system, guess I was wrong.

IF DVC were to do this, they'd have to take the current owners as a reference looking at the % that own at each level, limiting them appropriately to relatively small groups. Of course they could use different levels, but if they did, they'd almost certainly be at these numbers or HIGHER. I know there are polls on DIS in the past that address the number of points owned that could give a glimps as to how this might really shape up. I would think that with 4 levels, they'd be looking at over 85% in the lowest group, 10% in the next highest then 3-5% then less than 1% or something like that.

 

[ead79]

I personally wouldn't mind if Disney offered some extra perks like in-room gifts for those who own many points. However, I would hate to see DVC give any advantages in terms of booking window, wait list advantage, room location advantage, etc.

As someone who owns only 160 points, I bought in with the understanding of what those points would get me. I bought where I wanted to own to take advantage of the 11-month booking window priority at my home resort. If Disney suddenly diluted the value of my points via a better booking window or room location advantage for those who own more points, I would be highly disappointed. As I like to travel during the busy DVC season of early December, a tiered system like that could really affect my ability to stay at even my home resort in the type of room I want.

 

[Dean]

I personally wouldn't mind if Disney offered some extra perks like in-room gifts for those who own many points. However, I would hate to see DVC give any advantages in terms of booking window, wait list advantage, room location advantage, etc.

As someone who owns only 160 points, I bought in with the understanding of what those points would get me. I bought where I wanted to own to take advantage of the 11-month booking window priority at my home resort. If Disney suddenly diluted the value of my points via a better booking window or room location advantage for those who own more points, I would be highly disappointed. As I like to travel during the busy DVC season of early December, a tiered system like that could really affect my ability to stay at even my home resort in the type of room I want.

What do you think you would do, sell (which doesn't really hurt DVC), make the most of it or add on more points?

 

[gkrykewy]

I think Dean's post painted a compelling (and chilling) picture. I hope nothing like that ever moves forward.

It's more difficult for new members to accumulate large numbers of points via retail sale, since the price is now ~$100pp (soon to be $120) rather than 50/60. I would imagine that an enormously disproportionate share of the 500/700/1000pt+ club are members who bought early at OKW... and so the "Club 91" name suggestion begins to make sense.

 

[toniosmom]

I personally wouldn't mind if Disney offered some extra perks like in-room gifts for those who own many points. However, I would hate to see DVC give any advantages in terms of booking window, wait list advantage, room location advantage, etc.

As someone who owns only 160 points, I bought in with the understanding of what those points would get me. I bought where I wanted to own to take advantage of the 11-month booking window priority at my home resort. If Disney suddenly diluted the value of my points via a better booking window or room location advantage for those who own more points, I would be highly disappointed. As I like to travel during the busy DVC season of early December, a tiered system like that could really affect my ability to stay at even my home resort in the type of room I want.

I completely agree. My financial position dictates that I will not likely ever own a significant amount of points as described. I consider myself fortunate to have the points that I do have. I also am at the age (under 50) where I have a limited amount of vacation time, so owning a huge amount of points, say 1000, would be wasted on me.....not to mention the fact that I couldn't afford all of the MFs. I'd be really annoyed if I lost any kind of privilege that I currently have if DVC should move toward a tiered system. I would hope if that should come to pass, that it would only improve the benefits of those with a very large number of points without hindering the benefits of us at the low end.

 

[Brian Noble]

I was pretty sure you would not be happy with a have and have not system, guess I was wrong.

Most people view these programs based primarily on whether they will be a have or a have not. This is dangerous, because in some systems, the goal posts keep moving. Wyndham is notorious for this.

But, it works for them. I still see people who actually understand the product and the market wanting to buy more points for relatively worthless perks.

 

[tjkraz]

Between the survey a few months back and this new DCL perk tier, it has me thinking that it's more a question of "when" than "if" DVC adopts a similar system.

Personally I don't think I'd mind a two-tier system where only those with, say, 1000+ received added benefits. That's a pretty small population and even booking perks wouldn't have much impact on other members.

Having multiple tiers as Dean illustrated would probably have a greater positive impact on sales. Many people would be within a stone's throw of a higher tier and thus could be swayed to add-on for that reason alone. But I can only imagine the impact on bookings if you have 20% or more members with a booking advantage above-and-beyond the current Home resort system. Some of the really small categories like AKV Concierge and Grand Villas at OKW or BWV would be immediately impacted.

I guess the devil is in the details so it's hard to debate until something is actually announced. Added booking perks would have a far greater impact on members than something benign like a dedicated check-in window or in-room gifts.

If DVC's motivation is to increase sales, it seems to me that DVC could get the most mileage by simply exempting those who purchase resale. There may have to be some grandfathering of current members. But beyond that everyone would be forewarned that a resale purchase would exclude them from receiving certain perks.

I also think that other seemingly easy moves like disallowing renters and friends from taking advantage of member perks could have a positive impact on sales. I'm sure there are serial renters who get great deals by renting points over and over again. But when you start chipping away at perks (no free Internet, no free valet, no access to BLT lounge, can't buy DDP, no dining discounts), some may eventually reach that tipping point and decide to purchase.