Stores With "No Public Bathroom"

[Gracie09]

No, its making an exception one time. The rules still apply the next time the person is in the store or whatever. The rule applies to that person but the circumstances warranted an exception.

Exception - defined

noun
1.
the act of excepting or the fact of being excepted.
2.
something excepted; an instance or case not conforming to the general rule.
3. an adverse criticism, especially on a particular point; opposition of opinion; objection; demurral:

What you are not seeing is that its a slippery slope. You make an exception for a small child, what about the elderly or a pregnant woman? (both groups that often have immediate unanticipated bathroom needs)

 

[TAX GUY]

Based on most of the replies in this thread and the rules, I would think this is coming next:

 

[pryncess527]

Apparently there are laws pertaining to this in several states. Forgive me if this was previously mentioned, I did not read every page, and only saw one prior legal reference, to Florida building code.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restroom_Access_Act
The Restroom Access Act, also known as Ally's Law, is legislation passed by several U.S. states that requires retail establishments that have public toilet facilities for their employees to also allow customers to use the facilities only if the customer suffers from an inflammatory bowel disease or other medical condition requiring immediate access to a toilet.

As of April 2013, at least 14 U.S. states had passed versions of the law. They include Colorado, Connecticut, Illinois, Kentucky, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Ohio, Oregon, Tennessee, Texas, Wisconsin, and Washington.[2][3] A Virginia bill, which would have levied fines of $100 for non-compliance,[4] was shelved due to concerns about exposing businesses to lawsuits, as well as concerns about security and intellectual property.[5]

In general, each state requires that the customer present a document signed by a medical professional attesting that the customer uses an ostomy device or suffers from Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, or other inflammatory bowel disease or medical condition requiring access to a toilet facility without delay. In at least two states, Oregon and Tennessee, the customer can present an identification card issued by a national organization advocating for the eligible medical condition.[7][8]

Some states also include pregnancy as a covered medical condition.[2]

 

[Gracie09]

Apparently there are laws pertaining to this in several states. Forgive me if this was previously mentioned, I did not read every page, and only saw one prior legal reference, to Florida building code.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restroom_Access_Act
The Restroom Access Act, also known as Ally's Law, is legislation passed by several U.S. states that requires retail establishments that have public toilet facilities for their employees to also allow customers to use the facilities only if the customer suffers from an inflammatory bowel disease or other medical condition requiring immediate access to a toilet.

As of April 2013, at least 14 U.S. states had passed versions of the law. They include Colorado, Connecticut, Illinois, Kentucky, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Ohio, Oregon, Tennessee, Texas, Wisconsin, and Washington.[2][3] A Virginia bill, which would have levied fines of $100 for non-compliance,[4] was shelved due to concerns about exposing businesses to lawsuits, as well as concerns about security and intellectual property.[5]

In general, each state requires that the customer present a document signed by a medical professional attesting that the customer uses an ostomy device or suffers from Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, or other inflammatory bowel disease or medical condition requiring access to a toilet facility without delay. In at least two states, Oregon and Tennessee, the customer can present an identification card issued by a national organization advocating for the eligible medical condition.[7][8]

Some states also include pregnancy as a covered medical condition.[2]

The sample law has a lot of exceptions, many of which are situations that were discussed in this thread.

The Restroom Access Act of Illinois states:

Sec. 10. Retail establishment; customer access to restroom facilities. A retail establishment that has a toilet facility for its employees shall allow a customer to use that facility during normal business hours if the toilet facility is reasonably safe and all of the following conditions are met:
(1) The customer requesting the use of the employee toilet facility suffers from an eligible medical condition or utilizes an ostomy device.
(2) Three or more employees of the retail establishment are working at the time the customer requests use of the employee toilet facility.
(3) The retail establishment does not normally make a restroom available to the public.
(4) The employee toilet facility is not located in an area where providing access would create an obvious health or safety risk to the customer or an obvious security risk to the retail establishment.
(5) A public restroom is not immediately accessible to the customer.[9]

 

[BadPinkTink]

Apparently there are laws pertaining to this in several states. Forgive me if this was previously mentioned, I did not read every page, and only saw one prior legal reference, to Florida building code.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restroom_Access_Act
The Restroom Access Act, also known as Ally's Law, is legislation passed by several U.S. states that requires retail establishments that have public toilet facilities for their employees to also allow customers to use the facilities only if the customer suffers from an inflammatory bowel disease or other medical condition requiring immediate access to a toilet.

As of April 2013, at least 14 U.S. states had passed versions of the law. They include Colorado, Connecticut, Illinois, Kentucky, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Ohio, Oregon, Tennessee, Texas, Wisconsin, and Washington.[2][3] A Virginia bill, which would have levied fines of $100 for non-compliance,[4] was shelved due to concerns about exposing businesses to lawsuits, as well as concerns about security and intellectual property.[5]

In general, each state requires that the customer present a document signed by a medical professional attesting that the customer uses an ostomy device or suffers from Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, or other inflammatory bowel disease or medical condition requiring access to a toilet facility without delay. In at least two states, Oregon and Tennessee, the customer can present an identification card issued by a national organization advocating for the eligible medical condition.[7][8]

Some states also include pregnancy as a covered medical condition.[2]

and there you have it folks.... the LAW states that in order to allow customers to use the employee restroom , the customer must present official documentation of a medical condition. So there fore if you don't have the documentation, then you are not allowed to use the employee restroom.

 

[luvsJack]

But the next time would be an emergency too. And the time after that.
And then the next person has an emergency. And the time after that.
And then the next person gets mad because they aren't allowed in---and when told "oh, they had an emergency" will either claim to have an emergency themselves or have a meltdown. They might even claim discrimination---people do that all the darn time.

LOL really? You think there are that many people running in and out of little stores that don't have bathrooms?

Had three kids. I think I have had to ask once. Its not happening that much. Again, we were talking about a rural store, they are getting that many requests.

And you use judgement. Its not that hard to tell when someone is in distress.

 

[kamik86]

I never, not one time, said the rules do not apply to me. I never said my child was special. I never said anyone should bully anyone. I said if I am trying to get my child out of a store that refuses to let him/her use the restroom and he/she has an accident on our way out the door, I will give the cleaning supplies back to them. Actually in reality we would be heading out the door so no throwing or handing either way would be possible.

I do not bully, I rarely even complain. I do not expect anyone to do anything, but if the need was to arise would be rather annoyed if they refused in certain situations. If there is a mall or gas station or another store or whatever, that is completely different.

Using a bathroom in a time of urgency is hardly the same thing as dining plans and hot dogs and waiting rooms.


So, are you also the same in every situation. The rule for your employer is that you cannot leave the register at all. Period. A person falls outside and is bleeding, what do you do? Seems like a lot of folks here would let them lay there and bleed.

Well since I'm not at all medically trained and wouldn't know what to do with a serious injury (and I'm assuming it is serious because otherwise doing nothing while they get up with scrapped knees is pretty reasonable) I would probably call 911 so someone that is trained to help could do so.

 

[wvjules]

No. The exception can be made if the circumstances deem necessary, not because the rules don't apply to THAT person.

No, its making an exception one time. The rules still apply the next time the person is in the store or whatever. The rule applies to that person but the circumstances warranted an exception.

I'm not following your circular logic....

 

[verleniahall]

For those of you think rules can be broken in special circumstances, I'm curious why you think it's okay to argue, berate, bully, and/or make a scene when you're told "No, I'm sorry."

Are you that way w/ everything?

"I know there are rules, but the rules don't apply to me & my special situation."

Seriously?

There are some of you who are calling those of us who have said we are fine w/ some places not having public restrooms dispassionate or unfeeling/uncaring since we assumedly sided w/ the employee in the OP.

You know what? If I overhear someone arguing w/ an employee & trying to bully the person into letting them do or get whatever they feel entitled to, I'm not standing there thinking, "Wow, that's such a kind, considerate, compassionate person."

And I know that MIGrandma didn't say that her DIL argued or anything w/ the employee, but some of you have said if your child or whoever was refused a restroom, you'd argue w/ the employee. Some of have even given instances of where they bullied/threatened the employee in order to get their way. One person said she'd throw cleaning supplies at the employee if she were asked to clean up a mess that she (or her child) made.

Would it be nice if every single place offered a public restroom? Sure.

There are a lot of thing that would be nice.

It'd be nice if our pediatrician's office offered "well patient rooms" in addition of "well waiting rooms." It'd be nice if there were the same number of hot dogs in a package as there were buns. It'd be nice if Disney would increase the child-age on the dining plan from 9 to 12. It'd be nice if our county offered curbside recycling - maybe we're too rural. LOL!

Would it be nice if every single situation you encounter always worked out to your advantage? Sure.

But that's not life.

And sometimes you just have to make do w/ situations as they are.

Asking an employee to break the rules for you & risk possibly losing his/her job is not very nice or compassionate.

AMEN!

 

[luvsJack]

Well since I'm not at all medically trained and wouldn't know what to do with a serious injury (and I'm assuming it is serious because otherwise doing nothing while they get up with scrapped knees is pretty reasonable) I would probably call 911 so someone that is trained to help could do so.

And just leave the lying there while they wait?

 

[Kbee]

LOL really? You think there are that many people running in and out of little stores that don't have bathrooms?

Had three kids. I think I have had to ask once. Its not happening that much. Again, we were talking about a rural store, they are getting that many requests.

And you use judgement. Its not that hard to tell when someone is in distress.

Using judgment goes both ways. If you live in an area where its so rural there is only one store for 30 miles and it doesn't have a bathroom, go before you leave the house, don't drink any caffeine, don't keep your kid out too long knowing they haven't used the bathroom in awhile. I could go on and on with examples of one using their judgment.

As far as the employee using theirs, well telling a customer "no, we don't have public restrooms" is using judgment. I would assume they don't want to risk losing their job. Seems like they are using very good judgment in that situation.

 

[luvsJack]

I'm not following your circular logic....

If I walk in the store today and they make an exception because I suddenly go sick, that doesn't mean I should expect that same exception tomorrow. The rule still applies to me, they simply made an exception because of my circumstances.

 

[luvsJack]

Using judgment goes both ways. If you live in an area where its so rural there is only one store for 30 miles and it doesn't have a bathroom, go before you leave the house, don't drink any caffeine, don't keep your kid out too long knowing they haven't used the bathroom in awhile. I could go on and on with examples of one using their judgment.

As far as the employee using theirs, well telling a customer "no, we don't have public restrooms" is using judgment. I would assume they don't want to risk losing their job. Seems like they are using very good judgment in that situation.

Yes, yes, I know. There must be an awful lot of people on unemployment because they made the horrible mistake of letting a 5 year old use the bathroom.

You do realize that you can do all the things you mentioned and still have an issue with your kid? Do you have kids?

 

[sam_gordon]

If I walk in the store today and they make an exception because I suddenly go sick, that doesn't mean I should expect that same exception tomorrow. The rule still applies to me, they simply made an exception because of my circumstances.

So they make an exception for anyone who is sick. That means the rule doesn't apply to you if you're sick.

 

[Kbee]

If I walk in the store today and they make an exception because I suddenly go sick, that doesn't mean I should expect that same exception tomorrow. The rule still applies to me, they simply made an exception because of my circumstances.

And what if you are sick the next time you go in?
Doesn't matter, the very act of making an exception, even one time, does in fact mean the rule doesn't apply to you. If it did there would have been zero exceptions made for you. I'm not sure whether to roll my eyes or feel sorry for the fact that you don't understand that.

 

[Kbee]

Yes, yes, I know. There must be an awful lot of people on unemployment because they made the horrible mistake of letting a 5 year old use the bathroom.

You do realize that you can do all the things you mentioned and still have an issue with your kid? Do you have kids?

Yes, I have 3 and we've managed to get through their childhoods without expecting people to make exceptions for them.

 

[luvsJack]

So they make an exception for anyone who is sick. That means the rule doesn't apply to you if you're sick.

Oh, dear Lord.

You know darn good and well what I mean, Sam.

Let me put it in terms for MY employment. The rule is that a student should not miss more than 6 days from a class that meets 3 days a week. On the 7th absence the policy is that the student should be cut out of the class, there is no allowance for illness or other emergency situations. So, lets say little Suzy misses 6 days due to having pneumonia and then has the flu. She calls the instructor and tells him/her that she has the flu. The instructor makes an EXCEPTION in her case and allows her to stay in the class. Next semester, the same instructor has Jane and she also is out 6 days due to illness and then gets sick again. The instructor can choose NOT to make an exception in her case. Or if the same instructor has Suzy again, and again she misses over 6 days because she is sick, he/she can still choose not to make an exception to the policy.

The policy still applies to all students, the instructor can make an exception on a case by case basis.

 

[wvjules]

So one professor doesn't follow the rules and one does. Either it is a rule or it is not.

 

[scrapquitler]

My daughter-in-law is a postal worker, delivering mail in the rural area. There is a party/convenience type store on one of her regular routes where she delivers their mail. She gets out of her car and takes it in and gives it to the person manning the cash register. Occasionally she'll make a purchase (bottle of water, something for her lunch, etc.) there. Recently she had delivered their mail, picked up a couple things to purchase and put them down on the counter and then asked if she could please use the restroom while she was there. The clerk said no, "no public bathroom." Really? She delivers your mail and you refuse her the use of your restroom? She walked out without making her purchase and hasn't purchased anything there since.

The other day I was at the vet's office with my cat. Noticed a new sign on the door "no public bathroom." There was a woman waiting, with her dog, and two small children (maybe 2-3 years old). What if one of the children needed to use the restroom? Small children like that can't "hold it" for very long. Would the staff tell her no?

So, my question is, do you think small stores, places of business, etc. should be able to tell paying customers that they can't use their restroom? I think a paying customer should be allowed to use it.

All restaurants have public restrooms, large department stores have them, stores in malls have them, even the library and grocery stores have them. What makes smaller stores so different that they feel they can refuse their bathroom to their paying customers?

I worked at a convenience store that had no public restroom. The reason we had no public restroom was that the only way to get to the restroom was thru the storage room...and that wasn't a safe or secure place for non-employees to be (there was equipment and merchandise in the areas they would have to walk thru to get there). I think that restaurants might be REQUIRED to have a public restroom, but that's because they serve food (at least in my case that is what i have always been told) but there's not any requirement for other businesses.

 

[luvsJack]

And what if you are sick the next time you go in?
Doesn't matter, the very act of making an exception, even one time, does in fact mean the rule doesn't apply to you. If it did there would have been zero exceptions made for you. I'm not sure whether to roll my eyes or feel sorry for the fact that you don't understand that.

Yes, because we all make it a habit to go in the same store every time we get sick. Really?

Again, case by case basis of exception. It can be done, its done everyday in the real world. Everything is not as cut and dried as you want it to be.

And, btw, I never said I EXPECT anyone to do anything.