Disappointing Changes at BWV/Boardwalk area

[Chloe'sMom]

You know I bet offsite restaurants are salivating at the opportunity to regain some of the trade they lost to Disney. I have a feeling I'll be very disappointed the next time I go. After all the opportunity to eat food not available to you at home is one of the draws at Disney.

And now that I think about it, it wont just be the offsite restaurants that benefit...the Swolphin will probably get a bit of a bump up too.

As far as the pool bars go...I agree its highly disappointing. Those pools that are near counter service options like VWL and AKL wont have any complaints. This reminds me of the shift away from unique products to plush shops a few years back. I've pretty much quit buying souveniers because they are all the same. The last major souvenier I bought for myself was a Minnie Christmas dress back in the late 90's.

I agree. The best part about planning a disney vacation is thinking about where we wanted to eat. We never ate poolside so therefore these changes don't effect me to much. But I am very disappointed at other changes to menus around WDW. For instance Ohana's not offering the Shrimp and changing the appetizers to less, Olivia's becoming more standard fare, and several other cut backs. We may be looking at dining off property more often, or getting more groceries and eating what we like in the room.

~Amanda

 

[eliza61]

My opinion is that crisi is probably right and those who see DDP as the root cause of all evil are probably not right. I think the issue is bean counters trying to reduce inventory and cut costs -- not the Evil Empire sticking it to DVC owners.

Don't get me wrong. I think the menu standardization and cost cutting have degraded the dining experiences available at WDW, and have actually made dining offsite much more attractive than it was before.

The standardization may be helpful to folks who just want FOOD, but if you want to eat well, WDW is becoming much less attractive. It's almost like you only have to eat one dinner onsite, and everything after that is just repetition.

There are some very good restaurants offsite in the Orlando area, and some legendary restaurants an hour or so away in Tampa.

I'm more inclined to believe this. Remember folks, most of us here on the DVC forums are probably Disney-pod-people. We've been many, many times and we remember "the good old days" when dining at disney was a lot more fun and adventurous. We had our favorite restaurants and our favorite dishes and now we see them being reduced to chicken nuggets on every menu, so it's easy to blame the DDP plan. I too believe it's more of the bean counters who in trying to cut cost, have made dining on site really sad. My family always have a car available now just so we can eat off site. After every trip I make it a point to send a letter to Disney just to say how disappointed I am with the lack of dining diversity and I keep hoping it will change back.

 

[dumbo71]

Last time I checked the BWI was a Deluxe resort and they share the feature pool with BWV so Leaping Horse belongs to both of them. Those 'resort cash guests' are experiencing the same cut back as DVC owners, not saying it's right just that in this case the Deluxe resort isn't getting any better treatment than the DVC portion.

You got me there Keys.

Only example where it works, however.

 

[jakenjess]

And don't forget, no food take out at Beaches n' Cream either - only ice cream. DH and I actually sent an inquirying (angry ) email and got a phone call back. The gentleman's response was the usual - "upper management decision", "will look into it", etc. but point is, they did call. Isn't it is amazing that a huge company like Disney would call to talk to a couple from a small town in Pennsylvania about not being able to get a burger and fries to-go? This is one little soda shop, at one resort hotel, in one area of the US in the whole big realm of their worldwide holdings. Thats pretty cool and it tells me someone HAS to be listening. So I think we should all send letters, emails, and/or call and let them know, "We're made as h--- and we're not going to take it anymore." Seriously, we should make ourselves heard. I understand the outcry was so great about the children's menu changes that they are "rethinking" that so it must work.

I agree that everyone should voice their concerns to Disney. I did that about the new children's menu and did receive a call. The woman was very nice and seemed genuinely interested in my opinions. While I had her on the phone, I told her my other concerns about the homogenizing of the menus in general and also I've heard that some of the specialty drinks aren't being offered anymore, it's more of a general menu of drinks at the bars. Hopefully we'll see some action taken.

 

[ADP]

The rumored closing/move of ESPN Club is scheduled for sometime in 2008. It will move in the current space occupied by Disneyquest (again just rumor).

I don't know if anyone has noticed Disney's stock of late, but it seems to be headed north. I'm not trying to cause a stir about stock vs. Disney service and quality, but it is quite a coincidence.

 

[SimbaNoodle]

I'm not saying that we should play the martyr. I was just commenting on the fact that most DVC Members vacation differenty and more frequently than other vacationers and that small changes like poolside eating and restaurant quality can effect us more.

 

[dumbo71]

I've spent two years listening to people raving about how many hundreds of dollars their family saved with the DDP (comments which were nearly impossible to come by before 1/1/05.) Trying to convince me that any cost cutting moves regarding food and beverage are not related to the DDP is falling on deaf ears here.

And I think BOTH are true. I agree that crisi did a fine job of explaining the logic behind the cuts. But I also believe the cuts were NECESSITATED by the profits lost via the dining plan.

We're talking about people who report eating $70-80 worth of food in a day for which they are only paying $37.99!!!

In all fairness to tjkraz, these are only snips of his post that I felt were relevant to my point.

I totally agree with everything tjkraz has posted in this thread but especially these statements.

Crisi is right that they are cost cuting moves. Those moves were necessitated by the dining plan IMO. As tjkraz noted $70 -$80 worth of food for $37.99? Something had to give and in this case everyone pays with generic menus and a less than magical dining experience.

If DVC keeps forcing people off site to get a decent meal how long before people finally decide that being on site isn't that important? It may take a while but I really think we'll see a decline of WDW bookings if this continues. That in the end may result in some changes.

I owned and operated three successful restaurants. In the early days I decided to become a part of the Entertainment book. Most have it in their area, but for those that don't, you basically get a free meal when another of equal or greater value is purchased.

The idea behind it is to get people into your restaurant. The hope being that they will become regular customers. Now if I could afford to give away a free meal then my prices were either way to high or my portion sizes too small. Neither were true so I had to make a decision. Either raise prices to cover for the money I was losing or reduce portions. I chose to do neither.
Things were tough for a while because many in that area simply went to the Entertainment places. Many restaurnats stopped punching the cards as well to allow repeat visitors. That Entertainment book so many love kills the small guys. Either thaey have to bend and become part of it or they lose business. Either way they lose.

I see paralles with the dining at WDW since the dining plan. WDW chose to streamline menus and costs to cover the money they were losing.

Time will tell but I believe it is a mistake to limit guest choice.

Also I am very surprised Jimmia is disputing this stuff. I usually agree with all of his posts. Maybe he did it to help out Crisi because he sure is off here in this thread.

 

[lilstint]

Lilstint, CUTE KID!

Thanks......it took a crane to get him out of that thing!

 

[spiceycat]

so sorry your vacation was not what you wanted.

I have food allergies - BIG TIME. So I really hate to eat out - I will, but I or the chef needs to read every ingredents in the food. this take time - lots of time.

I therefore eat alot at my villa. one reason I brought DVC - they do have a kitchen or kitchennett.

so you do have an alternative. Think of the poor WDW resort guest who don't. also since most of them are now using DME no easy or cheap way to get offsite. Now they are stuck with what Disney has.

you because you have a kitchen and can order grocery through gardengrocer or wegoshop - even if you use DME - have alternatives.

 

[tjkraz]

I don't know if anyone has noticed Disney's stock of late, but it seems to be headed north. I'm not trying to cause a stir about stock vs. Disney service and quality, but it is quite a coincidence.

Stock prices respond more to earnings than anything else. Cut costs (or raise prices)...earnings go up...investors happy.

The problem is that if the reduced services / higher prices begin to alienate your customers, revenues will inevitably decrease due to dissatisfaction with the product.

It's a delicate balance.

 

[Synonymous]

And, for those of you who don't already know, Dumbo is grumpy with DVC because he got a nasty-gram from Disney legal...so you have to take his disgruntled comments with a grain of salt.

I don't know anything about Dumbo, but anyone who hasn't noticed a decline in Disney food quality and service over recent years just hasn't been paying attention. It's an inevitable corporate practice- build a good reputation, then milk that for all the revenue it's worth until it's destroyed. Then blame the prior management team.

 

[snowbunny]

Crisi is correct that corporations have to show increased revenue and/or profits year to year, it's not enough to do the same as you did the year before (at least it never was in my corporation from which I burned out eventually.)

However I think the $ losses associated with the dining plan must be more than made up for by getting "butts in beds" at rack rate.

As noted, codes are a thing of the past. How much more profitable for Disney to fill many rooms at rack, standardize menus for maximum volume purchasing power and efficiency, and stop floating a large variety of codes and promotions throughout the year. The DDP is the promotion.

I'm on the same page as Synonymous, right now it's about milking profits in the short term. As a long-term strategy it's foolish, but most corporate executives figure that will be someone else's problem and they're trying to make their next quarter.

 

[tjkraz]

However I think the $ losses associated with the dining plan must be more than made up for by getting "butts in beds" at rack rate.

That may well be true when viewed as a whole, but the reality of Corporate America is that every division is expected to pull its own weight. The heads of the dining division will be held accountable for their own profitability with little regard for what hand they were dealt.

Someone like Al Weiss isn't going to sit idly by and accept the DDP as a blanket excuse for lower profitability. Instead he is going to ask the next logical question: What steps have you taken to reduce operating expenses?

 

[salmoneous]

This reminds me of the shift away from unique products to plush shops a few years back. I've pretty much quit buying souveniers because they are all the same.

I'm pretty sure the standardization and homogenization in the gift shops is also the fault of the DDP.

 

[crisi]

That may well be true when viewed as a whole, but the reality of Corporate America is that every division is expected to pull its own weight. The heads of the dining division will be held accountable for their own profitability with little regard for what hand they were dealt.

Someone like Al Weiss isn't going to sit idly by and accept the DDP as a blanket excuse for lower profitability. Instead he is going to ask the next logical question: What steps have you taken to reduce operating expenses?

I don't think Dining is its own reportable division. Resorts is. Theme Parks are. But I think Dining wraps up through its location (either resorts or theme parks). I could be mistaken.

 

[crisi]

I'm pretty sure the standardization and homogenization in the gift shops is also the fault of the DDP.

My mother in law invited herself over for dinner tonight - I KNOW that's the fault of the DDP. And I'm out of toilet paper at home - DDP? You be the judge.

 

[lilstint]

Did you just return from Disney? If so, DDP probably is responsible for both.

 

[crisi]

Did you just return from Disney? If so, DDP probably is responsible for both.

16 months ago.....close enough!

 

[tjkraz]

My mother in law invited herself over for dinner tonight - I KNOW that's the fault of the DDP. And I'm out of toilet paper at home - DDP? You be the judge.

Cute, but I don't see the relevance.

The primary discussion here appears to be two more cut-backs in dining-related services at WDW and the possible link to a program which clearly drains resources in that same department. I fail to see where posters are blaming all of WDW's ills on the DDP.

 

[saschab]

I would think if a TS restaurant made it clear that if you had take-out, it would still count as a TS credit, there should be no problem.

I do realize that the kitchen having to make more meals than there are seats can be a added unwanted burden for them.

That being said, I think my husband broke the take-out option!

He and DS went to ESPN the first week in November with the intention of ordering a few take-out orders of wings.

The dozen wings are now 7-8 wings per order.

DH asked about carry-out at the hostess stand. The hostess referred him to the bar, the bar staff sent him back to the stand, only to be sent back to the bar again. Finally the manager was called, he explained to DH that they were making changes in their take-out process, and apologized for his employees' confusion. He proceeded to take their order, sit them down in front of the large screen TV, and comp them drinks for their inconvenience. He said he would personally get DH's order.

After waiting for an hour, with no wings in sight, DH found a very embarrassed manager. I'm guessing he forgot. So DH waited 15 more minutes, and the manager ended up comping 5 orders of wings.


So....see, it's not the DDP to blame...it's my husband~
Actually, crisi, he is the one responsible for the missing toilet paper in MY house!