2025 Condo Meeting Information - Renting

[JulieBeeRN]

It's frustrating to already see confirmed reservations for December.

 

[Carouselofplanning]

It's frustrating to already see confirmed reservations for December.

Agreed. This is the nonsense that should be nipped in the bud immediately. Talk about making a reservation for the sole purpose of scalping it. I don’t care whether you have 100 or 1000 points. This is commercial.

 

[Brian Noble]

I am increasingly convinced that we need some adjustments to points charts,

I've thought this for as long as "Fall Frenzy" has been a term here on the DIS. In fairness, I think there have been some changes to increase e.g. October and reduce summer during that time, but it seems like there is room for more.

On the other hand, I don't mind visiting in a season that is less popular, but that's because I have the points to do so.

 

[Sandisw]

Agreed. This is the nonsense that should be nipped in the bud immediately. Talk about making a reservation for the sole purpose of scalping it. I don’t care whether you have 100 or 1000 points. This is commercial.

Except in the context of DVC and what is prohibited, it is not.

Now, some want DVC to find a way to prevent this under the commercial purpose clause but DVc needs to ensure it meets the standards in the law. And maybe someday things will change.

But, as of today, the commercial use policy in place does not include this action, in and of itself, to be a violation.

Until it does, frustrating as it is, owners are free to rent a confirmed reservation, even if they are hard to get and popular.

Of course, owners who rent a lot are at risk of being flagged and it’s even possiblle that part of DVCs monitoring of accounts has them flagging accounts with a lot of overlapping reservation at the same time, especially during these high demand times.

 

[airjay75]

On the other hand, I don't mind visiting in a season that is less popular, but that's because I have the points to do so.

That thought also crossed my mind. One one hand, I wouldn't mind Easter week costing a few less points since that is our spring break week and I imagine we will travel then much more than we ever will during Christmas, but I also appreciate not having think too much about participating in the December madness and having lots of flexibility for that week.

 

[airjay75]

Except in the context of DVC and what is prohibited, it is not.

Now, some want DVC to find a way to prevent this under the commercial purpose clause but they also need to ensure it meets the standards in the law.

But, as of today, the commercial use policy in place does not include this action, in and of itself, to be a violation.

Until it does, frustrating as it is, owners are free to rent a confirmed reservation, even if they are hard to get and popular.

Of course, owners who rent a lot are at risk of being flagged and it’s even possiblle that part of DVCs monitoring of accounts has them flagging accounts with a lot of overlapping reserveatipns R the same time, especially during these high demand times..

I think that is all the more reason that, if you are dissatisfied with December availability, adjusting points charts is the best answer. Any other solution (other than just enforcement behind the scenes of those clearly in violation of commercial renting policies) will have unintended consequences that could make average ownership more difficult.

It seems to me that points chart adjustments to be more in line with rack rates (including regularly offered discounts) would actually have the effect of decreasing (although perhaps not eliminating entirely) the incentives for renting spec reservations.

 

[VGCgroupie]

I am increasingly convinced that we need some adjustments to points charts, especially if Disney is going to keep providing such big spring and summer discounts. Rack rate spring discounts are currently up to 25% and summer discounts are currently up to 40%. Just ran some numbers on rack rates vs. points for some rooms at RIV.

Riviera, Deluxe Studio, 12/5-12/12
Resort View: $7,463.25
Points: 123 or $60.67/point
Preferred View: $8,419.53
Points: 152 $55.39/point

Riviera Deluxe Studio 6/20-6/27
Preferred View: $4,502.96 (30% discount - could get up to 40% if AP)
Points: 157 or $28.68/point
Note: Resort view was unavailable

Rivera Tower Studio, 3/28-4/4
$6,030 (no discounts although 25% discounts are generally available for spring)
Points: 167 or $36/point
Note: No Deluxe Studios currently available for cash bookings so couldn't compare, but figured a tower studio would be the closest comparable - according to the dvcrofr.com calculator, the rack rate on a Deluxe Studio, Resort View would be $8,049, and points would be 202 or $39.85/point

So, let's say you are either (a) someone looking to get the most value of out your DVC membership and have the flexibility to go in early December or (b) someone looking to rent out some points, whether commercially or for other reasons, and you want to get the most $/point for renting out, which of the above are you going to pick?

Another interesting tidbit I'll put out there. Go check out availability for Easter Week. We're about 2.5 months out, so you'd figure there wouldn't be much left and, surely, getting a full week at this point would be difficult, right? You would be very wrong. Easter week takes the same amount of points as Christmas-New Years. Think you can get a full week in any resort for any week in December 2.5 months out? My guess is that would be very, very difficult.

Perhaps including that a point chart adjustment is needed should also be emailed.

DVC wont know how members feel or are impacted unless we speak up.

 

[airjay75]

Perhaps including that a point chart adjustment is needed should also be emailed.

DVC wont know how members feel or are impacted unless we speak up.

Agreed. I think e-mailing them and proposing a solution that is potentially workable is probably a lot more helpful than just telling them you're dissatisfied.

That said, I suppose that is where the rubber meets the road. Does the membership want a steeper points chart for December in exchange for better points charts in spring and summer? Or, would there be a lot of blowback from members on that? And, perhaps that is why, in part, we haven't seen that yet.

 

[VGCgroupie]

Agreed. I think e-mailing them and proposing a solution that is potentially workable is probably a lot more helpful than just telling them you're dissatisfied.

That said, I suppose that is where the rubber meets the road. Does the membership want a steeper points chart for December in exchange for better points charts in spring and summer? Or, would there be a lot of blowback from members on that? And, perhaps that is why, in part, we haven't seen that yet.

I do not wish to ever be there in the Summer again, but whatever is best for the overall membership is what should happen. I always thought the point chart followed cash rates. I have never really compared it was just something I assumed.

 

[ShaneDJ]

I do not wish to ever be there in the Summer again.

Agreed!

 

[airjay75]

I do not wish to ever be there in the Summer again, but whatever is best for the overall membership is what should happen. I always thought the point chart followed cash rates. I have never really compared it was just something I assumed.

I hear you on Summer (even though I'm going this June) . It seems like the points chart follows . . . until they start throwing on the seasonal discounts. And, for whatever reason, they seem to have made that a pretty regular part of summer discounts. I mean, I get it - summer in FL is brutal, but kids are off of school, so what better way to move people to come than giving them actual discounts and also being able to advertise it as an actual discount. But, seems to me points charts don't have to follow the full rack rates and should be able to encompass regular discounts. I just think it would go a long ways to solving these problems.

I was even thinking about brokers and the fact that they have their regular, custom booking rate they offer and then separate reimbursement rates for confirmed reservations. I can sort of understand why their custom booking rates have to be a bit behind confirmed reservation reimbursement rates. One, probably almost impossible to fulfill a custom booking request for times like December. And, two, they have to set a reimbursement rate that makes sense for all time periods. They can't say, well, for a June reservation, we can only pay $15/point, but for December, we can pay you $25/point (well, I suppose they could make their system much more dynamic like that, but then they'd have a harder time getting owners to take the low $ rental requests). So, instead, they pick numbers that will work across the board for all seasons. If you balance things out better, they may not have an incentive to make their custom bookings reimbursement rates lower than their confirmed reservation reimbursement rates.

I guess, at the end of the day, I feel like a lot of this comes down to basic principles of supply and demand. And because that is way out of whack during times like December (or, on the opposite end of the spectrum, during summer), it create inefficiencies, and people are incentived to do things like walk reservations and use spec rentals instead of just using custom booking reservations. Don't much hear about the need to walk reservations for June, July, and August (at WDW) - I mean, maybe for July 4th, but I'm sure that is nothing like December.

 

[robinb]

I just found is thread and I am very upset. Those are rooms taken away from owners in the 11-month window and that's not right IMO.

It's frustrating to already see confirmed reservations for December.

That would be confirmed reservations on Disney's website.

I found the following studios available for 12/9/26 - 12/19/26:

AKV Resort View - Kidani - $756 (plus tax)
AKV Resort View - Jambo - $845 (plus tax)
BLT Theme Park View - $1247 (plus tax)
BCV - $934 (plus tax)
BWV Boardwalk View - $1048 (plus tax)
BWV Garden View - $961 (plus tax)
BLT Theme Park View - $1247 (plus tax)
CCV, BRV- all studios - $847 (plus tax)
VGF Resort Studio, Resort View - $1149 (plus tax)
RIV Resort View - $1033 (plus tax)

I look at ALL of them on the DVC website and there is only partial availability for 12/9 - 12/16. As for the dates of 12/17 and 12/18, they must have snatched them up today

Mod comment:: this was restored because it is Disney cash inventory and not confirmed rentals through brokers.

 

[Cyberc1978]

December is brutally hard to get a reservation. I went back three years of facebook posts to January when people are trying to reserve for December and there were complaints. There are probably years more of complaints. I know the popular thought on Facebook is that bots are involved, but I think it's just a high demand time. A disproportionate number of members want to go in December. AND renters know non-members want to go in December too, so they are trying to snag dates to rent out. Plus it's a low points time. It's been mentioned that December points should be raised to offset the demand and elsewhere in the year lowered. I think that could be the way that Disney might handle this if they want to make December less desirable.

For the first time in years we are going in December and hands down i didn’t know what to book to please the family. So I went with 2 studios and 2 2br (one is a lockoff) that way we have time to decide if we wanna splurge and use the extra points or not.

 

[VGCgroupie]

For the first time in years we are going in December and hands down i didn’t know what to book to please the family. So I went with 2 studios and 2 2br (one is a lockoff) that way we have time to decide if we wanna splurge and use the extra points or not.

You always have the best luck with bookings.

 

[Cyberc1978]

You always have the best luck with bookings.

I certainly can’t complain.

I know BWV studios RV are in high demand, but the view you get is meh. I know if you don’t care about the view and just want the cheap room then “meh” is fine.

Personally I like a nice view (don’t we all) but if I have the choice I’d rather save the points.

 

[CarolynFH]

I do not wish to ever be there in the Summer again, but whatever is best for the overall membership is what should happen. I always thought the point chart followed cash rates. I have never really compared it was just something I assumed.

Way back in the 1990s, the points charts did follow cash rates. Even the dates for the various seasons and the names were the same when we first bought. However, Disney can change cash rates much more freely than they can change points charts. I think any given day is limited to a 10 or 20% increase in points cost year over year? Can’t remember. In any case, through the 2021-2024 or 2025 points charts DVC did make adjustments, including increasing the number of seasons as well as making summer cheaper and fall more expensive. I think they might be giving it a few years now, to see what changes occur in members’ booking patterns, before they make more changes.

However, given how miserable summers are, they’d have to make summers almost free and double fall/winter points before we’d even consider going in summer instead of October through March.

 

[Cfabar1]

However, given how miserable summers are, they’d have to make summers almost free and double fall/winter points before we’d even consider going in summer instead of October through March.

Seems to me this is going to be inevitable... That summer will go down in points cost and much of the rest of the year will need to go up... Even early September seems too high in my view...

 

[Cyberc1978]

However, given how miserable summers are, they’d have to make summers almost free and double fall/winter points before we’d even consider going in summer instead of October through March.

personally we like the warm summer months in Orlando. If they made them free, we would have month long stays

 

[mkatsy]

I posted elsewhere but I wanted to post here too.

I have noticed a trend. I have seen so many complaints across social media boards the last 30 days about not getting anything at 11 months. I saw someone this weekend who couldn't even get a 1 bed at their resort at 11 months. Something is changing not sure what. I would encourage sending DVC an email to complain if you have time and if it is effecting your ownership. Maybe its commercial entities maybe its DVC themselves but something is for sure different and people are noticing.

I get worked up over the rental issue quite easily, but I honestly think that the change in availability we are seeing is the direct result of the across the board dues increase. Everyone (most everyone) is feeling financial stress from everyday life, then the dues hit. One of the unintended consequences of discussing the rental issue, is that it catches people’s attention that may not have otherwise thought to do it. Basically, you teach people how to make money, right when people unexpectedly need more money.

 

[Sandisw]

Just a reminder. You can discuss things in general in terms of impact but please do not post any specific dates, or room sizes, and especially do not share what is being offered as confirmed outside of general terms.

For example, I see a lot of the near park resorts out there for rent, for early December. Thst is fine.

I see a lot of confirmed reservationsfor the first week of December at XYX resort,,,not allowed.

I know…it may make it hard to discuss…but we don’t know who owns those reservations and someone could be posting as a way to get around the rules of the Rent/Transfer thread.