Whats Wrong with Disney?

[ahoyle]

Before someone calls me a Universal fan boy or something, I have Disney passes, no Universal pass, and haven't been to Universal in 2-3 years. I also live 10 minutes from the Magic Kingdom, and love Disney, but I am very frustrated with their direction the past 6-7 years.

With that said, all you have to do is examine what Disney has done in the past, and what they are currently doing, to see if they are maintaining what made them the premier park in the world.

Look at the 70s, opened Magic Kingdom- enough said there.

80s- Opened Epcot, opened HS, built Thunder Mtn at MK, later opened Maelstrom

90s- This is where it gets good. Opened Animal Kingdom, MK- Splash Mountain and Buzz, Epcot - Test Track, HS - RnR coaster, Fantasmic, Tower of Terror

00- MK- Philharmagic, Epcot- Soarin, Nemo/Turtle Talk, Mission Space, HS- American Idol, Lights Motor Action, Toy Story, AK- Everest, Primeval Whirl, Finding Nemo

10s- MK- SD Mine Train, not sure if any other plans, Epcot- ?, HS- ?, AK- Pandora (2 rides, one of which sounds like a Soarin upgrade).

Do people really not see the difference there? In the 90s, Disney opened 4 of the best theme park rides in existance, RnR coaster, TOT, TT, and Splash. Plus I would add the Safari ride as well. Opened a new park on top of all that. 2000s saw nothing towards the end of the decade, but still saw Mission Space, which even though it wasn't as big as promised, had everyone talking and excited at the time. Also Soarin is a classic, and Everest a good coaster (I personally don't consider it great, but a headliner still).

Maybe Pandora adds a classic to the disney staple. Certainly new fantasy land has left my family underwhelmed to say the least. At the pace Disney builds things, unless we hear of something this year, we probably aren't seeing it until 2020.

IMO, Disney has been too busy expanding other parks and building boats (thanks by the way, love the cruises), and have neglected Orlando in the process. Doing this at the same time Universal is doing a great job of things, is bad timing IMO. My son and I would gladly trade our Disney passes for Universal ones at this point. I'll keep my tables in wonderland card though and continue to enjoy dining around Disney and getting my touch of the Disney experience. I just don't need to fork over 500 a year for rides I have been riding for 20 years.

 

[NYDisGuy]

They did close space not terribly long ago for a refurb. April 2009-November 2009. We lived.

Do a search on this forum and read some of the posts during that time period when Space Mountain closed. Trip cancellations, kids dreams were crushed, overall disgust etc. Again, any headliner that closes will bring out mass hysteria, it doesn't matter which park. If they closed Forbidden Journey you would get the same reactions. People complain about the Yeti but still ride it multiple times and would scream if it closed. They will live too.

 

[ChrisFL]

Before someone calls me a Universal fan boy or something, I have Disney passes, no Universal pass, and haven't been to Universal in 2-3 years. I also live 10 minutes from the Magic Kingdom, and love Disney, but I am very frustrated with their direction the past 6-7 years.

With that said, all you have to do is examine what Disney has done in the past, and what they are currently doing, to see if they are maintaining what made them the premier park in the world.

Look at the 70s, opened Magic Kingdom- enough said there.

80s- Opened Epcot, opened HS, built Thunder Mtn at MK, later opened Maelstrom

90s- This is where it gets good. Opened Animal Kingdom, MK- Splash Mountain and Buzz, Epcot - Test Track, HS - RnR coaster, Fantasmic, Tower of Terror

00- MK- Philharmagic, Epcot- Soarin, Nemo/Turtle Talk, Mission Space, HS- American Idol, Lights Motor Action, Toy Story, AK- Everest, Primeval Whirl, Finding Nemo

10s- MK- SD Mine Train, not sure if any other plans, Epcot- ?, HS- ?, AK- Pandora (2 rides, one of which sounds like a Soarin upgrade).

Do people really not see the difference there? In the 90s, Disney opened 4 of the best theme park rides in existance, RnR coaster, TOT, TT, and Splash. Plus I would add the Safari ride as well. Opened a new park on top of all that. 2000s saw nothing towards the end of the decade, but still saw Mission Space, which even though it wasn't as big as promised, had everyone talking and excited at the time. Also Soarin is a classic, and Everest a good coaster (I personally don't consider it great, but a headliner still).

Maybe Pandora adds a classic to the disney staple. Certainly new fantasy land has left my family underwhelmed to say the least. At the pace Disney builds things, unless we hear of something this year, we probably aren't seeing it until 2020.

IMO, Disney has been too busy expanding other parks and building boats (thanks by the way, love the cruises), and have neglected Orlando in the process. Doing this at the same time Universal is doing a great job of things, is bad timing IMO. My son and I would gladly trade our Disney passes for Universal ones at this point. I'll keep my tables in wonderland card though and continue to enjoy dining around Disney and getting my touch of the Disney experience. I just don't need to fork over 500 a year for rides I have been riding for 20 years.

 

[Jennasis]

Do a search on this forum and read some of the posts during that time period when Space Mountain closed. Trip cancellations, kids dreams were crushed, overall disgust etc. Again, any headliner that closes will bring out mass hysteria, it doesn't matter which park. If they closed Forbidden Journey you would get the same reactions. People complain about the Yeti but still ride it multiple times and would scream if it closed. They will live too.

Which is precisely my point...just fix the yeti! Complaints be darned...we survived other long term refurbs and we'd survive EE being down too, Just as we did before it was even built.

 

[MichiganDVC]

Which is precisely my point...just fix the yeti! Complaints be darned...we survived other long term refurbs and we'd survive EE being down too, Just as we did before it was even built.

Or maybe:
A. Its popular enough without a working Yeti and most people have no idea anything is wrong and still enjoy the ride, so they can wait.
B. They will open Avatarland in phases and once the phase with a comparable E-ticket ride emerges, they will close down Everest to refurb.

 

[Jennasis]

Or maybe:
A. Its popular enough without a working Yeti and most people have no idea anything is wrong and still enjoy the ride, so they can wait.
B. They will open Avatarland in phases and once the phase with a comparable E-ticket ride emerges, they will close down Everest to refurb.

We can hope!

To be fair and honest I've assumed they will close it to fix the yet I after Pandora is open.

 

[Gottahavemorecowbell]

Hey I'm tough on Disney I admit it. I want to go back, however the road they are headed down isn't a good one in my opinion. I would love to see them right the ship.

We've gone to Disney several years in a row. We've been there in several different months of the year. The crowded resorts, parks and the energy we've felt at DTD (at least pre-construction) just doesn't bear out what you're selling here regarding the effort to "right the ship." Reasonable people can obviously disagree. Disney is far from perfect and I have no problem with people having high expectations. However, I don't believe the numbers (crowds/revenue) point toward much of a decline. Correct me if I'm wrong. It seems as though some (not saying you) on this board are coming close to viewing this as Universal Studios' defenders = the enlightened crowd vs. WDW lovers = ignorant sheep. It's a long thread but this is my takeaway. At the end of day we're all just guessing what might happen in the next 10-20 years as far as Universal's threat to the Mouse. To answer the original question again, I say "not much" is wrong with Disney.

 

[ahoyle]

We've gone to Disney several years in a row. We've been there in several different months of the year. The crowded resorts, parks and the energy we've felt at DTD (at least pre-construction) just doesn't bear out what you're selling here regarding the effort to "right the ship." Reasonable people can obviously disagree. Disney is far from perfect and I have no problem with people having high expectations. However, I don't believe the numbers (crowds/revenue) point toward much of a decline. Correct me if I'm wrong. It seems as though some (not saying you) on this board are coming close to viewing this as Universal Studios' defenders = the enlightened crowd vs. WDW lovers = ignorant sheep. It's a long thread but this is my takeaway. At the end of day we're all just guessing what might happen in the next 10-20 years as far as Universal's threat to the Mouse. To answer the original question again, I say "not much" is wrong with Disney.

Its incorrect to look at Disney having increasing attendance and say nothing is wrong. Not saying thats exactly what you are saying, but you see it on this board a lot. Disney's attendance could be up 10% every year, but all their competitors up 20%. In that case something is wrong (unless its a one time blip, etc). You see that in all parts of the economy. Worlds Biggest Bank announces record profits and revenues, laying off 10000 people. Increased revenue and attendance do not measure a parks performance alone, as in a world of increasing people and money, the status quo will lead to increases.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

I got to witness the Yeti "move" in it's first year of operation. It was pretty sweet. I say shut it down and fix it since "we" won't be headed back until Avatar opens.

And does the ME still have that spiel about Disney's latest and greatest attraction, Expedition Everest playing?

Actually ME has a new film just this year. Which I have seen a lot of complaints about because it no longer features any Disney characters and is considered "boring" by some. Which may be another instance of "I'm tired of this - you need to do something else - but not that."

 

[MichiganDVC]

We've gone to Disney several years in a row. We've been there in several different months of the year. The crowded resorts, parks and the energy we've felt at DTD (at least pre-construction) just doesn't bear out what you're selling here regarding the effort to "right the ship." Reasonable people can obviously disagree. Disney is far from perfect and I have no problem with people having high expectations. However, I don't believe the numbers (crowds/revenue) point toward much of a decline. Correct me if I'm wrong. It seems as though some (not saying you) on this board are coming close to viewing this as Universal Studios' defenders = the enlightened crowd vs. WDW lovers = ignorant sheep. It's a long thread but this is my takeaway. At the end of day we're all just guessing what might happen in the next 10-20 years as far as Universal's threat to the Mouse. To answer the original question again, I say "not much" is wrong with Disney.

Where on Earth would you get that impression?

 

[Gottahavemorecowbell]

Where on Earth would you get that impression?

Oh, I don't know. Just a wild guess. I was trying to be nice.

 

[ahoyle]

Before someone calls me a Universal fan boy or something, I have Disney passes, no Universal pass, and haven't been to Universal in 2-3 years. I also live 10 minutes from the Magic Kingdom, and love Disney, but I am very frustrated with their direction the past 6-7 years.

With that said, all you have to do is examine what Disney has done in the past, and what they are currently doing, to see if they are maintaining what made them the premier park in the world.

Look at the 70s, opened Magic Kingdom- enough said there.

80s- Opened Epcot, opened HS, built Thunder Mtn at MK, later opened Maelstrom

90s- This is where it gets good. Opened Animal Kingdom, MK- Splash Mountain and Buzz, Epcot - Test Track, HS - RnR coaster, Fantasmic, Tower of Terror

00- MK- Philharmagic, Epcot- Soarin, Nemo/Turtle Talk, Mission Space, HS- American Idol, Lights Motor Action, Toy Story, AK- Everest, Primeval Whirl, Finding Nemo

10s- MK- SD Mine Train, not sure if any other plans, Epcot- ?, HS- ?, AK- Pandora (2 rides, one of which sounds like a Soarin upgrade).

Do people really not see the difference there? In the 90s, Disney opened 4 of the best theme park rides in existance, RnR coaster, TOT, TT, and Splash. Plus I would add the Safari ride as well. Opened a new park on top of all that. 2000s saw nothing towards the end of the decade, but still saw Mission Space, which even though it wasn't as big as promised, had everyone talking and excited at the time. Also Soarin is a classic, and Everest a good coaster (I personally don't consider it great, but a headliner still).

Maybe Pandora adds a classic to the disney staple. Certainly new fantasy land has left my family underwhelmed to say the least. At the pace Disney builds things, unless we hear of something this year, we probably aren't seeing it until 2020.

IMO, Disney has been too busy expanding other parks and building boats (thanks by the way, love the cruises), and have neglected Orlando in the process. Doing this at the same time Universal is doing a great job of things, is bad timing IMO. My son and I would gladly trade our Disney passes for Universal ones at this point. I'll keep my tables in wonderland card though and continue to enjoy dining around Disney and getting my touch of the Disney experience. I just don't need to fork over 500 a year for rides I have been riding for 20 years.

Quoting myself to add a few things to this.
In the 80s you had Disney opening Pleasure Island, and closing it in 2010. An entertainment perspective I left off that has since been removed.
You also had Typhoon Lagoon in the 80s and Blizzard Beach in the 90s, adding to your Disney experience.

Just further highlights the expansion and investment in Orlando that has disappeared from Disney the past decade. We'll see if Disney Springs adds anything more than a few shopping options to DTD. I am hopeful, as the traffic headache from all the construction makes going there a nightmare at this point.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

Pleasure Island closed in September 2008 (I remember it well).

 

[ChrisFL]

It seems as though some (not saying you) on this board are coming close to viewing this as Universal Studios' defenders = the enlightened crowd vs. WDW lovers = ignorant sheep. It's a long thread but this is my takeaway.

My take is that there's a lot of Disney fans commenting on here who have never stepped foot in Universal...but people who have been, and actually enjoy Universal are also very familiar with Disney. Therefore the opinions on each side are not equal. One is familiar with both, one is not.

Also, a vast majority of Universal fans ALSO like Disney...just don't like the direction that WDW is going...stagnation, lack of cleanliness, closed or abandoned buildings, lack of maintenance, upcharging for events as separately ticketed that used to be free,

 

[ahoyle]

Pleasure Island closed in September 2008 (I remember it well).

I'll take your word for it, I just quickly looked it up on Wikipedia, and may have looked at the date wrong. I only had the pleasure of going one time as an adult, back in 2002, and that night at The Adventurers Club was one to remember.

 

[Reddog1134]

IDisney's attendance could be up 10% every year, but all their competitors up 20%. In that case something is wrong (unless its a one time blip, etc).

But that's the problem with percentages, they can be misleading. A 10% increase for Disney is still a larger increase in actual attendance then 20% for a competitor.

 

[MichiganDVC]

My take is that there's a lot of Disney fans commenting on here who have never stepped foot in Universal...but people who have been, and actually enjoy Universal are also very familiar with Disney. Therefore the opinions on each side are not equal. One is familiar with both, one is not.

Also, a vast majority of Universal fans ALSO like Disney...just don't like the direction that WDW is going...stagnation, lack of cleanliness, closed or abandoned buildings, lack of maintenance, upcharging for events as separately ticketed that used to be free,

And people who still enjoy Disney, don't complain about every paint chip, and have zero interest in going to Universal are treated with kindness and respect....

I'll admit...the audacity of someone commenting on the DIS boards, on a thread about what's wrong with DISney, and not having been to Universal...unbelievable.

 

[ahoyle]

But that's the problem with percentages, they can be misleading. A 10% increase for Disney is still a larger increase in actual attendance then 20% for a competitor.

While your statement about percentages is true, they aren't misleading when Universal is compared to Disney. If I was comparing a new small park like Legoland and saying they are up 30%, watch out Disney, that would be laughable. And we can more or less leave Magic Kingdom out of the discussion. Its the juggernaut. You could probably leave it untouched for the next 20 years, just do maintenance, and it would still lead the way. Too much nostalgia, too many classics, too much scenary.

Its the other three parks that seeing a 5% increase and a competitor is up 10%, should concern Disney. Especially where their resort strategy is concerned.

Should we throw in waterparks? Aquatica might surpass Blizzard Beach and Typoon Lagoon this year! I'll run and hide now!

 

[DisUniversal]

Oh, I don't know. Just a wild guess. I was trying to be nice.

I'm glad you two found each other. Enjoy!

 

[DisUniversal]

But that's the problem with percentages, they can be misleading. A 10% increase for Disney is still a larger increase in actual attendance then 20% for a competitor.

Actually far more misleading to just look at the numbers. Growth is measured using percentages.