Spoke to principal- I'm not a happy camper-- update post 155

[Disney8704]

No link...heard it on the news a long time ago. Do a search though. You may find something.

"Scientifically proven?" Link please? Thank you!

 

[Disney8704]

Just wondering but has anyone ever thought of asking what her son wants? He does have a mind of his own you know. IMHO, it should be HIS decision on what should be done. After all, he's the one who is taking the test. Hes the one who would have to go to summer school. Not his parents, not us, but HIM.

 

[mncherokee]

my daughter is in 4th grade this year (and has been in gifted and talented since 1st) her teachers are wonderful and understanding and supportive.i always try to schedule for when she won't miss anything important.and i know some teachers on here will say she misses class instruction HA!! i've been class mom for 5 yrs. now (i now bounce between dds classes)and as far as i'm concerned(and witnessed)class instruction is" here read this, do this"!!there is no student teacher relationship anymore which is sad but true...when did my child go from being a student to be a test score!! We don't get any praise as parents when our children get straight a's or pass a test.(the teachers get that)but let them get a less than flattering grade and here come the "you must not be doing your job a a parent"notes and by the way lately it seems i spend more time at home doing the teachers jobs than they did at school in the 1st place.

I am truly sorry that you have been in classrooms that you haven't seen the teacher/student interactions. I know there are good teachers as well as those who are task-only oriented. And as someone who has studied education, I know that learning happens interactively (both in home settings and at school) and we need both teachers and parent involvement. Your child is lucky to have a mom who is willing to step in and help out with their child's education... there are many parents who either won't or can't be that involved.

My hat goes off to all those homeschooling parents. Your task is challenging.

My hat also goes off to all those teachers in classroom settings. You have different challenges in teaching.

 

[princessmom29]

It doesnt matter where it came from or who answers it. What they speak of is the truth. I agree to the article as that is exactly what I have always thought and believed in. IMHO, you teachers need to open your eyeballs and realize theres more then 1 way to receive a proper education. My sister is to a teacher for a public school. But at least she can admit and agree that home schooling is the way to go!

I may believe the sky is pink but that doesn't make it so. There are times when homeschool is a vaild opiton, but you need to open the eyes to that fact that there are also times when public school is a better choice. Not all public schools are evil or a substandad education.

 

[Disney8704]

Home-Schooled Kids Get Into Harvard And Other Top Massachusetts Schools & Home-Schoolers Excel

http://www.massnews.com/past_issues/2000/7_July/hschool.htm

Massachusetts News
By John Pike

July2--While many parents spend thousands of dollars on elite private schools hoping it will get their “Johnny” into an Ivy League college, one new freshman at Harvard, Forrester Cole of Manchester, got there the old-fashioned way—he hardly ever went to school at all.

Cole got his education by “home-schooling,” the fastest growing alternative to public school in the United States.

Cole, who earned A’s and B’s at Harvard last semester, told Massachusetts News that his academic preparation for Harvard was “adequate.” He is glad he was home-schooled, but has nothing to compare it to. “It was a good experience,” he said.

The five to 10 home-schoolers annually accepted by Harvard perform as well as other students, says David Illingworth, a Harvard admissions officer.

And since home-schooling parents spend on average only $400 per student, it can cost significantly less to home-school than pay for a private school.

The number of home-learners in Massachusetts is about 9,000—1.2% of all students—up from approximately 3,000 in 1983, said Patrick Farenga, publisher of Growing Without Schooling magazine in Cambridge, Mass. This increase is remarkable in an era of two-income families because it pretty much requires one dedicated parent (generally the mother) at some financial sacrifice.

In 1984 less than 100,000 children in the United States were home-educated. Today, there are about 1.2 million, or around 0.7% of all school-age kids, reports the Home-school Legal Defense Association in Purcellville, Va. And Brian Ray, President of the National Home Educatiuon Research Institute in Salem, Ore., says that the number of home-educated children in the United States is increasing between 15% and 40% every year.

“The home-schooling image is not wacko, fringe, lunatic-type people anymore,” said Ray. “Today almost everyone knows a home-schooler, so it’s more socially acceptable.”

As traditional educators nationwide try to implement new ways to reverse
recent declines in standardized test scores, mostly through increased funding, home-schoolers “on average score at or above the 80th percentile, 30 points above the national average, in all areas of standardized achievement tests,” said Ray. And home-educated students whose parents are also certified teachers did no better than other students.

Home-Schoolers Excel

According to a 1998 study by the Home-School Legal Defense Association, home-schoolers perform an average of one grade level above their counterparts in public and private schools in the elementary grades. By the eighth grade, the gap amounts to four grade levels.

Lawrence Rudner, the national testing expert who conducted the study, said: “It shows that home-schooling works for those who make the commitment. It is not proof that home-schooling is superior to traditional education.”

Rudner says the results may be slightly skewed because the families surveyed tended to be better educated and wealthier than average—factors that research has proven generally result in higher achievement.

One reason kids test well with home-schooling could be because of the individual attention they receive. Home-schooling is a one-one-one situation, with heavy parental involvement. Teaching 25 students in a class individually is a challenge, so academic excellence is one of the main reasons parents choose to become home-educators.

Alysa Dudley is teaching her three daughters at home in Billerica, she told Massachusetts News, because, “Children learn best at their own pace and are studying what interests them.”

Dudley says she decided to home educate her kids when her oldest child Rachel, now 12, was academically ahead of the other first-grade children and her progress was being stunted as a result. During first-grade Rachel could already read, while virtually the rest of the class could not, said Dudley. So, Rachel had to waste time doing assignments that she already understood.

Sitting in her living room next to an 8x5x4-foot fish tank she uses to teach marine biology, Dudley says public-school pedagogues have to teach the whole class the same way, but home-schooling allows flexibility. There was some discussion with administrators to have Rachel skip a grade, but Dudley was advised against it because Rachel would then be behind in other ways.

Home-education experts say this flexibility can help not only gifted students
such as Rachel, but also academically poor students who could also be
better off learning at their own pace.

 

[disneyworldmomma]

I am truly sorry that you have been in classrooms that you haven't seen the teacher/student interactions. I know there are good teachers as well as those who are task-only oriented. And as someone who has studied education, I know that learning happens interactively (both in home settings and at school) and we need both teachers and parent involvement. Your child is lucky to have a mom who is willing to step in and help out with their child's education... there are many parents who either won't or can't be that involved.

My hat goes off to all those homeschooling parents. Your task is challenging.

My hat also goes off to all those teachers in classroom settings. You have different challenges in teaching.

Thank you for your kindwords i consider myself very lucky to be able to be at my daughters school almost on a daily basis and i originally thought that if i was there (in class room) that the teachers would try a little harder but not so much!! i can't belive some of the things i've witnessed..i guess what bothers me most is the fact that i would never tell a teacher that what they teache in class is not important ,so how could a teacher tell me that what i teach my child at home(a love for life,family,and country) is less important than sitting in a desk to take a test that doesn't even teach her but instead judges her!!
i'll end this by saying something my granny always said and i hope people think about it and apply to thier lives as i have mine:"I DON'T WEAR A WHITE ROBE,OR A BLACK ROBE SO WHO AM I TO JUDGE"

 

[Disney8704]

OP, Im sorry your thread has turned for the worse. Seriously though, this thread needs to come to an end already. This thread is so off topic its pathetic. Im very surprised the MODs havent locked this thread already.

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

Home-Schooled Kids Get Into Harvard And Other Top Massachusetts Schools & Home-Schoolers Excel


Lawrence Rudner, the national testing expert who conducted the study, said: “It shows that home-schooling works for those who make the commitment. It is not proof that home-schooling is superior to traditional education.”

Your article quoted just proved my point! Home schooling is not better nor our those kids smarter. Just because one "feels" otherwise does not make it so.

To the OP - why two weeks of vacation? Could there be a compromise of 1 week vacation?

The only job a kid has is to go to school!

 

[Loverly]

Home-Schooled Kids Get Into Harvard And Other Top Massachusetts Schools & Home-Schoolers Excel

http://www.massnews.com/past_issues/2000/7_July/hschool.htm

Massachusetts News
By John Pike



The five to 10 home-schoolers annually accepted by Harvard perform as well as other students, says David Illingworth, a Harvard admissions officer. .

Harvard University
EDUCATIONAL INSTITUTION



Harvard Business School
Harvard Divinity School
Harvard Law School
Harvard Medical School
John F. Kennedy School of Government
Radcliffe College
Location:
Cambridge, MA

Founding Date:
8-Sep-1636

Motto:
Veritas

Team:
Crimson

Mascot:
John Harvard

Enrollment:
19,650


So roughly, each year The Harvard Freshman class is around 4500 students.
And 5 to 10 are homeschooled. Big whoop

I do admire your tenacity, Disney8740, and your very strong opinions. Especially in the realm of Homeschooling and authentic cuisine.

 

[Disney8704]

Look we all can go around and around on this subject, but I truely believe that home schooling is better! You might not think so, but do you think I care what you think? No I dont. I dont care if you think eduction on the moon is better! It may say "It is not proof that home-schooling is superior to traditional education", however it DOES say "According to a 1998 study by the Home-School Legal Defense Association, home-schoolers perform an average of one grade level above their counterparts in public and private schools in the elementary grades. By the eighth grade, the gap amounts to four grade levels." People wanted to see a study performed, I gave them an article to read about a study that was performed back in 1998. You know I read on another website and they provided a really good point. Your kids learn how to talk, walk, read and even write at home. Why take that learning habit away from them and throw them into a school where they can learn just as much if not more at home?!

Your article quoted just proved my point! Home schooling is not better nor our those kids smarter. Just because one "feels" otherwise does not make it so.

To the OP - why two weeks of vacation? Could there be a compromise of 1 week vacation?

The only job a kid has is to go to school!

 

[GJM]

Have not read all the posts - but what happens with a child that isn't there at the start of the year to take the tests. My DS didn't start this school until the end of the school year, and he took the year end tests.

I am not a big believer in the testing they do, at our school I think the kids get so stressed by the tests. I do beleive some kids just do not do well on tests.

I think it is a waste to send him to summer school, if he is a straight A student, what a waste of time for the teacher in summer school. Because he missed a test.

And yes, not every parent can take off from work when their child is off. At my previous job I could not take off during our busy times, which was holidays and summer. Also the end of month was hard, because we had to close out our month.

Do what is best for you and your family - you never know what will happen tomorrow.

I am taking my DS for the lst. time to go to Disney in Sept. My DH is deploying and won't be home for a year, so I would like the school tell me I can't!

 

[missj1975]

Wow interesting thread and I don't even have kids. But when I do have kids I plan on homeschooling. But back to the OP's problem, I think you should do whatever is best for your family and only you know the answer to that.

 

[Disney8704]

Decided to remove this post. Its not worth getting points over it especially since it was to all the bullies. Which IMHO arent worth even speaking to not alone getting points.

authentic cuisine[/I].

 

[perkinsrose]

Ok I just put on my flame suit so here's my two cents worth. What comes first, your child's education, or some momentary pleasure at Disney? As much as I love being in MK, eating at LTT, or riding TT, this is a no brainer, he needs to be in school! Your son is missing 2 weeks if I understand correctly, so it's not just a test he's missing, but also other subjects work that will be missed. Your child can't learn if he's not there plain and simple. You should have changed the dates when the first principal advised you of the conflict. One last thing, I beleive this will come back and bite you in the future because your son is old enough to realize what your trying to do and justify it by using we haven't had a vacation in 6 years so we're going on one and it just happens to be at Disney.

It all boils down to that your playing with your son's future here. It may not seem that significant to you right now, it's just a test, but you have no idea what the future problems might come from this are.

I think we have to remember a parent is not choosing between entire education and disney. A parent is choosing between 2 weeks of formal education in the classroom vs. 2 weeks of Disney. The rest of the year may be another situation entirely.

As a parent with 2 teaching degrees & license and several teaching endorsements, when I take my children out of school for WDW, I'm not placing importance on Disney over education on the whole-rather a choice between two environments for a finite period of time.

 

[OnourwaytoWDW]

Original poster here-
Wow...I didn't think it would get much attention!! LOL

So, yes, he is going to be gone for 9 days of school. Life is to short to worry over 9 days of missed school. While I thought the idea of withdrawing him and then re-registering him was amusing , I just don't think that's an option.


Yes, the dates were set because the original principal said it "would be worked out" and not to worry. Her words were "Anything he can experience out of school is great in my eyes". Our school system going through a major restructure and the principal we have now is a shared between another school. As for the new principal, we didn't even know who the principal was going to be till 1 week before school!!

Now, we were invited to walk the Mackinaw Bridge Labor day and the old principal even approved that! So he would have missed not only 10 days, but plus another 1 or 2 on top. But I then thought the whole thing would have been to much with our other trip right behind.

DH's job is at FedEx and it's not like he can rearrange his vacation dates that easily. All dates for vacation are to be submit and approved way before he can take them.

I have called the ISTEP state department and left a message for the director herself. She'll be in on Tuesday. I'm sure there is some way to work this out. I"ll let everyone know what happens!

Thanks everyone!

 

[Disney8704]

Good for you! And good luck.

Original poster here-
Wow...I didn't think it would get much attention!! LOL

So, yes, he is going to be gone for 9 days of school. Life is to short to worry over 9 days of missed school. While I thought the idea of withdrawing him and then re-registering him was amusing , I just don't think that's an option.
We did discuss with him about doing extra

Yes, the dates were set because the original principal said it "would be worked out" and not to worry. Her words were "Anything he can experience out of school is great in my eyes". Our school system going through a major restructure and the principal we have now is a shared between another school. As for the new principal, we didn't even know who the principal was going to be till 1 week before school!!

Now, we were invited to walk the Mackinaw Bridge Labor day and the old principal even approved that! So he would have missed not only 10 days, but plus another 1 or 2 on top. But I then thought the whole thing would have been to much with our other trip right behind.

DH's job is at FedEx and it's not like he can rearrange his vacation dates that easily. All dates for vacation are to be submit and approved way before he can take them.

I have called the ISTEP state department and left a message for the director herself. She'll be in on Tuesday. I'm sure there is some way to work this out. I"ll let everyone know what happens!

Thanks everyone!

 

[Disney8704]

Im outa here! Im done with this thread! OP good luck with whatever happens!

 

[eyor44]

I do not like the emphasis that is placed on the standarized tests. In our district the teachers spend a lot of time preparing the children for the tests and how to take them. In my opinion the tests do not accurately measure how much the children know, because they have been coached too much. In our area the tests are used for grading the school. That kind of pressure is too much for children in my opinion.

When my oldest DS was in 2nd grade he wore a retainer. One day at lunch, in the middle of testing week, he left his retainer on the tray when he turned it in. When he realized his mistake, he asked his teacher if he could go back to the cafeteria for it. She told him no, that he could not miss any of the testing. When I got home that evening he told me what had happened and we raced to the school to see if we could get to the trash before it was taken out. We were too late. I asked the cafeteria manager what the policy was and given that she was the same manager as when I went to school there, I already knew the answer. Said child is given gloves and shown which trash bags to go through and someone from the cafeteria helps them until they find said retainer. Happens occasionally and they always find it, providing the child arrives before the trash is taken to the dump.

The next day I spoke to the principal about this. She sided with the teacher! I asked what would happen if he would have gotten sick instead. He would have been allowed to make up the tests he missed. I asked what was the difference and the administration did not understand why I was so upset until I presented them with a spread sheet of the cost involved for me to replace the retainer. Time off from work, driving to the dentist (not close) and the cost replacement of the retainer itself. I being a single mother, working part time, going to school part time. They finally understood but would not apologize.
I realize this isn't the same situation as OPs, but I just wanted to point out that yes, way too much emphasis is put on these tests.

I have also pulled my second DS from school twice for Disney, when he was younger. I never told them where I was going, just that we were going out of town for the week and there wasn't anyone to leave DS with. They never questioned me and he did all work he took with us, plus extra credit work that I required of him. Had it not worked the first time, I never would have done it the second. People have very strong feelings on both sides of this subject and the real issue is the OP was told something by one person only to have that person leave, and now has to deal with a new person with a different attitude about it.

 

[Nicholfamily5]

True but I've rarely seen anyone post 'I'm thinking about taking the kids out of school to go to Washington DC for a week'. Yes I realize this is a Disney-related board, but there seems to be this opinion that if you say you're going to WDW the whole world should just roll over & say 'Well, it is WDW so of course its OK. If it were something silly like D.C. we'd say no but since its Disney we'll certainly allow it.' That's my problem. That the world is suppose to stop spinning & the planets align & everyone roll over & let whoever do whatever they want regarding taking their kids out of school because its Disney.

I love Disney too. But my childs education comes first. And as I said before, state tests or no state tests, 2 weeks would put them tremendously behind.

Okay, now you'll hear it.
My mother and grandfather pulled my sister and me out of school a few times to go to Washington DC. I had a wonderful time, and I plan on doing it with my children as soon as they get a bit older. It is a truly great vacation to bring children on, once they hit upper grade school/middle school age.

As far as Disney, I've found many things to educate my children with. Sure it's about the fun, and the rides, and spending quality time together, but there is no reason why you can't keep up with school work while you are there.
While I'm not sure I would have scheduled my vacation for the same time as testing, I think parents should be given far more control over when to take their children out of school.

Oh, and I'm going to HAVE to get snotty for a moment, I'm not in a very good mood
The teacher that keeps posting, so upset about everyone attacking those who teach their children? Use spell check, dear, apparently you aren't an English teacher.

See? Warned you I was going to get snotty.

 

[perkinsrose]

Harvard University
EDUCATIONAL INSTITUTION



Harvard Business School
Harvard Divinity School
Harvard Law School
Harvard Medical School
John F. Kennedy School of Government
Radcliffe College
Location:
Cambridge, MA

Founding Date:
8-Sep-1636

Motto:
Veritas

Team:
Crimson

Mascot:
John Harvard

Enrollment:
19,650


So roughly, each year The Harvard Freshman class is around 4500 students.
And 5 to 10 are homeschooled. Big whoop

I do admire your tenacity, Disney8740, and your very strong opinions. Especially in the realm of Homeschooling and authentic cuisine.

I don't homeschool, but to be fair shouldn't we look at the more information? How many homeschooled children apply to Harvard vs. traditionally school kids. Also, what percentage of children are homeschooled in US. What percentage of homeschooled children attend college vs. what percentage of traditionally schooled kids attend college? I need more statistics to understand the comparision. If anyone has links for this type of info, I'd love to see it.