Living rent free in someone else's home

[stitch'sgirl]

How is it that the sisters have more knowledge and access than you? And it sounds like the brother has been left at least somewhat out of the loop too. I realize you are estranged so that can explain some of it. Were/are your sisters closer to your parents and thus privy to more information or given more reign on decisions? Is the one sister their executor of the estate or will?

My dad named my oldest sister executor and she believes that gave her all the power. My dad told me before he passed away that she had no idea what the function of an executor was and that she was a "tyrant". My other sister has just sided with her, I really don't know why.

No, they weren't any closer to my parents. My mom gave me her only possession of value, her beautiful engagement ring about 3 years ago. I tried to refuse it, I was so honored but I felt so awkward after around my sisters. The funeral director thought that might have been the catalyst for their dislike of me.

I guess I'm just wondering is this really about 2 beds and some furniture?

You're right, it's so much more. I'm just annoyed today because I had to go out and buy my son a bed and mattress knowing there are two over there that are going to be disposed in a couple of weeks. And I have to let a stranger sleep on one up until then.

 

[stitch'sgirl]

There is a question though to be had is there some authority other than her own that the sister is believing she is able to throw all the possessions not desired by her or used by her or her family/friends away.

Exactly!! How do I stop her from doing this?

 

[stitch'sgirl]

Are your parents still alive or have they passed?

It's possible they discussed this arrangement with your sister without anyone else's knowledge.

How is it that the sisters have more knowledge and access than you? And it sounds like the brother has been left at least somewhat out of the loop too. I realize you are estranged so that can explain some of it. Were/are your sisters closer to your parents and thus privy to more information or given more reign on decisions? Is the one sister their executor of the estate or will?

From what I know with my grandmother's probate all parties legally entitled to property had to agree on the division of those assets unless something is specifically spelled out. I remember my estranged aunt ranting about wanting ice skates claiming my grandmother told her she could have them just to name one. And I remember all had to agree to in lieu of selling the house that was in my grandmother's name (but that my autistic aunt had been living in for several

Wow. So sorry you're going through this! My siblings and I didn't always agree and didn't do equal amounts of work, but we always considered each other equal decision makers and tried to be extremely fair about anything financial.

Are you parents still considered to have capacity to make decisions? If not, who is their POA?

I agree with you that no one of you should be benefiting unevenly from the home. Putting unpaying tenants in the house is just wrong. Your sister blew it because now she has lost everyone's trust. She could have had inexpensive rent for her son while he acted as a caretaker for the home with the blessing of everyone, instead she is flat out cheating/stealing from your parents.

I totally agree. I would have been fine with the nephew living rent free even, but his 2 buddies should have been paying rent which would have helped offset my parents' care cost in the group home.

And here's another gem I found out -- while my sisters kept telling me she was not of sound mind, they took a check over to her to sign for $22,000 to buy my niece (the squatter's sister) a new car.

 

[kymom99]

I would consult an attorney. My friend’s mom us still living and her sibling is behaving like your sister. Very similar story except that my friend lives 4 hours away so it’s difficult to fight him.

My brother handled my parents’ estate. He was very transparent. He worked with an attorney and did everything by the book. Your sister may have to reimburse you all if she does things that only benefit her.

 

[stitch'sgirl]

Do you know who is named executor of the will? Did you pay for the funeral? Please let us know what you figure out.

I will let you know! My oldest sister paid for the burial and headstone and will be taking that out of whatever assets are left. I know I mentioned this on another thread but I was the only one with my mom for the 2 days before she passed. It was such an honor and something those sisters will never be able to take from me.

Since there was no visitation and no funeral, the funeral home was gracious to let me spend some time with her alone.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

My dad named my oldest sister executor and she believes that gave her all the power. My dad told me before he passed away that she had no idea what the function of an executor was and that she was a "tyrant". My other sister has just sided with her, I really don't know why.

No, they weren't any closer to my parents. My mom gave me her only possession of value, her beautiful engagement ring about 3 years ago. I tried to refuse it, I was so honored but I felt so awkward after around my sisters. The funeral director thought that might have been the catalyst for their dislike of me.

This is insightful. I think the funeral director might be on to something. A ring like that is a big deal. Not just because it’s a diamond, but it’s got a lot of sentimental value. Your sisters might’ve been jealous and/or hurt that your Mom gave that to you. Family dynamics can be strange.

I was the only one with my mom for the 2 days before she passed.

This too.

You're right, it's so much more. I'm just annoyed today because I had to go out and buy my son a bed and mattress knowing there are two over there that are going to be disposed in a couple of weeks. And I have to let a stranger sleep on one up until then.

I realize you’re hurt, and it seems silly, but who wants that crappy old bed anyway? Go to IKEA and get a nice new one for your DS that doesn’t cost much and let them keep their bed if it makes them feel like they’re getting something over on you. It’s just not worth the aggravation! (I see you’ve already gotten one!)

I am just finishing up my Mom’s estate. It was a lot of work and emotionally difficult. Mom wanted things divided equitably. I’ve offered ‘things’ to my sibs and the only thing one wanted was some pictures. (Actually asked me to make albums (!), which I have not had time for, but I’ll try once I come across old pics, thanks for the reminder.) We had an attorney, but just fyi when we started the probate process, they had to send out a notice, published in the newspapers, giving notice about anything that is owed to anyone by the estate, who could then make a claim. This could be something you can look into, as you definitely have claim to part of the estate unless you were specifically left out of the will. (Not a legal expert nor do I play one on TV, just sharing my recent experience with this process. Not sure how state laws come into play.) Twice the attorney also has had to write to my siblings - once, asking if they had any objections to my being the executor, and again now that things are just about complete, everyone has to sign off on the final accounting of the estate; that will be the last step, I guess. Even if they aren’t using an attorney, there are laws that they must follow. Hope this helps you understand you have rights.

 

[kymom99]

I will let you know! My oldest sister paid for the burial and headstone and will be taking that out of whatever assets are left. I know I mentioned this on another thread but I was the only one with my mom for the 2 days before she passed. It was such an honor and something those sisters will never be able to take from me.

Since there was no visitation and no funeral, the funeral home was gracious to let me spend some time with her alone.

Was the no visitation the wishes of your mother?

 

[stitch'sgirl]

Thank

This is insightful. I think the funeral director might be on to something. A ring like that is a big deal. Not just because it’s a diamond, but it’s got a lot of sentimental value. Your sisters might’ve been jealous and/or hurt that your Mom gave that to you. Family dynamics can be strange.

This too.


I realize you’re hurt, and it seems silly, but who wants that crappy old bed anyway? Go to IKEA and get a nice new one for your DS that doesn’t cost much and let them keep their bed if it makes them feel like they’re getting something over on you. It’s just not worth the aggravation! (I see you’ve already gotten one!)

I am just finishing up my Mom’s estate. It was a lot of work and emotionally difficult. Mom wanted things divided equitably. I’ve offered ‘things’ to my sibs and the only thing one wanted was some pictures. (Actually asked me to make albums (!), which I have not had time for, but I’ll try once I come across old pics, thanks for the reminder.) We had an attorney, but just fyi when we started the probate process, they had to send out a notice, published in the newspapers, giving notice about anything that is owed to anyone by the estate, who could then make a claim. This could be something you can look into, as you definitely have claim to part of the estate unless you were specifically left out of the will. (Not a legal expert nor do I play one on TV, just sharing my recent experience with this process. Not sure how state laws come into play.) Twice the attorney also has had to write to my siblings - once, asking if they had any objections to my being the executor, and again now that things are just about complete, everyone has to sign off on the final accounting of the estate; that will be the last step, I guess. Even if they aren’t using an attorney, there are laws that they must follow. Hope this helps you understand you have rights.

Thank you for your explanation of the process, that was very helpful and gives me an idea of the timeline and what to watch for.

As for as the furniture, none of it is crappy or old, what I ended up buying for my son is definitely crappy and cheap-ish!

 

[cedricandsophie]

Unfortunately In this kind of situation the only really smart thing to do I hire a lawyer, who can demand to see the will if there is one. If not he or she can stop assets from being disposed of until probate is underway. One of your sisters could have been named executor but that still doesn’t give her a right to do anything she wants., unless of course the entire estate was left to her.
We have three daughters, one disabled. To avoid any problems , because the two oldest like to fight over everything, we have stated that all assets be sold (I will probably give away a few pieces of jewelry etc in advance). Then the proceeds go into trust, anything ovER a certain amount that we believe our disabled daughter needs for the rest of her life, will he divided according to our wishes, mostly to the other daughters but also small percentages to our niece and nephews and to a couple charities.
You may not like the idea of fighting over assets but you could be losing out on thousands of dollars resulting from the sale of the house etc. Think about how you could use that money for college or retirement. And your parents probably didn’t want this to happen.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Thank

Thank you for your explanation of the process, that was very helpful and gives me an idea of the timeline and what to watch for.

As for as the furniture, none of it is crappy or old, what I ended up buying for my son is definitely crappy and cheap-ish!

Glad it was helpful. I was being facetious!

 

[SharonZ]

Honestly, it would be in your best interest to hire an attorney. If there was a will, he could get a copy of it for you. How do you know that the executor is disposing of the assets of your parents in accordance with their wishes? I would also want to dispute the check that was issued for the new car.

 

[SirDuff]

Agree with hiring an attorney.

Also, don't try to remove things from the house until you have the attorney and things are sorted. I'm unclear why your brother was asking you what you wanted from the house, but don't arrange to take anything at this point. It can really come back to bite you.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The funeral director thought that might have been the catalyst for their dislike of me.

I'll be honest a funeral director shouldn't be gossiping with you even if they know you outside of their job. In family estrangement and dysfunction (not said in a bad way just the term for it) it's usually so much going on that sure giving you a ring maybe adds fuel to the fire but highly doubtful that was a big enough issue to be vindictive on its own. You mentioned in this thread your two sisters don't talk to you, whatever happened in the past over time is usually the bigger reason/issue.

I'm just annoyed today because I had to go out and buy my son a bed and mattress knowing there are two over there that are going to be disposed in a couple of weeks. And I have to let a stranger sleep on one up until then.

I get being annoyed but I wouldn't focus on it. In the grand scheme it's small and it wouldn't be guaranteed you'd get the beds and furniture just by virtue of wanting them. I also think perhaps focusing on it would be like thinking your sisters are focusing on the ring given to you, these objects are not the big issue. I don't know if the ring has sentimental value to them (it does to you of course) or if it's just the action of giving it to you but unless these beds and the furniture pieces are of sentimental value I wouldn't focus on them and instead would be more concerned about the whole situation such as disposing of the items without discussing it with anyone else giving anyone else the opportunity to take what would be thrown away, clearly profit is not their main goal if they are just throwing it away).

FWIW I do get sentimental things even furniture it just didn't seem like that was the main reason for wanting the furniture. There is a dining room table I have that has been in my family for a long time. It was my grandma and grandpas, then passed to my mom and while my mom has joked and prodded me for years about it I told her under no circumstances did I just want to throw it away. She gave it to me when she was replacing with a better one and it's now sitting in my dining room. It's in desperate need of reupholstering, and needs some tightening up (it's not exactly stable to use as a eating table) but it has high sentimental value to me.

Exactly!! How do I stop her from doing this?

That I don't know but def. agree with others to consult/hire an attorney. At the very least it's going to help you know your rights fully in your particular situation and any applicable laws of where you live. I don't know if they can physically stop her or if it's just punitive after the fact (like monetary compensation or something of that sort).

while my sisters kept telling me she was not of sound mind, they took a check over to her to sign for $22,000 to buy my niece (the squatter's sister) a new car.

This is something similar that happened with my aunt estranged from all of us but at the time not from my grandmother. She was my grandmother's favorite and could do no wrong in her eyes. It was calculated to be around $30K+ over several years leading up to my grandmother's death that she "borrowed" from my grandmother from paying utilities bills when her power and electricity was shut off due to lack of payment, to travel expenses to come visit (which she did only a handful of times due to lack of finances), to other things. She would call up my grandmother and ask for her cc information. While my grandmother was of sound mind she was being played like a fiddle in that respects. My uncle had been the power of attorney financially (and eventually medically) and basically had to take all CCs from my grandmother so she couldn't give the information away and watch 24/7 the bank account. They couldn't stop everything because my grandmother did give permission but it was syphoning money away from her savings that was being used for her (expensive) assisted living care.

When my grandmother passed they (my uncle, mom, and aunt) wanted to deduct the $30K+ from my aunt's share of what money was left over being split but that was just not how it worked. It just made everyone view my aunt in even worse light. When I mentioned earlier about they all thankfully agreeing to allow my aunt to stay in the house it was because since the deed was still in my grandmother's name it was part of the estate and had my estranged aunt not agreed to it the sale would have been forced since no one collectively had enough cash on hand to buy out my aunt. It would have been cruel for my aunt to have forced the sale given the autistic status of my aunt who had lived there for several years. What would have been her cash portion was agreed upon to just be the house (half of a duplex really in a 55+ community) in lieu of selling it and distributing the amount to each person entitled to it.

It's entirely possible your sister played your mom but it does depend also if your mother truly was of sound mind even if being manipulated vs your sister just trying to excuse her controlling actions by saying your mother wasn't.

I'm sorry you're going through all this, it was exhausting for my mom and it took something like 2 years to get through it all

 

[stitch'sgirl]

Agree with hiring an attorney.

Also, don't try to remove things from the house until you have the attorney and things are sorted. I'm unclear why your brother was asking you what you wanted from the house, but don't arrange to take anything at this point. It can really come back to bite you.

Oh boy. My sister said I need to get what I want out TONIGHT. Thank you for the warning.

 

[stitch'sgirl]

I sound like your aunt! Well, not the siphoning money, but the estranged and favorite part, lol!!

I'm sorry you had to go through this. It just is so complicated. Why can't people get along? My sisters have had my blocked on their phones and social media for 3 years now. They didn't even tell me about my mom's burial!

I'll be honest a funeral director shouldn't be gossiping with you even if they know you outside of their job. In family estrangement and dysfunction (not said in a bad way just the term for it) it's usually so much going on that sure giving you a ring maybe adds fuel to the fire but highly doubtful that was a big enough issue to be vindictive on its own. You mentioned in this thread your two sisters don't talk to you, whatever happened in the past over time is usually the bigger reason/issue.

I get being annoyed but I wouldn't focus on it. In the grand scheme it's small and it wouldn't be guaranteed you'd get the beds and furniture just by virtue of wanting them. I also think perhaps focusing on it would be like thinking your sisters are focusing on the ring given to you, these objects are not the big issue. I don't know if the ring has sentimental value to them (it does to you of course) or if it's just the action of giving it to you but unless these beds and the furniture pieces are of sentimental value I wouldn't focus on them and instead would be more concerned about the whole situation such as disposing of the items without discussing it with anyone else giving anyone else the opportunity to take what would be thrown away, clearly profit is not their main goal if they are just throwing it away).

FWIW I do get sentimental things even furniture it just didn't seem like that was the main reason for wanting the furniture. There is a dining room table I have that has been in my family for a long time. It was my grandma and grandpas, then passed to my mom and while my mom has joked and prodded me for years about it I told her under no circumstances did I just want to throw it away. She gave it to me when she was replacing with a better one and it's now sitting in my dining room. It's in desperate need of reupholstering, and needs some tightening up (it's not exactly stable to use as a eating table) but it has high sentimental value to me.

That I don't know but def. agree with others to consult/hire an attorney. At the very least it's going to help you know your rights fully in your particular situation and any applicable laws of where you live. I don't know if they can physically stop her or if it's just punitive after the fact (like monetary compensation or something of that sort).


This is something similar that happened with my aunt estranged from all of us but at the time not from my grandmother. She was my grandmother's favorite and could do no wrong in her eyes. It was calculated to be around $30K+ over several years leading up to my grandmother's death that she "borrowed" from my grandmother from paying utilities bills when her power and electricity was shut off due to lack of payment, to travel expenses to come visit (which she did only a handful of times due to lack of finances), to other things. She would call up my grandmother and ask for her cc information. While my grandmother was of sound mind she was being played like a fiddle in that respects. My uncle had been the power of attorney financially (and eventually medically) and basically had to take all CCs from my grandmother so she couldn't give the information away and watch 24/7 the bank account. They couldn't stop everything because my grandmother did give permission but it was syphoning money away from her savings that was being used for her (expensive) assisted living care.

When my grandmother passed they (my uncle, mom, and aunt) wanted to deduct the $30K+ from my aunt's share of what money was left over being split but that was just not how it worked. It just made everyone view my aunt in even worse light. When I mentioned earlier about they all thankfully agreeing to allow my aunt to stay in the house it was because since the deed was still in my grandmother's name it was part of the estate and had my estranged aunt not agreed to it the sale would have been forced since no one collectively had enough cash on hand to buy out my aunt. It would have been cruel for my aunt to have forced the sale given the autistic status of my aunt who had lived there for several years. What would have been her cash portion was agreed upon to just be the house (half of a duplex really in a 55+ community) in lieu of selling it and distributing the amount to each person entitled to it.

It's entirely possible your sister played your mom but it does depend also if your mother truly was of sound mind even if being manipulated vs your sister just trying to excuse her controlling actions by saying your mother wasn't.

I'm sorry you're going through all this, it was exhausting for my mom and it took something like 2 years to get through it all

 

[Poohlove]

Based on my experiences with estate/trust issues I highly recommend hiring an attorney if for no other reason than guidance. Even the best of relationships can be soured when financial matters need to be settled. Have you tried going to the county offices to see if you can get a copy of the will that way? We were able to get my grandmother's from ours for a very small fee.

 

[starry_solo]

Honestly, you need to hire an attorney right now and have them file paperwork with the court now to stop whatever the heck your sister is doing...

 

[DisneYE]

Thank you this gives me hope. But I also need to take action before that dumpster arrives! The "how" is where I am unsure of.

Your situation is so similar to what happened to me. I also haven't talked to my sister in over 10 years.

When both my parents died without a will my sister proceeded to take possession of both their properties, living in one and renting the other.
She took advantage of me being in a different country 3000 miles away.
I could hire a lawyer and take action but I'm too good natured and don't want the hassle and stress...and I have no need for these properties...plus she's a bum that would starve if she's left to fend for herself. So I let it go.

You're fortunate you're near where this is happening. I would definitely advise to hire a lawyer and claim what is yours if this property is important to you.
Good luck. Family conflicts are the worst and emotionally draining.

 

[stitch'sgirl]

Your situation is so similar to what happened to me. I also haven't talked to my sister in over 10 years.

When both my parents died without a will my sister proceeded to take possession of both their properties, living in one and renting the other.
She took advantage of me being in a different country 3000 miles away.
I could hire a lawyer and take action but I'm too good natured and don't want the hassle and stress...and I have no need for these properties...plus she's a bum that would starve if she's left to fend for herself. So I let it go.

You're fortunate you're near where this is happening. I would definitely advise to hire a lawyer and claim what is yours if this property is important to you.
Good luck. Family conflicts are the worst and emotionally draining.

Wow - that is quite an experience. I'm so sorry for what you went through. I admire your ability to let it go. I have to say I really thought a few years ago this would be a lot smoother.

 

[kymom99]

You might be able to get a mediator? It sounds like there needs to be a neutral party to cut through all the emotions. Of course all the legal issues cost money to address. It’s up to you to decide if it’s worth it. Maybe the relationship you had with your parents is enough for you to let it go and just let your sister do what she is going to do. There is a lot wrong here, but only so much you can do anything about.

Do you have a husband? Or a trusted friend? Hopefully you have someone to help process your grief.