High School:Good Grades vs. Challenging Classes

[Anne34]

My eldest was accepted at Purdue. She has taken mostly honors (weighted) courses throughout high school, both because she liked the challenge and the impact the grades would have on her college entrance and class rack.

My daughter did not receive all "A"'s in her weighted courses, but did have, at the end of junior year, a GPA of about 3.9, with and ACT of 31. We thought she would receive one of the nice scholarships, no problem. Well, surprise surprise, Purdue does not accept weighted grades, plus they only accept grades in 4 core classes. Something about how it is not fair to the students from schools that don't have honors or AP courses.

My daughter's GPA was now below the required 3.8 for Purdue scholarships, without the use of the weighted grades. Sure, her class rank at her school is still high, and while that did matter years ago when I was applying, I guess it doesn't matter so much now. Therefore, no scholarship through Purdue.

It bothers me that my daughter worked so hard all her years of schooling to excel in her honors courses, but it doesn't matter. Our younger daughter, we have decided, will go on a different path. Sure, she will still take college prep, but if Honors Geometry is not her strength, we will steer her away from it and have her take regular Geometry. I wish we knew four years ago what we know now!

Wow!! Purdue is where my daughter wants to go too -- she has a GPA of 4.0 weighted and mid 3's unweighted. Her only B's were her Honors Chemistry and Honors Biology (Both B+'s). She is doing her schedule for next year and is interested in Honors Spanish III -- I should tell her not to bother since it won't help her GPA. She is in the top 11% of her class so far (only a sophomore) Does class rank help?

Thanks for your help -- it helps to talk to parents who have been through it.

 

[Kirby]

Does class rank help?

Yes, look on the college website. It will tell you what score you have to make on the SAT/ACT and what class rank for those scores. Or at least the colleges here in Texas do that.

 

[golfgal]

We are going through both ends of high school registrations, a senior and freshmen. For our senior we have been told that colleges look first at the strength of their schedule then their grades as well as ACT/SAT scores. For incoming freshmen most of their acceptance into the honor's program comes from recommendations from current teachers followed by their grades and standardized test scores.

Our high school has 3 tracks, general, honors and AP. Honors and general are the only classes available to freshmen and sophomores and as juniors and seniors they can then take AP. For exceptional 9th and 10th graders they do make AP course exceptions-but only at the recommendation of the school never the parents and we are talking about kids like a classmate of DS16's that tested out of AP calculus and physics as an 8th grader exceptional. Most kids take a combination of honors/AP based on their interests. The GPA is weighted the same for honors/AP courses but the general track is only rated on a standard 4.0 scale.

The college acceptance rate at our high school is about 94% for 4-year colleges. I think in our area people are more concerned about getting into the program they want vs what name is on your diploma. Our class valedictorian last year got full ride scholarships to every school she applied. She had a perfect score on her ACT and close to perfect on her SAT. She could have gone anywhere but chose to go to the University of Minnesota because they had the program she wanted and the rest didn't.

I think people really need to stop worrying so much about the college their child attends. In the real world it means nothing to most employers. A Harvard grad that can't pull off an interview still isn't going to get a job over someone that had a great interview that went to a state school.

 

[asta]

I have a high school junior and a junior in college. Our experience tells us that for the most competitive schools (Ivy League and out of state applicants at public universities like Univ of NC or Univ of VA) the answer is that you need to have all A's in the most advanced classes at your high school. Any B's are probably not going to be good enough. The other applicants at those schools will have stats like that. (It is a different story if you are an in-state applicant at those public universities.) Also from going through this process, I firmly believe that a high SAT/ACT score is worth more than a high GPA. Credit may be given to valedictorians/salutatorian but beyond that I would put my effort toward a high board score. Another huge help is to apply early decision if you child really wants just that one school. This does make a difference.

With that out of the way, I can tell you that it is not the end of the world if you child does not perform at that level. There are many great schools out there and I think everyone can find a good match. You will be doing your child a huge disservice if you set them up to see only one or two schools as key to their future. Let them find and fall in love with a school that they match up with on skills and interests.

I would also like to point out that we found that in most of the colleges that we looked at three years ago, there are more females on campuses than males. In order to keep a more balanced campus, many schools will admit a male with lower stats than a female. It may not seem fair, but females are somewhat a victim of their own success. For many years the message has been that you have to try harder if you are female. This has resulted in a more competitive pool of female candidates than male candidates.

Another issue with AP classes is that once your child arrives on a college campus they may be registering for advanced courses against upper classmen. In my daughter's case, she could not get the better sessions as a freshman and sophomore because registration is done by total hours and the more advanced classes were full before the registration window was open for her. It is hard to focus on this when you are still in high school but this became a huge headache for her.

 

[goofy4tink]

You've got to be kidding. I'd be pleased as punch if DD could get into our state school, but it is not looking too comfortable that she can, even with several APs and all honors.

I hear ya. We're seeing students with incredible grades as well as wonderful extracurricular stuff that are getting turned down by UMass. That's where my dd would love to end up...and we would be thrilled if she was able to. She was hoping for NYU or Emerson but that is way out of reach, on many levels.

 

[ctinct]

Well, I got some more *cheery* news for this thread.

Just found out 5 minutes ago from one of DD's other safe schools (supposedly EVERYONE gets in here). Well, she didn't. Application denied. A woman at work was so sure my DD would get in here because her daughter's boyfriend got in last year with lots of D's and F's, barely a 1400 on the SATs. But yep, he got in. DD didn't.

Hugs to your daughter. As another poster said, sometimes it is just a matter of demographics.

My daughter is only a sophomore, but I have been following news on various boards about college admissions for a while. It seems that many colleges are seeing huge increases in the number of applicants they have seen this year. Students are applying to more places. A lot of them are shopping for the best aid packages, so there is more competition everywhere. Not to mention that endowments are down, loans are scarcer, etc. It sounds like students who would have been accepted prior years are getting rejected. Check out College Confidential...just be prepared. It's kind of like Lake Woebegon. EVERYONE is above average, but there is still alot of info to be gleaned there.

And here's another hug for your daughter just for good measure.

 

[Christine]

Hugs to your daughter. As another poster said, sometimes it is just a matter of demographics.

My daughter is only a sophomore, but I have been following news on various boards about college admissions for a while. It seems that many colleges are seeing huge increases in the number of applicants they have seen this year. Students are applying to more places. A lot of them are shopping for the best aid packages, so there is more competition everywhere. Not to mention that endowments are down, loans are scarcer, etc. It sounds like students who would have been accepted prior years are getting rejected. Check out College Confidential...just be prepared. It's kind of like Lake Woebegon. EVERYONE is above average, but there is still alot of info to be gleaned there.

And here's another hug for your daughter just for good measure.

Thanks! I have already been on College Confidential. Interesting place.

Yes, I have heard that competition is FIERCE this year. My dd's guidance counselor told me that 2-3 years ago, my dd would have "walked" into the schools she is applying to with no problem--with her very average GPA. Those schools are now denying her. Not even a deferral. I want to stress that I am talking about very average schools in Virginia. She didn't even *think* about applying to UVA or even Va Tech. Out of the questions. She's applied to places like Radford, Virginia Commonwealth, Old Dominion, etc. Schools historically set up for the average student. Our "reach" schools were George Mason and University of Mary Washington. The school that I thought she had the most chance at today was Old Dominion and that's not happening now.

It sucks when your co-worker just tells you a few days ago that *anybody" can get into ODU (as I said earlier, her dd's boyfriend was a very poor student last year but he got in--claims he didn't even fill out his application completely). Oh well.

 

[Disneycrazymom]

You all are making me nervous! Ds is a sophomore and I know this is coming way faster than I would like. He is in a college prep high school (private) and they claim 95% go on to college.

But I know the public schools around us have a lower % grading scale. I worry about his GPA not comparing to the kids who had the advantage of the lower scale. For example he got a 93% in a class and that was a B but in many schools that would be an A. I hope the colleges look at the grading scale as well as the GPA.

 

[Becky2005]

I'm officially freaked....the community college option is looking better & better for my DD.

She will be a Sophmore next year. The school freaked me out at 8th grade parent night by basically telling us to have our kids pick their colleges NOW so they can plan their HS courses. I'm even MORE freaked as it gets closer & closer. She can figure out what she wants to do after the basic 2 years in CC, I don't think she *really* knows what she wants to do when she grows up yet.

She's not in Honors nor will she ever likely be. She's won't be taking AP and I doubt after she gets most of the requirements done she is going to take any high level Science. She's taking Algebra split into 2 years and then will probably take regular Geometry Junior year.

Since her goal really isn't in Science or Math, I'm not too worried about that. She wants to go into acting or fashion design (actually *so far* her major is "Acting/Fashion Design with a minor in Animal Training" I have NO CLUE where she came up with that but that is what she told the Guidance Counselor! It's in writing on her 4 year plan.)

The only thing that we had a disagreement about was her to take French III next year. She doesn't want to but since most colleges want 2 years of language, I'm pushing for her to take it (she took French I in 8th grade but that doesn't go on your HS transcript even though it's a HS level course -- so basically you get punished by taking it that way). She plans on it but told me no way was she taking French IV.

 

[JPN4265]

All I can say is that the school my daughter was accepted into, was more impressed with the idea that even though she had all the credits that were required to graduate when she became a senior, she continued to take advanced courses even during her senior year in high school. This was a major point in her acceptance into the Academy.

 

[PigletsPal2]

Oh man, after reading this thread, I'm glad my kids are out of college age (35 and 42!) That said, my DGD is a HS senior and has been accepted by her first choice school - Florida Southern College, a small Methodist college in Lakeland, FL. They actually heavily recruited her; on her first pre-arranged visit to campus, there was a parking space with a sign that said "Reserved Parking for (DGD)" After that visit she received several notes from the admissions officer AND the financial aid officer, expressing their pleasure at meeting her and their assurance that they would do everything they could to ensure that she could attend FSC. She applied as soon as she could and was accepted w/in a week, with a financial aid letter the following week. With this scholarship and Bright Futures, she should do just fine. BTW, she's in two AP classes (English and Psychology), two Honors classes (Marine Biology (!?) and Economics) and two fun classes (acting and Off Book (a drama class). She's NHS, active in church youth group, and works 8-10 hours a week in a tea shop. She's in the top 10% of seniors in the state of Florida. Sometimes grades aren't the only thing considered.

Thank you for reading my brag note, and I send good wishes and lots of good luck to those parents whose kids are applying for college.

Queen Colleen

 

[SydSim]

I did all honors courses and got B's, sometimes C's in them...My brother did no honors courses and got all A's...he was accepted quickly to my first choice, while I was not...We both had the same amount of extra-curriculars-I probably had more

Geesh, what school was that?

 

[SydSim]

Since her goal really isn't in Science or Math, I'm not too worried about that. She wants to go into acting or fashion design (actually *so far* her major is "Acting/Fashion Design with a minor in Animal Training" I have NO CLUE where she came up with that but that is what she told the Guidance Counselor! It's in writing on her 4 year plan.)

OMG! That's my DD-12! That being said, I told her that with that major, she should work at Animal Kingdom or Seaworld, performing with the animals. I also looked into Disney's College Programs and internships. There's a place for them!

 

[agnes!]

I did all honors courses and got B's, sometimes C's in them...My brother did no honors courses and got all A's...he was accepted quickly to my first choice, while I was not...We both had the same amount of extra-curriculars-I probably had more

Geesh, what school was that?

Yeah....don't leave us hanging.

We just started getting e-mails from colleges/universities. DD's PSATs (taken as a sophomore) must have hit their systems. I know it's only junk mail of a sort, but it still makes me feel better.

agnes!

 

[Christine]

Yeah....don't leave us hanging.

We just started getting e-mails from colleges/universities. DD's PSATs (taken as a sophomore) must have hit their systems. I know it's only junk mail of a sort, but it still makes me feel better.

agnes!

I was getting tons of mail from private colleges. One place called "Mary Baldwin" even keeps calling me. Thank God for Caller ID.

 

[agnes!]

I was getting tons of mail from private colleges. One place called "Mary Baldwin" even keeps calling me. Thank God for Caller ID.

That's in Staunton, it's supposed to be pretty good... We haven't gotten any phone calls yet, but your DD is a year or two older. Maybe the colleges/universities don't start the phone calls until junior and senior year.

agnes!

 

[punkin]

Yes, the junk mail keeps on coming. DD gets stuff from places where she has no chance at all in being actually accepted.

Given the precarious state of the economy, we are mainly looking at state schools anyway. It may not be the best choice for her, but I do not want to saddle her up with a huge debt load in a deflationary economy.

 

[PlutoPony]

Christine (or others "in the know") - what are hearing about how much financial aide the private schools are offering this year? Or is it too early to know firm $$?

 

[Christine]

Christine (or others "in the know") - what are hearing about how much financial aide the private schools are offering this year? Or is it too early to know firm $$?

Personally, I'm not in the know. For financial reasons, we did not apply to any private colleges and knowing that my daughter's GPA was in the toilet so to speak, I knew there would be no aide for her. Historically, though, my friend's kids have received closed to 50% off their private school tuition as long as they were carrying close to a 4.0 GPA.

 

[taximomfor4]

Got a question that someone on here might know, that might help many of us. If a kid is a B-C student in French II and III, and French after III is considered AP, should they continue in to French IV? Does that give any extra oomph to a college app, having that French IV?