DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[sunburnin]

So it's okay for those with DAS to buy Genie+ and ILLs? I thought that was looked at as DAS abuse?

If you get DAS, definitely use these options as a supplement. Some of the ILL rides don't have a DAS option anyway.

It's not abuse at all, but this option is part of what makes DAS so powerful and appealing to scammers.

 

[Unity]

The topic of usage/super-usage is interesting… I started thinking about my own usage and my initial feeling was that gosh, maybe I am a super-user? Because I’m a frequent AP visitor, and my last park day felt really full. Like I’d done a lot. I was in HS for around 7 hours, which is a really long time for me, and I was wiped out after.

But thinking back, I did a whopping… ONE attraction with DAS. Another as SB because it was a 5-min wait. Seriously, two rides in 7 hours? What the heck was I doing the other 6ish hours?! There was a very long dinner with friends. Snapping some fun photos. A long snack break while catching up with a friend. Sitting in the shade, people watching for a while.

It felt like a really busy, fun, full day, and I’d have sworn I rode a bunch of rides, but nope.

On the flip side, the one time I tried G+ when it was first out, I did a BUNCH of rides - I want to say I topped out at HS at 7 or 8 - in about the same amount of time… but it didn’t feel particularly fun. I felt accomplished: like I’d ticked every item off a chore list. But it didn’t feel particularly great, if that makes any sense at all.

Sorry to get all philosophical lol! If nothing else, all of the discussions here so far have been helpful in thinking about what I like about WDW, what I want out of a visit, and whether it still holds adequate value for me.

One thing to keep in mind is that one DAS user's wipe time may be different from yours. And that is okay!

If someone can't stand to be in line for over a half hour at once, doesn't particularly mean they can't handle it a number of times over the course of one eight hour day.

 

[PurpleKomodo]

I have popped in and out of this thread several times since it started. I don't have the kind of immediate skin in the game as many of the posters because we don't have a trip planned with our disabled kiddo for quite awhile. But, I just wanted to chime in some perspective (even though I might get blasted for some of it). For reference, I have a medically complex five year old. He is a wheelchair user and typically navigates the parks in a large power wheelchair that is loaded down with all his respiratory, emergency, and feeding equipment. We have previously used both the online registration and the in person registration and been granted DAS at both WDW and DLR. I have no idea if we will still qualify as he does not have a cognitive or behavioral reason to not be able to wait in lines. I'm not going to get into all the reasons why waiting in lines is hard to avoid providing a script for anyone searching.

We recently visited a more local amusement park. This provided some real perspective and reminded us why Disney, even if we no longer qualify for DAS, will still be more accessible than most parks for us. At the local amusement park, we opted not to go through Guest Services for any sort of Disability pass because the rides he could ride there were mostly kiddie rides with short lines. But, because we opted NOT to use that service, we were scrutinized multiple times if he could ride a kiddie ride. Because he is in a wheelchair. We were asked for the park's disability document to use a wheelchair entrance to attractions. We would tell employees that he could wait in line, but his wheelchair won't fit in the line. I was told at one attraction that they had to see him walk to board. I told them he couldn't walk and they let us board anyway, so why ask, in front of my fully aware 5 year old. Basically, it was not fun to navigate it with a disabled child. And most of the teenagers/young adults working acted as if they had literally never encountered a person in a wheelchair before. No matter what happens with our DAS eligibility at Disney, I know we will not be treated like that....ever....and so they will continue to beat most theme park situations on that front.

That being said, my primary concerns as I process what touring the parks without DAS would look like for my family and am reading some early first person experiences really boil down to why G+ isn't great for us and concerns around the party size situations. We are a family of 5 (2 parents, 3 kids). Due to the significance of the needs of my youngest, we always bring an extra caregiver with us to Disney. Sometimes that is my Mom and sometimes it is a staff member that is not related to us. So, a hard limit at 4, with the option of "part of the group waits and joins up at the loading station" sounds like a logistical nightmare. It will certainly take longer than the regular line to accomplish this meet up as the people waiting would need to be tipped off by the people in line that they are close, and then try to get into the LL and get through and .... I am sure someone is waiting at the loading platform awkwardly taking up space waiting for the other party to get to them. I really think that is something that sounds good in theory, but execution will be messy and cumbersome. When I travel with my extended family and we are a total group of 17, I have never tried to add them all to my DAS, but it sure would be nice if at least the people staying in my resort room could be able to stay together. We also pay a lot of crip tax when it comes to time in the parks already. It takes us longer to get through security, go to the restroom, eat a meal, and walk through crowded spaces than a family that isn't dealing with the level of complexity that we are, so adding complexity and time to our day just doesn't feel very accommodating.

Which brings me to why G+ isn't a great alternative for us. We typically buy G+ as my disabled kiddo is still too short for some E-tickets that my other kids will want to ride. But, my issue with using G+ for everything really boils down to the return time windows. DAS windows are open ended. G+ and ILL are not. Because of how long everything takes us, as I said above, I am genuinely concerned that we would miss more windows than we would make and be overly dependent on cast member mercy to let us into the line after our window was over. Having to rebook them constantly reduces our likelihood of getting our money's worth out of it because of return times selling out.

Like I said, Disney will still be more accessible than most places we go for entertainment, but I have some real fear about how the changes will impact our ability to tour the parks as efficiently and low stress as we have with DAS. Maybe we will still qualify. We won't know for awhile. But, those are really the things that have continued to strike me as concerns with what this roll out looks like.

 

[Unity]

There are people who prefer to be naked. The rules can't change every time someone has a preference - or there would effectively be no DAS or even LL because EVERYONE would be in that line.

While I agree with the rest of your post... it seems a bit ill in taste to compare someone wanting to be naked in public to someone wanting to spend time with their family for long waits. [Especially for the longest of waits.] One happens for a lot [not all] people at Disney while one has a law against it.

But the overall sentiment I agree with, except in very much edge cases with small children.

 

[DisneyOma]

Realistically families separate for all kinds of reasons while at Disney that have nothing to do with disabilities. Height restrictions. Ride preferences. The need for a nap. The twelfth time someone is hungry. A shopportunity. Someone may want to sleep in - it is vacation after all - and someone else may not want to stay all the way to park close. None of these choices (or preferences or whatever) in any way negate the value of family time at Disney.

I have said elsewhere that I actually loved being able to make sure both of my kids were able to have positive experiences when their preferences didn’t necessarily align. And now sometimes I choose to ride, and other times I’ll enjoy sitting on a bench with my husband (my kids would say it’s “super romantico”). And once or twice I will even - gasp - take time for myself!

A DESIRE not to be split up is not the same as a genuine NEED. That’s why a single parent with kids too young to be in line by themselves may be given more accommodations than a group with multiple able bodied adults capable of waiting in the standby line.

I am not sure waiting while other people line up for things or going on separate rides sometimes is anything particularly new or something that would give Walt Disney much distress.

Families can do so many things together at Disney World.


I’m not sure GAC, DAS, FP, Genie+ or LL were on his radar back then. Lol.

And times change. Crowds build. People with disabilities now have a voice. Accommodations are made. But compromise is necessary.

I think people forget DL opened in the '50s. We should probably keep that in mind and not look at it through rose colored glasses.

The reality is accommodations are meant to get the experience as close as reasonably possible to a “typical” guest experience… and typical families at Disney run into many moments where they may need to split up in lines. Expecting your family to always be together because of wanting to experience it together, 100% of the time would be an accommodation above the normal park experience.

Others have mentioned the numerous other aspects of a visit that the family can do together. It's also important to note that in almost all scenarios Disney is still allowing the party to RIDE together, which had always been my understanding of Walt's dream. No attractions at WDW have upper height maximums, meaning adults and children can ride together unlike many other amusement parks -- particularly in that 1950's era. However families have been splitting up for years if there was a child too short, too young, didn't want to ride, etc.

There is a really big difference between a carrousel and a modern E-ticket.

I WANT to eat all table service at the perfect times for no more cost or time than the typical family without allergies can mobile order QS - but I can't. It's not uncommon that we even have to split and eat at multiple locations because the one who can handle X allergy can't handle the selective eater or Y allergy. We've had to take 2+ hours just to get quick service, and easily spend a solid 6 hours on just acquiring food in a totally normal park day.

Our preference would be to stick together and get all this done in 30 minute pops, but sometimes our needs stop that from being a reality. It's not on the other guests or the park itself to be asked to change so that we can do it the way we PREFER.

There are people who prefer to be naked. The rules can't change every time someone has a preference - or there would effectively be no DAS or even LL because EVERYONE would be in that line.

When it was a small company sure……today Disney is a billion dollar business. You cannot compare it.

If the Disney family felt that way they should have retained ownership.

BUT that sentiment is a possible solution.
Visiting local family owned parks that offer more streamlined services.
As popular as Disney has become they have too many people legitimately qualifying for DAS under the old rules.

Family owned parks may not.

Y'all missed the point - my response was to the PP who stated that being together at Disney was just a wish - but actually, Disney came up with the idea while watching his kids have fun without him. He wanted families to stay together. Did he mean just for the 2 minute ride? I doubt it. That's not on the program at WDW, for certain, anymore, but it started with Walt, wanting families to be together. Sad that's not the climate now.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

I understand. My daughter and I have a short August trip planned, and a longer "13th Birthday Extravaganza" trip planned for December. If she no longer qualifies for DAS, and the options given by Disney do not work for us during the August trip, we will be cancelling the December birthday trip we have been planning for eons. It IS really sad. I get it. I am scared of Universal because it overwhelms me because I know literally nothing, but we will be trying it out in December instead if WDW isn't an option for us.

FWIW, My family absolutely adores universal. It is so much simpler. You do not need to run all over the park generally. Express pass is a breeze to use. If you qualify for their Disability service , I believe you use the express pass line.

Harry potter world is wonderful, albeit crowded. They also have the best water park by far. Some of their rides are definitely more intense, So that is not always a bonus. The ride systems can also be a bit repetitive.

But honestly they are fun.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Y'all missed the point - my response was to the PP who stated that being together at Disney was just a wish - but actually, Disney came up with the idea while watching his kids have fun without him. He wanted families to stay together. Did he mean just for the 2 minute ride? I doubt it. That's not on the program at WDW, for certain, anymore, but it started with Walt, wanting families to be together. Sad that's not the climate now.

We all got the point IMO but disagreed with using Walt and Disneyland (or WDW for that matter TBH) to utilize the point, because when Walt was talking about families having a place to go together he was talking about it in a society where many were excluded for one reason or another. He didn't design his park for families with children who have disabilities in mind (certainly not cognitive disabilities much less mobility issues) not to mention persons of color (the realities of the cost ratio and not having the means to get there often excluded them) nor poor families for the most part. He was a product of his time. On a thread about disabilities it's not going to be the best rebuttal IMO.

 

[mistysue]

While I agree with the rest of your post... it seems a bit ill in taste to compare someone wanting to be naked in public to someone wanting to spend time with their family for long waits. [Especially for the longest of waits.] One happens for a lot [not all] people at Disney while one has a law against it.

But the overall sentiment I agree with, except in very much edge cases with small children.

I was just going for a random thing as the "preference" that I didn't think anyone was going to jump in and try to argue was totally fine.

 

[CmdrThor]

So it's okay for those with DAS to buy Genie+ and ILLs? I thought that was looked at as DAS abuse?

What can Guests do during their DAS virtual wait?

Answer​

Guests utilizing DAS can enjoy many other experiences throughout Walt Disney World Resort during a DAS virtual wait, such as other rides, shows, concerts, parades and Character Greetings. They can also take a rest in a break area, get something to eat or go shopping.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

Disney excludes those of us who can’t easily transfer from wheelchairs on many, many rides. They could have very easily built a “mission. observation room” in FoP to enable people who don’t fit the ride equipment to at least see the video. Run a walkthrough of RoR to enable wheels users to experience at least some of the attraction. The list goes on. I’m stuck asking my friends and family about their experience with no shared knowledge basis. It’s pretty aggravating and mentally upsetting.

That's a bit unrealistic. Shutting down a ride for a walk through? Or am I not understanding?

 

[nalababybear]

Posters have stated here and on other forums that this is DAS abuse.

And they are wrong. Genie+ is a paid service. DAS is an accommodation.

They happen to both utilize the LL to access the ride.

In fact, for those with limited dwell time in the parks due to their disabilities, it is encouraged to leverage G+.

 

[SueM in MN]

I'm sorry to hear the Guest Relations staff wasn't helpful, but they won't have details of the process at each attraction. The process to return to the queue will vary by attraction; you basically find your way out to a CM -- most likely that is back to the entrance but if close to the merge point or load it may be ahead. That CM will let you know how to re-enter the queue/rejoin your party.

Agree
From everything I've read, there is no set procedure that fits every attraction because every attraction is different. The same attraction can even have different processes depending on where you are in the line. I've even read multiple accounts of guests being escorted backstage by a CM to 'secret' CM bathrooms and then back into the attraction.

It doesn't appear to be a new procedure at all. It has been available for many years according what people are writing. As far as I know, Disney never had anything about it in writing before, but has chosen to put it prominently on their websites and make sure people who might need to leave the line to know it's available

This new process has been so chaotic and stressful for families. And then I wonder will this actually stop abuse if you don’t require any form of documentation? Just spending some time here or on other platforms, you can find out that they are just looking to see if you can’t stand in lines. What is stopping people from lying about this? There is no way to prove this over a video chat.

So is this new system the best way to fight abuse or just for them to get more people buying Genie plus ?

Documentaion/proof has been discussed many times on this thread already.
Honest people will give honest proof and ask for the amount of access they need.
Dishonest people will come up with ways to fake documentation and will lie or exaggerate their access needs.
There are 'rent-a-doctors' who will pretty write whatever someone wants for a price and there are people who will make their own fake documents.
The system used by Universal for documentation doesn't appear to be very robust. Many of the things they accept don't say anything about needs in a theme park queue (for example, handicapped parking permit) and the 'requested accommodations' are filled out by the person, not verified by documentation.
Also, I've read a lot of reports from people who got temporary approval within an hour or less of submission and final approval soon after.
There are a lot of people who say anyone who is 'really disabled' would provide documentation, so those who don't must be faking. Many of us COULD provide documentation, but don't want to share with a marketing company with no medical background.

 

[mistysue]

That's a bit unrealistic. Shutting down a ride for a walk through? Or am I not understanding?

I would think they could let people go through to the part where you line up to be prisoners just before loading into cars, then do a video version as people maybe did a moving sidewalk return to the exit area? There has to be a way to get people that first half of the experience that wouldn't change anything for other users.

But this is certainly a much better example of exclusion than "I am excluded because my family separates during the line before riding together"

 

[SteveMouse]

That's a bit unrealistic. Shutting down a ride for a walk through? Or am I not understanding?

It would be perfectly plausible to have a walk-through mode without ride vehicles operating for a couple of hours each day or to again utilize an “observer” option where a video feed (or “recording”) of the “mission” is available to”rebel leaders” (aka those not on the ride but part of the riders’ park party) who are in a secure “bunker” in another location.

That would at least enable a shared experience rather than the wheelchair user being stuck in ilmbo.

 

[jjpet]

Y'all missed the point - my response was to the PP who stated that being together at Disney was just a wish - but actually, Disney came up with the idea while watching his kids have fun without him. He wanted families to stay together. Did he mean just for the 2 minute ride? I doubt it. That's not on the program at WDW, for certain, anymore, but it started with Walt, wanting families to be together. Sad that's not the climate now.

With respect (and I really mean that) - I think this is all in the eye of the beholder. My son has several diagnoses including intellectual disability, and the first time we walked into Carsland at DLR my husband and I both became extremely emotional. Our son was OBSESSED with Cars, and was socially cut off from the world in many ways owing to his various disabilities - but even just walking down that main street we felt like we were able to enter into HIS world. Watching him interact with the various landmarks in the park, etc. felt like we were all in some giant playground *together*. That was such a magical experience. The rides are definitely an important part of the magic, but they are not the *only* important thing. The music, the architecture, the smells, the sounds, the kinetic energy, the atmosphere, the theming... is so set apart from ordinary life, or even most other amusement park experiences that it can transport someone to a different place if they let it. It is not enough to overwhelm our son's disability, we will still have to cope with that. And though I've gone through a whole spectrum of emotions about the changes to DAS (that he may not be given it even though he 100% still qualifies) and that even with DAS our family will be separated for sections of the day, but there will also be special times that we will share together... and seeing a kiddo's eyes light up while they tell me something that happened when we were apart is also special in it's own way - it is it's own unique experience.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

I would think they could let people go through to the part where you line up to be prisoners just before loading into cars, then do a video version as people maybe did a moving sidewalk return to the exit area? There has to be a way to get people that first half of the experience that wouldn't change anything for other users.

But this is certainly a much better example of exclusion than "I am excluded because my family separates during the line before riding together"

True. It is unrealistic to expect Is every single ride to meet every suitable physical limitation of every person.

People get excluded for height requirements, People get excluded for size requirements. Sometimes health reasons prevent it. They do the best they can to build a ride In such a way that it includes as many groups as possible while making it safe as well.

For RotR I could see what your suggesting working, But that would require allowing a decent number of people to probably exit via the back stage emergency exits. I doubt they want that on a regular basis.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

It would be perfectly plausible to have a walk-through mode without ride vehicles operating for a couple of hours each day or to again utilize an “observer” mode where a video feed (or “recording”) of the “mission” is available to rebel leaders who are in a secure “bunker” in another location.

That would at least enable a shared experience rather than the wheelchair user stuck ilmbo.

I respectfully disagree. Considering the high level of usage of that ride , shutting it down for a couple of hours for walk-through is unreasonable.

 

[SirDuff]

Y'all missed the point - my response was to the PP who stated that being together at Disney was just a wish - but actually, Disney came up with the idea while watching his kids have fun without him. He wanted families to stay together. Did he mean just for the 2 minute ride? I doubt it. That's not on the program at WDW, for certain, anymore, but it started with Walt, wanting families to be together. Sad that's not the climate now.

And, you, apparently, missed the points of all the other posters. Or you're ignoring it. When Walt had his idea, his thinking would have excluded many people with disabilities entirely. Not only could they not ride with their family, in many cases, they wouldn't have even been able to enter the park due to various barriers.

 

[starlite_]

Which brings me to why G+ isn't a great alternative for us. We typically buy G+ as my disabled kiddo is still too short for some E-tickets that my other kids will want to ride. But, my issue with using G+ for everything really boils down to the return time windows. DAS windows are open ended. G+ and ILL are not. Because of how long everything takes us, as I said above, I am genuinely concerned that we would miss more windows than we would make and be overly dependent on cast member mercy to let us into the line after our window was over. Having to rebook them constantly reduces our likelihood of getting our money's worth out of it because of return times selling out.

I don't know if you are aware, but you can modify G+ windows without loosing the time you have already waited for it.

As a quick example, lets say you book a LL for Haunted Mansion for 12-1 pm at 10am. Something happens at 12pm and you know you won't be able to make the return window, you can modify the LL for a later return if available (not only for a later HM return, but for any ride available, so you could modify for a Jungle Cruise return if you wished). So you could modify to get a 2-3pm return window, and since two hours have passed since you booked it (in the scenario, this LL was originally booked at 10am) you can now book another LL. So you don't "loose" the time you already waiting for it like you would if you simply cancelled it.

 

[mistysue]

True. It is unrealistic to expect Is every single ride to meet every suitable physical limitation of every person.

People get excluded for height requirements, People get excluded for size requirements. Sometimes health reasons prevent it. They do the best they can to build a ride In such a way that it includes as many groups as possible while making it safe as well.

For RotR I could see what your suggesting working, But that would require allowing a decent number of people to probably exit via the back stage emergency exits. I doubt they want that on a regular basis.

Yes. I don't know enough about how their backstage is arranged (or any of the physical locations during the experience) but suspect they could put some appropriate "back door" together - even if it meant boarding that transfer ship in reverse if it actually moves? Or just a walkway "cave" that went around it and gave people an exit back near the front. I would be surprised if there wasn't any possibility there.