Can DVC do this..?

It DOES say they can modify the vacation club agreement at any time, but they do specify this part pretty clearly, and there are likely legal ramifications for not providing some tangible use advantage for owners.

Quoting:

"DVCMC reserves the right in its sole, absolute and unfettered discretion to extend or decrease the Home Resort Priority Period; provided, however, in no event shall the Home Resort Priority Period be for a period of less than one (1) month prior to the period during which the other Club Members have the right to reserve that Vacation Home during that Use Day. In addition, DVCMC reserves the right to establish a continental or other preference periods in the event resorts located outside of the jurisdictional limits of the United States are associated as DVC Resorts."

Looks like the language also assures current owners the ability to book resorts other than their home resort. Future sales could certainly restrict or remove that option but may negatively impact occupancy should people have to more closely monitor and plan their visits.
 
We read the contract and asked ourselves if we would be OK just staying at our home resort. Even buying direct, after reading the language in the contract, it seemed to us that staying there with a 1 month booking priority was the only guarantee. Everything else was just fluff.

Just reread the contract. Its amazing what you don't notice the first time. Anyone ever noticed the "Special season preference list" section? That one was new to me. Or they have the ability to charge reservation booking fees on non-home resort reservations?

I don't think they would take away the ability for resale buyers to book at a non-home resort, because that would really tank value, but then again it's the mouse. I can't even predict what they'll do down the line. The only thing I would expect is for them to continue tinkering. The only constant is change.
 
Actually, in the early years of DVC, the Special Season Preference List was used for a couple years or so. It was deemed unnecessary and hasn't been used since.
 
They could make changes across the board, but I think they would run afoul of the law if they try to make different rules for different people with regards to the real estate use. Now if DVC wanted to buy up a bunch of rooms at certain resorts and transfer their ownership to different entity and allow for certain members to book those rooms with different reservation windows then it would be different. I don't see them doing that as it would cost a lot of money and add a lot of complexity to the system.
I honestly don't understand why they don't give people who buy from disney a certain number of fast passes...ie. 1 fastpass for every 5 points purchased every year for 5 years. That would be a huge incentive to buy direct and not cost disney anything at all.
This is essentially how Marriott has handled the points system. They now have a points system with it's own inventory and the weeks system with it's own inventory. The only access to either by each side is if someone on the other side gives up what they own.
 

We read the contract and asked ourselves if we would be OK just staying at our home resort. Even buying direct, after reading the language in the contract, it seemed to us that staying there with a 1 month booking priority was the only guarantee. Everything else was just fluff.

Just reread the contract. Its amazing what you don't notice the first time. Anyone ever noticed the "Special season preference list" section? That one was new to me. Or they have the ability to charge reservation booking fees on non-home resort reservations?

I don't think they would take away the ability for resale buyers to book at a non-home resort, because that would really tank value, but then again it's the mouse. I can't even predict what they'll do down the line. The only thing I would expect is for them to continue tinkering. The only constant is change.


For a time in the 1990's, the Christmas holiday period was a designated special season preference list. The home resort priority right did not apply. You could put yourself on a list for any paticular resort, including one not your home, for the Christmas holidays starting two years in advance. Then at about one year out, MS would start calling those on the list in the order on which they got on the list to determine if they were or were not going to actually reserve the period specified, and would continue making those calls until either the resort was full or the list ended. That special season list was ended, and one was likely never adopted again, because it was too much of a hassle for MS to handle every year. I would not expect another one to be created except possibly for an unusual occassion such as the Olympics coming to Orlando.

They do not have the right to charge reservation booking fees for any DVC resort reservations made by members, whether home or non-home. The documents provide for how the costs of the reservation systems are to be paid as part of dues and breakage income, and the contracts with the Disney entities that run the reservation systems do not allow those entities to charge additonal fees for member reservations of DVC resorts. Moreover, under Florida timeshare law, any fees outside of dues, or the reservation of a right to charge such fees, for making reservations at the timeshare resort must be clearly spelled out in the public offering documents or no such right will exist, and a statement that the developer generally reserves the right to change or amend the documents is insufficient to constitute a reserved right to charge reservation fees. Those restrictions, however, do not apply to non-DVC resort reservations and thus you have the $95 fee for trade-outs to non-DVC resorts.

As to taking away rights to reserve DVC resorts other than your own, it is a lot more difficult than some have suggested. Once a resort is made part of the multisite DVC system, the documents provide that it will remain a site in that system until its DVC end date and subject to reservations by owners from other DVC resorts unless it is earlier removed from the multisite sytem and that can only happen if: (a) a resort is destroyed and cannot be rebuilt; (b) the resort is taken over by the government via eminent domain; (c) the relevant Disney entity managing the resort or the inter-resort reservation system becomes insolvent or goes bankrupt; (d) the owner/members of the resort (the actual members not some Disney designee), by a vote equalling at least 60% of the ownership interests in each and every unit in the resort, vote to remove the resort from the DVC system or vote to remove the Disney entities that are manging the resort; or (e) the applicable association and the Buena Vista Trading Company (the entity that is responsible for the reservation system for the multisite reservations) mutually agree to terminate the contract to provide such services. A though D are obviously events highly likely not to occur. It is (e) that might create some concern but the relevant entities are deemed fiduciaries of the owners and thus better have a real good reason that benefits members for terminating the contract. DVD does not have any right or discretion to change the reasons allowed or ignore them or to just abolish the multisite sytem if it feels like it. Note that in the situation of destruction of all or part of a resort, there can be temporary suspension of rights to reserve the affected resorts or parts while there is reconstruction.
 
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For a time in the 1990's, the Christmas holiday period was a designated special season preference list. The home resort priority right did not apply. You could put yourself on a list for any paticular resort, including one not your home, for the Christmas holidays starting two years in advance. Then at about one year out, MS would start calling those on the list in the order on which they got on the list to determine if they were or were not going to actually reserve the period specified, and would continue making those calls until either the resort was full or the list ended. That special season list was ended, and one was likely never adopted again, because it was too much of a hassle for MS to handle every year. I would not expect another one to be created except possibly for an unusual occassion such as the Olympics coming to Orlando.

They do not have the right to charge reservation booking fees for any DVC resort reservations made by members, whether home or non-home. The documents provide for how the costs of the reservation systems are to be paid as part of dues and breakage income, and the contracts with the Disney entities that run the reservation systems do not allow those entities to charge additonal fees for member reservations of DVC resorts. Moreover, under Florida timeshare law, any fees outside of dues, or the reservation of a right to charge such fees, for making reservations at the timeshare resort must be clearly spelled out in the public offering documents or no such right will exist, and a statement that the developer generally reserves the right to change or amend the documents is insufficient to constitute a reserved right to charge reservation fees. Those restrictions, however, do not apply to non-DVC resort reservations and thus you have the $95 fee for trade-outs to non-DVC resorts.

As to taking away rights to reserve DVC resorts other than your own, it is a lot more difficult than some have suggested. Once a resort is made part of the multisite DVC system, the documents provide that it will remain a site in that system until its DVC end date and subject to reservations by owners from other DVC resorts unless it is earlier removed from the multisite sytem and that can only happen if: (a) a resort is destroyed and cannot be rebuilt; (b) the resort is taken over by the government via eminent domain; (c) the relevant Disney entity managing the resort or the inter-resort reservation system becomes insolvent or goes bankrupt; (d) the owner/members of the resort (the actual members not some Disney designee), by a vote equalling at least 60% of the ownership interests in each and every unit in the resort, vote to remove the resort from the DVC system or vote to remove the Disney entities that are manging the resort; or (e) the applicable association and the Buena Vista Trading Company (the entity that is responsible for the reservation system for the multisite reservations) mutually agree to terminate the contract to provide such services. A though D are obviously events highly likely not to occur. It is (e) that might create some concern but the relevant entities are deemed fiduciaries of the owners and thus better have a real good reason that benefits members for terminating the contract. DVD does not have any right or discretion to change the reasons allowed or ignore them or to just abolish the multisite sytem if it feels like it. Note that in the situation of destruction of all or part of a resort, there can be temporary suspension of rights to reserve the affected resorts or parts while there is reconstruction.

Interesting about the special season. Nice history lesson.

It's probably new, but they have reserved the right to charge an "in-bound exchange fee" for Ko Olina Resort if it experiences higher than average use demand compared to other resorts. I thought I read somewhere they had put that in for the others, but I'm unable to find it in the POS right now.

I agree that getting rid of the non home reservation booking system would be extremely difficult and unpleasant, most likely tanking resale values. It's the nuclear option, but it's there. But why would they do that?
 
It's probably new, but they have reserved the right to charge an "in-bound exchange fee" for Ko Olina Resort if it experiences higher than average use demand compared to other resorts. I thought I read somewhere they had put that in for the others, but I'm unable to find it in the POS right now.

Did not know about Aulani but its program is ruled by Hawaiin law not Florida and likely that possible exchange fee has been in there since the beginning for Aulani and thus would even be properly reserved under Florida law. I have seen nothing to show any such terms for the WDW resorts (I do not have documents for non-WDW resorts).
 
/
Did not know about Aulani but its program is ruled by Hawaiin law not Florida and likely that possible exchange fee has been in there since the beginning for Aulani and thus would even be properly reserved under Florida law. I have seen nothing to show any such terms for the WDW resorts (I do not have documents for non-WDW resorts).

We bought at VGF so its a new one. I just found the clause. They also reserve the right at future DVC properties. So VGF?/Poly on I guess they can charge an in-bound exchange fee, IF demand is high.
 
We bought at VGF so its a new one. I just found the clause. They also reserve the right at future DVC properties. So VGF?/Poly on I guess they can charge an in-bound exchange fee, IF demand is high.
'Demand' is ALWAYS going to be HIGH. Timeshare intends for nearly 100% occupancy year-round. My read is they've reserved that right "just in case we feel like generating extra revenue." :(
 
We bought at VGF so its a new one. I just found the clause. They also reserve the right at future DVC properties. So VGF?/Poly on I guess they can charge an in-bound exchange fee, IF demand is high.

I assume you are referring to something in the multi-site public offeriung stament. I am not finding it in AKV and pre-AKV, but I want to make sure I am not overlooking something. Do you have a section number or page number where that appears?
 
For a time in the 1990's, the Christmas holiday period was a designated special season preference list. The home resort priority right did not apply. You could put yourself on a list for any paticular resort, including one not your home, for the Christmas holidays starting two years in advance. Then at about one year out, MS would start calling those on the list in the order on which they got on the list to determine if they were or were not going to actually reserve the period specified, and would continue making those calls until either the resort was full or the list ended. That special season list was ended, and one was likely never adopted again, because it was too much of a hassle for MS to handle every year. I would not expect another one to be created except possibly for an unusual occassion such as the Olympics coming to Orlando.

They do not have the right to charge reservation booking fees for any DVC resort reservations made by members, whether home or non-home. The documents provide for how the costs of the reservation systems are to be paid as part of dues and breakage income, and the contracts with the Disney entities that run the reservation systems do not allow those entities to charge additonal fees for member reservations of DVC resorts. Moreover, under Florida timeshare law, any fees outside of dues, or the reservation of a right to charge such fees, for making reservations at the timeshare resort must be clearly spelled out in the public offering documents or no such right will exist, and a statement that the developer generally reserves the right to change or amend the documents is insufficient to constitute a reserved right to charge reservation fees. Those restrictions, however, do not apply to non-DVC resort reservations and thus you have the $95 fee for trade-outs to non-DVC resorts.

As to taking away rights to reserve DVC resorts other than your own, it is a lot more difficult than some have suggested. Once a resort is made part of the multisite DVC system, the documents provide that it will remain a site in that system until its DVC end date and subject to reservations by owners from other DVC resorts unless it is earlier removed from the multisite sytem and that can only happen if: (a) a resort is destroyed and cannot be rebuilt; (b) the resort is taken over by the government via eminent domain; (c) the relevant Disney entity managing the resort or the inter-resort reservation system becomes insolvent or goes bankrupt; (d) the owner/members of the resort (the actual members not some Disney designee), by a vote equalling at least 60% of the ownership interests in each and every unit in the resort, vote to remove the resort from the DVC system or vote to remove the Disney entities that are manging the resort; or (e) the applicable association and the Buena Vista Trading Company (the entity that is responsible for the reservation system for the multisite reservations) mutually agree to terminate the contract to provide such services. A though D are obviously events highly likely not to occur. It is (e) that might create some concern but the relevant entities are deemed fiduciaries of the owners and thus better have a real good reason that benefits members for terminating the contract. DVD does not have any right or discretion to change the reasons allowed or ignore them or to just abolish the multisite sytem if it feels like it. Note that in the situation of destruction of all or part of a resort, there can be temporary suspension of rights to reserve the affected resorts or parts while there is reconstruction.
While I doubt they would, they could charge reservation fees if they wanted, they'd just have to back it out of the dues. Cancellation/change fees are also possible but almost as unlikely.
 
'Demand' is ALWAYS going to be HIGH. Timeshare intends for nearly 100% occupancy year-round. My read is they've reserved that right "just in case we feel like generating extra revenue." :(

Yah I thought that too.

I assume you are referring to something in the multi-site public offeriung stament. I am not finding it in AKV and pre-AKV, but I want to make sure I am not overlooking something. Do you have a section number or page number where that appears?

In our multi-site public offering statement that we received may 2014, the text portion page 4. 3 a. "Demand balancing and vacation points" section 1 has the bit about Aulani. But then in the overview it has the mention on page 9 (85 overall) about resorts in the future. Very last paragraph of V. Use attributes and restrictions.
Edit: Rereading makes me think I jumped the gun on the new properties. The language is hazy and just says about not being able to balance demand at times. But then it goes clearly on to state about Aulani. Most likely a HI FL thing as you pointed out. My apologies!
 
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Those sections in the pre-Aulani resorts do not mention anything about a possible exchange fee in the future.
 
Actually, in the early years of DVC, the Special Season Preference List was used for a couple years or so. It was deemed unnecessary and hasn't been used since.
We used that for the week after Christmas in 2001. 4 months after 9/11, and they ended up begging for guests. I remember that New Year's Eve tickets for Downtown Disney were 50% off.
 
The ability to book at non-home DVC resorts is not guaranteed in your contract. The only thing you are guaranteed is the ability to reserve a room at your home resort at 11 months out if there is availability.

DVD has the right to change the home resort booking advantage as well. Right now you have 4 months advantage at your home resort. DVD can make that 1 month, 0 months or 10 months. Their discretion.

Its all in the paperwork you received when you purchased.

I actually don't think it's true (well, it is true but not in the way that you mean).

The reason why they don't guarantee the ability to reserve a room is because a resort could be booked up, and they don't want people complaining that they couldn't book at VGF at the 7-month window, not because they plan on blocking out resale members from booking outside the home resort.

Here is the BLT Condominium Declaration:
http://or.occompt.com/recorder/eagl...532599&id=DOC293S21987.A0&parent=DOC293S21987

The process of booking DVC outside of your home resort is laid out in the Condominium Declaration and explains the process as we all know it (section 12.12).

One interesting note is that the agreement with BLT to the DVC Reservation Component (the exchange that allows you to reserve outside your home resort), ends on 1/31/2057, while the BLT contract ends in 2060 if I remember correctly. I suppose it theoretically possible that they could change it from the years of 2057-2060.

Based on the Condominium Declaration, they cannot give reservation priority to one member over the other for any reason, both Home Resort booking and non-home resort booking. Must be "first come, first served" (sections 12.12.1 and 12.12.2).

Could they blow up the current exchange and start a new one like OP is suggesting? I don't know, but I feel that would be a pretty risky move by Disney from a legal perspective. Not only DVD, but the individual DVC resort management associations (who would have to agree to pull out of the exchange) as well.
 
I would assume they can.
I further assume you are talking about resale contracts?
If so, there is an important point that is easy to over look: Doing so would also hurt members who purchase directly from Disney.
When you switch out at the 7 month window, at the simplest level, a trade has occurred. You traded your week at resort X for a week at Resort Y. Now, resort X has an "extra" week available. Someone trades for that.

If you eliminate the ability for resale contracts to book at another resort, that is one person that can not "trade" out, meaning there is one less person that can "trade in".

Your question begs the further question of Why would they do that? Disney is going to do what is best for Disney, and what they think will make them the most money. A move like this would Tarnish the DVC product offering, and would not make them any extra money.

The recent moves will make(save) them money, that is a lot of potential non discounted annual passes in the future.

Furthermore, realize that DVC is under no obligation to make any new constructions part of the existing 'System'. Not that I think they will, but Disney could say Wilderness Lodge 2 is only for people who buy there...period. This is something that could come into play if DVC ever wanted to take the "moderate" DVC approach.

I just do not see it as a move that does them any good. However, just because I can not see a good reason for such a move, does not mean one does not exist.
 
Those sections in the pre-Aulani resorts do not mention anything about a possible exchange fee in the future.
It doesn't have to mention it, to not be allowed there would have to be wording that prevented it and I don't believe there is. It'd have to be across the board though but could be covered by DVD in terms of a VIP program if applicable.
 
One interesting note is that the agreement with BLT to the DVC Reservation Component (the exchange that allows you to reserve outside your home resort), ends on 1/31/2057,
That is indeed curious. I wonder if that's how they intend to handle the final three years; you can only book at your home resort. That could solve the problem many have forecast about availability problems due to the various use years.
 
It DOES say they can modify the vacation club agreement at any time, but they do specify this part pretty clearly, and there are likely legal ramifications for not providing some tangible use advantage for owners.

Quoting:

"DVCMC reserves the right in its sole, absolute and unfettered discretion to extend or decrease the Home Resort Priority Period; provided, however, in no event shall the Home Resort Priority Period be for a period of less than one (1) month prior to the period during which the other Club Members have the right to reserve that Vacation Home during that Use Day. In addition, DVCMC reserves the right to establish a continental or other preference periods in the event resorts located outside of the jurisdictional limits of the United States are associated as DVC Resorts."
But they couldn't completely take away the opportunity to book at resorts other than home resort, correct? They can only change the timeframes that non home resorts may be booked if available? Not a guarantee that a non home resort would be available, but they couldn't completely take that option away from only resale could they?
 



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