will the draft be reininstated?

[jennyanydots]

Originally posted by jipsy
Recruit nothing but women. Put them all together for about 6 months. It is known that when women are together for a long period of time, they begin their menstrual cycle together.

Once this happens, put them all on the front line at the first signs of PMS. They will win.

War over.

(*this message is brought to you with a large amount of sarcasm; please take it that way*)

 

[N.Bailey]

Originally posted by I <3 Eeyore
Please step off the pedestal. I'm not going to play 'Can you top that?' with stories of my abusive childhood with an alcoholic parent. Suffice it to say that I fully understand the trauma and hardship that it entails. It taught me at an early age that the world can be a dangerous place for children.

The difference is that I don't shield my children from life, I teach them how to deal with it head on. I never said that made my daughter better than anyone else. I do believe, though, that she's better equipped to handle what comes her way.

Pedestal? Please!! I only state my situation to explain why my daughter will not be facing the same situations I did! It was for no other reason.

I realize your children are older and I realize as time goes by my decisions regarding what I do to protect them will change. I don't feel that protecting my children makes them weak! For parents out there who don't think it's their JOB, I'd suggest they might not be the best parents, but that's my opinion!

Here are a couple of decisions I've been faced with so far. My daughters one friend's mother was picked up by the police for dealing drugs. I was unaware of this, but since I'd been told, I have seen the state police sitting outside their home on more than one occasion. I used to allow my daughter to go away with them for the weekend, and I'd let my daughter go over after school. Since learning of all this however (and it was told to me very discretely because these people were aware my daughter was going there) I refuse to allow my daughter to spend any time with this child after school. Am I shielding my child? Absolutely! My child also has another friend who is experimenting with cigarettes. Do I allow my child to be around this girl? Sometimes, but I never allow her to be in a position with her when I know smoking could be involved. Sue me again! I take my kids to the movies and let them watch their movie, but I pick them up after instead of letting them run the streets. Sue me again!! I talk to children's parents if my child is spending the night there because I want to be sure the parent will be home and I also want to make sure my child was actually invited and that the kids didn't concoct things that they weren't given permission to do. I've caught my daughter lying quite a few times. She has this one friend who is actually a good kids, but she's very conniving. She doesn't take no for an answer and if she feels the answer will be no, she changes the story a lot before I hear about it so my daughter will be allowed to do it. For instance, these girls decided they wanted to walk home from school one day (she was spending the night here) and she told me she was not allowed to ride my daughter's bus home. She said her mother talked to the bus driver. Now, 100 kids have come here after school and have all rode our bus. I'm suppose to believe this story? It's 2 miles from the school to my house, not too far, but instead of ask, they were afraid I'd say no, so they lied. This, I do no approve of! I should have not allowed her to come here! So, when I said I didn't believe them and they wouldn't allow me to talk to her mom (wonder why?), they accidentally missed the bus the next day!!

Yeah, these are life changing decisions I'm faced with!

They're not dating yet, they're not driving yet. Basically, I haven't had to shield them from too much! If at 12 & 13 though, you think my parental skills are as you say, putting my kids in a cocoon, I can't imagine what you allowed your children to do at this age.

The point is, I allow my kids to do things on their own, but I am fully aware of what they're doing!! If that makes me a bad parent, so be it I guess!

Not rereading this, excuse typos. I need to get going!

 

[Crankyshank]

Originally posted by Rutt and Tuke


It is simple to me.

Nobody should be drafted unless absolutely, absolutely necessary.

If anyone is drafted then it should be both men and women.

Exactly my thoughts. ITA Rutt and Tuke

 

[jennyanydots]

Originally posted by N.Bailey
There are a lot of weak women out there. I used to take my one friend water skiing (well, she just likes boating). She tried it once and the 2nd she had to hold the rope to try and get up, she let go instantly because her wrists were too weak to hold her up. I don't know about you, but if I were a soldier, I would not want her fighting beside me in any war. I also listen to Evil Princess, now I don't know her from Adam, but I don't believe she is a person I would want to be standing beside on the front lines either. Do you honestly think she wouldn't do more harm than good there? Guys would be trying to protect her and she'd be worthless to anyone because she'd probably be shaking in her skin and maybe even in hysterics. I'm certainly not trying to offend her and I don't believe she'd take my reply here as such, but you tell me where that does anything to help our troops or our morale? Heck, she's been as sweet as can be to all of you who have criticized her. Would you have been as sweet as she has been in response if someone said the same about you? I know I wouldn't have been!

I've no doubt that someone sweet and feminine, if she survived basic training, would know how to handle herself on a battle field. The military won't place someone out there if they didn't feel the person would do more harm than good. though I suspect that a girl who is in college, would be more useful to the military in some capacity other than infantry soldier.

 

[N.Bailey]

I've read what each of you have replied. I got to get and really look forward to participating in this conversation more later though.

I will say this. The woman that enlist in the military are not typical of the woman across this nation. So, the women you're seeing serve are not going to represent the women that would be included in any draft. There are MANY girly girls out there who are not capable. Not all woman have got the stomachs for war! You might, but everyone does not share your philosophy! Opppps, I broke a nail! I think you get my drift! Think back to your high school days, who do you really feel would make it through boot camp, let alone a war? I can name you MANY from my class!

Again I say too, this country is not ready to start seeing women come home in body bags. I guess time will tell if my opinion holds true on that theory, but I'd wager any of you out there on this fact today?

Got to go, kids are starving!

 

[jennyanydots]

Earth to N. Bailey, you need a reality check. You'd have us believe that all the women in the military are muscular, masculine amazons for whom the "don't ask don't tell" policy was invented. What a slap in the face to the women who proudly serve their country.

Or are they simply better human beings than you are?


I've met several women in the military. (I've also met women who serve in the police force and the fire department -- a similar situation.) when they take off their uniforms at the end of the work day, they go home to the same concerns you and I do. I read the profiles of many of the women serving in Iraq -- they run the gamut from young women trying to earn money for college, single mothers trying to make a better life for their children, married women who have made a career of the military -- in short, the full spectrum of American womanhood.

 

[I <3 Eeyore]

Originally posted by N.Bailey
I certainly wasn't raised like she has been either. I was raised to take care of myself from grade 6 on. This included, working in a store and delivering papers to buy every single thing I wanted, including my own clothing. I had no parental involvement really. I had to cook my own meals, clean our house, do my own laundry and God forbid if I'd need help with homework because there was never anyone there to help! I did all this while playing hockey on the school team, lacrosse and I was GOD forbid, a cheerleader. I was also quite involved in many other school activities. I'd also baby-sit a lot for extra money. I messed with sex, drugs and alcohol too! This made me tougher (wouldn't necessarily say stronger) than what I hope my daughter ever has to be. I've seen and done more than I'd ever let her do today. What I teach her isn't going to do anything that would ever make her a good soldier!! My hope is rather to get her through high school with high academic achievements and to help her in anyway to keep her an honor student so she's able to get into a good college and then eventually get a good job.

I'm sorry for the challenges you faced in childhood but I think you probably learned many valuable life skills as a result. It's too bad that what you're teaching her isn't going to do anything that would ever make her a good soldier.

Some of the things my daughter was taught were:

a solid work ethic, moral codes and values, self-sufficiency, do the right thing - not the easy thing, think for yourself (although this may seem counter to the military way - she never found herself up on charges for abusing POW's), the value of a good education, a sense of humour, teamwork, respect for herself and respect for others.

What I taught her (and her siblings) were skills to help her be successful as a person, not just as a soldier. As a result, she's a great soldier, a talented journalist, and a hell of a woman who enjoys getting her hair done and polishing her nails as much as any other 'girly girl'.

 

[jennyanydots]

Bravo for your daughter, Deb!

 

[Rutt and Tuke]

Originally posted by N.Bailey


I will say this. The woman that enlist in the military are not typical of the woman across this nation. So, the women you're seeing serve are not going to represent the women that would be included in any draft. There are MANY girly girls out there who are not capable. Not all woman have got the stomachs for war! You might, but everyone does not share your philosophy! Opppps, I broke a nail! I think you get my drift! Think back to your high school days, who do you really feel would make it through boot camp, let alone a war? I can name you MANY from my class!

I'm a pretty average woman and I considered enlisting out of college. This was back in the 80's and to be honest, I didn't think there was a chance in hell that there would be a war for me to fight in. I'm a wimp. If there had been a war going on, I wouldn't have even considered enlisting. However, if I had enlisted and we had gone to war while I was in uniform-- I would have taken the responsiblity and done my military job. It would have been a risk, but we all must take risks every day of some sort.

I don't even know if I would have made it through boot camp, but having seen the film, Private Benjamin, I thought "if she can, I can." (Okay, so it's a fictional story, but still...).

I would be suspect of anyone who went around saying they DID have a stomach for war. That doesn't mean we don't do what we must do.

BTW I didn't enlist; I was rejected on medical reasons.

What I'm trying to say is that I don't think you can stereotype women into "the type that enlists" and the type that doesn't.

Even the girl who cries over a broken finger nail, will most likely fight if she is in danger. I find it farcical to imagine a bunch of women running from the front lines like cowards. I'm sure it happens, but it happens with the men as well.

Gender makes no difference in this situation.

 

[I <3 Eeyore]

I would be suspect of anyone who went around saying they DID have a stomach for war. That doesn't mean we don't do what we must do.

Ditto that! They're the ones that will get you killed!

BTW I didn't enlist; I was rejected on medical reasons.

Careful, since you can't prove that here it makes your claim suspect in some people's eyes.

Thanks jennyanydots. She's pretty terrific.

 

[jipsy]

quote:
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Tell me, why should an unwilling male be sent and not an unwilling female? How is ok to send your son and not your daughter?
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This is something I've wondered about all along. I'm shocked at the number of people that seem to value their daughter's lives more than they value their son's.

Not that this is an excuse AFR, but this comes from an old belief. If we save the women, we can always repopulate, but if all the men are dead, there is no one to carry us on as a species.

Does that make sense?

 

[ToriLammy]

Originally posted by N.Bailey

I will say this. The woman that enlist in the military are not typical of the woman across this nation. So, the women you're seeing serve are not going to represent the women that would be included in any draft. There are MANY girly girls out there who are not capable. Not all woman have got the stomachs for war! You might, but everyone does not share your philosophy! Opppps, I broke a nail! I think you get my drift! Think back to your high school days, who do you really feel would make it through boot camp, let alone a war? I can name you MANY from my class!

Again I say too, this country is not ready to start seeing women come home in body bags. I guess time will tell if my opinion holds true on that theory, but I'd wager any of you out there on this fact today?

Got to go, kids are starving!

Please explain to me how I was not typical of the women across the is nation? I'm about as average as you get. Do women who enlist have a big sense of responsibility? Are you saying women across the nation don't? Or are you implying that we are somehow more mannish than women across the nation? I'm really curious as to how you know that I'm not typical and what exactly you say is typical. Please enlighten us.

 

[AirForceRocks]

There are MANY girly girls out there who are not capable.

This is the exact same attitude that men used for years to keep women from voting, from working outside the home and from enjoying equal rights in this country.

I really thought we were past that, but apparently not.

 

[I <3 Eeyore]

Cheer up, ladies, I have good news! I hear corsets, crinolines and fainting couches are making a comeback this year. Can knights on white horses be very far behind?

 

[N.Bailey]

Originally posted by jennyanydots
Crankyshank, the double standard evident on this thread has set the women's movement back 20 years.

I hope the next generation is not so provincial and narrow minded.

I do respect those who are and have served. You're so in favor of this, just out of curiosity, did you serve?

 

[N.Bailey]

Originally posted by AirForceRocks
I do wear the uniform, and I'm absolutely in favor of including women in draft registration, and if it comes to it, drafting them as well. With rights come responsibilities, and it is high time, IMO, that women step up and take on these responsibilities.

Are you willing to have her lose her right to vote? Why shouldn't she - she isn't willing to fight for it.

Are you willing to have her lose her to to equal pay for equal work? Why shouldn't she - she isn't willing to fight for it.

Are you willing for her to lose all of the rights guaranteed her under the Constitution? Why shouldn't she - she isn't willing to fight for them.

I usually agree with you and I do highly respect your opinion. I do not however agree with you on this issue, but that doesn't mean I won't respect your opinion on the next thread. I also respect that you serve the country. It was however, your choice to do so. That does not mean I respect what you're doing any less. It just means because you chose that, it does not make it the right choice for everyone.

And to answer your other questions, sure, I'm willing to give up my rights and my daughter's rights to all that you've listed here, the day everyone else that has them gives them up if they've not served too! I think this includes the President and the former!

 

[N.Bailey]

Originally posted by Rutt and Tuke


It is simple to me.

Nobody should be drafted unless absolutely, absolutely necessary.

I can agree with this! Sure, I'm selectively responding to what I wish, but you've all bombarded me with posts to respond to!

 

[N.Bailey]

Originally posted by jennyanydots
I've no doubt that someone sweet and feminine, if she survived basic training, would know how to handle herself on a battle field. The military won't place someone out there if they didn't feel the person would do more harm than good. though I suspect that a girl who is in college, would be more useful to the military in some capacity other than infantry soldier.

If we get to the point of a draft, I wouldn't look for things to go exactly the way they to today. You can bet, things will be pretty bad by that time.

 

[AirForceRocks]

Originally posted by N.Bailey
I usually agree with you and I do highly respect your opinion. I do not however agree with you on this issue, but that doesn't mean I won't respect your opinion on the next thread. I also respect that you serve the country. It was however, your choice to do so. That does not mean I respect what you're doing any less. It just means because you chose that, it does not make it the right choice for everyone.

And to answer your other questions, sure, I'm willing to give up my rights and my daughter's rights to all that you've listed here, the day everyone else that has them gives them up if they've not served too! I think this includes the President and the former!

Thank you for your kind words, and the feeling is mutual.

As to your second paragraph, you are twisting the question that I asked in order to give an utterly ridiculous answer. I didn't ask if everyone that hasn't served should give them up, I asked if everyone that isn't WILLING to fight for those rights should have them.

Is that more clear?

 

[cati]

Can knights on white horses be very far behind?

I sure hope not!!! My DD deserves a knight.