VDH Opening

[Canchaser143]

Yes if you are not a DVC owner currently unfortunately you cannot get a small contract. May be worth buying a small resale contract at WDW to become a member so you can do a small add on at VDH direct. Especially with resale prices going down.

To support this case, there’s a 25pt OKW contract for 80pp on Fidelity! CHEAP

 

[nkosiek]

I mean where is the theme? I guess that was the DVC of the past. No more Grand Californian’s,Wilderness Lodge’s, or Animal Kingdom’s.

I think the theme is Hotel Disneyland. It's not a standalone. Also, with 3 lodges like you just mentioned, do we really need a 4th in a similar vein?

 

[elenex]

While many think that, it has not been officially announced, so with DVD, until it is, no one knows what they might do.

It’s also why the decision for Poly tower is still up for debate, because the pandemic changed things in the DVC world for sales, etc. so until we see it confirmed I don’t think we can assume anything.

I do think restrictions are here to stay but just not going to say it’s a done deal until we see it in print from them.

While i think it likely restrictions are here to stay, you are very much correct. I think that to those of us who frequent a forum like this, the desire to purchase VDH is largely immune to the macro economy. However, we do not make up the population at large that Disney needs to buy in here. Disney is feeling the pinch and people in general are tightening up on luxuries like timeshares. If anyone here needs proof of that look at the current resale market and current ROFR behavior... It's collapsing, and Disney doesn't have the resources to stop the collapse (by exercising ROFR). While it's exciting as buyers, we should all have some level of concern that our investment has lost a pretty high percentage of its value over the past year... On quick calculations mine has now lost about 14%.

Additionally, VDH is uniquely positioned as its only sibling is VGC. VGC itself is unique in that a high percentage of owners have been forced to buy resale, and keeping the restrictions in place alienates those members in terms of their ability to try before they buy. It's a weak argument given that they have other modalities to achieve buy in of these customers, but I'm playing devil's advocate here and it certainly would be an incentive and would also help alleviate VGC availability.

In the end, these things are still likely to go against the owner, but it's not over until DVD says it is and they have motivation to forgo restrictions on this one.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

While i think it likely restrictions are here to stay, you are very much correct. I think that to those of us who frequent a forum like this, the desire to purchase VDH is largely immune to the macro economy. However, we do not make up the population at large that Disney needs to buy in here. Disney is feeling the pinch and people in general are tightening up on luxuries like timeshares. If anyone here needs proof of that look at the current resale market and current ROFR behavior... It's collapsing, and Disney doesn't have the resources to stop the collapse (by exercising ROFR). While it's exciting as buyers, we should all have some level of concern that our investment has lost a pretty high percentage of its value over the past year... On quick calculations mine has now lost about 14%.

Additionally, VDH is uniquely positioned as its only sibling is VGC. VGC itself is unique in that a high percentage of owners have been forced to buy resale, and keeping the restrictions in place alienates those members in terms of their ability to try before they buy. It's a weak argument given that they have other modalities to achieve buy in of these customers, but I'm playing devil's advocate here and it certainly would be an incentive and would also help alleviate VGC availability.

In the end, these things are still likely to go against the owner, but it's not over until DVD says it is and they have motivation to forgo restrictions on this one.

Love the comment. There is no question Disney is hurting for cash. Every opportunity will be taken so as not to leave money on the table. But it is harder to go backwards than forwards. Economically, it is real ugly right now. Fed is continuing to raise rates and there is a lot of push to go half a percent. We have not seen the true fall out yet. Disney has to be cautious as to not over price the initial buy in.

 

[Jayunit09]

Just spoke to DVC about something else but asked about points charts and sales dates for "points stays" for VDH. He said regrettably they have been "very quiet with us" on that front.

Didnt hurt to ask lol

 

[AstroBlasters]

I agree with you.
AKV rooms are themed: the colour scheme, the dark carved furniture, the light fixtures. Everything participates in the theme, nothing screams "Disney" at you.
If you walk around Galaxy Edge, you won't find white walls with giant posters of Rey and Palpatine. But an environment with so many small details that make you feel like that it a real lived place.

Those are very nice rooms and I cannot wait to book there, I hope they're easier to get at 7 months. But they're not themed. Slapping a giant Princess picture on your face is not theme, it's decoration.

I get what you are saying now. We’ll have to wait and see what the actual rooms look like and not just the artist renderings.

 

[naman1221]

While i think it likely restrictions are here to stay, you are very much correct. I think that to those of us who frequent a forum like this, the desire to purchase VDH is largely immune to the macro economy. However, we do not make up the population at large that Disney needs to buy in here. Disney is feeling the pinch and people in general are tightening up on luxuries like timeshares. If anyone here needs proof of that look at the current resale market and current ROFR behavior... It's collapsing, and Disney doesn't have the resources to stop the collapse (by exercising ROFR). While it's exciting as buyers, we should all have some level of concern that our investment has lost a pretty high percentage of its value over the past year... On quick calculations mine has now lost about 14%.

Additionally, VDH is uniquely positioned as its only sibling is VGC. VGC itself is unique in that a high percentage of owners have been forced to buy resale, and keeping the restrictions in place alienates those members in terms of their ability to try before they buy. It's a weak argument given that they have other modalities to achieve buy in of these customers, but I'm playing devil's advocate here and it certainly would be an incentive and would also help alleviate VGC availability.

In the end, these things are still likely to go against the owner, but it's not over until DVD says it is and they have motivation to forgo restrictions on this one.

I overall agree with this comment.

I think calling DVC an investment is a big issue I have noticed with a lot of buyers here and really on any DVC facebook page- it is not an investment. It is a luxury purchase, no different than purchasing a new Mercedes SUV or a luxury handbag. Both of these items had huge increases in value over the last few years and are now dropping back down. I don't consider my car an investment just like I don't consider my DVC an investment.

The initial buy-in IS actually a sunk cost. Any money you retain is just a bonus.

While there has been historical price increases that have protected the buy-in value, there is no actual fundamentals behind that to continue (not saying it won't - just that there isn't a real fundamental reason). The biggest reason that prices stayed up was due to DVC raising prices and then ROFR contracts that were lower than a certain price to resell at higher prices. Disney has no financial obligation to help us maintain the value of our contracts and it is actually in the best interest of true Disney investors that they enforce these restrictions as it SHOULD make DVC themselves more money from Direct buyers.

 

[elenex]

I agree with you, it falls under a luxury which is also to the point of "TBD" in terms of restrictions. It's not something to be bought unless the buyer loves the product, is willing to assume that the investment will be completely lost, AND has extra resources with which to purchase it. That said, to this point in time at least, it's not unreasonable to appreciate that in addition to the buyer's enjoyment of the luxury product it has proven to be an investment that retains value.

That said, as Pete and company have said over and over... Don't buy DVC as an investment. I consider it like a blue card extra.. It could disappear at any time, but I'll enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[RoseGold]

That said, as Pete and company have said over and over... Don't buy DVC as an investment. I consider it like a blue card extra.. It could disappear at any time, but I'll enjoy it while it lasts.

If you think DVC is that risky, then I don't see why you would buy in at all. Just rent points or stay cash. You don't need to pony up five figures you are willing to lose to stay at Disney.

 

[DonMacGregor]

I overall agree with this comment.

I think calling DVC an investment is a big issue I have noticed with a lot of buyers here and really on any DVC facebook page- it is not an investment. It is a luxury purchase, no different than purchasing a new Mercedes SUV or a luxury handbag. Both of these items had huge increases in value over the last few years and are now dropping back down. I don't consider my car an investment just like I don't consider my DVC an investment.

The initial buy-in IS actually a sunk cost. Any money you retain is just a bonus.

While there has been historical price increases that have protected the buy-in value, there is no actual fundamentals behind that to continue (not saying it won't - just that there isn't a real fundamental reason). The biggest reason that prices stayed up was due to DVC raising prices and then ROFR contracts that were lower than a certain price to resell at higher prices. Disney has no financial obligation to help us maintain the value of our contracts and it is actually in the best interest of true Disney investors that they enforce these restrictions as it SHOULD make DVC themselves more money from Direct buyers.

Why do people find this so hard to accept?

 

[Sandisw]

If you think DVC is that risky, then I don't see why you would buy in at all. Just rent points or stay cash. You don't need to pony up five figures you are willing to lose to stay at Disney.

Owning DVC is still saving me over the cost of doing those trips on cash, even if I get nothing back,

Its silly to keep saying that buying DVC isn’t worth it unless it will grow in value. It’s a timeshare.

 

[DonMacGregor]

If you think DVC is that risky, then I don't see why you would buy in at all. Just rent points or stay cash. You don't need to pony up five figures you are willing to lose to stay at Disney.

For you, five figures may be the world, for Elon Musk, it's not even pocket lint (never mind pocket change). The rest of us fall somewhere on that spectrum. Take that for what it's worth.

 

[RoseGold]

Owning DVC is still saving me over the cost of doing those trips on cash, even if I get nothing back,

Its silly to say that its only worth it to buy if it doesn’t lose value.

The PP said they thought DVC would "go away." If points become worthless, then buying in was a bad move for all of us.

Vero might actually do this, if the dues keep skyrocketing the way they are.

 

[naman1221]

If you think DVC is that risky, then I don't see why you would buy in at all. Just rent points or stay cash. You don't need to pony up five figures you are willing to lose to stay at Disney.

Why buy anything? I wanted control over my own reservations, I wanted to have the benefits, I wanted to own it. It wasn't a risk...i was making a purchase.

If you go in thinking DVC is "risky", you are in the wrong mindset already.

 

[Sandisw]

The PP said they thought DVC would "go away." If points become worthless, then buying in was a bad move for all of us.

Vero might actually do this, if the dues keep skyrocketing the way they are.

If my DVC is worth $0 on the resale market. It has no impact on me because I still own something I can use,

So, no, it’s not bad for everyone…just those who bought expecting or wanting it to hold value.

 

[RoseGold]

The initial buy-in IS actually a sunk cost. Any money you retain is just a bonus.

If this is how you are doing your math, then I don't see why you would buy DVC at all. Just stay at the Four Seasons, probably cheaper, and I'm sure they have nicer TP.

If DVC is five figure "sunk cost," then rental rates are way, way undervalued. And renting becomes even more attractive because it removes the risk.

 

[DonMacGregor]

If DVC is five figure "sunk cost," then rental rates are way, way undervalued. And renting becomes even more attractive because it removes the risk.

The whole "five figure" thing really is something for you, isn't it. You must have said it 100 times now in various threads.

 

[gottalovepluto]

Why do people find this so hard to accept?

Emotions.

ESPECIALLY when it says “Disney”

 

[Sandisw]

The whole "five figure" thing really is something for you, isn't it. You must have said it 100 times now in various threads.

I guess I don’t get it either…

Why would buy a DVC for anything other than a way to stay on property at the resorts they want for less than paying cash year after year?

Go in expecting to get nothing back on initial price and it’s a bonus later on if you do!

 

[naman1221]

If this is how you are doing your math, then I don't see why you would buy DVC at all. Just stay at the Four Seasons, probably cheaper, and I'm sure they have nicer TP.

If DVC is five figure "sunk cost," then rental rates are way, way undervalued. And renting becomes even more attractive because it removes the risk.

I bought DVC because I WANTED it. That's exactly my point - it was a want. It wasn't a smart "investment" game although being able to stay at a Deluxe on property for the price of a moderate was a benefit. That is how luxury purchases work - you buy them because (first and foremost), you want them.

That doesn't mean it is not a sunk cost because by definition, that money is gone and cannot be recovered. Having a secondary resale market is independent of your buy-in and what you initially paid doesn't necessarily have to have a direct correlation to what you get back.

I can't help but question the five figure comment over and over. Maybe I am going to come off as rude but plenty of people lose 30-50k every week on something ridiculous - buy a used car for 30k and tomorrow it dies. Sorry, you are out of luck. That is precisely why you buy something like this with no intention of getting money back - because it CAN happen.