Thoughts on Cars Land replacing Tom Sawyer Island at The MK

[Donald Duck Family]

Also, TSI and the Riverboat aren't paradise, and Cars ain't a parking lot

Given the circumstances MK finds itself in I actually disagree. Lots of people enjoy the relaxing ambience of the area. Not everything needs to be IP and an e-ticket. I still see plenty of people (my family included) on the riverboat and the island. I will greatly miss the sound of the riverboat's whistle when its gone. Cars do tend to be found in parking lots, so I stand by my statement.

Think of the view of the Haunted Mansion now that you will have to look through anthropomorphic vehicles to see it.

WDW was built with the "blessing of size", why is management scared to use it? Instead they bring out the bulldozers every chance they get.

To be fair, I am actually really excited for both of these areas, I just take issue with what is being lost in order to get them.

 

[Mai Ku Tiki]

...if it's anywhere NEAR how Car Land is set up in DL, it's going to be AWESOME and AMAZING! My guess is they will have to construct some sort of bridge which doesn't impede the course of Liberty Square Riverboat....

LB Riverboat will be gone.
In fact, the entire Rivers of America will be pave over!
Just like the Castle moat.... Sitting outside the Plaza for a quiet meal gazing at he reflection of the Castle...All gone.
And even if your kids don't know who Tom Sawyer is, it's worth taking them to TSI just to have them explore it.

 

[disny_luvr]

I realize Cars Land is not geared to a 67 year old like me, but even my Cars loving 5 year old Granddaughter found Cars Land at CA a disappointment.

Really! What didn't she like about it? We just returned from our first trip to Disneyland and my family loved Cars Land. We thought the land was very immersive and we all loved the rides - even my twin 18-year-olds. I am so excited that Disney will be getting its own version of Cars Land.

 

[Mai Ku Tiki]

Hold on! I've just read again. Does this mean they're draining and removing the river completely? ...So, just more concrete? ETA: And more concrete, with less greenery and water = hotter.

Yep! All gone. Drained & paved. Just like the Castle moat that disappeared.
The original Disney WDW: Creating a sense of time & place, sightlines, immersion, theming all made Disney Parks the alternatives to typical amusement parks. And each of the $ Parks were very individual in what they offered. Now they plop IPs anywhere & sometimes in more than one Park. And as other parks are embellishing the surroundings of their rides, WDW is diminishing their themed surroundings that set them apart & creating more rides than "attractions."
I'm grateful to have enjoyed WDW for decades, but I think I'll be saving up for DL Paris next... Imagineers there still remember to create the Magic.

 

[CynBeth]

I am sad to hear this. I had only been on TSI a few times but we do the riverboat every trip.

 

[BrianL]

Given the circumstances MK finds itself in I actually disagree. Lots of people enjoy the relaxing ambience of the area. Not everything needs to be IP and an e-ticket. I still see plenty of people (my family included) on the riverboat and the island. I will greatly miss the sound of the riverboat's whistle when its gone. Cars do tend to be found in parking lots, so I stand by my statement.

Think of the view of the Haunted Mansion now that you will have to look through anthropomorphic vehicles to see it.

WDW was built with the "blessing of size", why is management scared to use it? Instead they bring out the bulldozers every chance they get.

To be fair, I am actually really excited for both of these areas, I just take issue with what is being lost in order to get them.

I mena, they can expand, but they still have unused areas too. I'm not necessarily saying that TSI is "unused" but it isn't all that busy - which is nice. They are expanding further north, but they kind of need a way to get there. The waterway can't be crossed. Also, how big can a theme park get when it becomes unwalkable? Epcot? All things need a balance. It's a tough call, but I do get it. Hopefully it will all turn out really nice!

 

[HopperFan]

Not going to quote anyone ....

My thoughts ~ I'm excited and I'm not even really a Cars movie fan. The rendering looks awesome with a "complete" land in play not just a single attraction.

Frontierland has been nothing but a sidewalk to get from the Hub to Tiana and Big Thunder (and a couple restaurants and some singing bears good for AC). It is seating for the parade. But it's story has long been lost, it has no purpose. For a decade there have been rumblings inside what will happen. The only way to deal with it is (1) completely retheme it OR (2) EXPAND it. I am shocked but so pleased that Disney is finally making a big bold move.

Losses ~ barely used island that is only open about half of Disney hours. They have never added, only removed from it. With all the lines the last place I'm going to waste an hour of my time is TSI. A riverboat ride which is a great slow way to chill but has limited hours and limited sailings. I had not been on in a decade and DS asked to ride a couple years ago. We did. I was kinda shocked at some of the scenery, do we really need a cremation scene?

Disney gains tons of land to create a cash generating space that folks of all age can enjoy, children will love and Frontierland is now connected by more than long walkways. This is win/win for Disney and guests.

SO folks like the tranquility for a break ... this is a theme/amusement park. Go out to the lake or back to your hotel or visit another hotel for that. I pay money to be entertained, not to stare at water or wander through woods. Hey take the boat to Ft Wilderness and enjoy. Even in the park there are quieter and relaxing spots. I know because DS needs to decompress at times.

Folks say why existing land why not just use all the empty land ........... that is very very complicated. To disrupt land Disney has to first go through the approval of the S FL Water Management and when they do that it involves months maybe a year of all kinds of environmental testing. Then they have to offset the same amount of land to offer water shed. This is why Disney owns a large nature conservation area south of Kissimmee and add to it so they can disrupt other land. The "river" is a ride, not a river. It has a concrete bottom and is the boat's version of a water park. No approval is likely needed at that top level. They can move right in to the demo and construction permits, at least for Carsland.

Haunted Mansion ~ my home away from home. Not worried. They will build berms, plantings and it will be hidden from Cars and visa versa. Rendering shows a path from Liberty Square (next to riverboat building) heading in with lots of trees on either side that will buffer.

Riverboat ~ hoping Disney uses it for Fireworks Parties, private sailing parties and maybe even weddings.

Villains, more complicated ground wise and hopefully they start that process soon. Of course I'm all in for Villains!

 

[tvguy]

Really! What didn't she like about it? We just returned from our first trip to Disneyland and my family loved Cars Land. We thought the land was very immersive and we all loved the rides - even my twin 18-year-olds. I am so excited that Disney will be getting its own version of Cars Land.

She's 5 so hard to say as I was not there. Maybe as a Cars fan she was expecting more, too much build up. My son says he was surprised that her favorite thing was the Enchanted Tiki room. To the point that she has to hear the Tiki room song in the car on the way to school every day.

 

[BrianL]

Yep! All gone. Drained & paved. Just like the Castle moat that disappeared.
The original Disney WDW: Creating a sense of time & place, sightlines, immersion, theming all made Disney Parks the alternatives to typical amusement parks. And each of the $ Parks were very individual in what they offered. Now they plop IPs anywhere & sometimes in more than one Park. And as other parks are embellishing the surroundings of their rides, WDW is diminishing their themed surroundings that set them apart & creating more rides than "attractions."
I'm grateful to have enjoyed WDW for decades, but I think I'll be saving up for DL Paris next... Imagineers there still remember to create the Magic.

But the issue is that people want rides and not "attractions." It's the same reason they just announced a boatload of sequels! People will go see those, but they will not go see original fare. When the shows aren't full and people aren't wandering the trails, but they are all in line for the latest technological thrillhouse, then what are they to do? If you wonder why they are doing it, all you have to do is look at us - the fans, the park goers, the customers. You may not like it, but it simply is what it is.

Also, I'm pretty sure the Imagineerss that create attractions for Paris are the same ones who create them for everything.

 

[BrianL]

Not going to quote anyone ....

My thoughts ~ I'm excited and I'm not even really a Cars movie fan. The rendering looks awesome with a "complete" land in play not just a single attraction.

Frontierland has been nothing but a sidewalk to get from the Hub to Tiana and Big Thunder (and a couple restaurants and some singing bears good for AC). It is seating for the parade. But it's story has long been lost, it has no purpose. For a decade there have been rumblings inside what will happen. The only way to deal with it is (1) completely retheme it OR (2) EXPAND it. I am shocked but so pleased that Disney is finally making a big bold move.

Losses ~ barely used island that is only open about half of Disney hours. They have never added, only removed from it. With all the lines the last place I'm going to waste an hour of my time is TSI. A riverboat ride which is a great slow way to chill but has limited hours and limited sailings. I had not been on in a decade and DS asked to ride a couple years ago. We did. I was kinda shocked at some of the scenery, do we really need a cremation scene?

Disney gains tons of land to create a cash generating space that folks of all age can enjoy, children will love and Frontierland is now connected by more than long walkways. This is win/win for Disney and guests.

SO folks like the tranquility for a break ... this is a theme/amusement park. Go out to the lake or back to your hotel or visit another hotel for that. I pay money to be entertained, not to stare at water or wander through woods. Hey take the boat to Ft Wilderness and enjoy. Even in the park there are quieter and relaxing spots. I know because DS needs to decompress at times.

Folks say why existing land why not just use all the empty land ........... that is very very complicated. To disrupt land Disney has to first go through the approval of the S FL Water Management and when they do that it involves months maybe a year of all kinds of environmental testing. Then they have to offset the same amount of land to offer water shed. This is why Disney owns a large nature conservation area south of Kissimmee and add to it so they can disrupt other land. The "river" is a ride, not a river. It has a concrete bottom and is the boat's version of a water park. No approval is likely needed at that top level. They can move right in to the demo and construction permits, at least for Carsland.

Haunted Mansion ~ my home away from home. Not worried. They will build berms, plantings and it will be hidden from Cars and visa versa. Rendering shows a path from Liberty Square (next to riverboat building) heading in with lots of trees on either side that will buffer.

Riverboat ~ hoping Disney uses it for Fireworks Parties, private sailing parties and maybe even weddings.

Villains, more complicated ground wise and hopefully they start that process soon. Of course I'm all in for Villains!

I am maybe not quite as 100% sold as you are, but I think I generally agree. I know that part of it for me is will they spend the money to make it right? If they do, then it's gonna be great. If they don't....ehhhh.

But, all that aside, for me it's a matter of attitude. Is it what *I* personally would have done? No, not really. Does it have to be? Nah. I can either be depressed that they are ruining this place that I have loved for a long time, or I can embrace it and have fun with the new stuff that is coming. I choose the latter.

And, hey, don't panic yet. Knowing Dinsey they will schedule to break ground in three years to be finished in about nine and by the time they get to three years on they will have scaled down the plan so much that it fits in one corner of Tom Sawyers Island and they will act like it was the plan the whole time.

 

[tx911]

Given the circumstances MK finds itself in I actually disagree. Lots of people enjoy the relaxing ambience of the area. Not everything needs to be IP and an e-ticket. I still see plenty of people (my family included) on the riverboat and the island. I will greatly miss the sound of the riverboat's whistle when its gone. Cars do tend to be found in parking lots, so I stand by my statement.

Think of the view of the Haunted Mansion now that you will have to look through anthropomorphic vehicles to see it.

WDW was built with the "blessing of size", why is management scared to use it? Instead they bring out the bulldozers every chance they get.

To be fair, I am actually really excited for both of these areas, I just take issue with what is being lost in order to get them.

I do agree about the aesthetics, and I wish they could coexist.

 

[HokieRaven5]

First of the permits have been filed:





https://apps.sfwmd.gov/entsb/docdownload?object_id=0900eeea968a1411

 

[Moliphino]

Also, I'm pretty sure the Imagineerss that create attractions for Paris are the same ones who create them for everything.

Yeah, if you want peak magic you have to go to Tokyo.

 

[Tatebeck]

We went to Tom Sawyer Island 2 trips ago and rode the ferry around the rivers on our last trip just because we like to try everything at least once! They were cool, but definitely not very exciting. We didn't grow up with them or anything so I'm not nostalgic for them or anything and I think it will be well worth the sacrifice to get a good Cars ride and a Villain land! Though again I wish they would expand the park more instead of tearing down and redoing areas already in use but this is about as good as you can hope for to add 3 or 4 good attractions and good themed areas

 

[BrianL]

Yeah, if you want peak magic you have to go to Tokyo.

Yeah, but WDI still creates all of the attractions, it's just hat OLC will pay top dollar for them.

 

[Moliphino]

Yeah, but WDI still creates all of the attractions, it's just hat OLC will pay top dollar for them.

True. The problem isn't the Imagineers it's the bean counters.

 

[Tatebeck]

True. The problem isn't the Imagineers it's the bean counters.

They have enough beans. Time to plant them!

 

[HopperFan]

First of the permits have been filed:

View attachment 885533

View attachment 885534

https://apps.sfwmd.gov/entsb/docdownload?object_id=0900eeea968a1411

YES YES YES.

We went to Tom Sawyer Island 2 trips ago and rode the ferry around the rivers on our last trip just because we like to try everything at least once! They were cool, but definitely not very exciting. We didn't grow up with them or anything so I'm not nostalgic for them or anything and I think it will be well worth the sacrifice to get a good Cars ride and a Villain land! Though again I wish they would expand the park more instead of tearing down and redoing areas already in use but this is about as good as you can hope for to add 3 or 4 good attractions and good themed areas

And this is what is happening. Those of us that have been going for 40-50 years still remember the old TSI and the folks who haven't been going for decades see it for what it is.

 

[mmackeymouse]

I can't quite put into words how crushed I am.

And, I am not someone who frequents TSI and the Riverboat on every visit.

But....what this does to the area- the ambiance, the vibe, the feel, the sightlines. That's the part that feels the worst to me. The noise from the cars while trying to enjoy Liberty Square. And so on.

It does such a disservice to Walt's vision. WAIT. Before you come at me that the parks were never supposed to be a museum and were supposed to be an ever evolving entity. Yes.

But.

A strong, maybe THE most, important part of Walt's vision was that it would be a park for families, for people of all ages....and a place that everyone would have their own area that they love. Not for it to be all rides and all thrills, all the time. It was intended for there to be ebbs and flows. Someone earlier described it beautifully by comparing it to the art of storytelling.

Ultimately, though, the part that gets me so incredibly emotional. (tearing up as I type this) Tom Sawyer Island. Liberty Belle Riverboat. These were clear homage to Mark Twain, a hero of Walt's, and a native son of Walt's Missouri. That area...down to the names themselves, are the most intense and purposeful connection Walt had to his home.

It's difficult for me to imagine why they would get rid of this area, this area that means a lot of things to a lot of people....when the land is there to expand.

And, if you are someone that says, it's boring, no one goes there, good riddance.....well if it's the last one, I'm sad for you. But...remember this when they come for Swiss Tree House. When they come for Carousel of Progress. When they come for the People Mover. When they come for the Tiki Room.

 

[Deb]

And, if you are someone that says, it's boring, no one goes there, good riddance.....well if it's the last one, I'm sad for you. But...remember this when they come for Swiss Tree House. When they come for Carousel of Progress. When they come for the People Mover. When they come for the Tiki Room.

in my experience, people actually go the last three of those