Teen daughter - vent

[tzolkin]

Really? You think this girl wants that job because her friends are telling her that they deal with screaming toddlers, clean up poop, pee, and spit-up, etc., etc., etc.? I mean maybe they are dealing with some of those things, but I’m sure it’s the Lead Teachers doing the heavy lifting, and the teen girls are there to supplement. Heck, I have seen such jobs advertised that way in local FB pages. “Come have fun with kids!”

If this is a legit daycare, I strongly doubt it. My daughter was looking at getting a job at two different local small childcare providers. Both require that she do 20+ hours of certifications even though she had already completed all the same trainings twice for her early childhood education class at the community college and again for her job doing childcare at the YMCA over the summer.

The YMCA job was just as a teen “helper” for summer camps for elementary aged kids. She was limited in her interaction because she was under 18. But she still had to complete all kinds of training on child abuse, safety, etc and to get her CPR certification. It took almost as many weeks to do the training as what she actually wound up working with the kids.

Does the daughter know how much $ is in this car fund and when a new deposit is made? Or is this just an idea that the parents have?

This is why I think it’s important for the daughter to have her own money and the responsibility to pay for things herself.

It’s easy for the parents to say “teen doesn’t appreciate all that we are paying for her” when they know the full extent of the savings and expenses. But it’s entirely possible that to the teen it’s just an abstract (my parents pay for “stuff”) or perhaps the parents haven’t even yet told her that they plan to buy her a car.

 

[MomOfDisneyPrincess]

You might have a child who needs to do things herself, learn things the hard way or figure it out on her own. The things you are providing, such as the car/insurance/college are very important to you, but not important to her, at least not right this very moment. She may not have any real idea of the true value of those things or how hard they are to acquire or maintain. If those concepts are nebulous to her and have no real value to her right now, I can see how she may seem ungrateful and uncooperative. It sounds like she may share your vision, but does not share your sweat equity in providing these things.

The process of getting and keeping a job will probably be much harder than she realizes and harder than the gig she has right now, but it may be invaluable in her path to adulthood. She may lose a job before realizing that it's not all about hanging out with friends, but rather real work. She may surprise you and may really enjoy her new job and when she sees her first paycheck, she may thank you for all you're doing. Realistically, it is better for the teen to make some of these mistakes early on and learn from them long before they are actual adults.

My DD15 is rather lazy, but had the opportunity through the high school foods class to work at their culinary institute in the bakery. She was working with dough, kneading and baking, etc. She came home that day and told me how dead tired she was and then asked if this was what it was like to work a full-time job. I tried not to laugh as I responded, "Pretty much." Then she declared, "I don't know how you do this every day!" LOL!! The point it, she did not grasp it until she experienced it herself.

 

[DLgal]

Heck not even a license! When I worked at the insurance company any person 16 and older was required to be rated or excluded. I def. paid for my own car insurance but at that point I had had a job for enough time to save for it. I bought myself my own car but by that time I had had a job for enough time to save for it. Most insurance companies tell you you gotta add the kid on the policy, some do have ways for them not to be rated (like they just have a learner's permit) others don't.

What are you talking about? How would the insurance company even know you have kids?

We have a 17 year old (non driver) and our insurance company has never inquired about him at all. I don't even know if they know he exists. They have certainly never asked us the ages of our kids. We will add him to our insurance when he gets his permit at 17.5, but our insurance company doesn't charge anything for adding a permitted driver.

 

[kyton]

It’s times like this that I wish I had a popcorn emoji! I have a 16yo daughter plus 14yo son and 11yo son. Sorry but anyone with preteen boys cannot IMO even compare them to teenage girls.

OP you chose to have kids, yes asking for the eldest to do chores is perfectly fine however stopping her from working part time is nuts to me. Our 16yo is quite lazy around the house but will work a million shifts at her part time job because she loves earning her own money. Now she is still expected to do certain things - maintain schooling, keep her room clean, feed the dogs etc and yes she is asked (very rarely nowadays because of their ages) to “watch” her youngest brother but it would never occur to me to make that her “job” without (a) asking if she was agreeable and (b) paying a sum that is equitable with what she would earn at her part time job.

We even bought her a car for her 16th birthday and would have paid for all upkeep other then fuel however she has decided she is not mentally ready to learn to drive. That then led to the discussion that we cannot hold onto a car for an indefinite amount of time so it has been sold. She understood and accepted that each action has a reaction.

I wish your family peace and happiness but most of all I wish you all patience and understanding.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

What are you talking about? How would the insurance company even know you have kids?

We have a 17 year old (non driver) and our insurance company has never inquired about him at all. I don't even know if they know he exists. They have certainly never asked us the ages of our kids. We will add him to our insurance when he gets his permit at 17.5, but our insurance company doesn't charge anything for adding a permitted driver.

Same with ours. We didn’t get charged for our oldest until she was a licensed driver. Our second is 16, the insurance company knows this, but she has not been added to any policy (doesn’t have a permit or license yet).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

What are you talking about? How would the insurance company even know you have kids?

We have a 17 year old (non driver) and our insurance company has never inquired about him at all. I don't even know if they know he exists. They have certainly never asked us the ages of our kids. We will add him to our insurance when he gets his permit at 17.5, but our insurance company doesn't charge anything for adding a permitted driver.

Some of it is state DOI requirements (Department of Insurance) was it PA or NJ or something like that where you signed a paper stating here's all the exposures and whatnot. Usually it's written in the insurance paperwork about notifying them of new drivers. Back in the day the insurance company I worked for also gave a new parent discount where you'd add your kid but they would not be rated until they reach of age. In the 33+ states the insurance company I worked for the state I live in was the only one the DOI prevented rating a permitted driver all other states it was 16 and they could be returned to permitted status for 1 term after that nope (had to deal with the Colorado Insurance Commission over a complaint on that one one time). As for how they find out usually an accident they want covered. Everyone should read their policy back for the information as it pertains to their state, their insurance company and the auto product they are in. I can tell you I did get calls from Claims "so if we add the 17 year old the day before the accident how much will the cost be" in determining if the loss would be covered. But when you switch insurance companies named carry over to from your C.L.U.E report. The insurance company I worked for was heavy in finding exposures because people tend to not want to list and rate someone who has constant access to their vehicle but they do want the company to cover them in the event of a loss (and many times the insurance company I worked for did even when not required usually a good will/PR/retention measure)

As for what the heck I'm talking about...obviously insurance stuff

Eta I should say I didn't say the company charges for permitted. The company I worked just didn't care if the teen was permitted after a certain point they were rated irrespective of full license or not.

 

[Mousemom234]

It’s times like this that I wish I had a popcorn emoji!

 

[Hisgirl]

Speaking as a mama whose chicks left home over 10 years ago, I think you are laying a foundation for your DD to seriously resent you, not want to come home to visit once she does leave, and move far, far away. That seems to be the behavior of the kids who are held too tight and not allowed to grow and have any autonomy.

I get what you are saying. And you aren't wrong. There just isn't room in your family plan for DD to do what she wants. When DDs don't get to do what they want, they tend to find a way to do it anyway, in secret ways and it usually doesn't bode well for mama/daughter relationships down the road.

So take some advice from an older woman. Give that girl of yours some space, room to grow, and the chance to make a mistake. She can't see anything but the door out right now. Let her figure some things out. And nix all the free stuff. She won't value it, if she doesn't pay a price for it. Trust me on that one.

 

[NotUrsula]

What are you talking about? How would the insurance company even know you have kids?

We have a 17 year old (non driver) and our insurance company has never inquired about him at all. I don't even know if they know he exists. They have certainly never asked us the ages of our kids. We will add him to our insurance when he gets his permit at 17.5, but our insurance company doesn't charge anything for adding a permitted driver.

The insurance companies here do an address search of DMV records on the home addresses of all their policyholders. If the DMV has a dependent's address info (for a license or even a state ID card) then the insurance company knows they they are there.

Our insurance company also doesn't charge for unlicensed residents. My eldest dragged his heels on going from a permit to a full license, and we never did have him on our policy, because by the time he got around to passing his test, he was just about to move away to college in another state. The insurance company told us to have him change his license to one for that state as soon as he got there, and then he would not have to be insured on our policy, as he did not have a car on campus. (When he was home for breaks he could drive our cars as a guest, but he never did come home for an entire summer.) My understanding is that not every company will allow it to be handled this way, but it worked very well for us. He got a car when he graduated from college, and insured it himself. The first year of that was insanely expensive b/c he'd never been insured before, but once he proved he was a good driver the price came down.

As to the OP, my suggestion would be to stop all the freebies and pay the DD fair market value for her job as a babysitter for younger siblings: meaning exactly what that infamous daycare would pay. Also give her a regular schedule and pay her extra if you have to have her go over. If you track hours manually and pay her informally, she won't owe taxes on it, and will thus make a lot more money than she could at a daycare, for doing essentially the same work. Like any employee, she could be fired for nonperformance of her duties, and would not get paid if she didn't show up and actually work. Once you are paying her what she is worth, they she can contribute back what her expenses cost you, such as the add'l premium to have her on your insurance, the gasoline that she uses, her own clothing/laundry, etc. What she resents is not having actual money of her own, and not being allowed to pursue her own interests; so work on making that happen in a way that gives both of you something of what you want/need. (You come out ahead on the daycare part because of the convenience, an in-home babysitter won't require you to take off work to stay home if a child is ill, and you won't have to fit your hours to a daycare's, either.)

 

[Karin1984]

This thread really bothers me. We only know what the OP has told us, and we aren't hearing from the daughter.

That is usually the case in these kinds of threads on this board. With all kinds of family problems put on here, you only hear one side of it.

But this is one of the few (to speak in Reddit terms) AITA threads, and the answer is for most of the people here: Yes, you are TA.
Not a bad parent or a bad mom, keeping in mind the stress of her job and the stress the teenager, the OP writes down her problem, constantly writing herself in a bad light.
She came here to vent, probably hoping for support, and while we are all supportive of the stress she is under in her particular work situation and teenagers in general, with how she writes what she does or how she does it, she writes herself more and more into a corner.

When you have a problem, and to the outside world, you can't make yourself look like the one on the 'right' side' by just telling your side of the story, alarm bells should go ringing like crazy.

I hope the OP takes a step back, takes the time to have a good look at herself and her behaviour and then think of a game plan together with her daughter. I think she didn't have time to process between posting this problem, us commenting and immediately when the daughter wakes up go into the talk.
Maybe a nice new years resolution?

 

[disykat]

Time to stop giving her $40 a week, no more saving money to buy her her own car. Make alternate arrangements for the other kids. Let her work or lay on the couch and deal with whatever consequences come her way due to her choices. (I would continue to pay her insurance to drive your car as part of the family and also continue to expect her to watch for the occasional work overlaps - minimal supervision of sibs for an hour every month or two is also a perfectly reasonable family expectation IMO. If one were to argue that it wasn't, I think you could also argue paying for her insurance wasn't.)

I certainly understand why she doesn't want to watch the sibs and wants to get a job, but I'd bet money on her regretting her decisions. Finding a ride for a specific regular schedule is not as easy as it sounds. Giving up the "mom is buying me a car with the extra money she is able to make if I help a few minutes a week with the sibs" plan is also going to look much different once that opportunity is gone. She may be home on the couch due to no transportation, but not getting $200+ dollars a month or looking forward to a gifted car.

 

[TwoMisfits]

What are you talking about? How would the insurance company even know you have kids?

We have a 17 year old (non driver) and our insurance company has never inquired about him at all. I don't even know if they know he exists. They have certainly never asked us the ages of our kids. We will add him to our insurance when he gets his permit at 17.5, but our insurance company doesn't charge anything for adding a permitted driver.

I've gone through this - when your child only has a permit, they do not have to be added to your insurance (at least not at my company). However, when they earn their license, they have to be insured whether or not they have a car. The insurance company and the state (for me) insists on it, whether your kid drives or doesn't (my kid drives about a mile once a month, but I still have a more than a doubled insurance payment for that limited driving).

Since I pushed her to get her license (in case my health has an emergency), I obviously pay it. The only way to get a reduced rate for a kid's insurance in the 1st few years (my company is 3 clean driving years to a discount) is to have them away at college without a car - if they stay home, you pay, no matter how they commute to college.

 

[Sinder]

Really? You think this girl wants that job because her friends are telling her that they deal with screaming toddlers, clean up poop, pee, and spit-up, etc., etc., etc.? I mean maybe they are dealing with some of those things, but I’m sure it’s the Lead Teachers doing the heavy lifting, and the teen girls are there to supplement. Heck, I have seen such jobs advertised that way in local FB pages. “Come have fun with kids!”

Do you actually think her friends working there aren’t telling her what the job is? You claim to be so sure so in your expert opinion on teens do you think they wouldn’t be complaining about all that stuff to their friends?

But you are right I don’t know why she wants the job or what she thinks the job is anymore than you do.

Bottom line is she’s a 17 year old who wants a specific job that her parents won’t allow her to get because they feel its her responsibility to take care of the other children they chose to have. According to the what the OP says its like they think she owes them and they are holding that over her instead of letting her do something on her own so she can contribute in a different way.

 

[jo-jo]

I wonder if a family meeting can be called? Mom and Dad work so many hours a week, with our salary, we pay this , that , the other. If one of us cuts back, we would also need to cut out XYZ. From time to time, you read stories of mom goes to work, after paying for childcare, work clothes, etc, there isn't much left over from pay check. Might be better all around if one parent can cut back hours, cut back on extras, but have more peace in the house.

Of course, many jobs, you can't just say, I'l like to work 25 hours, not 40. But maybe it might happen.

 

[piccolopat]

Your DD wants to grow up but I suspect she doesn't yet understand what that means. She resents having to watch YOUR kids, even if they are her siblings. Find reliable child care for your younger kids and then let her get a job under a few conditions. First, she has to keep up with her school work and maintain whatever average is acceptable to you. Second, her allowance stops and she is now responsible for all of her wants. Third, she is responsible for all of her transportation to and from work. That might mean riding her bike, getting a ride from a friend, taking car service/Uber or working around your schedules until she can afford to buy, maintain and insure her own car. It's good that she does this before starting college in September.

 

[mom2rtk]

I really don't like either side in this. Not a fan of how this has been handled by parents. Seems pretty heavy handed so far, and that never ends well. And the daughter comes off as entitled (from what we've heard so far). Time for a "clear the air, cards on the table" discussion where everyone gives a little to solve the problems at hand.

Kids, even teenagers, need to be taught that they are part of a family, and need to pull together when needed. They also need to understand that nobody owes them a car, or even money for college for that matter.

But parents should be trying hard to get those kid what they need, and to give them the opportunity to do the things they want to do.

And I'll admit, the nanny cam thing really puts me off. If I was 17 and my mom pulled that, I'd have a hard time coming back to the table.

 

[Disneylover99]

And I'll admit, the nanny cam thing really puts me off. If I was 17 and my mom pulled that, I'd have a hard time coming back to the table.

Yeah. someone watching me, watching my siblings in my own house, would totally creep me out.

Does the daughter know about the cameras? I’m not sure if the Op addressed this.

 

[mom2rtk]

Yeah. someone watching me, watching my siblings in my own house, would totally creep me out.

Does the daughter know about the cameras? I’m not sure if the Op addressed this.

I don't even care if the daughter knew about the cameras.

 

[Disneylover99]

I don't even care if the daughter knew about the cameras.

It could totally make a difference if the daughter knows or not though.

The cameras could be a non-issue for the daughter if she grew up always knowing they were there (for whatever reason) and/or thinking it’s the norm to spy on household members. Lol.

 

[mom2rtk]

It could totally make a difference if the daughter knows or not though.

The cameras could be a non-issue for the daughter if she grew up always knowing they were there (for whatever reason) and/or thinking it’s the norm to spy on household members. Lol.

Maybe it's just me. But I wouldn't care if I knew about it in advance. I still wouldn't like it, especially if it was used in an argument with my parents. Honestly, no wonder the girl wants to be out on her own more.