Questions on ROFR and other stuff

[mic_key_mouse]

Hi all. This is my first time starting a new thread on these boards, and I apologize in advance for asking a question that has probably been asked and answered a million times. Prior to posting this thread I thoroughly read the FAQs both here and at The Timeshare Store (many times over the past couple of years), studied vascubaguy's spreadsheet on ROFRs recently, as well as read tons of posts here (even though I don't post too much here I lurk a lot ).

I am considering buying property via resale, as it looks like a way better deal than going through Disney- with the exception of the current SSR deal as the 15% incentive gets you to within a few dollars of the pre-opening deal, and when you add the 'pre-banked' points in that they are giving as incentive it would be easy to pull the trigger if I wanted that as my home resort.

With all that out of the way (finally...whew) here is my (multi-part) question. Is ROFR really as 'off the wall' as it appears to be? It appears as though Disney allows some offers to go through at a certain price-per-point, yet on other offers for comparable properties they exercise their ROFR. Is there any way to make sense of this? Is there a time of year when more offers at a lower price-per-point seem to be allowed through? I am able to pay cash (or I can finance). Does paying cash have an effect on ROFR?

Also, why do the maintenance fees vary from resort to resort? Right now SSR is way low at $3.98 pp (but I see that creeping up slowly as the resort gets closer to buyout), with the others being relatively close yet there are differences. Was just wondering about this.

Lastly, could someone send me a PM as to what the larger and more experienced DVC timeshare companies are (other than the sponsor)? I would like to have as many options open to me as possible and this seems the best way to accomplish that without offending anyone.

Thanks for taking the time to answer. The information I have garnered from the 'regulars' here on the DVC boards has been invaluable and is much appreciated

 

[spiceycat]

ROFR is (my opinion) definitely off the wall when they buy back at $80 a point 25 points - but earlier allow a 100 point for $74 to go through.

makes no sense to me!!!

the maintence fees vary with the resort. each resort has different costs. the BWV and BCV both have the boats to the Epcot and big swimming pools to surpose.

OKW this time is a BIG increase - but someone says it is because they are resurfacing the GV.

If it doesn't stay the same or go down next year. I want an explanation from DVC....

BWV, BCV and VWL all have valet parking and room service - these services must be paid for it you use this stuff or not - so they are included in the maintence fees.

the maintence fees also pay for the bus service - OKW and SSR have more bus service than BWV, BCV or VWL. (no parks with walking or boating distance)

OKW got a new slide - but WDW claims they were paying for this - since it was voted down twice by the members.

Everything at the resort must be paid for by members. All the services, restuarants, staff, etc.

the DVC resorts that share with a WDW resort split these costs.

 

[LisaS]

Welcome to the DVC boards. I am fairly new here myself so hopefully some more experienced and knowledgeable owners will also chime in here.

Is ROFR really as 'off the wall' as it appears to be? It appears as though Disney allows some offers to go through at a certain price-per-point, yet on other offers for comparable properties they exercise their ROFR. Is there any way to make sense of this? Is there a time of year when more offers at a lower price-per-point seem to be allowed through? I am able to pay cash (or I can finance). Does paying cash have an effect on ROFR?

How you come up with the money for your resale contract does not affect your chances of passing ROFR. Just so you are aware, when you purchase directly from Disney, you can finance with Disney (provided you qualify). When you purchase a resale contract, you would have to arrange for any financing yourself. Some people get a home equity loan for example. When you close on your resale contract you will have to pay in cash via a certified check.

I don't think anyone has figured out the magic formula for what is going to pass ROFR. Part of the problem is that it's not static. Lately it seems like a lot of smaller contracts are getting ROFRd. Some folks have speculated that contracts where the seller offers to pay the closing costs are more likely to get ROFRd but many of those sail right through, even with banked points and at a good price. Sometimes it seems as if certain resorts are getting ROFRd more than others. Beca's thread here on the boards and vascubabuy's database that track which contracts are passing and which are being ROFR'd should give you some idea what to expect to pay for points at a particular resort and may help you identify recent trends.

My advice to you is to find a broker with a lot of DVC experience and follow their advice on price. That's what I did (I purchased through the board's sponsor: the Timeshare Store) and it worked out great.

Also, why do the maintenance fees vary from resort to resort? Right now SSR is way low at $3.98 pp (but I see that creeping up slowly as the resort gets closer to buyout), with the others being relatively close yet there are differences. Was just wondering about this.

Other people can answer this better than I can but fees vary based on the cost of running the resort and the number of units sharing the cost. It costs more to run some resorts than others based on the amenities at that resort. Some resorts are more expensive to maintain (resorts with interior hallways need to maintain the carpeting in those hallways, resorts such as VB and HH are more likely to suffer storm damage). Smaller resorts (BCV, VWL) mean each owner bears a larger share of the cost of operating and maintaining that resort. So there are several things that play a role in determining the maintenance fees.

Lastly, could someone send me a PM as to what the larger and more experienced DVC timeshare companies are (other than the sponsor)? I would like to have as many options open to me as possible and this seems the best way to accomplish that without offending anyone.

I know that you asked for people to PM you about brokers other than the Timeshare Store but it is the only broker I have any experience with. For the benefit of others in your situation who are reading this thread, I wanted to share my experience with the Timeshare Store. I was so grateful for what I learned about DVC here on these boards prior to purchasing that I chose to support our sponsor by purchasing through them and it was a great experience. They are friendly, knowledgeable and efficient. They know DVC and can advise you on what price to offer to increase your odds of getting through ROFR. They make good use of technology (email, fax, etc.) to get your paperwork to you quickly so that the process goes as quickly as possible. I wouldn't hesitate to use them again. If you don't see the contract you want in their listings, call them and tell them what you are looking for and they will contact you if something comes in. Some contracts never make it to the listings board -- they are matched up with people who previously contacted TTS and told them what they are looking for.

Good luck!!

 

[JimMIA]

Hi all. This is my first time starting a new thread on these boards, and I apologize in advance for asking a question that has probably been asked and answered a million times. Prior to posting this thread I thoroughly read the FAQs both here and at The Timeshare Store (many times over the past couple of years), studied vascubaguy's spreadsheet on ROFRs recently, as well as read tons of posts here (even though I don't post too much here I lurk a lot ).

First of all, welcome!

I am considering buying property via resale, as it looks like a way better deal than going through Disney- with the exception of the current SSR deal as the 15% incentive gets you to within a few dollars of the pre-opening deal, and when you add the 'pre-banked' points in that they are giving as incentive it would be easy to pull the trigger if I wanted that as my home resort.

For openers, here's a link to a thread we started several months ago discussing resale. It starts with a discussion of "home resort" that may be helpful, and there are a lot of tips and tidbits throughout the thread. http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=778634
One of the things you have to remember as you read that thread is that it was started months before the most recent price increases and incentives -- so the numbers made sense then, but not now.

People who don't read thoroughly often think I do not believe home resort is important. That's not true. I think it is critical for some folks, and not important at all for others. I also think you need to know which group you fall into, and act accordingly. The biggest mistake anyone can make with DVC is to think there is one best answer to anything. There isn't. Everybody's best answers depend on their own personal and unique situation.

With all that out of the way (finally...whew) here is my (multi-part) question. Is ROFR really as 'off the wall' as it appears to be? It appears as though Disney allows some offers to go through at a certain price-per-point, yet on other offers for comparable properties they exercise their ROFR. Is there any way to make sense of this? Is there a time of year when more offers at a lower price-per-point seem to be allowed through? I am able to pay cash (or I can finance). Does paying cash have an effect on ROFR?

ROFR does appear to be pretty off the wall. I think there are several reasons for that. One is that Disney appears to use ROFR for two different purposes -- they use it primarily (IMHO) to prop up resale prices to make their "new" prices more attractive, and they use it to fill requests from current owners for add-on points at "sold-out" resorts. Another reason for the difficulty in deciphering ROFR threshholds is that they are constantly moving targets, depending on Disney's varying needs. And finally, we are often flying blind, because we are able to see only small portions of the overall ROFR picture. No matter how diligently vascubaguy maintains his database, he can only show what we tell him and the truth is very few buyers share their information.

As someone else has already mentioned, the larger DVC realtors are a better source of guidance on ROFR. The Timeshare Store is the largest, most experienced, and has the largest inventory of resales, so obviously they see more of the activity than anyone else. The other two who are quite active are Jaki at DVC by Resale, and "the one who cannot be named." For her name, you will have to give someone your email address because it will get ****'d out here, whether in a post or a PM. (Someone else will have to provide that, because I have not used her, and don't have her contact info.)

When I purchased, it was at a time when Disney was attempting to unload approximately 10,000 OKW points they'd accumulated over time, so I thought that was a good time to try to get a low price. However, when I called TTS, I was told that my prospective offer of $72 would not pass ROFR, but $73 probably would (there were no ROFR's on Beca's thread above 70 at the time). I bought at $73 and passed, and a number of others bought at $72 and got ROFR'd.

ROFR is always an educated guess at best, but it's the most important number in your contract. You have to offer high enough to get past ROFR. If you don't, nothing else matters. Vascubaguy's database is full of ROFRs where most of us just shook our heads when we saw the price, wondering what those people were thinking. A lot of the ROFRs are $5-6 too low!

 

[spiceycat]

oh gee forgot

www.atimeshare.com
www.dvc-resales.com
www.******************.com ******** crawford
www.thetimesharewarehouse.com
www.reid4florida.com
www.bidshares.com
www.myresortnetwork.com
www.monstertimeshares.com
www.redweek.com

send me an email if you want the * - dis won't allow some websites to be posted. Says that they misrepresented the facts to people?

 

[mic_key_mouse]

People who don't read thoroughly often think I do not believe home resort is important. That's not true. I think it is critical for some folks, and not important at all for others. I also think you need to know which group you fall into, and act accordingly.

I guess I haven't read enough yet to completely understand the pros and cons of this issue. I guess it is something that I will have to do some research on. Thanks for the link to that thread BTW- it answered most of those 'nagging' questions that I still have

Thanks to those that have responded, it has been very helpful

 

[vascubaguy]

I guess I haven't read enough yet to completely understand the pros and cons of this issue. I guess it is something that I will have to do some research on. Thanks for the link to that thread BTW- it answered most of those 'nagging' questions that I still have

Thanks to those that have responded, it has been very helpful

Definately take into consideration where you want to stay, when you'll be able to plan vacations, and future vacations (if your trends might change). Some of those key issues are, if you can't book more than 7 months out, go for SSR (lower MN fees, and the 15% promo is a good deal). If you can book more than 7 months out, and want to stay at a specific resort, you should buy at that resort to guarantee that you'll have the best chance of getting what you want. Example: If you want BWV or BCV in October, or VWL around Christmas. Also, be sure and factor in the MN fees when you look at resales. The price of some of the VB contracts are pretty tempting, but when you add in the MN fees over time, it isn't as good of a deal in the long run.

Good luck!

 

[bavaria]

Definately take into consideration where you want to stay, when you'll be able to plan vacations, and future vacations (if your trends might change). Some of those key issues are, if you can't book more than 7 months out, go for SSR (lower MN fees, and the 15% promo is a good deal). If you can book more than 7 months out, and want to stay at a specific resort, you should buy at that resort to guarantee that you'll have the best chance of getting what you want. Example: If you want BWV or BCV in October, or VWL around Christmas

I think that this is excellent advice. Don't just consider your current situation, but where it may be 10 years from now, and the potential impact on your vacation habits.

If you truly believe that you will be booking at 7 months out or less for a number of years, then 'buy where you stay' may not apply.

 

[Dean]

With all that out of the way (finally...whew) here is my (multi-part) question. Is ROFR really as 'off the wall' as it appears to be?

Remember the main goal of ROFR is to minimizes the people that buy resale and push them to retail. Thus being unpredictable is more effective than the reverse. I've seen them buy one back at X price let one contract go through at a cheaper price but similar accounting. Now that they have gotten more aggressive, I do believe they are a little more predictable than before.