My son got a "referral" at school yesterday.

[Liberty Belle]

He's only in kindergarten, but I hope this is his first and last.

By his and witnesses accounts, he was sitting in the lunchroom eating his lunch when a boy in his class (who has tripped him and pushed him before on several different occasions) told him to get up so he could have that seat. My son refused, so the boy grabbed his arm and pinched him. My son pushed him and then the boy clawed his face. He's got a big scratch/gouge on the side of his face.

The referral said that my son was sent to the office for "fighting back, instead of getting a teacher." I am a para educator and completely understand why the schools make these rules, but...argh! I know if some woman came up to me, demanded I move and then grab and pinch me when I didn't, I'd most likely do more than push her.

I had to practically gag my fifteen year old, so he wouldn't tell my little one that he did the right thing by fighting back.

 

[lovemygoofy]

What the heck happened to the other kid? I don't think your son did anything wrong if he was defending himself and I would tell that to the school.

 

[RN4Babies]

He's only in kindergarten, but I hope this is his first and last.

By his and witnesses accounts, he was sitting in the lunchroom eating his lunch when a boy in his class (who has tripped him and pushed him before on several different occasions) told him to get up so he could have that seat. My son refused, so the boy grabbed his arm and pinched him. My son pushed him and then the boy clawed his face. He's got a big scratch/gouge on the side of his face.

The referral said that my son was sent to the office for "fighting back, instead of getting a teacher." I am a para educator and completely understand why the schools make these rules, but...argh! I know if some woman came up to me, demanded I move and then grab and pinch me when I didn't, I'd most likely do more than push her.

I had to practically gag my fifteen year old, so he wouldn't tell my little one that he did the right thing by fighting back.

Oh, hell no. I would be filing a grievance and demanding a meeting with the classroom teacher, the principal and the boy's parents. There's a history of the other kid bullying your son; he should not have the opportunity to approach your son in the crowded chaos of the lunchroom to further terrorize and intimidate him. It's unacceptable; if the school isn't responsive and can't keep that other kid away from your son, I'd be going to the school board, writing letters to the editor of the local paper, etc. until there was a satisfactory plan in place. I would also demand that the "referral" be expunged from his file/record.

 

[Lisa_M]

If the teacher/school had nipped the bullying in the bud previously, this situation would have likely not occurred. I'd like to know how they are going to address the bullying going on in Kindergarten. That is what I would ask the Principal. Not that it's ok to fight, but good for your son, for standing up for himself.

 

[Liberty Belle]

What the heck happened to the other kid? I don't think your son did anything wrong if he was defending himself and I would tell that to the school.

The other kid got the same exact punishment, which I do think is wrong. I know Finn should have gone to a teacher instead of pushing the kid, but A) he probably knew the kid would sit in his seat when he did, and B) he probably couldn't stop himself after the kid pinched him (there is a little bruise, so I know it hurt).

I made myself wait to sign the note so I wouldn't write something I'd regret, but I did put on there that this child has physically hurt my child on different ocassions in the past. I agreed that Finn didn't make the best possible choice. I can't imagine many who would have in that situation, though.

A similar thing happened to my oldest in middle school. A kid hit him and Will hit him back - they both got the same punishment. I do think Will should have been punished for hitting him back, but I think the one who throws the first punch should get a harsher punishment.

 

[Liberty Belle]

Oh, hell no. I would be filing a grievance and demanding a meeting with the classroom teacher, the principal and the boy's parents. There's a history of the other kid bullying your son; he should not have the opportunity to approach your son in the crowded chaos of the lunchroom to further terrorize and intimidate him. It's unacceptable; if the school isn't responsive and can't keep that other kid away from your son, I'd be going to the school board, writing letters to the editor of the local paper, etc. until there was a satisfactory plan in place. I would also demand that the "referral" be expunged from his file/record.

If the teacher/school had nipped the bullying in the bud previously, this situation would have likely not occurred. I'd like to know how they are going to address the bullying going on in Kindergarten. That is what I would ask the Principal. Not that it's ok to fight, but good for your son, for standing up for himself.

I talked to the teacher. I've actually worked with her before when she was a sub at our school. She's a long term sub for my son's teacher who is out on maternity leave. She looked very sympathetic and kept saying, "I know...I know". I think she wanted to say more, but couldn't. She's only been in the classroom for about a week and a half.

The boy is on a behavior plan already. He actually came to my son's birthday party in November and behaved well (but was "off", so he may have an IEP), but all the pushing and tripping happened since then.

 

[Stitchfans]

Oh, hell no. I would be filing a grievance and demanding a meeting with the classroom teacher, the principal and the boy's parents. There's a history of the other kid bullying your son; he should not have the opportunity to approach your son in the crowded chaos of the lunchroom to further terrorize and intimidate him. It's unacceptable; if the school isn't responsive and can't keep that other kid away from your son, I'd be going to the school board, writing letters to the editor of the local paper, etc. until there was a satisfactory plan in place. I would also demand that the "referral" be expunged from his file/record.

I agree 100% with this person. I have always told my daughters to fight back and will continue to. I am not raising punching bags. I always told them that I would be there to back them up if they got in trouble after the fact. Once a bully figures out that you aren't going to defend yourself they will continue to terrorize you. That is awful that this is going on at such a young age.

 

[lovemygoofy]

The other kid got the same exact punishment, which I do think is wrong. I know Finn should have gone to a teacher instead of pushing the kid, but A) he probably knew the kid would sit in his seat when he did, and B) he probably couldn't stop himself after the kid pinched him (there is a little bruise, so I know it hurt).

I made myself wait to sign the note so I wouldn't write something I'd regret, but I did put on there that this child has physically hurt my child on different ocassions in the past. I agreed that Finn didn't make the best possible choice. I can't imagine many who would have in that situation, though.

A similar thing happened to my oldest in middle school. A kid hit him and Will hit him back - they both got the same punishment. I do think Will should have been punished for hitting him back, but I think the one who throws the first punch should get a harsher punishment.

Okay, I'd be more than pissed. This child is in kindergarten for goodness sake and already picking on people. He received the same "referal" which I have no idea what that means but received nothing else?

I'm sorry but that's unacceptable. This is just teaching the bully child and your poor son that standing up for yourself is wrong and it certainly isn't. Is there a principal or someone that you can speak to about this further?

 

[Kit'smommy]

Oh, hell no. I would be filing a grievance and demanding a meeting with the classroom teacher, the principal and the boy's parents. There's a history of the other kid bullying your son; he should not have the opportunity to approach your son in the crowded chaos of the lunchroom to further terrorize and intimidate him. It's unacceptable; if the school isn't responsive and can't keep that other kid away from your son, I'd be going to the school board, writing letters to the editor of the local paper, etc. until there was a satisfactory plan in place. I would also demand that the "referral" be expunged from his file/record.

I absolutely agree with this. I aplaude your keeping a cool head, but I wouldn't have written down that I think my son made a poor choice. If there has been a history with this other child, your son shouldn't have to keep putting up with his bullying or be punished for simply defending himself when provoked.

We had months of bullying issues with a set of twins that ganged up on DS this past year in preschool (K4) that resulted in us pulling him out of school. The school simply wouldn't deal with the other child. You had better believe that I would have backed my son up for standing up for himself.

You can only turn the other cheek so many times...

 

[Mouse House Mama]

Personally I think your son did the right thing. I don't think he should be punished. The other kid should have kept his hands to himself. Obviously the school knows there is a problem with this child bullying since the classroom teacher has said as much. I would be up at school talking to the principal. Good luck.

 

[JessicaR]

Oh, hell no. I would be filing a grievance and demanding a meeting with the classroom teacher, the principal and the boy's parents. There's a history of the other kid bullying your son; he should not have the opportunity to approach your son in the crowded chaos of the lunchroom to further terrorize and intimidate him. It's unacceptable; if the school isn't responsive and can't keep that other kid away from your son, I'd be going to the school board, writing letters to the editor of the local paper, etc. until there was a satisfactory plan in place. I would also demand that the "referral" be expunged from his file/record.

I agree 100% with this person. I have always told my daughters to fight back and will continue to. I am not raising punching bags. I always told them that I would be there to back them up if they got in trouble after the fact. Once a bully figures out that you aren't going to defend yourself they will continue to terrorize you. That is awful that this is going on at such a young age.

I agree with both these posts. It is unacceptable that this child is bullying your son!

Stitchfans - I tell my boys the same thing.

 

[Liberty Belle]

The schools are all that way, here. The rules are that if you fight back, you're punished the same as the instigator. I definitely think that's wrong. My son is not a pushover, though, and I do think he'll continue to stand up for himself, but I wanted to emphasize the rules to him, so he wouldn't get in trouble.

I'm really not sure what the best thing to do is.

The referal is basically just a note that goes into his records saying he was sent to the office for showing physical aggression.

 

[RN4Babies]

I'm going to add to my previous post, and tell you that my ds experienced being bullied in middle school (7th grade). There was a boy bigger and taller than ds at the time who started tripping him, elbowing him, pinching him and spitting on him when he thought no one was looking. My DS didn't tell me about it, and he dealt with it by trying to ignore it and the kid doing it. Finally, a gym teacher saw the kid spit on my ds in the gym locker room, and the story came out. I requested and received a meeting with the principal, the teacher who witnessed the spitting and the other boy's parents. The kid was suspended from school for a week...and when he came back, he started doing it again. The school couldn't do much more at that time, but indicated to me that I could pursue a complaint through the police department. (The other kid's parents just kind of laughed off the bullying as a "kids will be kids" kind of thing, and the mom took him to Florida for the week when he was suspended ).

Having a police officer show up their home after I filed a harrassment charge got their attention, and the bullying stopped overnight.

Yes, their son has an IEP, has anger management issues, behavioral issues, etc. etc. All of that does not give anyone a pass for bullying someone else.

I think a visit from a police officer would make a big impression on a kindergarten bully.

 

[lovemygoofy]

The schools are all that way, here. The rules are that if you fight back, you're punished the same as the instigator. I definitely think that's wrong. My son is not a pushover, though, and I do think he'll continue to stand up for himself, but I wanted to emphasize the rules to him, so he wouldn't get in trouble.

I'm really not sure what the best thing to do is.

The referal is basically just a note that goes into his records saying he was sent to the office for showing physical aggression.

You are such a good mom. I understand not being able to do much but I know I'd be beyond livid.

I do understand how the school is trying to teach the children that violence is wrong in any circumstance but what is being said about the bullying? Is it even being acknowledged? Is it a tricky road because this other child may have an IEP?

I guess I better find some patience if I'm going to be a parent and dealing with all these things I don't like or understand. Ya'll are way better people than I am that's for sure.

 

[Kit'smommy]

The referal is basically just a note that goes into his records saying he was sent to the office for showing physical aggression.

Then you fight it until another note is added to his record stating that he was physically provoked. I had a similar situation as a teenager where another girl got in my face and slapped me. Getting a teacher wasn't an option. My parents stood behind me and all history of the incident came out of my permant record.

Your son wasn't in the wrong and I wouldn't tell him otherwise.

 

[RN4Babies]

The referal is basically just a note that goes into his records saying he was sent to the office for showing physical aggression.

You really need to either make sure that referral comes out of his records, or that there is an addendum that outlines the history of bullying, and the full circumstances surrounding this incident.

If there are ever any issues in the future, a note in your son's records (even from kindergarten) saying he showed signs of physical aggression could have serious implications and consequences.

 

[Liberty Belle]

Then you fight it until another note is added to his record stating that he was physically provoked. I had a similar situation as a teenager where another girl got in my face and slapped me. Getting a teacher wasn't an option. My parents stood behind me and all history of the incident came out of my permant record.

Your son wasn't in the wrong and I wouldn't tell him otherwise.

You really need to either make sure that referral comes out of his records, or that there is an addendum that outlines the history of bullying, and the full circumstances surrounding this incident.

If there are ever any issues in the future, a note in your son's records (even from kindergarten) saying he showed signs of physical aggression could have serious implications and consequences.

It did say just what I told you guys, that he was provoked and got in trouble for fighting back. It, of course, didn't give the name of the other child, so I made sure to do that in my comment about there being a history of this boy being physical with my son.

You all have me thinking. Maybe I will talk to the principal.

 

[Liberty Belle]

You are such a good mom. I understand not being able to do much but I know I'd be beyond livid.

I do understand how the school is trying to teach the children that violence is wrong in any circumstance but what is being said about the bullying? Is it even being acknowledged? Is it a tricky road because this other child may have an IEP?

I guess I better find some patience if I'm going to be a parent and dealing with all these things I don't like or understand. Ya'll are way better people than I am that's for sure.

Tina, you'll make a wonderful mom. I'm absolutely sure of it.

Actually if he does have an IEP, they'd probably be quicker to document it. I'm surprised nothing else is being done - or, you know, maybe it is. I just have what my son told me to go by on that. The school didn't even tell me who the boy was. Most likely something else is being done, now that I think about it rationally. It really is a good school and the referal, though it indicated physical aggression, did sound slightly sympathetic to my child. It did say "fighting back" rather than just "fighting."

 

[Liberty Belle]

Oh, just a P.S. - my son's teacher (and her assistant who has been in the classroom all year) said they've never seen my son show signs of physical aggression before.

 

[lovemygoofy]

Tina, you'll make a wonderful mom. I'm absolutely sure of it.

Actually if he does have an IEP, they'd probably be quicker to document it. I'm surprised nothing else is being done - or, you know, maybe it is. I just have what my son told me to go by on that. The school didn't even tell me who the boy was. Most likely something else is being done, now that I think about it rationally. It really is a good school and the referal, though it indicated physical aggression, did sound slightly sympathetic to my child. It did say "fighting back" rather than just "fighting."

Is there anyway you can make an inquiry into the other child's punishment besides the referral(which is dumb by the way)? I'm thinking that there is or should be a lot of documentation about the events between your son and this child. I would want to know what is being done to help get rid of this situation. Are they in the same class? I know the school year is almost over but what about next year? Can you request they not be in the same class?

It just blows my mind that this stuff happens in kindergarten! Jeez at 6 years old I'd had my butt beat red if I even thought about doing something like that to another child.

My real issue is that your son wasn't at fault and I don't think standing up for yourself deserves punishment, especially if the other child did not receive anything more even though he instigated it.