Is anyone as frustrated as me, due to no 2008DDP info yet?????

[Lesleyluvsdisney]

I agree. Here is a copy of the analysis I did last year to demonstrate that to myself:

http://brianandrobbie.com/DiningPlanEstimatedCostsNoAppyNoDessert.htm

We did the same thing last year. We ALWAYS eat on site, whether it be CS, a few Character meals, and TS, as we don't hire a car, we are "on-site" for the entire 16 nights.

Even based on what we would normally spend, the plan was set to "break even". After looking at it when coming home, we would have spent more, based on the amount of food we ate, but that was the only reason it increased, as we ate in places we wouldn't normally pay out for, and obviously ordered more food.

Our cost difference between both years are as follows:

2006 = 2 x £336 + 1 x £96 = £768 converted at todays rate = $1497
2008 = 2 x £448 + 1 x £176 = £1072 converted at todays rate = $2090

So if we felt we didnt really save money last time, then next year is even worse, I understand previous posts frustration at those who "abuse" the DDP, as the majority of people, like myself purchase it as we would be eating on site anyway, and the DDP gives us more choice.

So as it stands i'll be calling Virgin later today to CANCEL DDP, although we will continue to eat on-site, but no way will we pay out over the $2000, i was prepared to pre-pay, and I am sure a lot of people feel the same.

 

[bicker]

I'm loyal to Disney, we go on average three times a year - sometimes more. BUT, to be honest I'm getting tired of the over priced meals, continued decline in quality and worrying about booking out meals so far in advance to insure we get a good time slot.

There is no question that there are degrees of loyalty -- some folks will pay a higher premium than others are willing to. Absolutely no question about that. And of course, you've touched on the real issue: having to worry about booking meals so far in advance makes it clear just how many folks are loyal enough, or attracted enough, to pay the premium Disney charges for their meals.

 

[bicker]

It just seems to be the DI$NEY WAY $$$$$$$$

It i$ the American way!

 

[Amyrlin]

If this is all correct I'll go back to booking with an AP discount and using my DDE, invariabley this will mean eating off site and making it more likey I'll visit other places more.

 

[Lesleyluvsdisney]

Ive just called WDW reservations, and read out the letter I'd received from Virgin stating

"Since making your reservation we have been notified by resort that for 2008 departures, the Disney Dining Plan package has changed. The new dining plan no longer has a starter as part of the table service meal, and gratuities are no longer included inthe price. All other aspects of the dining plan remain unchanged".

The guy I spoke to said it was the very first time he had heard of this, and they had absolutely no information regarding this. I'd to call back in a few weeks.

 

[Uncleromulus]

That really dosen't mean a whole lot--those folks are often the last to find out changes.

 

[JimMIA]

There is no question that there are degrees of loyalty --

What I meant by loyalty is frequent flyer status. We visit several times a year (as many do), we obviously stay onsite and will continue to do so because we own DVC. And despite the fact that we always have a car, we have not yet visited any other parks. Now that will all change, except for staying at DVC. In fact, we are not even going to renew our APs. We'll get the Florida seasonal passes, and if we decide to go during blackout periods, we'll just avoid the Disney theme parks.

Like many, we're good customers, but it's not the food that we're loyal to.

...some folks will pay a higher premium than others are willing to.

People who don't have cars don't have many choices. In the future, they will do well to research car rentals and cabs to give them more options. Both are probably no more expensive than dining onsite, so they may find going offsite is a better option than they thought. It's especially better if you are staying offsite.

If you spend your DDP researching time looking for great hotel and rental car deals, and take the money you save not using DDP, you may find that you come out hundreds of dollars ahead. Getting around just isn't that difficult, nor is it that expensive.

And of course, you've touched on the real issue: having to worry about booking meals so far in advance makes it clear just how many folks are loyal enough, or attracted enough, to pay the premium Disney charges for their meals.

I don't think that's the case, and I think the comments that maybe things will go back to the previous situation where you didn't have to sweat getting ADRs proves that. I think most of the ADR scarcity now is completely dependent on DDP, and if many people opt out of DDP, the restaurants will suffer. Of course, I'm sure that blinding flash of the obvious has occurred to Disney, and I'm equally sure they have a better handle on how much restaurant traffic will decline than we do.

 

[Lewisc]

That's one way of looking at it. I may decide not to purchase the dining plan. I may replace a meal at Boma and Le Cellier with one meal at blueZoo and have an extra counter service meal. My guess is I'll wind up spending less total dollars at Disney restaurants then I spent with the dining plan. I normally don't have dessert with a counter service meal and generally share dessert with my table service meal.

I suspect Disney would be happy if fewer guests purchase the dining plan. The danger with a price increase is if "normal" customers decide the DDP plan isn't for them leaving guests who will make sure they get "their monies" worth.

The question is if Disney will get enough guests paying an extra $10 to compensate for the number of guests who decide not to purhcase DDP.

Disney has always had a dining plan, prior to 2005 the plans were not very customer friendly and the plans weren't that popular. The current DDP is the only package mousesavers suggest. DIS posters never suggested prior dining plans as a way to save money.

edited to add Disney can always add back the tip, appetizer or even add a second snack if DDP bookings drop too much. It would not be easy for Disney to reduce benefits once the 2008 plan is released. Terms subject to change doesn't really give a business a "blank check" to make significant reductions.

They are constantly looking to improve -- and improvement to the shareholders means increased revenues, reduced expenses, and growing profits. If you eliminate the gratuity on DDP and make other adjustments, and improve your bottom line $10 per day per guest, you have grown profits substantially.

 

[Praying Colonel]

I agree--we may decide not to get the dining plan. And if that happens, we may decide not to stay on property. The DDP was what got us to start staying on property. If the rumored changes happen, I'll run the numbers under each scenario and we'll decide what works best for our family.

Maybe Disney's counting on most folks not looking so closely at it, or maybe they've decided that most will stay on property, anyway. But our family does have a "squeal point."

 

[Teacher03]

I agree--we may decide not to get the dining plan. And if that happens, we may decide not to stay on property. The DDP was what got us to start staying on property. If the rumored changes happen, I'll run the numbers under each scenario and we'll decide what works best for our family.

Maybe Disney's counting on most folks not looking so closely at it, or maybe they've decided that most will stay on property, anyway. But our family does have a "squeal point."

That's exactly how we feel...we stayed onsite the last two years because of the dining plan. The year before we stayed at Cypress Point, which was beautiful....three bedrooms, a large living room, kitchen, for a little more than the price of a value resort. We would probably go back there without the dining plan.

 

[faberj]

The last time we were on any type of plan was back in 2001 and we had the Silver plan that gave you 2 magic wishes per day that could be used for dining, tours, and a few other things and it was sixty some dollars per person per day. The meals did include the tax and tip and they were also 3 coursed (appi, main, and des). Did we save money, not really but it was nice tha everything was pre paid for. I was looking forward to using the DDP next December, but if they charge more, take away the appi, and have you pay out of pocket for tax and tip it is just not worth it for us (2 adults). I think it would just be too much of a hassle for budgeting purposes. I personally think Disney should keep the plan as it is and just up the cost of the plan from $38.99 to $45.00 (for adults) and keep the kids plan about the same cost as the kids menus are so limited as it is and think if the kids plan price got hiked up too much the family would turn away from it all together because it is just not worth twenty some dollars.
Anyway Disney TS and CS meals are overpriced as it is. I just might have to re think our trip for next year. We were going to stay onsite at a mod resort, used DME to and from the airport, use the DDP, and stay on Disney property. Now I might see what the price differance is (if any) to rent a car, stay off site, eat most of our meals off site.
I also don't think that the "loyal" or frequent visitors to the world should feel slighted as the majority of Disney guests can not afford to go multiple times per year or even once a year, it is more like once every 2 or 3 years. Just becasue we can not go as often as you doen't mean we are not intitled to the same benifits as the more frequent visitors.
Anyway that is just my 2 cents worth, I will get off of my soap box now. I am just as disappointed as everyone else, and waiting to see what is going to happen.

 

[Rabbit_Fan]

For my family, the DDP as it is allows us to eat at more TS than we would without it.

I am not sure if we fall in to the "working it" group according to some, but we did order things that we normally couldn't afford. For example, DH loves prime rib, and at home (and on vacation) we cannot afford it often, so he loves the DDP and his ability to eat it as often as he likes. I personally don't see that as 'abuse' though. I don't feel as though I should tell him to order a burger because otherwise we'd look like we're working the system. For us it's nice to be able to eat things we love more frequently than without the plan. We also all ordered appetizers and desserts because they were included -- we ordered appies and desserts that we could take with us and snack on later, or put in the fridge for breakfast the next morning. Again, I don't think we were wrong to have ordered the food to eat later as opposed to forgoing it because we weren't going to eat it at that very moment.

Without the tip,tax and appetizer included the DDP will not be a 'value' for us. We wouldn't eat at TS often (maybe once or twice per trip) and would instead order food from the garden grocer and eat in the room or venture off-site to eat and shop around/explore Orlando more (currently the only places we've been in Orlando have been the airport where we got in to a towncar or Disney's magical express bus, then on to WDW where we didn't go offsite once other than to return to the airport)

Though I will miss the DDP as it is now, it won't prevent our going to WDW, though we won't be going as often. On the upside, it is another check in the 'pro' column for buying DVC as we will have the kitchen all of the time -- If the DDP changes as stated above, we'll surely get a lot more use out of it than we would have otherwise, and Garden Grocer will be getting a lot more of our business.

 

[Mrs Grumpy]

I loved the fact that everything was prepaid. I didn't have to worry about what I was ordering and how much it cost. We didn't save a ton of money on it but I liked the convenience. If they drop the two things being discussed we would no longer be saving anything (I don't think....need to go figure a little bit and see for sure) since it is just my husband and I. We are not going back until 2010 so I guess I shouldn't worry about it too much because there will be a lot more changes by then I am sure.

 

[bicker]

What I meant by loyalty is frequent flyer status.

There is a difference between frequency and loyalty.

 

[faberj]

I loved the fact that everything was prepaid. I didn't have to worry about what I was ordering and how much it cost. We didn't save a ton of money on it but I liked the convenience. If they drop the two things being discussed we would no longer be saving anything (I don't think....need to go figure a little bit and see for sure) since it is just my husband and I. We are not going back until 2010 so I guess I shouldn't worry about it too much because there will be a lot more changes by then I am sure.

Well said! My DH and I feel the same way. It would be nice not to have to worry about what you are ordering and be able to enjoy a nice meal that you wouldn't normally be able to afford.

 

[JDiva02]

For a variety of reasons-going back to school for a mid-life career change, moving from Jacksonville, FL to Atlanta as well as a diabetic dog (who has now gone to his reward) we (DH and I, no kids) have not been to Disney since the early 90's--whereas before we had gone to WDW several times a year.

When I sat down in June to plan our first Disney trip in years I found this board and found out about the DDP--and that it was free in September--so I booked a value resort and made our ADR's. I also booked a brief Christmas trip at a value resort and forked over the money for the DDP. I was so pleased about the DDP (even when we paid for it)b/c it gave us an opportunity to splurge a little more than we would otherwise.

After looking at what I think I would order (picking what I want, not the most expensive items) for a typical day at WDW, if the rumored changes do take place, I would pay an additional total of $20.00 on top of the meal plan. The value of the meals and snacks would be $62.00--so I'm not sure saving maybe $3-$4 dollars by using the DDP is worth it. Most likely we will just eat more CS and just have one or two special TS meals, sharing an appetizer and dessert as we usually do.

I will still stay on-site, as I love the feeling of being in the world, and the values give us everything we need--but since we drive I will be much more likely to eat more meals outside of WDW.

LSL

 

[Anc96]

I agree--we may decide not to get the dining plan. And if that happens, we may decide not to stay on property. The DDP was what got us to start staying on property. If the rumored changes happen, I'll run the numbers under each scenario and we'll decide what works best for our family.

Maybe Disney's counting on most folks not looking so closely at it, or maybe they've decided that most will stay on property, anyway. But our family does have a "squeal point."

I haven't read the whole thread, but I've read enough to understand how people are feeling.
I feel the same way. If the new dining plan has the changes in this thread, I doubt we will be doing the ddp, and we probably wouldn't be staying on property much either.

 

[Brian Noble]

And there is no reason why the executives shouldn't admit as much. Executives are in the business of making money for their employers...so of course they are willing to take credit when they succeed!

You misunderstand---I was not casting aspersions. Rather, just providing support for my reasoning.

Edited to add: it appears that the (in)famous Len Testa has another variant of the rumor: no tip, but no mention of starter not being included. The new twist: a restriction back to the "old days" of snack credit eligibility.

http://www.wdwtoday.com/

Remember: it's all just guessing until the glossy brochure shows up in an AAA office near you!

 

[lenshanem]

I agree about the convenience factor of it. It was nice paying ahead of time and then not worrying about carrying around a lot of money or budgeting out the trip. Now if they take off the tip you're still gonna have to dig into your wallet. Before we wouldn't worry about it and if we had great service we'd lay down an extra $5 or something.


Really I'm at the point the whole meal planning thing is just tiring. When you're booking eleven months out, making ADRs 180+ days out and planning multiple trips in a year all trying to work around school calenders and waiting on WDW hours and special events it has just become not fun anymore. At least with the DDP you had the ease of convenience like you said. With the DDP changes and my daughter turning ten I see our dining habits changing dramatically.

The character buffets are just way too over priced, especially for what you pay for a ten year old!

 

[Praying Colonel]

You misunderstand---I was not casting aspersions. Rather, just providing support for my reasoning.

Edited to add: it appears that the (in)famous Len Testa has another variant of the rumor: no tip, but no mention of starter not being included. The new twist: a restriction back to the "old days" of snack credit eligibility.
http://www.wdwtoday.com/

Remember: it's all just guessing until the glossy brochure shows up in an AAA office near you!

I heard that, and also heard the other rumored variation of a DDP choice which would provide 3 meals and 2 snacks/day. I thought Scopa was on target when he called it "The Jabba The Hutt Plan."