I'm apparently the bad guy (child vent ahead)

[mjkacmom]

We don't know the whole situation. I have a friend who's 13 year old son is non verbal and autistic. Sometimes the more she tries to handle the situation, the worse it gets. At this point, she doesn't care who is judging her as she wrangles his kicking and screaming into the school bus. She's just tired.

 

[mom2rtk]

How are you at "the stink eye"?

I probably would have said something if I was in a store, but in an enclosed environment where I couldn't exit if needed, I probably wouldn't have said anything.

I don't disagree with that, and I have had my own imperfect public moments with my youngest. The difference is I tried to make it perfect. Sitting there, not trying, doesn't get you empathy or sympathy points.

Exactly that. I have huge sympathy for a parent who is at least making an effort.

 

[melanielll]

Everyone spouts that "its take a village to raise a child" until a villager questions something a child is doing. Then - the villager gets slammed to the ground. You are not the bad guy.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

I don't think the OP is a bad guy. I might have said something in the moment as well. Here, from my living room, with time to think on it and away from the actual issue, I have different insight. That's all.

 

[Liberty Belle]

Everyone spouts that "its take a village to raise a child" until a villager questions something a child is doing. Then - the villager gets slammed to the ground. You are not the bad guy.

I hate that saying. I've seen some members of the village and I do NOT want them interacting with my children.

 

[Hikergirl]

Everyone spouts that "its take a village to raise a child" until a villager questions something a child is doing. Then - the villager gets slammed to the ground. You are not the bad guy.

I don't think the OP is the bad guy, and I am not one of the believers in it takes a village however I think there are a couple ways one could go about it, neither are wrong. Like the OP, someone could ask the mom what is going on. OTOH, someone could ask the mom if she needed help.
I think seeing the mom try to do something would make people do the latter.

 

[Liberty Belle]

But what your child is doing isn't bad behavior, it doesn't matter what people think. I'm sure if your child was throwing a temper tantrum you wouldn't excuse it because of his epilepsy. I think that is what the pp meant, that parents often use their child's disability to explain and excuse actual bad behavior. A seizure isn't a temper tantrum and I am sorry that people you and your child come across can't see the difference.


I think this generation of parents are too soft, they don't dare want to damage their children's self esteem by disciplining. We don't want to squash free expression either.

There's a huge difference between explain and excuse.

When my child was younger, his ADHD and Anxiety/Panic Disorder would explain his behavior, but would not excuse it, necessarily.

 

[Hikergirl]

There's a huge difference between explain and excuse.

When my child was younger, his ADHD and Anxiety/Panic Disorder would explain his behavior, but would not excuse it, necessarily.

I'm not sure why you quoted me, I didn't say they were the same thing, and I am talking about those parents who do use their child's disability as an excuse, not those who are just explaining things.

 

[Liberty Belle]

I'm not sure why you quoted me, I didn't say they were the same thing, and I am talking about those parents who do use their child's disability as an excuse, not those who are just explaining things.

I responded because of this sentence: "I think that is what the pp meant, that parents often use their child's disability to explain and excuse actual bad behavior."

It sounded like you were lumping them together as the same or similar.

 

[DLgal]

As sensitive as I am to the incredible challenges faced by parents with kids who have special needs -- and I DO always consider this possibility when I see a child misbehaving -- it is also true that many parents these days appear not to feel any sense of responsibility to even TRY to control their kids in public.

In OP's metro ride this morning, are we to assume that both kids had special needs that account for their behavior? And that it's ok for their mom not to even TRY to control EITHER of them?

No matter how badly my day is going -- and like everyone I've had some doozies -- I always take full responsibility for my kids in public.

My sister's boyfriend has an amazing son who is autistic. He ALWAYS does what he can -- particularly in public -- to control anything that comes up. No one thinks that will ALWAYS work in EVERY situation -- and I think the vast majority of people are understanding of that. But he does always make the ATTEMPT as his parent.

I have only two children. Both of them are autistic. And yes, I have had them BOTH flip out on me in public at the same time. And I do what I can, usually swiftly leave wherever we are and deal with it in privacy of our car or home, which consists of staying deadly calm while they lose it and be there for a hug and to talk them down when they can tolerate listening. I used to have to physically lay down on my younger son to provide deep pressure and prevent him from hurting himself. They are older now and usually so well behaved that no one has any clue they are autistic. But sometimes, lately, our 12 year old, for some reason just starts SCREAMING (this is a normally fully verbal and articulate child who is highly intelligent). It comes out of nowhere (usually in restaurants) and when questioned about it after it happens, our son does not know why he does it and says he cannot help it. And he cries and beats himself up about it because he assumes everyone is mad at him for something he cannot control.

I really just wonder what does it look like TO YOU to "control" something like that? What is your yardstick for measuring whether a parent is "doing enough" or not?

 

[wvjules]

I tired to ignore it...for a long time, at least half of the ride. Then when the yelling tantrum was constant for about 5 minutes, I couldn't keep my mouth shut. I didn't yell at her, but I did have a "tone". The person that said it's not her fault wasn't close to her so I'm guessing it was just a stranger excusing the behavior. At one point the kid was mad because she couldn't unlock the phone, tantrum ensued, then another time mom took the phone, tantrum ensued, and I'm not even sure what prompted the tantrum that finally broke me. I really think these were just badly behaved children with a mom that can't control them so she gave up. Do I feel bad for saying something? No. No matter the ability of children, the parents have a responsibility to the public to at least try to gain some sort of control over them. That did not happen in this case.

 

[kidshop]

I'm on the Metro this morning. It is standing room only because DC's metro service sucks these days. Anyway, there is this woman and 2 kids. The kids are insanely out of control. The one is ripping apart the newspaper and yelling. The other one is screaming and hollering and thrashing herself around in the seat where she was sitting (I felt bad for the guy in the same seat) and on the floor. It was a nightmare. So after the kid is yelling nonstop for 5 minutes, I asked the mom if she was going to do anything about it. (She has done NOTHING to gain control of the kids this entire time.) Someone actually piped up and said "It's not her fault." I was flabbergasted. Her kids were out of control and she did NOTHING. How is it not her fault? And someone else said they felt bad for her. If she were trying to get control and was unsuccessful then yes, I'd feel bad for her. But she did absolutely nothing about either of her out of control kids. It was a very long 25 minute ride!

I'm sure someone here is going to say that maybe there were invisible disabilities, but I honestly don't care. There is no excuse for their behavior and no excuse for the mother not doing anything.

Thanks. I feel better.

I know exactly what you are talking about, I see this sort of thing when out all the time. (I also live in the NOVA area, but I think it is widespread everywhere). Some parents have given up I guess, and they do not admonish their children for loud, disruptive, destructive behavior. The kids have free reign and the control to do whatever they feel. They can't possibly all be disabled. And the disabled children probably wouldn't be left alone to terrorize out of the sight of their parents. I don"t know when I went all "get off my lawn" lol, but I know how I raised my kids when they were toddlers and young children, and they were taught respect and proper behavior. Now it seems the excuse is that it is just how they are, shrug.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I really just wonder what does it look like TO YOU to "control" something like that? What is your yardstick for measuring whether a parent is "doing enough" or not?

I know that I cannot possibly understand your experience. It's why I am always so understanding when I see situations where a parent is trying. That's all I would hope to see -- someone trying to control the situation.

As I said from my experience with my sister's boyfriend's son, all the trying doesn't always work. But he tries.

OP said the mom essentially sat and did NOTHING. There was nothing to measure with a yardstick. That's the part that bugs me.

 

[pweyl36]

I am NOT defending a neglectful mother, but there genuinely are disabilities that cause behavior problems that cannot be quelled even with the most ardent parenting intervention and discipline.

Again...I'm not defending a careless parent, but I do have to speak up for those parents who are raising kids with disabilities. I am sure it is hard enough without people judging them everywhere they go.

That is fine, but maybe the mother should of said that. I do thinks a lot of people use the disabilities as an excuse for not disciplining there kids.
my oldest son has ADD and he knew how to act in public I never let him act like a fool.

 

[Liberty Belle]

That is fine, but maybe the mother should of said that. I do thinks a lot of people use the disabilities as an excuse for not disciplining there kids.
my oldest son has ADD and he knew how to act in public I never let him act like a fool.

That's great, but I'm sure you realize that all children with ADD/ADHD are different and the perfecting of behavior can take a while. But, it does sound like in this case, the mother didn't even try.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I tired to ignore it...for a long time, at least half of the ride. Then when the yelling tantrum was constant for about 5 minutes, I couldn't keep my mouth shut. I didn't yell at her, but I did have a "tone". The person that said it's not her fault wasn't close to her so I'm guessing it was just a stranger excusing the behavior. At one point the kid was mad because she couldn't unlock the phone, tantrum ensued, then another time mom took the phone, tantrum ensued, and I'm not even sure what prompted the tantrum that finally broke me. I really think these were just badly behaved children with a mom that can't control them so she gave up. Do I feel bad for saying something? No. No matter the ability of children, the parents have a responsibility to the public to at least try to gain some sort of control over them. That did not happen in this case.

How do you do with the bad behavior of adults on public transportation? Those people are a dime a dozen in a big city. I learned a long time ago it's not worth my time to tell another how to behave in public. You either learn to tune it out or get off the train and grab the next one.

That said I couldn't help myself from speaking to the kids jumping on the store mattress with their muddy boots so I guess everyone has their limits.

 

[Hikergirl]

I responded because of this sentence: "I think that is what the pp meant, that parents often use their child's disability to explain and excuse actual bad behavior."

It sounded like you were lumping them together as the same or similar.

No, I meant it in the context of (the) parents that do. Sorry if it came across that I was speaking of any parents with children with disabilities, I didn't mean it too.

 

[pweyl36]

That's great, but I'm sure you realize that all children with ADD/ADHD are different and the perfecting of behavior can take a while. But, it does sound like in this case, the mother didn't even try.

they are not different it's the parents to set limits and teach there kids how to behave . ADD/ADHD is to me is really not a disability. it can
be controlled,but a lot of parents use the behavior as an excuse. I am tired of hearing oh he/she has ADHD. My child is 28yrs and knows how to
be respectful and has been at his job for almost 10yrs. I cant stand how its the ADD/ADHD.

 

[Liberty Belle]

they are not different it's the parents to set limits and teach there kids how to behave . ADD/ADHD is to me is really not a disability. it can
be controlled,but a lot of parents use the behavior as an excuse. I am tired of hearing oh he/she has ADHD. My child is 28yrs and knows how to
be respectful and has been at his job for almost 10yrs. I cant stand how its the ADD/ADHD.

Wow, well first, yes, they are all different. Children (with disabilities and without disabilities) are all different, and ADHD is a spectrum just like most disorders, AND there are often other disorders in children with ADHD.

Furthermore, I know you said "to me," but it is considered a disability by the government. It comes with varying symptoms and signs that, yes, sometimes can be controlled, but not 100% of the time and not immediately.

You may be misunderstanding people and think they're making excuses when in fact they are explaining things. If my child gets frustrated due to his ADHD and hits the table or yells out, I may say he's behaving abnormally due to his disorder, but that does not mean we do not continually work on helping him learn to control himself.

As someone who has been a para to children with disabilities, is a trained advocate for families with children with disabilities, and works in vocational rehabilitation with people with disabilities, and is a parent of a child with ADHD, I have a lot of experience.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

I really just wonder what does it look like TO YOU to "control" something like that? What is your yardstick for measuring whether a parent is "doing enough" or not?

One does not have to have an exact yardstick to know doing absolutely nothing is absolutely not enough. And that's what happened in the op's case.