I witnessed something very disturbing today (long)

[kc10family]

ITA. If she knew she was going to be spanked (hardly child abuse!) if she continued whimpering when she was told to stop, then she should have stopped.

Right! I am sure she has learned how far to push mom or dad by this time in her 2.5 yrs.

My DH's mother was the type to say "if you keep crying I'm going to give you something to cry about" and she would do just that. He grew up to be a wonderful man. Spanking is NOT "child abuse."

Sad, very sad. Joan Crawford comes to mind.

If more parents believed in "spare the rod, spoil the child" I think there would be less "problem children" in the world today. Same goes for in schools. Teachers and principals should still be able to spank students when necessary. Kids today know that teachers/principals "can't touch them" and so many parents are of the "time out" mindset so kids know they can get away with a whole heck of a lot more than they used to. Sad.

I feel sorry for people who think as you do.

Oh and I am not offened often, just seems your post offended me with your "problem children" ignorant comment.

 

[Carly_Roach]

Before I start, I realize this can be a hot topic.........

I guess what I have a problem with is if this was a case of a father beating his child, it obviously wasn't so bad that others felt it necessary to intervene. Not even you.

Ergo, it wasn't so bad.

Why even debate the topic? Only one person was there to see the alleged abuse and she did nothing. Everyone else is just speculating. Little Lydia is just fine.

 

[Minnie_me]

ITA. If she knew she was going to be spanked (hardly child abuse!) if she continued whimpering when she was told to stop, then she should have stopped.

My DH's mother was the type to say "if you keep crying I'm going to give you something to cry about" and she would do just that. He grew up to be a wonderful man. Spanking is NOT "child abuse."

If more parents believed in "spare the rod, spoil the child" I think there would be less "problem children" in the world today. Same goes for in schools. Teachers and principals should still be able to spank students when necessary. Kids today know that teachers/principals "can't touch them" and so many parents are of the "time out" mindset so kids know they can get away with a whole heck of a lot more than they used to. Sad.

What's SAD is your ignorance.

A child that age cannot just "STOP" crying when told to. Especially if she is fearing a beating!

I've been a teacher for over 20 years and have never once laid an angry hand on a child. Nor have I wanted to. Yet my classes are ALWAYS the best behaved in the school (as reported to me by the special area teachers, cafeteria workers and playground monitors). I teach mutual respect. And that's how I've raised my children as well. Never spanked them. They're also extremely well-behaved and well-mannered.

Respect and love go a long way when it comes to building character.

Violence just instills hatred and fear.

 

[Chattyaholic]

I feel sorry for people who think as you do.

Oh and I am not offened often, just seems your post offended me with your "problem children" ignorant comment.

Oh, good grief! I love it when someone calls you "ignorant" just because your opinion differs from theirs. Gawd!! Get over it already!

I would never dream of calling another person "ignorant" because they don't share my opinions. It's a difference of opinion, people! Geesh!!

 

[Skywalker]

For those that are saying spanking won't make someone stop crying. Well, if they are truly crying over nothing, then the spanking might make them cry more this time, but the next time they are ready to have a little tantrum they just might realize it's not worth it. It takes time to impart lessons.

Or, these parents could have had a long standing whining/whimpering problem with this child. Maybe they warned her the first time would be one hit. If she whined again it would be two. Now they are on three. Maybe she learned her lesson and isn't a whiner anymore. Maybe they are the most loving parents in the world who happen to spank. Plenty of respectable parents have and will.

Anyway, I have two children and no I have never spanked them, ever. But I don't see the jump here between a discipline spanking and abuse.

 

[Chattyaholic]

You have obviously managed to make your grandson understand his limits with you without having to resort to spanking. So why defend spanking so much? You clearly don't need it. Perhaps you are more consistent with him than his mom is. Perhaps you have a firmness in your voice that she doesn't have. Could be you have even given him "logical consequences" without realizing it! Whatever it is, it is pretty clear that you can handle him just fine without physical punishment. I'm not sure why it's so important to you.

This is what people mean when they say they don't need to spank - they have found ways to correct and teach without using it. It's not that they don't discipline at all - it's that they have found other ways to get their message across, just like you have with your grandson.

You're right, I don't have to spank my grandson. So far, "the look" and sternly telling him "no" works.

The same things worked with my DD (mother of said grandson), I don't remember ever having to resort to spanking with her. Maybe once or twice her entire childhood, if that.

DS on the other hand was a very willful child. He got quite a few spankings while he was growing up.

What works with one, doesn't always work with another.

I just don't see the harm in spanking. I was spanked as a child. I don't hate my mother for it and I'm not in therapy because of it. DH was spanked as a child as well. We weren't beaten. There is a difference.

 

[kejoda]

I would hardly call three whacks on the butt (I'm assuming butt) child abuse.

He did give her quite a few chances.

ITA. If she knew she was going to be spanked (hardly child abuse!) if she continued whimpering when she was told to stop, then she should have stopped.

My DH's mother was the type to say "if you keep crying I'm going to give you something to cry about" and she would do just that. He grew up to be a wonderful man. Spanking is NOT "child abuse."

If more parents believed in "spare the rod, spoil the child" I think there would be less "problem children" in the world today. Same goes for in schools. Teachers and principals should still be able to spank students when necessary. Kids today know that teachers/principals "can't touch them" and so many parents are of the "time out" mindset so kids know they can get away with a whole heck of a lot more than they used to. Sad.

I admit I haven't got past the first page. These 2 posts pissed me off big time..

How would the 2 of you like it if I hit you 3 times? I bet you would be saying something different then.

 

[momx2]

Of course it's not true in some cases, but the basic philosophy is. "Teaching" kids a lesson by hitting them is teaching them NOTHING. The only thing you're teaching them is that it's OK to hit someone, and you're likely to have problems when your child gets into an argument or fight at school and hits another child because that's what they've learned is right to do when someone is "bad". Then what are you going to say... hitting's bad?!

And for those of you who say that you have to hit your kids to discipline them... take a few child-rearing classes and you'll learn so many other ways I'm not saying that occasionally giving an older child a smack on the butt is going to ruin their lives forever, but you're honestly teaching them nothing but to fear you. Good luck with that.

I'm sorry, but I disagree. Both of my DDs were spanked at toddler to 6 or 7 age. It was very rarely and never a beating with a belt or fist or slaps or anything like that. It was either me swatting their diapered, clothed behind a couple of times. It mainly was just to get their attention after everything else failed. It did sound loud, because swatting the puffy diaper makes a muffled, loud noise. Or it was DH putting them over his knee (same diapered and clothed) and a few swats that way. He always told them why they were being spanked in a calm manner so they would know why and it was never in anger. They were never marks nor were they hurt in anyway.

I was brought up being beaten on with anything my mom could get her hands on and it was always in anger. Trust me, I know the difference between a beating and a spanking.

I am not defending what this particular dad did. He seems out of control. I would have probably gotten in trouble for beating my DH if he acted this way.

Trust me, my children do not physically fear me or my DH. Actually my oldest DD would much rather at 9 be spanked than grounded. Which is why we started exclusively grounding at around 6 -7 with her. Actually, I take that back. About a month ago she was being horrid and had been for several weeks. My DH finally took her to her room and spanked her. She was so embarrased, she has been great ever since. Not perfect, that'll never happen, but not the little devil she was. My youngest DD is 6 and she hasn't been spanked in probably a year or more.

I guess what I mean is, I believe that proper use of spanking is an effective tool in discipline. Not the only tool, but can be used if used appropriately. I know there are some that will never agree, but that is fine. We all can't agree with everything. My children are wonderful. I am blessed, but so are my children.

 

[Chattyaholic]

I admit I haven't got past the first page. These 2 posts pissed me off big time..

How would the 2 of you like it if I hit you 3 times? I bet you would be saying something different then.

If I were your child and I was misbehaving you go right ahead and give me 3 whacks on the butt!

 

[jodifla]

Let me explain why I considered it being "dragged across the floor". She was sitting in a chair next to her mom. Her back was to her mom, she had her face in her hands & she was crying/whimpering. The dad reached across the mom, grabbed the back of the coat (it was a coat with a hood on it) at the neck, pulled her on to the floor & then he dragged her on her butt over to sit in front of him.

I consider that being dragged across the floor. Why would it ever be OK to do that to anyone - let alone a child.

I can't believe you think this is such a big deal. I've been known to drag DS a place or two. Often to bath time...but I normally make a game of it, dragging him by his feet, and he's laughing by the time we get to the bathroom.

But I've been know to drag him by his coat or shirt if we need to MOVE and he's not, like in an airport security line or something.

 

[kejoda]

If I were your child and I was misbehaving you go right ahead and give me 3 whacks on the butt!

Nope I don't hit my kids. I'll just be glad that they behave without me abusing them.

 

[chris1gill]

Personally, I have a very loud mouth, and I personally would not have tolerated a father hitting his 2 1/2 year old like you describe. I couldn't and wouldn't do it. I wouldn't give the father permission to do it, by doing nothing you gave him permission. As for the mother, I'm sure he probably belts her to, this sounds like it happens quite frequently if she's yelling "no, daddy no".... Guess who won't have a real great relationship with her father? Lydia won't... and you know whose fault that will be? It will be both her mother and her father's fault. The mother for putting up with it and the father for doing it....

I've been in similar situations and I open my mouth and I'm sorry, that's just who I am...

As for hitting children, I've never had to. They knew what was expected of them and they behaved or they felt the wrath of parental disappointment. That was enough. Canceled trips, canceled events, that was enough in addition to the disappointment. There was nothing worse for either of my kids than the disappointment.

You let kids get away with stuff & the next thing you know you're on Nanny 911 (she does not support spanking as it completely defies logic), but I sure don't believe in spanking, as it is completely unnecessary.

 

[jodifla]

Personally, I have a very loud mouth, and I personally would not have tolerated a father hitting his 2 1/2 year old like you describe. I couldn't and wouldn't do it. I wouldn't give the father permission to do it, by doing nothing you gave him permission. As for the mother, I'm sure he probably belts her to, this sounds like it happens quite frequently if she's yelling "no, daddy no".... Guess who won't have a real great relationship with her father? Lydia won't... and you know whose fault that will be? It will be both her mother and her father's fault. The mother for putting up with it and the father for doing it....

I've been in similar situations and I open my mouth and I'm sorry, that's just who I am...

As for hitting children, I've never had to. They knew what was expected of them and they behaved or they felt the wrath of parental disappointment. That was enough. Canceled trips, canceled events, that was enough in addition to the disappointment. There was nothing worse for either of my kids than the disappointment.

You let kids get away with stuff & the next thing you know you're on Nanny 911 (she does not support spanking as it completely defies logic), but I sure don't believe in spanking, as it is completely unnecessary.

And what do you think the father's going to say? "Oh, gee, you're so right. Thanks, oh perfect parent!!"

I have a big mouth too, and if ANYONE ever said ANYTHING to me about the way I treat DS, there wouldn't be much left of them. I can shred a person with words when pressed.

 

[kribit]

I haven't read all the responses, but as far as the little girl, I can't help but wonder if she was crying because she was nervous. Children tend to get scared at the doctors office.

There is no question the guy was an idiot, however, I wouldn't have said anything to him. If this moron can do this to his own child in public, I can't imagine my telling him he's a jerk would do any good.

I wouldn't stir up trouble for what would amount to nothing. Perhaps someone at the office saw it and reported him.

 

[ticktock]

ITA. If she knew she was going to be spanked (hardly child abuse!) if she continued whimpering when she was told to stop, then she should have stopped.

My DH's mother was the type to say "if you keep crying I'm going to give you something to cry about" and she would do just that. He grew up to be a wonderful man. Spanking is NOT "child abuse."

If more parents believed in "spare the rod, spoil the child" I think there would be less "problem children" in the world today. Same goes for in schools. Teachers and principals should still be able to spank students when necessary. Kids today know that teachers/principals "can't touch them" and so many parents are of the "time out" mindset so kids know they can get away with a whole heck of a lot more than they used to. Sad.

I agree to an extent. The situation sounded a bit extreme though if it happened just as the OP described.

I have to laugh at the time out parents. I can't count how many times I've been told that I'm so "lucky" to have such a pleasant, well behaved son. It wasn't "luck",it was ALOT of work. Some of which was the very unpleasant task of spanking unfortunately. I wish others would put more effort into their kids instead of just expecting the rest of us to just deal with their kids "issues".

 

[Nana Annie]

Maybe you don't believe it but I do believe that if you "spare the rod" you do "spoil the child", as I am a believer in God and the Bible and that's where those words come from.

Beating is not the same as spanking, not even close.

I think if you took a survey of the inmates in prison you would find most of them are uneducated and that might be one of the main reasons (not that they were spanked while growing up) why they turned to a life of crime. Ivy League college students probably aren't going to wind up in prison. Most of the time anyway.

That must make shopping really tough, having to check labels so carefully in order to never buy anything made of a blend. No polyblends, no wool blends.

Must take that bible literally!

 

[Freyja]

I would hardly call three whacks on the butt (I'm assuming butt) child abuse.

He did give her quite a few chances.

Well I would. I don´t care how many chances he gave her. The kid was approx. 2 1/2!!!

 

[momrek06]

I have not read every post here but I always wonder about people like the father in this thread...if he does stuff like this in a public setting, well what the heck is he like AT HOME? Creep.

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Sorry, if someone has always said what I just said..great minds think alike!!!

Oh and FWIW: If it was my DD (and I do not have any DD's) I would have given her my purse to look at, big deal, I would be sitting right there next to her QUIET little self while she looked through it!!! Which would have AVOIDED everything that ended up happening today in the MD's office.

 

[birdiesunshine]

I've never hit my dd. Never had to. She listens to me just fine without having to use my hands.

Also


It would be weird to hit her and then teach her to keep HER hands to herself

 

[disney4us2002]

Speaking strictly from a CPS standard, if this incident was called in directly as reported in the OP, it would have been screened out at intake - that is, not investigated. It was not directly witnessed, there was no visible injury, presumably the spanking was with an open hand and not an object, and it doesn't sound as though the parent had malicious intent to cause injury. Now, every Dept. has some variance about how they look at these types of calls, but it is very rare for our Dept. to intervene in a "spanking" report.

That's not to say the father wasn't a jerk because a crying child won't stop crying after a spanking; they cry harder, duh!