Has anyone else had issues with the new Oceaneer's club/lab policies?

[bledsoedoc]

As I understand it, food allegries are not considered a disability or protected under ADA. Not to cause a fight, but the ADA is very specific to what is and is not a disability which limits life activities.

Under the ADA an individual has a disability and is protected by the law if he or she has an "impairment" that "substantially limits" one or more "major life activities."

What is an impairment?
The concept of "impairment" includes physiological as well as mental or psychological conditions. A physiological impairment is a disorder or condition, a cosmetic disfigurement or an anatomical loss affecting any of the major body systems. A psychological or mental impairment includes most disorders, such as mental retardation, organic brain syndrome, emotional or mental illness and special learning disabilities. Under this inclusive definition of "impairment" a broad range of conditions have been protected under the ADA, including:

Depression
Back problems
AIDS
Epilepsy
Diabetes
Blindness
Schizophrenia
Mobility Impairments
Think, concentrate and interact with others

Ada clearly protects food allergies at school and work and the Ada amendments protects on planes. I did a quick Google search to double check. Well, tripled check.
But really, you were making my point. Which isn't even relevant to this thread. Disney is great when it comes to food allergies, but it isn't an Ada requirement. It is more a cover your butt liability issue. And they really want to help their customers.

 

[Disney Dreams]

What was the "most inappropriate experience" that made Disney change their rules? I am going on a cruise in May and am on the fence about whether or not to leave my kids (5 & 7 at cruise time) in the club. That statement makes me a little uneasy. If you could elaborate I would greatly appreciate it.

I wouldn't worry about your kids. The situation involved a teen and a special needs adult in the teen clubs.

We don't know that the one incident that was reported on the Dis boards is what prompted these changes. For every incident that is reported here, there are many others that occur that we never hear about.

Nothing of great concern happened inside the kids club. A special needs adult took an interest in a teen and it made her family feel uneasy. The complaint was they felt he was following her around. He banged on their stateroom one night- and there was some sort of confrontation outside a restaurant.

I think the fault lies with the parent off this young man and DCL security who by the account of the family seemed reluctant to act sooner.

No one actually knows why Disney made these changes. Everything on these boards are assumptions and speculation.

I have heard that in regards to the situation everyone keeps talking about that the matter was escalated to higher ups in the business than just someone at a call center- and that the parents were demanding a change in policy. So I don't see the restatement coming on the heels of this as unrelated....

I really dont understand why there is the assumption by people here on DIS that the Kids' Club policy changes on every DCL cruise ship are due to one incident that one DIS Board Member shared. And, an incident that did NOT occur within the Kids' Clubs at that.

It was one incident (albeit upsetting). 1,000s of things happen on Disney cruise ships every day. 1,000s of things happen to people that are not on DIS. If that one incident had not been shared here on DIS, no one here would know about it. So, that means that there are countless other significant incidents that occur onboard Disney ships that never make it to the DISBoards.

The changes are being made to Kid's Club policies. The incident that was discussed here did not happen in the Kid's Club.

I would advise being very cautious about making any assumptions as to why changes occur. We all know what happens when assuming.... The "why" doesn't really matter.

- Dreams

 

[bledsoedoc]

A few sites:
Www.aafa.org
Www.foodallergy.org

 

[travispete]

I just got off the Wonder yesterday. It is called Open House on the Navigators. There were long (sometimes 5 hours) blocks of time in both the Lab and Club dedicated to Open House time. While it's true that while one of them had open house hours, the other was secured, my 3 yr old DD was not interested in the Lab at all and they did NOT bring things over from the Club, as had been suggested in a prior post. I also want to point out that because of KSF, there were an add'l 200 kids on our ship, according to Guest Services. The first time I took my daughter to the Club during secured programming, they had 135 kids checked in - just at the Club. They said that about 50 of them were brought over from the Lab when it was converted to Open House time. We canceled one spa service and one Palo brunch because of Open House times. I also want to point out that during secured programming, my husband I were both allowed access to the Club. We went back there, played, held our daughter and took a picture of our daughter when Ariel made a surprise visit. So, they are not adhering to their own policies. Please feel free to ask any Wonder specific questions about the Lab/Club..... although, I'm sad to say, I don't have the navigators. I thought I packed them, but I can't find them anywhere.

 

[cnj]

Thanks for posting this! That is what we are afraid of. Did you let Disney know why you were canceling and did you write it on the comment card at the end?

 

[True Romance]

I just got off the Wonder yesterday. It is called Open House on the Navigators. There were long (sometimes 5 hours) blocks of time in both the Lab and Club dedicated to Open House time. While it's true that while one of them had open house hours, the other was secured, my 3 yr old DD was not interested in the Lab at all and they did NOT bring things over from the Club, as had been suggested in a prior post. I also want to point out that because of KSF, there were an add'l 200 kids on our ship, according to Guest Services. The first time I took my daughter to the Club during secured programming, they had 135 kids checked in - just at the Club. They said that about 50 of them were brought over from the Lab when it was converted to Open House time. We canceled one spa service and one Palo brunch because of Open House times. I also want to point out that during secured programming, my husband I were both allowed access to the Club. We went back there, played, held our daughter and took a picture of our daughter when Ariel made a surprise visit. So, they are not adhering to their own policies. Please feel free to ask any Wonder specific questions about the Lab/Club..... although, I'm sad to say, I don't have the navigators. I thought I packed them, but I can't find them anywhere.

Thank you very much for your first hand report, this is what I have been afraid of. I want to know what is being said and done on the ship. Did you or anyone else complain to the Youth Activities staff onboard? Did you tell them about your canceled services?

Shoreside is clueless and giving out wrong information and our letters seem to be going unnoticed. I think now the only changes are going to be made are from complaints that are actually coming from onboard.

Wow, moving 50 kids over from the lab?? Did you notice how crowded/uncrowded the open houses were? I can't believe this is still going on and more people are not spitting mad on the ship.

 

[keaster]

I just got off the Wonder yesterday. It is called Open House on the Navigators. There were long (sometimes 5 hours) blocks of time in both the Lab and Club dedicated to Open House time. While it's true that while one of them had open house hours, the other was secured, my 3 yr old DD was not interested in the Lab at all and they did NOT bring things over from the Club, as had been suggested in a prior post. I also want to point out that because of KSF, there were an add'l 200 kids on our ship, according to Guest Services. The first time I took my daughter to the Club during secured programming, they had 135 kids checked in - just at the Club. They said that about 50 of them were brought over from the Lab when it was converted to Open House time. We canceled one spa service and one Palo brunch because of Open House times. I also want to point out that during secured programming, my husband I were both allowed access to the Club. We went back there, played, held our daughter and took a picture of our daughter when Ariel made a surprise visit. So, they are not adhering to their own policies. Please feel free to ask any Wonder specific questions about the Lab/Club..... although, I'm sad to say, I don't have the navigators. I thought I packed them, but I can't find them anywhere.

This is exactly what I'm worried about. The secure club will be packed with kids. Just curious Travispete, when there were 135 kids in the secured club, how busy was the open house?

 

[jetskigrl]

I just got off the Wonder yesterday. It is called Open House on the Navigators. There were long (sometimes 5 hours) blocks of time in both the Lab and Club dedicated to Open House time. While it's true that while one of them had open house hours, the other was secured, my 3 yr old DD was not interested in the Lab at all and they did NOT bring things over from the Club, as had been suggested in a prior post. I also want to point out that because of KSF, there were an add'l 200 kids on our ship, according to Guest Services. The first time I took my daughter to the Club during secured programming, they had 135 kids checked in - just at the Club. They said that about 50 of them were brought over from the Lab when it was converted to Open House time. We canceled one spa service and one Palo brunch because of Open House times. I also want to point out that during secured programming, my husband I were both allowed access to the Club. We went back there, played, held our daughter and took a picture of our daughter when Ariel made a surprise visit. So, they are not adhering to their own policies. Please feel free to ask any Wonder specific questions about the Lab/Club..... although, I'm sad to say, I don't have the navigators. I thought I packed them, but I can't find them anywhere.

Thank you so much for the update. I'm sorry to hear that they have not adjusted the times yet. I fear that it will be the same for us when we cruise at Spring Break time. I would be curious to know the overall feeling of parents that experienced this with their kids. I can't imagine that people are happy with this.

I do hope they realize that they are losing money every time a parent cancels a spa treatment of Palo reservation because of this.

 

[kathi]

Can someone tell me if the "craft room" on the Dream is part of the Lab or the Club? We toured the kids area on our only Dream cruise, but our daughter was not with us so I didn't take note.

We are on the Dream in April and I'm definitely concerned about the new Open House policies. Our daughter, who is 7, usually spends every night from about 7 till 10 in the kids area (most recently the Lab on the Magic). She likes to play board/card games and do crafts. I'm wondering if this will be an issue with the open house? What area is used for the secure programming on the Dream?

We could potentially all be miserable in the evenings (because we do not enjoy the same night-time activities - which is why the Disney Cruise is so appealing!)

 

[Mcky36]

I just got off the Wonder yesterday. It is called Open House on the Navigators. There were long (sometimes 5 hours) blocks of time in both the Lab and Club dedicated to Open House time. While it's true that while one of them had open house hours, the other was secured, my 3 yr old DD was not interested in the Lab at all and they did NOT bring things over from the Club, as had been suggested in a prior post. I also want to point out that because of KSF, there were an add'l 200 kids on our ship, according to Guest Services. The first time I took my daughter to the Club during secured programming, they had 135 kids checked in - just at the Club. They said that about 50 of them were brought over from the Lab when it was converted to Open House time. We canceled one spa service and one Palo brunch because of Open House times. I also want to point out that during secured programming, my husband I were both allowed access to the Club. We went back there, played, held our daughter and took a picture of our daughter when Ariel made a surprise visit. So, they are not adhering to their own policies. Please feel free to ask any Wonder specific questions about the Lab/Club..... although, I'm sad to say, I don't have the navigators. I thought I packed them, but I can't find them anywhere.

*sigh* This is really disappointing to hear. I am sailing in 3 weeks on a KSF cruise and I am really frustrated that they are STILL blocking out entire afternoons for "open house." My son will only go to the club, so if it is having open house during our Palo reservations, I will have to cancel too. I'm hoping that won't be the case.....but it doesn't sound like they are making any adjustments to the open house schedule on the Wonder. Very disappointing!

 

[travispete]

In reflection, the KSF is a blessing and a curse. While you save a ton of money by not having to pay for kids, you have a situation where people might pull kids out of school for a week to save the money. As a result, you get a much fuller turnout of kids. This meant big lines for the character photos and packed houses for the clubs.

Another thing I was not prepared for -- the Oceaneers Club is extremely dark, and has very low ceilings. There is zero natural light in the Club or in the Lab for that matter. The Lab is more lit, but with a lot of colored light and computer stations.

One other thing to note for the really little ones -- when they enter the club, their hands are squirted with some soap and they are directed to the back of the club to wash their hands. Just note that mom or dad can't go back there with them to help.

On a positive note, the counselors are overall very nice, but it is definitely "herding" the kids.

While we are not anti-Disney, if we cruise in the future, it will be with a cruise line that has more balance in terms of age and the number of kids -- that way, our child will have a kids club experience that is more like a preschool/lower ratio environment.

 

[kimmypie1]

Thanks Travispete! We sail in 4 weeks and this is very upsetting. Did you voice your concerns to anyone on board? It appears that shoreside is not taking any action with our numerous emails/phone calls about this.

Also, when the clubs were packed, did you see any kids being turned away?

thanks again for your account of the situation!

 

[travispete]

No one got turned away, as far as I can tell. We did note things on our comment card, but there is really nothing that they can do about the number of kids or the lack of natural light in the clubs. I think this is more about how well you think your kids will adapt to a busy environment, without a lot of one on one time.

Our DD is 3.5 years old, so if your child is a little older, they may adapt better. Throughout the day, the clubs are not as crazy busy as you may think. Its really just a few times, like the first sea day. In hindsight, we would have worked around those super busy times.

 

[TDC Nala]

There is zero natural light in the Club or in the Lab for that matter.

They're located on the inside of the ship, natural light probably shouldn't be expected.

 

[kimmypie1]

No one got turned away, as far as I can tell. We did note things on our comment card, but there is really nothing that they can do about the number of kids or the lack of natural light in the clubs. I think this is more about how well you think your kids will adapt to a busy environment, without a lot of one on one time.

Our DD is 3.5 years old, so if your child is a little older, they may adapt better. Throughout the day, the clubs are not as crazy busy as you may think. Its really just a few times, like the first sea day. In hindsight, we would have worked around those super busy times.

Good to know they are not as crazy busy as it sounds. I am picturing a mad house! lol. We have one older and one younger than your DD so we will just have to see how it all plays out.

As for the comment cards, I was referring more to the new open houses than the natural light and number of kids. Since this is something brand new that DCL is trying out, they need to know if it caused people to cancel Palo and Spa, like you did because of it.

Again, thanks for reporting back your experience. Hope you had a great cruise.

 

[jetskigrl]

No one got turned away, as far as I can tell. We did note things on our comment card, but there is really nothing that they can do about the number of kids or the lack of natural light in the clubs. I think this is more about how well you think your kids will adapt to a busy environment, without a lot of one on one time.

Our DD is 3.5 years old, so if your child is a little older, they may adapt better. Throughout the day, the clubs are not as crazy busy as you may think. Its really just a few times, like the first sea day. In hindsight, we would have worked around those super busy times.

I think many of us were wondering if any complaints were made regarding the long hours of the Open Houses (resulting in the over crowding of the secure area, having to cancel your plans, etc). Since prior to the change, the kids were distributed between the two areas and both were open all day, DCL does have the ability to reduce the hours of the Open Houses and make the secure times more enjoyable for the kids. So I'm just hoping they get enough feedback in these situations to actually act on it.

It is even more salt on the wound to those of us that are bothered by the long hours for Open Houses to find out that they are still allowing parents in during the Secure Programming

 

[True Romance]

I think many of us were wondering if any complaints were made regarding the long hours of the Open Houses (resulting in the over crowding of the secure area, having to cancel your plans, etc). Since prior to the change, the kids were distributed between the two areas and both were open all day, DCL does have the ability to reduce the hours of the Open Houses and make the secure times more enjoyable for the kids. So I'm just hoping they get enough feedback in these situations to actually act on it.

It is even more salt on the wound to those of us that are bothered by the long hours for Open Houses to find out that they are still allowing parents in during the Secure Programming

I totally agree.

I think everyone that cruises, at least on the Wonder with the long blocks of open houses, needs to complain to YA supervisors on the ship. It seems that each ship sets their own hours. I have exhausted what I can do from my end at home. Now I am going to send an email to my travel agent for her to forward to her DCL rep. Maybe communication coming from the Reps. will have some impact.

I really want to hear from people that have actually confronted the YA Counselors on the ship and hear what they have to say.

 

[kathi]

Is there any possibility they are doing this because they are understaffed?

 

[Jessika]

I have read most of these posts. It only took most of three evenings. I am extremely interested in how this all pans out. I will be taking my kids on our first cruise December 22-29 this year on the Fantasy. My kids are 8 and 9 year old boys, so I know that no matter where I drop them off, they will have fun.

I am concerned though for the little kids and whether they will get fair play time if they are forced into a room crowded with bigger kids. I guess having never sailed with Disney before, I don't have an idea of the staff's abilities to control things, but I really wanted to weigh in here. I know if I was the mother of 4 year old I would not want to drop him off in a room with a bunch of older kids, many up to 10 years old. It just wouldn't feel right.

I plan to make a reservation for myself at Palo and possibly Remy. I don't see anything on here that would cause me not to. If my kids were younger though, this issue might make me change my mind about a cruise, becuase I know that I wouldn't want to leave my little kids in crowded programming with bigger kids who would monopolize the stuff no matter how well intended the staff are.

I'm going to wait to get worked up about it though until closer to time to cruise. I've got nearly a year to wait. I think I'd like to have faith that Disney will iron it all out.

 

[Jessika]

I also wanted to point out that from everything I have read, the Club and the Lab are for KIDS ONLY. My kids may be older, but if I was to show up to pick them up and see from across the room that one of them was talking to an adult that was not a Disney Employee, I would be livid! If parents were allowed to hang with their kids - and thereby my kids in the club/lab previously, then a change needed to happen.

Remember now, that I am not a cruise veteran, my December 2012 Christmas Cruise will be our first. I booked right after Christmas and this information (about the open houses) should have been available then. I don't think it''s necessary for them to give the exact schedule, but the fact that the open houses are on more than just the first day would have been nice.

Forgive me if I misinterpret things here, but for those of you who say you think it's great that they have these open houses so you can spend more time with your kids, why do you need an open house for that? Isn't the ship full of activities for families all day long?

The reason I chose Disney over the other cruise lines was for the programming in the Lab and what it seems to offer. I'm 100% certain my kids will be fine no matter how packed the lab is and they will be fine in the club as well, BUT I would feel terrible if one of my older bigger boys somehow hurt a smaller kid unintentionally just due the the close quarters. I'm constantly having to tell them to slow down and look where they are going.. Now I'm gonna have to tell them to be careful not to mow down the three year olds?