"Gone With the Wind" should go the way of the Confederate Flag

[pat fan]

There is a difference between taking the flag off of state capitol property or changing a state's official flag so as not to include it and the government banning a movie. And one does not lead to the other.

Really? Then why are Amazon, Walmart etc...no longer selling anything with the flag on it? This is free speech people, it's not always comfortable or PC but that's what made America great. Your right to say something, fly something etc...offensive is PROTECTED! When the PC police get all hue and cry they need to be ignored because if they can shut down one voice you can be pretty darn sure they will be coming to shut down YOUR voice at some point. People forget that when they are shutting down something they agree needs to be shut down. Once you start on that path, it leads to a police state. Look at Berkley. The president wants to ban phrases...what's next??

http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/15260/
http://www.goduboisforum.com/index.php?/topic/18280-university-of-californias-speech-police/

 

[pat fan]

A guy shoots a bunch of people and instead of a frank discussion about gun culture we're rushing to ban flags and books/movies.

It's not a gun culture problem, it's mental health and hate that is the problem. Another be-heading in France today. No gun involved, just hate.

 

[eliza61]

Really? Then why are Amazon, Walmart etc...no longer selling anything with the flag on it? This is free speech people, it's not always comfortable or PC but that's what made America great. Your right to say something, fly something etc...offensive is PROTECTED! When the PC police get all hue and cry they need to be ignored because if they can shut down one voice you can be pretty darn sure they will be coming to shut down YOUR voice at some point. People forget that when they are shutting down something they agree needs to be shut down. Once you start on that path, it leads to a police state. Look at Berkley. The president wants to ban phrases...what's next??

http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/15260/
http://www.goduboisforum.com/index.php?/topic/18280-university-of-californias-speech-police/

LOl, Ok let's calm down with the "we're losing our free speech".
Freedom of speech does not include the right:

• To incite actions that would harm others
• To make or distribute obsecene materials

Walmart, amazon, Disney don't give a flying hoot about PC. They are businesses, their job is to make a boat load of cash for their shareholders.
Disney at any time can rerelease SOTS. They chose not to because why tick off people that spent close to 1/2 billion dollars on vacations and travel.
Disney does not deny or acknowledge gay days. Once again why? they are not trying to be PC, they are not going to get a whole bunch of folks who spend a gazillion bucks in their theme park mad at them.

Walmart at any time can sell any legal material it's little heart desires. No one has told them to stop, no one has threatened them with legal action for doing so.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

Really? Then why are Amazon, Walmart etc...no longer selling anything with the flag on it? This is free speech people,

.

Well last I checked, Walmart, Amazon, and the like aren't the government. They are free to sell it or not sell it as they choose. And no, free speech does not apply to force private entities to sell that flag. Nor does free speech apply to private entities at all. You don't even have free speech on this board. Nobody has been banned by the government from selling the flag and nobody has been banned from flying it themselves. So free speech is a ruse. The state no longer flying the flag on capitol grounds is not a free speech issue. And if the company that owns the rights to Gone with the wind decides not to sell it, that isn't a free speech issue either any more than is Disney deciding not to release The Song of the South. It's their movie

 

[slo]

I didn't read this whole thread....

Gone With the Wind is my most favorite movie (and I love the book too).
The thought of it getting banned makes me
I guess I should order a copy of the book and another copy of the movie soon, before it's to late.

 

[ZephyrHawk]

No, no, and no.

No to censorship in all forms.

Taking down the flag is different because it was in front of a government building. As such, it implies government approval for the "speech" inherent to that item. Unless and until the government endorses Gone With the Wind and similar novels, then there is no reason for us to ever be having this discussion.

 

[eliza61]

I didn't read this whole thread....

Gone With the Wind is my most favorite movie (and I love the book too).
The thought of it getting banned makes me
I guess I should order a copy of the book and another copy of the movie soon, before it's to late.

No, you shouldn't panic. it's not going anywhere.
first the article was written as an opinion piece.
second, the newspaper it was in is not what I would call even remotely a good source. It's one step up from National Enquirer land.

 

[pryncess527]

I don't think the government should be screening GWTW
I don't think the government should be flying the flags of the Confederacy

I don't think the government has any business telling private individuals whether or not they can watch GWTW or whether than can own a Confederate flag. (though if private businesses do not want to sell them, that is also their right. you can always sew your own flag if it means that much to you.)
No art should ever be banned.

 

[Luvchefmic]

No, you shouldn't panic. it's not going anywhere.
first the article was written as an opinion piece.
second, the newspaper it was in is not what I would call even remotely a good source. It's one step up from National Enquirer land.

As you like to say " Oy Vey " quit picking on my hometown paper I LOVE the NY Post...now the NY Times that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish discussion for another time but yes it was just some ******* entertainment columnist opinion that started all this about GWTW

 

[mom2rtk]

Hattie McDaniel was the first black actor to win an academy award. Do we want future generations to not experience seeing her performance?

The Wizard of Oz didn't do the best in their handling of little people. Maybe that one should go too.

So happy to have my GWTW DVD (and numerous books acquired through the years on the filming of this masterpiece) safely in hand.

 

[mom2rtk]

I scared my dgd will be born into mamby pamby, everyone is PC and sensitive land.

I'm afraid that ship might have sailed already.

 

[eliza61]

As you like to say " Oy Vey " quit picking on my hometown paper I LOVE the NY Post...now the NY Times that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish discussion for another time but yes it was just some ******* entertainment columnist opinion that started all this about GWTW

LOL, my parents would get both. my dad use to say he got his informatin from the Times and he read the post for fun. Ironically we were never Daily news folks.

I think you last line is what everyone should remember. Add to that, this comes up every so often. someone has a problem with GWTW and wants it relagated to the vaults.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

There are so many amazing films out there. Some are historically accurate, some show the hardships and resiliency, some are spoofs(Blazing Saddles anyone?)... What is okay to portray and what isn't? Who gets to make that choice?

 

[pryncess527]

Really? Then why are Amazon, Walmart etc...no longer selling anything with the flag on it?

Because they are private businesses who make decisions based on what they think is in the best interest of their business. I would not support a law that forbid them to sell the flag, nor would I support a law that requires them to sell it.

Free Speech cuts both ways.

 

[eliza61]

There are so many amazing films out there. Some are historically accurate, some show the hardships and resiliency, some are spoofs(Blazing Saddles anyone?)... What is okay to portray and what isn't? Who gets to make that choice?

The studio with the money. once again let's remember these are "for profit" institutions. they make movies that will make a gazillion dollars the first weekend it's release.

independant filmmakers, writers, actors, producing all complain about how hard it is to get a movie made and distributed.

Anyone remember the first Avengers movie? remember the uproar when Thor said something supposedly demeaning about adopted siblings? It supposedly made 1 Billion dollars in 19 days world wide. guess what, lol we got Avengers two.

 

[pat fan]

Free Speech cuts both ways.

I agree.

I never said the gvt was making them stop selling it. That said, in this PC frenzy world we are living in, to buck the PCness gets you in a lot of hot water. People/businesses should not be so afraid of conducting themselves in a manner they see fit. Why is it ok for them to still sell Nazi stuff? Or Che? I don't give a rats behind if they do, but let's get real. There is real and significant pressure to knuckle under, and if you don't think so, nothing I say on this board will convince you otherwise. Can I go to a bakery and order a cake with a rebel flag on it? I have zero need or desire for one, but just wondering.

 

[eliza61]

I agree.

I never said the gvt was making them stop selling it. That said, in this PC frenzy world we are living in, to buck the PCness gets you in a lot of hot water. People/businesses should not be so afraid of conducting themselves in a manner they see fit. Why is it ok for them to still sell Nazi stuff? Or Che? I don't give a rats behind if they do, but let's get real. There is real and significant pressure to knuckle under, and if you don't think so, nothing I say on this board will convince you otherwise. Can I go to a bakery and order a cake with a rebel flag on it? I have zero need or desire for one, but just wondering.

No they shouldn't be forced to operate in any way other than they see fit, but they also have to man up and take the reprocussions. A few years back a bridal salon refused to sell a dress to a lesbian couple because of her religious beliefs. fine no problem, but then she complained that her business went under. Well why should I spend my money at an establishment that discriminates? So you can't get mad if the unintended consequences bite you (the business person) in the backside. the problem is that folks think that "freedom of whatever" means "I can do what I want without any thing happening as a result". Sorry that's not how life works.

I don't see it as "knuckling" under at all. Now walmart, amazon and disney are a differnt entity. They have shareholders, so their board of directors have a specific responsibility. They are beholded to their shareholders as such they are obligated to do what's best for the business NOT how they feel or think. I am a disney shareholder, I don't give a rat's patooie how Bob Iger feels about ANYTHING outside of how it will directly effect my holdings.
So no he is not free to "conduct" himself as he sees fit. If he wants to voice his opinion, he is free to quit his job and become Joe public.

And yes, you can go to a bakery and order a cake iwth the rebel flag on it.
In fact, like I said previously the three websites I looked up where all sold out of rebel flags. so in this case PC is making them a boat load of money.

 

[pat fan]

No they shouldn't be forced to operate in any way other than they see fit, but they also have to man up and take the reprocussions. A few years back a bridal salon refused to sell a dress to a lesbian couple because of her religious beliefs. fine no problem, but then she complained that her business went under. Well why should I spend my money at an establishment that discriminates? So you can't get mad if the unintended consequences bite you (the business person) in the backside. the problem is that folks think that "freedom of whatever" means "I can do what I want without any thing happening as a result". Sorry that's not how life works.

I agree you take the consequences of your choices. But what about where those cases have gone to court and they have been told they HAVE to provide that service? That is no longer a choice. That's where I have the problem. Like I said, I have no desire to go order that cake, but I would be curious to see what a bakery would say and what would happen if it went to court. It just needs to be a level playing field, not cherry picked.

 

[BrianL]

Yes, for the most part we are not talking about truly "banning" movies and other items, which would be completely wrong and a violation of free speech, though some of the talking heads are using the term. For businesses, it is their right to decide what they will and will not sell. I guarantee you that if they thought they could make more money by selling the items in question than not selling them, they would be singing a different tune.

 

[eliza61]

I agree you take the consequences of your choices. But what about where those cases have gone to court and they have been told they HAVE to provide that service? That is no longer a choice. That's where I have the problem. Like I said, I have no desire to go order that cake, but I would be curious to see what a bakery would say and what would happen if it went to court. It just needs to be a level playing field, not cherry picked.

Totally with you on that Pat fan. I'm not a big fan (excuse the pun) of court order anything mainly because especially with small business, word of mouth and such usually forces change.

But market conditions and public preception have always exerted pressure on businesses. that's why big companies go to great lengths to protect their reputations.
I know a friend of my late husbands, big time southern baptist conservative, lives in philly and has his own business. Sells all kinds of presidental paraphanelia and I know how he feels about this administration. I asked him about it especially since the Democratic convention plus the pope are both coming to Philly.

He told me his job is to sell what the public wants, not what he wants.