Father's rights ( no custody agreement)

[Swan4Me]

They were poor kids -seniors in HS-when she was born
She wants to go-new DH has an apartment in manhattan, has $$ and took them to Aruba for vacation

My

nephew is a hard worker with no money-he owns a lawn care biz-just him. Pays the bills etc

I really feel for him-he has emotional issues and this is sending him "over the edge"

 

[cornflake]

I'm trying to understand why he didn't have a custody agreement in place for the last 14 years (since she is starting HS I assume she about 14? Especially if the ex is re-married.

People do this alllll the time. They're friendly, it's working out and they both don't want to spend the $ on lawyers and a lot of people seem to see the idea of getting court orders as necessarily unfriendly or combative. Like 'we don't need to go to court, we're getting along!'

It protects everyone to do this, especially in this kind of situation. If a marriage breaks up, that's one thing and someone can end up scrambling if it turns acrimonious like this did.

But in a case in which they were never married, establish paternity! Even if it's just for a medical emergency or something, it's just nuts not to.

 

[sparklynails23]

They were poor kids -seniors in HS-when she was born
She wants to go-new DH has an apartment in manhattan, has $$ and took them to Aruba for vacation

My

nephew is a hard worker with no money-he owns a lawn care biz-just him. Pays the bills etc

I really feel for him-he has emotional issues and this is sending him "over the edge"

Does the daughter want to go? Private school in NYC will be expensive.

 

[kathie859]

While I agree that moving the girl away is a big change---I don't get how this makes the mother "evil" It sounds like the mother moved on with her life and so did the father. Her marrying someone with money is certainly not a crime.

It's not too late to establish a formal custody arrangement either. Perhaps the girl prefers to be with her Mother. We don't know. If the father has "emotional issues" (whatever that means) he may not be the best custodial parent for her and, for all we know, this move might be the best thing for her.

There's several sides to this perceived problem.

 

[okeydokey]

It is not too late to get a custody arrangement but he has to be willing to hire a lawyer. My friend who lived in another state, got divorced and then moved with the kids back to her home state. Her ex took her to court and the judge made her move back to the ex husbands state. She did not have the right to move his kids away from him.

 

[Swan4Me]

While I agree that moving the girl away is a big change---I don't get how this makes the mother "evil" It sounds like the mother moved on with her life and so did the father. Her marrying someone with money is certainly not a crime.

It's not too late to establish a formal custody arrangement either. Perhaps the girl prefers to be with her Mother. We don't know. If the father has "emotional issues" (whatever that means) he may not be the best custodial parent for her and, for all we know, this move might be the best thing for her.

There's several sides to this perceived problem.

He is Bi-polar and hyper (ADD) if he doesnt take his meds.
The DD is loving the move.
I think it was very wrong not to tell him until the last minute
it was all
"hashed out" on Facebook last nite=not pretty.

 

[DebbieB]

He is Bi-polar and hyper (ADD) if he doesnt take his meds.
The DD is loving the move.
I think it was very wrong not to tell him until the last minute
it was all
"hashed out" on Facebook last nite=not pretty.

That is going to be a hard case to win. The daughter wants to go, dad has emotional issues. Maybe the mom was afraid to tell him, that he would "freak out".

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

If she's in high school and wants to go, he's really only going to waste his money at this point. He should get info from the mom regarding visitations and such. They've worked it out this long, they should be able to finish up the last four years.

People have to take the jobs where they get them, it's better for him and his daughter that this guy has a job. Also, you don't know every detail...maybe his emotional problems are a reason for them moving further away? Maybe not.

I'm just saying, dropping a ton of money to make a teenager visit you a couple times a year?Not worth it. A judge won't make someone give up their job for this. Just sounds like a waste of time.

 

[cornflake]

If she's in high school and wants to go, he's really only going to waste his money at this point. He should get info from the mom regarding visitations and such. They've worked it out this long, they should be able to finish up the last four years.

People have to take the jobs where they get them, it's better for him and his daughter that this guy has a job. Also, you don't know every detail...maybe his emotional problems are a reason for them moving further away? Maybe not.

I'm just saying, dropping a ton of money to make a teenager visit you a couple times a year?Not worth it. A judge won't make someone give up their job for this. Just sounds like a waste of time.

Judges do indeed. Well, they don't but they will say the child can't be moved. The subterfuge here will not sit well with the court.

Even if a judge would allow this, the OP's relative could likely easily get an order for them to pay for all transit for her back and forth and for him to get all school vacations and whatnot. He needs to go to court; he has rights, he just has to have them codified.

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Judges do indeed. Well, they don't but they will say the child can't be moved. The subterfuge here will not sit well with the court.

Even if a judge would allow this, the OP's relative could likely easily get an order for them to pay for all transit for her back and forth and for him to get all school vacations and whatnot. He needs to go to court; he has rights, he just has to have them codified.

IF he had a custody agreement, he does not. By the time he gets anything together for that, they could well be gone. The judge probably won't make them move back.

Be pissed about it all you want, is it better to have a husband to the mother that has a job, and can pay bills as well as part of schooling, or better for him to have to shoulder a bigger burden if the husband can't get his old job back? The kid isn't 5, she's in high school. That's going to be a LOT of time, effort and money to spend on a kid that WANTS to go. At her age, the judge will take into consideration what she wants to do. I watched it happen to my bil, the daughter decided she wanted to stay and the judge couldn't force her to go with her mother. Visa Versa in this case.

Swan, I'm just saying he will be out of a lot of money and time if he wants to pursue it in the courts now. Especially since the child wants to go.

 

[izzy]

He is Bi-polar and hyper (ADD) if he doesnt take his meds.The DD is loving the move.
I think it was very wrong not to tell him until the last minute
it was all
"hashed out" on Facebook last nite=not pretty.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but maybe they purposely waited until the last minute to tell him because of what I bolded. I definitely agree with you that hashing this out on Facebook was not the way for this to be handled!

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Bi-Polar and ADD...hell I'd have been planning a move for ages.

Who needs to have to deal with that crap? It's one thing if you take your meds, another if you blow them off. It's exhausting dealing with that type of yoyo effect.

 

[chloelovesdisney]

This happened to my friend in NYC. She was never married to her son's father, he was not very involved and did not pay child support. She got married and new dh wanted to move out of state for a job. Bio dad filed in NYC family court and my friend was not permitted to move her son for over two years while they got the issue worked out.

 

[sparklynails23]

Teenagers don't want to be around their parents much anyway. He needs to suck it up and be supportive of his daughter. Keep the lines of communication open. She probably saw the Facebook fight, so he needs to apologize for that. The daughter will probably be sad after the move, when she is stressed about meeting new people and fitting in. Dad needs to be available for support.

I don't know what good a visitation schedule will be without knowing the daughter's calendar for the year. She will not want to miss important high school activities. He should probably plan a visit in a couple of months. Mom doesn't seem to have the best track record with men, so the mom and kids could move back in no time.

Nephew is going to be upset. This isn't what he expected for the high school years, but he needs to find others to be close to besides the daughter. She'll be an adult soon.

 

[cornflake]

IF he had a custody agreement, he does not. By the time he gets anything together for that, they could well be gone. The judge probably won't make them move back.

Be pissed about it all you want, is it better to have a husband to the mother that has a job, and can pay bills as well as part of schooling, or better for him to have to shoulder a bigger burden if the husband can't get his old job back? The kid isn't 5, she's in high school. That's going to be a LOT of time, effort and money to spend on a kid that WANTS to go. At her age, the judge will take into consideration what she wants to do. I watched it happen to my bil, the daughter decided she wanted to stay and the judge couldn't force her to go with her mother. Visa Versa in this case.

Swan, I'm just saying he will be out of a lot of money and time if he wants to pursue it in the courts now. Especially since the child wants to go.

Hence I - and many others - suggested he get a lawyer to file an injunction to prevent them from moving her in the short term, which can happen very quickly, so that he can get a custody order in place.

Given the sneaking out of town, yeah, a judge certainly could order them back. Courts don't appreciate that kind of crap.

And yeah, a judge could allow the move - but if he gets the injunction to get it hashed out now, much easier than when they're in another place and he can get orders for them to pay for all travel for both parties, for his legal fees, etc., based on the shady move.

 

[tinkerbellandeeyor]

I know there is a arrangement were the court can prevent the mom from leaving the county. or at least there was 24 yrs ago.

 

[Swan4Me]

Teenagers don't want to be around their parents much anyway.

She'll be an adult soon.

:confused - your comments seem dsmissive

she is 14 and starting high school

He was her softball assistant coach for the last few years and spent a lot of time with her- she is his world.

When he takes his meds - all is well

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Hence I - and many others - suggested he get a lawyer to file an injunction to prevent them from moving her in the short term, which can happen very quickly, so that he can get a custody order in place.

Given the sneaking out of town, yeah, a judge certainly could order them back. Courts don't appreciate that kind of crap.

And yeah, a judge could allow the move - but if he gets the injunction to get it hashed out now, much easier than when they're in another place and he can get orders for them to pay for all travel for both parties, for his legal fees, etc., based on the shady move.

It's not sneaking out of town if he knows about it, and he doesn't have any custody agreement, so she's not breaking any orders.

I'll say it again, he's gonna have to think long and hard if he wants to spend a lot of money on it, they will still move away and the daughter will still go with them if that's what she wants. Once they are older, the judge will take her wishes into consideration. If he's on mediciation and has a history of not taking it, that only will work against him.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not saying it isn't going to break his heart, I'm saying that his being broke from throwing his money away uselessly isn't going to help him.

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

The statement "when he takes his meds all is well" is concerning. If he can't be trusted to take his meds, he can't be trusted to take the daughter full time, even if she wanted to stay.

 

[cornflake]

It's not sneaking out of town if he knows about it, and he doesn't have any custody agreement, so she's not breaking any orders.

I'll say it again, he's gonna have to think long and hard if he wants to spend a lot of money on it, they will still move away and the daughter will still go with them if that's what she wants. Once they are older, the judge will take her wishes into consideration. If he's on mediciation and has a history of not taking it, that only will work against him.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not saying it isn't going to break his heart, I'm saying that his being broke from throwing his money away uselessly isn't going to help him.

Telling him just before it happens, when he's paid school fees for a school she won't be attending certainly seems sneaking out to me. If they just found out and told him right away that'd be one thing but doesn't sound like it.

I'm saying he won't be blowing his money because it sounds from the circumstance like he can at least stop them in the short term and he can certainly then get orders in place to solidify his rights.

If they are doing this in a shady way, there's a good chance he won't end up paying anything - and regardless, if they're the ones want to move and are granted permission, it's very common that an order will be placed forcing them to pay for all transport costs for her and possibly him for visitation. I think that's a lot of help, personally.