DISNEY if you don't want the average Joe to stay at the parks just say so...

[parkluvr]

Yes, but you're assuming everyone is dissatisfied as you. There's a ton of folks on these boards that don't even weigh in on these threads because they are satisfied and don't want to get dragged into the mire of discussing everything people dislike about Disney. Calling people minions just because they don't feel the same way you do is childish.

Every year there's another crisis whether it's ride closures, construction, monorail cutbacks, FP+, dining degradation, price increases, napkins, etc. Yet, not one of those things have yet to affect me in a bad way once I get there again. Comparing Disney today to 1970's Disney is not even realistic. I have no idea if cheeseburgers were better when I was there 40, 30, or even 20 years ago. It's a cheeseburger for crying out loud, at 8 years old I didn't take any mental notes . I just ate it and went on my way. The parks probably were cleaner in the 1970's, but it's not exactly like the place is a "dump" nowadays. It's still a pretty awesome place to hang out .

I just look at it from the perspective of am I still getting enough value for my money compared to other vacation choices and the answer is a resounding yes. Every year we stay in a awesome villa at a beautiful resort, we eat great TS meals and decent CS meals, and we are entertained from early morning until late, late night. And that's all for about $85 a day per person. I'm just not anywhere close to the same point as some of you who think the Disney experience is not worth the money anymore . And for what it's worth, as a shareholder I'm expect Disney executives to look at their bottom line every day .

My minion reference was not meant to be a generalization of everybody that goes to WDW. If you are satisfied with Disney and are happy with what they are giving you for your money, you are making your own choice to continue visiting the WDW complex and therefore by definition you are not a minion. I believe that if you look at my previous posts in this thread you will see that what I am referring to is the people who aren't satisfied with the direction that Disney is taking it's WDW complex. People indicate that they aren't happy with various things but many feel that their feelings don't matter and continue to book trips. If you do this, you are essentially bowing to Disney's whims and giving them affirmation that your willing to accept a lower product for the same or more money. As a shareholder you should worry that the parks aren't as clean and the food isn't quite as good. When Walt Disney conceived Disneyland he was fed up with the other amusement parks and carnivals because they were essentially dirty rip offs. What has always differentiated Disney from Six Flags and Universal and other entities is the attention to detail, the cleanliness of the parks, the courteousness of the staff. If these things are continued to be lost in the effort to make more money, then the Disney magic disappears and Disney becomes just another company. In the short term staffing cuts and short changing guests may be good for the stockholders but everybody has their limit and I believe it will hurt profits in the long term.

 

[GAN]

And lets look at it another way. Lets take the $53,000,000 in cuts to executive compensation and divide it by the total number of guest who visited Disney Parks Worldwide 2015, lets say 104,000,000 in 2014. Disney could give each guest a discount of 51 cents per park visit. 2015 attendance was higher so the discount would be lower.

Criticizing Executive compensation shouldn't be a factor of revenues(guests) ...it doesn't matter. Their compensation is partially related to revenues earned because of products, services, properties that people(guests) felt they were worthy of handing their hard-earned money over to them for. The Company earned it for whatever reason. The only time it's fair to argue Executive compensation is when it goes up while employee benefits/compensation goes down at the same time(including layoffs). So it should be a factor of employee benefits. There could be a legitimate case made against Disney on this regard. Of course, that's my opinion ...and what do I know.

 

[Ametista]

Orlando vacations are not expensive if you rent a house offsite (with private pool even). Often these are only $120/night. Then we usually buy 14-day Seaworld/Aquatica/Busch Gardens passes (currently $139). Sometimes we will get a 2 or 3 day pass to the Universal parks (right now it's $180/3 days, which is more than we need), and then do maybe one day at MK on a MNSSHP or MVMCP night. We always have a Disney water park annual pass (like $110/year, but we visit Orlando 3x a year. We end up paying maybe 15 bucks a visit because we go a lot). We always spend at least one day at the beach (free except for gas). We have only done 5-day Disney tickets one time and it was so expensive it was ridiculous. I don't want to be stuck at just Disney parks, but the cost was so high that it was all we did that trip.

 

[MolonLabe]

The people who are complaining that they will have to take less trips each year don't get much sympathy from me because I don't have the money to go every few years, let alone multiple times a year.

You do see the irony in listing 7 stays at Contemporary and Poly in your signature... right?

The problem I see (in general, not particularly with the post I just quoted) is that many, many people like to look above them with envy... at the same time they never realize someone below them is up to them.

For example the "1%"... guess what, everyone making $36,000 is the top 1% income earners in the world... crazy huh? Perspective.

Speaking of perspective, it's all those "multi trip per year" families that keep spending the extra money to keep the rates lower than where they would be without them subsiding the trips of others.

So as to not having any sympathy are you starting to see even more irony now?

 

[xthebowdenx]

In general, people now want more for less. I understand that some people have more money than others. I understand that Disney World may be a one time thing for some people. But as with all things in this world, if you want it bad enough, work for it. I'm tired of hearing people complain about what they think should be cheaper or free. I am by no means wealthy. But my boyfriend and I work our butts off to have and do what we want in life. Do I want to pay $15 for premier parking? No, so I'll walk a little more. Do I book free Dining and then complain about restrictions? No, it's FREE. Vacations at Disney World are not a right. Disney is a corporation who cannot function without profits. And before anyone asks, no I'm not a Trump supporter or on the payroll of any Republican run company.

 

[AnAmericanInDisney]

Or maybe they had all just had a good meal and were full???? I know as many times as I say I'm going to have a Mickey bar I maybe end up hungry enough for one a trip.

If it were just after meal time that I noticed the trend, I might agree, but there were plenty of skinny people who could have used some extra calories with no snacks, too. I even heard a mom yell at her kids one morning by the entrance that they weren't buying any snacks that day. They looked sad and hungry- and skinny, the dad included. $6 for a soft pretzel with some "cheese" dip is a little hard to justify, don't you think?

 

[cjparker0110]

You do see the irony in listing 7 stays at Contemporary and Poly in your signature... right?

Oh yes...lots of irony. I was born in 76 so those every 2-3 year trips we had (notice...not every year or multiple times a year) were paid for by my parents. They also came at a time when WDW was much smaller and less expensive...the first several of which there were not even the options of moderate or budget hotels. They only had a few. Notice the LARGE gap since my last trip? It's called adulthood and responsibility. In fact, if it weren't for my aunt working there for a few years in the 2000s, I wouldn't have even been since 1998 or so. I only went a few times then because of her. Only one of those was a legit stay on property thanks to her discount. The others I stayed with her and got in for free by her. So the irony does not exist.

Speaking of perspective, it's all those "multi trip per year" families that keep spending the extra money to keep the rates lower than where they would be without them subsiding the trips of others.

Subsidizing the trips? What in the world are you talking about? Nobody is subsidizing anyone's trips. If multi trip per year families didn't go like that, then the prices would probably drop. Basic economic principles state that when the demand is higher, the price goes up. When the demand is lower, the price falls. If WDW wasn't so stinking busy all the time they would have lower pricing. Thus, when it is a slower time of year they start trying to fill up their hotels by posting major savings and offering great package prices that aren't available if you just plan a trip for any old time. If they were subsidizing the costs, WDW would not be planning surge pricing.

For example the "1%"... guess what, everyone making $36,000 is the top 1% income earners in the world... crazy huh? Perspective.

Glad I make less than that so I can still complain that I am not part of the 1%. Of course, I'm also glad I live in a very small town where everything is affordable. As an example, my house was less than a typical new car...and is bigger and it better shape than my parents $200,000+ house. Perspective.

No...I don't feel any sense of irony based on my past being raised by parents who had tons of disposable income and went to WDW when it was smaller, cheaper, and easier to do.

 

[hookedonears]

Criticizing Executive compensation shouldn't be a factor of revenues(guests) ...it doesn't matter. Their compensation is partially related to revenues earned because of products, services, properties that people(guests) felt they were worthy of handing their hard-earned money over to them for. The Company earned it for whatever reason. The only time it's fair to argue Executive compensation is when it goes up while employee benefits/compensation goes down at the same time(including layoffs). So it should be a factor of employee benefits. There could be a legitimate case made against Disney on this regard. Of course, that's my opinion ...and what do I know.

You missed the context of the entire conversation. I was just pointing out how insignificant executive compensation is to the cost of going to WDW, or any other Disney park. Too many people don't quite understand that.

 

[pumpkinhead10a]

Walt Disney World will be testing premium parking spots at the Magic Kingdom and Epcot from March 15-17. The cost will be $15, on top of the $20 it already costs to park in the theme park lots. Annual passholders and resort guests would pay just $15, as they already get free parking. These premium spots would put guests within a few minutes walking distance of the main gates, or in the case of the Magic Kingdom, within walking distance of the Transportation and Ticket Center.

At the Magic Kingdom, the premium lot will be the Aladdin lot. Every day, a different colored tag will be used to indicate that the car has paid for the premium parking. These tags will be placed under the car’s windshield wipers.

Parking in these spots would eliminate the need to ride the parking lot trams or to walk up to 15 minutes to get to the front of the lot.



HAHAHA...Dam they getting worst... next you will be paying for PREMIUM AIR ....Premium walkways... Premium rides and anything else they can attach the word premium too, what more are they going to do???? Pretty soon they will only have premium spots left to park....you can bet you bottom dollar that they are looking to charge more for FP+ and MDE...NO WAIT THEY ALREADY GOT YUOR BOTTOM DOLLAR..TOO LATE...LOL

 

[GAN]

You missed the context of the entire conversation. I was just pointing out how insignificant executive compensation is to the cost of going to WDW, or any other Disney park. Too many people don't quite understand that.

No I didn't miss the context -I agree with you. My point is it's insignificant not only to the cost of going to WDW, but in any comparison of that as well. They already have our money -we shouldn't care how it's distributed after that ....unless Iger gets a 10M bonus while cutting employee benefits. That is bad business practice in my opinion.

My original post might have been a little confusing -sorry.

 

[Don Disney]

I have to say that I have enjoyed reading this thread. The one thing that I wanted to point out is the opinion that has been raised that those of us that are invested in Disney social media (Dis boards, other forums, twitter, Face book etc) are in the minority as park guests and thus are not really influential to a large enough degree with Disney management.

Because I have gone to WDW frequently in the past, many of my friends and family who don't go or who don't care to be plugged in to the happenings and trip planning knowledge depend on me for advice about how to go about planning a trip. They know that I go and that I know what I am doing when it comes to a Disney vacation.

When I run the number$ with them and explain that they will have to plan their trips with a military like precision, that they will be in the Florida heat in long lines, eating low quality food and they will be paying premium prices, that they will be staying at very expensive hotels that no where near reflect the price paid per night except for the benefit of "Location" and they will be on the receiving end of disappearing customer service and Disney "Magic", they look at me like I am crazy. They can't believe that this is the Disney vacation that they are going to experience.

If they can get past the high price of food, tickets and lodging many of them are completely turned off by the fact that they will have to pick table service restaurants 180 days out. "But I went last week and I could get Be Our Guest at 7:30 at night!" some of you say. Well.... eating that late doesn't always translate so well for this reason or that. The bottom line for the dining equation is that if you are going to WDW and you don't know the ropes AND you have your heart set on eating at a particular place during reasonable hours for your family you'd better be safe and book 180 days out, assuming that there is even availability with all the crowds flocking to Disney and being herded the same way.

Then I explain the concept of FP+ and the herding that occurs with that. I tell them that FP+ insures that they will get on 3 rides relatively quickly and then wait in longer lines (because of FP+) everywhere else. No more happy wandering in the theme park for them. The concept that the standby line can be really short but that it will advance so slowly because every person with a FP, even those who aren't even in line yet, will have priority over them is met with incredulous stares. I explain that Disney spins the positive impact that herding people can have on their trips while conveniently leaving out all the negatives. Those negatives are there for them to experience after they have plunked down thousands of dollars and it's too late.

Then I talk about all the staff and entertainment cuts paired with multiple price increases across the board. I explain that during the recession, when Disney should have been AHEAD of the curve and expanded it's domestic parks in anticipation of the inevitable economic upswing, they spent the money on outdated rubber bracelets that have been made obsolete by smart phones. Then there is all the money that was spent designing and building Shanghai Disney, propping up under performing foreign theme parks and the construction delays at Pandora. Let us not forget the anemic Fantasyland expansion at MK in WDW.

Then I get to the part where despite record profits WDW guests are being continuously price gouged to pay for these blunders because, well, Disney just can command that kind of money.

Then I ask them if THIS is the type of money they want to spend for this kind of a vacation experience? I explain to them that Disney is depending upon them being trapped in the bubble and that the whole Disney experience is being engineered these days to provide the least to the guest for the most amount of money. I call this the new Disney "Magic". Then I explain that they are much better off NOT staying on Disney property since virtually every other external accommodation is less expensive and frequently offers a better value for the money spent. I recommend that they rent a car, spend the least number of days at WDW and explore all the other wonderful things that Orlando has to offer for a family vacation. I explain that the competition has been catching up and in some cases beating Disney at it's own game.

There is a tipping point that each of us has as to whether Disney is still "worth it". The only thing that separates those of us who are Disney savvy thanks to social media, and the majority of people who aren't, is experience. Once those who aren't experienced go on a trip to WDW and see for themselves I doubt they will be back. After all, when you have more and more hardcore Disney vacation fans realizing that the parks are in a death spiral due to all of these unfortunate decisions, how long will it take for the rest of the vacationing demographic to catch on.

~NM

 

[hookedonears]

No I didn't miss the context -I agree with you. My point is it's insignificant not only to the cost of going to WDW, but in any comparison of that as well. They already have our money -we shouldn't care how it's distributed after that ....unless Iger gets a 10M bonus while cutting employee benefits. That is bad business practice in my opinion.

My original post might have been a little confusing -sorry.

As most of us know, Iger's number one job is to keeping those investment dollars rolling in, thus growing the company and provided a competitive return on their investor's investment. (The company dies if the investment dollars stop coming in. Too many people just don't understand that.) His and other executives compensation are tied to it. If cuts are required to accomplish their goals, so be it. It's business.

 

[Don Disney]

What a great point of view....I WISH i could have said it like that!!! That's about as true a statement about this subject I have seen!!Ninja Mom!!!

 

[Don Disney]

When I read statistics like these I'm reminded if the old saying: 80% of stats you see online are made up

-the joke being that the 80% number is also completely made up.


As for the content I'll say this: if you broaden your scope to all 7 billion people on earth then the people who live in the slums of Detroit ARE the 1%ers.

Look up what the average standard of living is like in Mumbai, Rio, or most of Africa. It'll make you realize that YOU are the 1%.

Not talking about the rest of the world...just the USA......

 

[Jcon]

As most of us know, Iger's number one job is to keeping those investment dollars rolling in, thus growing the company and provided a competitive return on their investor's investment. (The company dies if the investment dollars stop coming in. Too many people just don't understand that.) His and other executives compensation are tied to it. If cuts are required to accomplish their goals, so be it. It's business.

What investment dollars? Has Disney released bonds?

 

[hookedonears]

What investment dollars? Has Disney released bonds?

No, a poor choice of words on my part. The number one job of Iger to grow the company, thus providing a competitive return on their investor's investment.

 

[TedH]

The truth is, more people attend Disney and the Parks are full because "More People Can Afford Disney". when I was a kid, a Disney Vacation was a once in a lifetime dream for a family. I didn't know anybody who could afford to go every year. A DW vacation was not an Average Joe activity 30 years ago. It was a once in a life time dream. If anything I see far more average and under average Joes (income wise) at DW now than I ever have.
That Aside..the resort fee really angers me. Because as was said they are already expensive.

 

[Jcon]

No, a poor choice of words on my part. The number one job of Iger to grow the company, thus providing a competitive return on their investor's investment.

All good. ROI is king.

 

[MolonLabe]

Oh yes...lots of irony. I was born in 76 so those every 2-3 year trips we had (notice...not every year or multiple times a year) were paid for by my parents. They also came at a time when WDW was much smaller and less expensive...the first several of which there were not even the options of moderate or budget hotels. They only had a few. Notice the LARGE gap since my last trip? It's called adulthood and responsibility. In fact, if it weren't for my aunt working there for a few years in the 2000s, I wouldn't have even been since 1998 or so. I only went a few times then because of her. Only one of those was a legit stay on property thanks to her discount. The others I stayed with her and got in for free by her. So the irony does not exist.

Weird, I'm a year younger than you with three daughters. Crazy how some people handle adulthood and responsibility differently. Huh....

Subsidizing the trips? What in the world are you talking about? Nobody is subsidizing anyone's trips. If multi trip per year families didn't go like that, then the prices would probably drop. Basic economic principles state that when the demand is higher, the price goes up. When the demand is lower, the price falls. If WDW wasn't so stinking busy all the time they would have lower pricing. Thus, when it is a slower time of year they start trying to fill up their hotels by posting major savings and offering great package prices that aren't available if you just plan a trip for any old time. If they were subsidizing the costs, WDW would not be planning surge pricing.

There are these things called "overhead". They exist whether there are 10,000 people in the park on a given day or 40,000 people. I can only imagine what the electricity costs are for a place like WDW, yes they have their own plant but they still have to purchase the fuel for it. Likewise treating all that water every day comes at a cost as well. Employees, have you ever noticed how many employees Disney has at any given time. Sure many are students getting a lower wage but it still adds up when you considered the tens of thousands on the WDW payroll.

Its simple economics, there is a "bottom" price WDW can charge to stay in the black. The sword cuts both ways, the more people that come can justify price increases but if enough people don't come, they have to raise prices as well to keep the lights on.

Glad I make less than that so I can still complain that I am not part of the 1%. Of course, I'm also glad I live in a very small town where everything is affordable. As an example, my house was less than a typical new car...and is bigger and it better shape than my parents $200,000+ house. Perspective.

No...I don't feel any sense of irony based on my past being raised by parents who had tons of disposable income and went to WDW when it was smaller, cheaper, and easier to do.

Your "Glad I can still complain"... I have no idea where to go with that. Why wouldn't you want to better yourself? It sounds like it's more about Mommy Daddy issues than anything else.

 

[cabanafrau]

You just don't like statistics that go against your core belief and understanding. My statistics may not be exactly right, but they're in the ballpark. Look them up.

People who know how statistics are derived know well which statistics they want to pull to demonstrate exactly the point they're trying to drive home. Not particularly impressive for those who know how to review statistics themselves.