Disney hasn't given me my guaranteed week, isn't budging- help!

[crisi]

Oh - and stop posting about this here if that's what you intend to do. Part of your problem is that if Disney looks like they caved, and gave you a Poly bungalow, the internet will decide they too get a Poly bungalow for their disappointment. Disney doesn't want an internet precedent (not a legal precedent) that sets expectations.

 

[Sandisw]

If the clause was there to get me this years points, it would state 2020 as the first year, as they provided points for 2020 as well, (which I immidiatly banked into 2021(June Use Year)) so this would not make sense.

The contract states that the fixed week MAY not be available the first year, but then in the next sentence says that it will be notated which year I will receive my first guaranteed week. That notation clearly states 2021- in both the Deed and the purchase agreement.

I will keep you updated as to what comes out of this, though it may be a while. I suspect they will have to figure out how to handle this when I contact them next. I will have to carefully word my email so that everything is in writing, not just phone conversations. I will likely send to my guide and to the DVC satisfaction team to try and create movement on this issue.

Just want to say that with a June UY, your first set of points had to be 2020 since you bought in January 2021, which is in the June 2020 UY. Those were your current UY points, which is why you got them. You were entitled to them.

However, the first FW you were entitled to would be FW 2021 even though you bought in the 2020 UY for June. You were not entitled to a FW for your 2020 UY because November 2020 was already over.

So, technically, that is why the first actual FW you were entitled to was 2021...and probably why the contract says that, but because you were already past the 11 month window, the clause from the Product Understanding Checklist applies.

Good luck, but the more I put these two pieces together, I do think both the contract was correct with saying your first FW would be 2021, but the limitation for the first FW applies since you bought after the 11 month window.

 

[Leight19]

In January, we purchased a guaranteed week direct from Disney. We got a Copper Creek 2 bedroom for week 47(thanksgiving week). Our guide told us that guaranteed weeks aren't always available the first year, but that my purchase agreement and deed would state the first year that the guaranteed week would be available.

No problem.

However,

Our deed AND purchase agreement both state that "Beginning January 1st, 2021(the "First Fixed Use Date")..." and goes on in legal jargon to say that I will be allotted a 2 bedroom for my week beginning in 2021.

Disney did not reserve me the room, and when I pointed this out to member services, they said no rooms were available and they could not book it for me. When I brought this to the attention of our guide, he had to pass it along to his supervisor.

Since then, I have received a phone call from our guide every week for the first 3 weeks, then every other week for about 6 weeks, and now it's been almost 3 weeks since I've heard from him. In every phone call, he states that "We're still working on getting you that room." But I have my doubts about the success with it- as I suspect almost nobody is going to be cancelling.

Since purchasing this, we found out my wife is pregnant, so we would be unlikely to utilize this week ourselves, but I have a large family and would love to gift this week to one of them to enjoy with their kids.

How long do I give them to fulfill my week? Do I need to take legal action? Would it be worth it? Should I demand they cover this years dues to compensate me? What recourse do I have?

I suspect my situation is unique, but I'm hoping that this wonderful community of Disney nerds will have some advice for me.

My instinct if I was in your situation would be to think what would be fair/possible for both parties and not get too caught up in what you thought you were entitled to. It sounds like there is at least some ambiguity for them to argue if you challenged and I imagine legally if you are right most likely remedy would be to void the contract. If you want out of contract then maybe you can use this issue to get out but it sounds like you want to keep and mainly want the room which is currently not possible without them canceling another persons trip.

From your post it looks like you were looking for 2br week of thanksgiving. Since you also said you likely will not travel this year, is there really reason to fight the issue? It may make sense to consider if person you gift room to would be willing to take a studio or 1br and stay longer or save points for later. I just did a quick search of cash dvc rooms and looks like the week has 1br at bwv and cc available cash; maybe Disney would give you the welcome home treatment and pull their cash inventory for one of these?
You could also look to explore other weeks if you want to keep to the 2br at cc but are willing to book a different week.

 

[anomamatt]

If the clause was there to get me this years points, it would state 2020 as the first year, as they provided points for 2020 as well, (which I immidiatly banked into 2021(June Use Year)) so this would not make sense.

Yes, then your situation is different from mine. Because you have, essentially, two UYs worth of points that are not following the guaranteed week model (mine was just the first UY of points because Riviera wasn't open). In that case, the contact indeed might be worded incorrect (but that is outside my expertise). Although "first year" versus "first use year" might impact things, too. Regardless, good luck -- and be sure to let us know how it turns out!

 

[CraigInPA]

I don't understand the controversy here? You have one spot in your purchase contract that says you get the guaranteed week, and another spot that says if you buy in under 11 months from that guaranteed week that it isn't guaranteed. You're under 11 months, and stated that you don't want to go. So, why wouldn't you just take the points and bank them for next year, or rent/transfer them out to a third party? DVC isn't going to pay you cash for your unused points, especially when the contract has a stipulation that you can receive the points and use them elsewhere. There's no "DVC is breaking the contract" at all here.

 

[EM Lawrence]

I don’t understand the controversy here either, but for different reasons. He has it in writing in a sales contract signed by both parties that he gets the guaranteed week this year. There are conflicting clauses in the contract, but it is not clear cut that he has zero right to a fixed week this year. At best, it is ambiguous. Disney wrote the contract, controlled what was in it, and agreed to it, so they messed up, and they should make this right. Offering him a similar accommodation at another resort is not at all unreasonable, and frankly, I’m surprised that they did not do this immediately. I really think some of the people on this board would smile and say thank you if Disney mailed them a dirty diaper.

 

[Sandisw]

I don’t understand the controversy here either, but for different reasons. He has it in writing in a sales contract signed by both parties that he gets the guaranteed week this year. There are conflicting clauses in the contract, but it is not clear cut that he has zero right to a fixed week this year. At best, it is ambiguous. Disney wrote the contract, controlled what was in it, and agreed to it, so they messed up, and they should make this right. Offering him a similar accommodation at another resort is not at all unreasonable, and frankly, I’m surprised that they did not do this immediately. I really think some of the people on this board would smile and say thank you if Disney mailed them a dirty diaper.

Actually, after posting that he bought a June UY, it don’t think it’s vague now and that the clause he is referring to is accurate,

It simply stated his first FW would be for 2021 because he bought in his 2020 UY after the date had passed for the FW for 2020.

I already detailed it above, but I’m pretty sure that is why it said what is said and why the clause regarding a first year FW not guaranteed applies in this case.

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

Man, this is a lot of drama from my perspective. Take your points and bank them. Big deal. The entitlement here is over the top.

 

[poofyo101]

Man, this is a lot of drama from my perspective. Take your points and bank them. Big deal. The entitlement here is over the top.

agreed

 

[jbreen2010]

Just ask for a cabin as remuneration for them missing your going that week. I'm sure Disney can throw in their extra pool of points to compensate for their miss.

 

[Bing Showei]

Offering him a similar accommodation at another resort is not at all unreasonable, and frankly, I’m surprised that they did not do this immediately.

If OP had stopped there, few would probably take issue with this. Instead, he goes on to propose this...

or asking them for some sort of financial compensation. Hoping for this years dues, since they were unable to fulfill this years room which they were contractually obligated to provide.

I’ve never been accused of being a Disney apologist, but this part of it didn’t sit well with me.

There was no genuine misunderstanding, misrepresentation, or failure to communicate with the OP that he would not receive this year’s GW. Not only did the guide clearly communicate this, OP clearly understood the circumstances under which he was buying in, and only after seeing what he construed to be a clerical error, decided to suddenly take issue with the agreement and squeeze something out of it.

As @KAT4DISNEY identified the clause that addresses this exact situation, which again, reflects the understanding of both parties entering this contract, it may not be a clerical error at all.

If OP was willing to surrender this year’s points for this year’s dues because he can’t use the points at all, or just seek help securing equivalent accommodations elsewhere, most could get behind that. But instead he’s now looking to be paid to keep the points.

It’s not accepting a dirty diaper, what you’re catching wind of is people calling out the bull ****.

 

[crisi]

Add in that a "reasonable" solution is a Poly bungalow, worth over three times the amount of points as his CCV 2 bedroom. I am not a Disney apologist, but I am a Disney pragmatist. Disney as a brand is a soft feel good company. Disney as a corporation plays serious hardball. If you don't want to have your expectations smashed as a DVC owner, its good to understand the difference.

 

[EM Lawrence]

So why do you suppose that his sales guide has been stringing him along for weeks with the message that he/they are trying to get him that room? If the contract is as straightforward as people seem to think it is, why not just explain to him the terms of the contract? A well trained sales guide should have been able to easily clear up any confusion on the buyer’s part.

I copied this clause from an earlier post, I added the bold font to the text at the end.

2. Depending upon the week you want to be your Week and the type of Vacation Home you want to be your Vacation Home Type, your Guaranteed Reservation may not be available to you immediately based on the resort opening date and the Use Year of your Ownership Interest. It may only be available to you beginning in a future year. Your purchase agreement and deed will identify the calendar year in which you will first have a Guaranteed Reservation.

OP says that his purchase agreement and deed both specify 2021 as the calendar year in which he will first have his GW. It sounds like it should have listed 2022 as the calendar year that his GW would first become available to him, since he purchased after the booking window, but instead his contract specifically says 2021.

What is wrong with asking Disney to explain what appears to be either confusing, contradictory, a clerical error, a mistake by the Guide, or a poorly worded contract? And, if they have made a mistake, asking them to make the buyer whole in some way? He just spent a major chunk of change on a DVC contract. I’d be angry if I were in his shoes and felt like I was getting the runaround from Disney.

By the way, @Bing Showei, you have such a way with words. I always enjoy reading your posts, even if you are disagreeing with me.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

So why do you suppose that his sales guide has been stringing him along for weeks with the message that he/they are trying to get him that room?

Because they're trying to help him out? Going above and beyond? A few still do. Fixed weeks are so rarely sold that the OP may have convinced the guide to make the extra effort when the contract and Understand documents don't legally require it.

 

[Bing Showei]

What is wrong with asking Disney to explain what appears to be either confusing, contradictory, a clerical error, a mistake by the Guide, or a poorly worded contract? And, if they have made a mistake, asking them to make the buyer whole in some way? He just spent a major chunk of change on a DVC contract. I’d be angry if I were in his shoes and felt like I was getting the runaround from Disney.

My issue with the OP in this instance is that he’s not just asking for help with getting an equivalent room to make himself "whole," he’s wanting to pile on with what he sees is a “gotcha” moment in the agreement. Again, he seemingly understood what he was buying, agreed to it that he may not get the GW this year, and had "No problem" with it.

But then he saw the contract and his eyes suddenly had dollar signs over them. Now he’s talking about getting dues covered for an entire year, or staying in a Poly bungalow for a week? That’s a bit rich and starts to feel like a grift.

I agree that he has the right to raise whatever issue he has with the contract. Part of me hopes Disney concedes they messed up on drafting the contract and secures him that week, because then he would be left holding a reservation he doesn’t even want and wouldn’t have anything to lord over Disney while fishing for some manufactured magic; likely at the expense of someone's job.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The point trying to be made by someone that the fact the guide is conceding to messing up by trying to book the week is not necessarily indicating anything like that that but instead could be a guide trying to go above to satisfy their customer. Of course it is also possible that since most guides sell very few or no fixed weeks they might have initially been confused too when contacted and even though they've since been told the week wasn't promised because of the purchase in the 11 month window that they still set up a waitlist to try and get the week just because they're nice. And this experience can teach them to not go above and beyond and try and be helpful about these type of demands.

Part of me hopes Disney concedes they messed up on drafting the contract and secures him that week, because then he would be left holding a reservation he doesn’t even want and wouldn’t have anything to lord over Disney while fishing for some manufactured magic; likely at the expense of someone's job.

Just a couple of thoughts from other things stated here along the way and only quoting as part addresses the conceding the contract was incorrect. I'm sure there are ways the contracts could be done differently too or something about it addressed in the POS to allow DVC to handle it differently. However the wording has been the same in the couple of fixed week contracts I've seen as what the OP received. Having read it all and the POS it really is no question to me. It can create a moment where you go "ah ha - I should be getting this!" until you keep reading what your signing to where they expand on how timing of your purchase can affect that first calendar year week.

So the guide is being nice and trying to satisfy them by getting them that week and that's fine and I don't think there's anything to concede on messing up on the drafting either. When contracts are drafted they don't know when a buyer is going to sign and I think it would be ignoring the POS if they started holding weeks at the time a contract is drafted because of the first come 11 months window that we all agree to. And who knows when or even if a contract will get signed unless they are onsite and signing right then. Do we want DVC to hold inventory for a potential sale? I know I don't although I concede there is already a bit of that when they load points right away even without a signed contract. But still if not onsite and the timing is close DVC would have to check availability at the time the contract is drafted and then depending on changes to availability by the times it's signed they might have to do an addendum to either book the week if they were cautious and stated it would not be booked or that they can't book it if it were no longer available but had been when they drafted.

OR - just have the part about it might not be available if you're within 11 months and then you'll get points. And have your guides tell the buyers that too.

 

[Brian Noble]

So why do you suppose that his sales guide has been stringing him along for weeks with the message that he/they are trying to get him that room?

At the very least, the Disney Guest Services Playbook says: "Never say 'no' to a Guest unless you have to."

Saying "we're working on it" comports with this, and it is something they can do (e.g. by manipulating the wait list and waiting for a cancellation.)

I would definitely not take this as evidence that Disney believes they are wrong.

 

[crisi]

So why do you suppose that his sales guide has been stringing him along for weeks with the message that he/they are trying to get him that room? If the contract is as straightforward as people seem to think it is, why not just explain to him the terms of the contract? A well trained sales guide should have been able to easily clear up any confusion on the buyer’s part.

I

I'm guessing the guide would like a satisfied customer, and has probably bumped him to the top of the waitlist. That doesn't cost the guide or Disney anything, and is a fair solution to the issue of "I bought a fixed week within the eleven month window and my room was booked - if someone cancels, I get first dibs on the room." And if that is the case, the guide is trying to get him the room - he isn't stringing him along, he's providing regular status updates. But the guide cannot cancel another members reservation in order to provide the room.

(Brian beat me to it).....

And this has been a weird year in terms of cancellations. Its very probable that the guide thought when this whole thing first started "certainly someone will cancel a Thanksgiving reservation in a few weeks - people have been cancelling like crazy - and then I'll be able to make this guy happy. But vaccine euphoria has hit, and we are all sure we will be keeping our Fall travel plans, so you are probably now moving into a much less likely to cancel than in a normal year situation.

 

[sndral]

...
"This means that beginning January 1, 2021, PURCHASER has the right in each Use Year to have a Studio Shower Vacation Home Type automatically reserved (the 'Guaranteed Reservation') for PURCHASER's use during Week #49 (the 'Use Period') using all of the Home Resort Vacation Points allotted for the applicable Use Year"

That said, Disney covers their bases with other language in the agreement. Thinking you also have the below in the contract:

2. Depending upon the week you want to be your Week and the type of Vacation Home you want to be your Vacation Home Type, your Guaranteed Reservation may not be available to you immediately based on the resort opening date and the Use Year of your Ownership Interest. It may only be available to you beginning in a future year. Your purchase agreement and deed will identify the calendar year in which you will first have a Guaranteed Reservation.

3. If you are purchasing your Fixed Ownership Interest within the eleven month booking window of your Guaranteed Reservation start date, your Guaranteed Reservation may not be available to you in the first year but may only be available to you beginning in a future year. This is because you will be competing with other DVC members for availability in that first year. If your Guaranteed Reservation is not available to you in the first year, you may use your Vacation Points to make another reservation, based on availability, just as if you had purchased a Floating Use Ownership Interest.
...

It seems clause 3 is clearly applicable to OP, they purchased w/in the 11 month booking window of their fixed week thus they were on notice that they would have to compete with other owners for availability. Plus, their guide clearly explained that to them.
Clause 1 gives them ‘the right to have a [specific villa] automatically reserved for them.’ We know the automatic reservation happens in the month prior to the 11 month window opening - so in OP’s case that reservation is made in Dec. each year & OP bought after Dec., it could be interpreted that they are getting their 2021 guaranteed reservation, in Dec. 2021 a 2 br. will be automatically reserved for their use in Nov. 2022.
If the intent was to identify the first guaranteed stay/occupancy the contract could have said so, instead the contract says guaranteed reservation.

 

[EM Lawrence]

At the very least there are clauses that contradict each other in his contract. Clause #2 is very specific. It lays out the conditions under which he would not get the GW and then refers him to the place where the first calendar year he is entitled to the GW will be in the contract, and both of those say 2021.

I don’t think it is good customer service to string a member along. It would be one thing if the guide explained to OP that he is not entitled to the week, and pointed out to him where in the contract it says so. Then it *might* be good customer service to say they were going to try to go above and beyond to find him a room. If he has no right to the week, even bumping him on a waitlist seems unfair to me. Why should the waitlist be violated if he is only confused about what he is entitled to?

Is DVC/Disney a company that goes above and beyond to achieve customer satisfaction when the customer is confused and wrong about the terms of their contract, or a cold-hearted corporation that only cares about stock holders and is only bound only by the most literal examination of the language in the contracts they enter in to with members? I can’t keep it straight.

Allowing him to believe that he is entitled to the week, and that they are just working on the logistics of securing it for him, while not giving him a straight answer, is terrible, rotten, horrible customer service. I would not feel pixie dusted by that kind of treatment at all.