Brawl at Test Track-Epcot

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

Wonder if there was an uptick in umbrella sales at Disney over the last few days? Never know when you might need to "use" one.

 

[Arielle22]

I think what declansdad and I are saying is that the laws of nature, common sense, and decency supersede corporate bylaws.

We are debating in circles. Laws of nature, common sense and decency have no bearing on corporate policy. Whether people like it or not, the CM being fired would be legal in this situation.

 

[declansdad]

We are debating in circles. Laws of nature, common sense and decency have no bearing on corporate policy. Whether people like it or not, the CM being fired would be legal in this situation.

I never said it wouldn't be legal, I said it is a stupid policy.

 

[Praying Colonel]

Ejection go like this?

 

[DisneyPrince1982]

We are debating in circles. Laws of nature, common sense and decency have no bearing on corporate policy. Whether people like it or not, the CM being fired would be legal in this situation.

Likely legal but stupid and lazy.

 

[cattywampus]

At Disneyland's upscale Carthay Circle restaurant, I was at dinner with my seven year old. There was a large table adjacent with two couples and their respective children. They had all been drinking and very loud but one of the moms was on a rant VERY loudly the entire time with the "F" word flying in EVERY sentence.

Now, I work in real estate development and I can curse to make construction workers blush, but certainly not at Disney and/or in front of kids.

Blessedly (and miraculously) 7 year old has never heard the F word ( at least out of us) so I didn't want to highlight it as a bad word. I said ask the server if anything could be done with the "loud and colorful" language (it was BAD for the entire meal). The answer was a sympathetic no.

Again, because they seemed like they were finishing and because I didn't want to have to point out the language to the 7 year old I didn't speak to a manager or say anything directly, but I doubt anything would have happened. Had there been another adult present, I would have spoken to the manager out or earshot, but it was just the two of us.

The entire dining room breathed a collective sigh of relief when they left. Ruined the meal.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

Agreed. The popular media celebrates lowlife behavior and mocks Christianity and responsible behavior. Don't believe it? Jerry Springer. Honey Boo Boo. Jersey Shore. Kardashians. Real Housewives. Anything with Paris Hilton. Etc., etc., etc.

The Duggars. Oh, wait...

 

[TLSnell1981]

Do we know yet, who threw the first shot?

Bystanders have reported, the argument was verbal only, until Goofy put her hands on the guest in front of her. It escalated from there and Poppins pulled out her parasol . Ugly. Really.

 

[littleblackegg]

I couldn't agree more with this.

Bystanders have reported, the argument was verbal only, until Goofy put her hands on the guest in front of her. It escalated from there and Poppins pulled out her parasol . Ugly. Really, even

This is why we can't have nice things.

 

[TLSnell1981]

We are debating in circles. Laws of nature, common sense and decency have no bearing on corporate policy.

Or anything else for that matter

 

[kyleandconnorsmom]

nkie, post: 54125394, member: 23024"]I think both parties are guilty.

The woman should have kept walking instead of walking back to confront the kid and her mother. Did she hit first? I can't tell from the video. But my gut(and growing up, teaching and still living in the hood) tells me that the kid and her mom didn't just start throwing punches for nothing. I think that woman hit one of them and caused the fists to start flying.
Up until that point it was just a bunch trash talking.

Yes, she should have kept walking away from them. They were separated~still talking trash~but there was a bit of distance between them.[/QUOTE]
Sometimes, unfor

Some of the time ignoring trash talk works. At other times, ignoring it builds rage. In an enclosed space at an amusement park, especially when you have an out of control adult who should be trying to calm the situation instead of causing more havoc, it's harder to control than in a classroom.

I agree with this 100%. Unfortunately, I had a situation my self a few years ago. I had to take my kids to a local health dept. to get a shot that their doctor was out of. A lady sitting behind us in the waiting area kept calling my kids names (they were 9 and 2 at the time and i was pregnant with my third) and talking about them loudly on her phone (called them ugly white boys several times, among other things). My oldest asked why she kept yelling at them and I told him to just ignore her. My husband called me about this time and could hear the lady. I decided at this point to just get up and go stand by a wall, near the office staff. The lady, as I'm walking away is threatening to hurt me if I "say a word about" her to anyone. Then, her daughter comes out from seeing the doctor and I figured they were leaving. Instead, the daughter screams at me "what did you say to my mom?!" I told her I didn't say a word to her mom and that her mom had been talking about my kids (I hate confrontation to begin with, but I'm also a very small person and I was pregnant and holding a 2 year old) and before I could finish a sentence the girl was pulling my hair and punching me in the head. The rest was a blurr, I know someone pulled her off of me and I went running to the back of the office area with my kids. She took off in her car at that point and police were called by the clinic.
So the point of that long story was that sometimes remaining silent makes people just as angry. And, as far as the CM goes, I would only hope that someone close by would step in and help just like the people in the clinic did for me that day. I can only imagine what may have happened to me, or my toddler, or the baby I was carrying, if people had just sat around, afraid to help because they may face consequences. It's a sad place our world is coming to when people are regularly punished for doing the right thing.

 

[asta]

Bystanders have reported, the argument was verbal only, until Goofy put her hands on the guest in front of her. It escalated from there and Poppins pulled out her parasol . Ugly. Really.

From watching the video (too many times, really) I think this is right. Goofy hat appears to put her hands on the woman as she walks away. It is hard to see but it looks like she put her hands up and pulled the woman's hair or at least touched her head. And using the umbrella introduced a weapon and whole new level of ugly responsibility.

 

[Jaya]

The worst fight I ever saw was between two women waiting with their small children to see Santa Claus at the mall. Some racial insults were traded and then it got physical. I mean rolling around on the floor, punching and hairpulling physical.

The second worst one was many, many years ago at The Joy and Pageantry of Christmas, a fantastic living nativity scene that Disney used to put on three times a night for about a month before Christmas at the village. There was always a large crowd waiting to get to the seats as the show was emptying and there would be a huge rush. Two guys got into it over a seat and the show they put on would have put a MMA fight to shame.

Nothing says "Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays" quite like a good knock-down-drag-out, huh?

 

[LaurenT]

The written portion of that link says that a sherrif's deputy responded, no one was arrested, no one was injured and no one was asked to leave the park.
Yes - was embarrassing for the kids and an awful example to set, but let's not blow it out of proportion with talk of lifetime bans.

 

[DisneyPrince1982]

...but let's not blow it out of proportion with talk of lifetime bans.

A fight is a fight. The person who threw the first punch should be given a ban of some sort, let's say 5 years, as a warning shot. We really need to start sending the message that nobody NOBODY can raise their fist ever.

 

[NHdisneylover]

I don't think anyone should be banned (nor do I know how that could be enforced)--but I do think all those who were fighting (not walking away, or only defending themselves by blocking, etc--so in this case both goofy and Mary Poppins) should have been removed from the park and had their tickets blocked so they could not return same day (yeah, I suppose they could buy new ones, but . . . ). (and, no, I do not feel that anyone removed from the park due to their behavior should get a refund on the ticket, or on any non refundable dining reservations, etc)

There is a lot of middle ground between lifetime ban and do basically nothing.

 

[LaurenT]

A fight is a fight. The person who threw the first punch should be given a ban of some sort, let's say 5 years, as a warning shot. We really need to start sending the message that nobody NOBODY can raise their fist ever.

I don't disagree with you, but we shouldn't just make believe that's what happened and report it as such. I didn't read all 400 posts, but on the first page someone informed everyone else that they got a lifetime ban ... That's just not true.
I had a guy go off on me once for simply asking him if he knew anyone in the line after he pushed his way past a dozen of us when there were FP machines at DHS .... I kept calmly explaining that we were waiting as he kept cursing and screaming that it was none of my business. Two CMs came and took him away to calm him down .... I spent the rest of the day worried that I would bump into him. His wife and child were visibly horrified at his behavior. He didn't get kicked out - honestly, I think he was a risky individual and could easily have hurt someone - he was a big guy and cod have done a lot more damage than these girls ... But if you eject him, the kid is probably going to have to leave too ... So I think Disney avoids doing that if at all possible.

 

[DisneyPrince1982]

I don't think anyone should be banned (nor do I know how that could be enforced)--but I do think all those who were fighting (not walking away, or only defending themselves by blocking, etc--so in this case both goofy and Mary Poppins) should have been removed from the park and had their tickets blocked so they could not return same day (yeah, I suppose they could buy new ones, but . . . ). (and, no, I do not feel that anyone removed from the park due to their behavior should get a refund on the ticket, or on any non refundable dining reservations, etc)

There is a lot of middle ground between lifetime ban and do basically nothing.

What if you just kick them out of the park for a day, they come back the next day and get in a fight with someone else, only this time someone gets hurt?

 

[NHdisneylover]

What if you just kick them out of the park for a day, they come back the next day and get in a fight with someone else, only this time someone gets hurt?

What if someone who has never started a fight at the parks before comes in, gets in a fight and gets hurt?

I can see eventually banning someone with a history of repeat issues--but one time, from a fight that involved both sides being aggressive (not an attack on someone totally innocent) and no one got hurt or pressed charges? Nope. I don't think one strike and you'Re out is a very good policy for anything other than the worst offenses out there. I don't think it is healthy for society as a whole to look at every transgression as either REALLY bad and deserving some huge big punishment, or no big deal and basically ignoring it.

Odds are decent that missing out on half of day or so of paid park time, combined with time to cool tempers down and NOT ending up in line right next to someone else equally combustible, would mean the same people would not be involved in another fight. Could it happen? Sure, of course. Lots of things could happen. But it isn't very likely to occur.

 

[DisneyPrince1982]

...from a fight that involved both sides being aggressive (not an attack on someone totally innocent)...

Even if someone was being verbally abusive, that is still no justification for throwing a punch. I believe this is what we teach our children and should apply to adults as well. This is why I said the punishment should be for the person who threw the first punch. The people who were being verbally abusive, I'm fine with them getting booted for the rest of the day (if that's what happened, doesn't sound like it was).

I don't think one strike and you'Re out is a very good policy for anything other than the worst offenses out there.

If fighting in a crowded theme park attraction doesn't qualify as a worst offense, I'm curious what you think does. Selling drugs in the park? Brass knuckling someone?