Are the Days of Walking a DVC Reservation Numbered?

[AstroBlasters]

Do you own at VGF? Have you tried booking week 47 the past 2 years in a standard room of any size? This is a sometimes problem, not an all the time.

So then book a different view category or book the day after the walkers.

 

[dvcsince93]

So then book a different view category or book the day after the walkers.

Why, give me one good reason a member should have to alter their plans just to support walking?

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Except according to the board last week, it wasn’t just some folks doing it. It was a lot of owners who were calling day by day.

That is the reason they stated it changed. Owner concerns and overwhelming of MS.

So, while this prevents walking, and every morning all rooms are open for all, but that doesn’t mean it’s more fair than current, unless the only thing one is defining is open rooms.

In this system, especially given online booking you could end up with day one of your trip and not get day two. Now, you’ve got a gap.

Fair is not always equal and equal is not always fair. The 8 am booking start online is the same for everyone but you can’t say that it works for everyone equally.

DVC is never going to be able make a system that is going to be 100% fair and equal in every owner’s eyes.

So, we come back to what booking rules should we have in place that meets the needs of the membership as a whole and what creates the least amount of negatives that owners see as acceptable.

Some of us just believe that walking is the best negative in exchange for being able to use our membership with maximum flexibility.

Well I can certainly see where even a small percentage of day by days would be a problem before there was online booking. Perhaps IT isn’t even up to it now…

 

[lowlight]

So then book a different view category or book the day after the walkers.

No.

 

[dvcsince93]

Well I can certainly see where even a small percentage of day by days would be a problem before there was online booking. Perhaps IT isn’t even up to it now…

So wait a minute, you think day by day isn't fair, but walking is??

 

[Maistre Gracey]

So wait a minute, you think day by day isn't fair, but walking is??

Other way around

 

[dvcsince93]

Except according to the board last week, it wasn’t just some folks doing it. It was a lot of owners who were calling day by day.

That is the reason they stated it changed. Owner concerns and overwhelming of MS.

So, while this prevents walking, and every morning all rooms are open for all, but that doesn’t mean it’s more fair than current, unless the only thing one is defining is open rooms.

In this system, especially given online booking you could end up with day one of your trip and not get day two. Now, you’ve got a gap.

Fair is not always equal and equal is not always fair. The 8 am booking start online is the same for everyone but you can’t say that it works for everyone equally.

DVC is never going to be able make a system that is going to be 100% fair and equal in every owner’s eyes.

So, we come back to what booking rules should we have in place that meets the needs of the membership as a whole and what creates the least amount of negatives that owners see as acceptable.

Some of us just believe that walking is the best negative in exchange for being able to use our membership with maximum flexibility.

Other way around

my bad

 

[dvcsince93]

Except according to the board last week, it wasn’t just some folks doing it. It was a lot of owners who were calling day by day.

That is the reason they stated it changed. Owner concerns and overwhelming of MS.

So, while this prevents walking, and every morning all rooms are open for all, but that doesn’t mean it’s more fair than current, unless the only thing one is defining is open rooms.

In this system, especially given online booking you could end up with day one of your trip and not get day two. Now, you’ve got a gap.

Fair is not always equal and equal is not always fair. The 8 am booking start online is the same for everyone but you can’t say that it works for everyone equally.

Wow, that really seems to twist reality on its head.

Non-walkers face the whole- get day one, not day two- as it is, because of walkers.

No matter how often you say it, without walkers, everyone has the same opportunity at the same time to reserve the same room whereas with walking a subset of people have an advantage.

 

[disfanforlife]

Do you own at VGF? Have you tried booking week 47 the past 2 years in a standard room of any size? This is a sometimes problem, not an all the time.

No, I don’t own there. I had never been able o book a room before they made the resort studios. I stayed there twice so far and going again in February which I booked at 7 months in advance.

 

[DanCali]

Or the fourth road, "It's happening, but what does it matter if you can pick up the scraps after they walk past your date". I'm not really sure why people are being disingenuous.

"Scraps" is what happens at AKV value/club where you get one 1-2 days at a time and they immediately get picked up.

I don't think the current availability in November at RIV, VGF, and BLT (for example) represents scraps.

How is it "scraps" when you can literally pick up a 7, 10, or 14 day reservation that ends 11/19?

I already am locked out my week 47 trip for 2025 by walkers. It will never open up again.

I'm not saying walking is not frustrating - but it's better than any alternative I've seen or heard about. And just because some people learned how to click fast at 8am, doesn't mean the system should be revamped. If they are using software for bookings, that's a different issue that should be addressed.

Week 47 is Thanksgiving week (Nov 27)? I don't think you know yet that it will "never open up again" just because Nov 20 is gone. You can also try again at 8am tomorrow for Nov 21, which doesn't seem "locked out" and then add earlier dates later is you need them.

Moreover, you're not really "locked out" when you can get a better view for a slightly higher cost (or a similar room at the same cost at VGF). The only way it doesn't open up again is that all those alleged walkers are walking to Thanksgiving and stopping. In my opinion, something will definitely open up for your desired dates. The question is, how long will it last out there?

 

[Sandisw]

Wow, that really seems to twist reality on its head.

Non-walkers face the whole- get day one, not day two- as it is, because of walkers.

No matter how often you say it, without walkers, everyone has the same opportunity at the same time to reserve the same room whereas with walking a subset of people have an advantage.

You misunderstood. That comment of getting day one and not getting day two was in relation to the day by day booking that was happening with the old system.

Not with the current one. It doesn’t happen now because when DVC changed the rule back in 2008 they added the plus 7 to prevent gaps….which were occurring when the old system was in place.

Now the 11 month window opens 7 nights for booking and not one.

Anyone not getting the days they want is because there are too many owners who want those rooms at the price they cost.

And I don’t mean being locked out just at 8 am…I mean never getting them because they don’t come back.

That is why the impact of walking is relevant to whether it is an issue.

Even if someone is walking a PV room at RIV, you don’t know it because there are rooms still available to book.

Not making a judgement here…just saying that it’s not as simple as some think it is.

 

[Tatebeck]

"Scraps" is what happens at AKV value/club where you get one 1-2 days at a time and they immediately get picked up.

I don't think the current availability in November at RIV, VGF, and BLT (for example) represents scraps.

How is it "scraps" when you can literally pick up a 7, 10, or 14 day reservation that ends 11/19?

Scraps happen after walkers pass the high demand periods. AKV value and club are just high demand all the time. 11/19 isn't a high demand period for most resorts or room types other than those. Keep watching in the next few weeks when those dates being dropped are at Thanksgiving into the first few weeks of December. I believe those will be the scraps they are talking about

 

[Orsino]

I don't agree with the assertion that walking isn't a problem. It might not be a problem *for me*, but that isn't the same thing. Furthermore, even if I didn't think walking was a problem now, it clearly is a thing that grows over time. I have walked, not because I wanted to, but because I felt I needed to. As walks get longer, that will only encourage more walking with earlier and earlier start dates. Personally, I don't want this. The idea that stalking a website and walking a reservation for months is a virtuous act of dedication that deserves to be rewarded baffles me.

I remember when Broadway shows started selling day-of front row seats for a heavy discount to get students an opportunity to go to shows. People showed up an hour before the show. Then people realized they needed to show up earlier to get tickets and showed up two hours, then three, then all-day. When kids were camping out all night in front of the theater, management had to put a stop to the practice and switched to a lottery, which is the norm today.

Put modest, time-limited restrictions on the ability to cancel check-in day, and long walks go away without burden to the membership. The main protest I hear about this method is that large point holders would have more flexibility to mini-walk than small point holders, to which I just shrug: more points can do more.

 

[dvcsince93]

"Scraps" is what happens at AKV value/club where you get one 1-2 days at a time and they immediately get picked up.

I don't think the current availability in November at RIV, VGF, and BLT (for example) represents scraps.

How is it "scraps" when you can literally pick up a 7, 10, or 14 day reservation that ends 11/19?



I'm not saying walking is not frustrating - but it's better than any alternative I've seen or heard about. And just because some people learned how to click fast at 8am, doesn't mean the system should be revamped. If they are using software for bookings, that's a different issue that should be addressed.

If walkers are so good at clicking at 8 am then wait for the 11 month window to start your reservation. There is no disadvantage to them.

 

[Sandisw]

Scraps happen after walkers pass the high demand periods. AKV value and club are just high demand all the time. 11/19 isn't a high demand period for most resorts or room types other than thos. Keep watching in the next few weeks when those dates being dropped are at Thanksgiving into the first few weeks of December. I believe those will be the scraps they are talking about

So isn’t that then a demand issue? AKV CL never comes back…which means the owners who grab those dates grabbed the ones they intended to use.

 

[Genie+]

We have been through this back and forth endless times in endless threads. Those that walk, or support walking, do not believe they are doing anything wrong, or frankly don’t care that they are doing anything wrong.

Personally, I promised myself I would not do this again after last year. The walking has already started weeks ago for every, and I mean EVERY single standard room category for VGF and RR. If it follows last year, it will walk to week 48 of 2025, the week after Thanksgiving.

There is no talking about solutions. The contract is clear. DVC has admitted unintended consequences are happening, which is clearly “violations of the first come first serve booking at 11 months prior to desired check in date”. DVC doesn’t just get to hand wave this away- a contract is a two way street. Management has an obligation, under the contract, to protect members use of their points. They have failed to do so in regards to both the commercial renting and walking of reservations aspect. I am not able to use my membership as laid out in the contract I signed, not due to circumstances within my control, but rather because they have allowed a loophole to be abused to the detriment of their membership at large.

Can someone who is familiar with contracts tell me what remedies are available in a situation where I was sold a membership under false pretenses and am unable to use it as laid out in the contract?

I agree and possibly why when DVC representatives spoke up at the meetings, they were careful to say ‘not widespread’ to both walking and commercial renting. It’s a means to protecting DVD and DVC management legally. Disney is a master at closing themselves off legally because of all the experience they’ve had at being a target

 

[lowlight]

"Scraps" is what happens at AKV value/club where you get one 1-2 days at a time and they immediately get picked up.

I don't think the current availability in November at RIV, VGF, and BLT (for example) represents scraps.

How is it "scraps" when you can literally pick up a 7, 10, or 14 day reservation that ends 11/19?



I'm not saying walking is not frustrating - but it's better than any alternative I've seen or heard about. And just because some people learned how to click fast at 8am, doesn't mean the system should be revamped. If they are using software for bookings, that's a different issue that should be addressed.

Week 47 is Thanksgiving week (Nov 27)? I don't think you know yet that it will "never open up again" just because Nov 20 is gone. You can also try again at 8am tomorrow for Nov 21, which doesn't seem "locked out" and then add earlier dates later is you need them.

Moreover, you're not really "locked out" when you can get a better view for a slightly higher cost (or a similar room at the same cost at VGF). The only way it doesn't open up again is that all those alleged walkers are walking to Thanksgiving and stopping. In my opinion, something will definitely open up for your desired dates. The question is, how long will it last out there?

My apologies, week 48 of 2025. The week after Thanksgiving. Your understanding of walking is quite different than mine. I'm not sure it's even worth it to talk about at this point when we are starting from different definitions of the very act. Walking has nothing to do with 8am, so I'm not sure what you are even talking about.

 

[dvcsince93]

So isn’t that then a demand issue? AKV CL never comes back…which means the owners who grab those dates grabbed the ones they intended to use.

Sure, if we all have equal shots at the same units at the same time. But walkers take inventory out of the system prior to the 11 month window, so that is not the case.

 

[dvcsince93]

I must say however, that this string has shown me that unless DVC stops walking, then there is a subgroup of members that will do it no matter what. They know that walking gets around the 11 month window and they not only don't care, they like it.

I am curious what DVC will say about the problem when they see the attitude of these members.

 

[Tatebeck]

So isn’t that then a demand issue? AKV CL never comes back…which means the owners who grab those dates grabbed the ones they intended to use.

For AKV yes part of the problem is a high demand issue. Club studios rarely come back. I have heard stories of people that basically try to live in those club level rooms. Get a room, extend it to 30 days for their intended day (with or without walking it), try to grab another date, and repeat lol.

But 2 things can be true at once. A room itself being in too high of demand (or too low in qty) and people walking reservations are 2 different problems that can exacerbate each other.

A high demand room may prompt members to walk a reservation for it

And walking a high demand room lowers the number of rooms bookable at 11 months as is intended, which makes it even lower in stock and can drive up demand