What do you do with people that cut in line to meet up with group?

[KellyNY]

1. I meant when one person goes in and gets seats while another goes and gets popcorn. You don't have a problem with the seat saver do you?

2. lol, it's not that cut and dried. the whole argument is the definition of "line cutting". My view is if someone has saved a spot, it isn't cutting.

What about my Dole Whip example? you skipped that one.

No matter how many people in your party and how many seats you hold in movie theater, movie will start at particular point, same for everyone, even if your friends still buying pop corn. Nobodys experience will be different because of them.
Dole Whip or any food line is basically per order, not per person, so this example also does not work for rides.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

I also don't see this working either. I mean how would you know when the person is in front of the line. I am sure there has been a lot of research done on Disney part the most effective way is used.

yes lots of research.

and lots of moving away from traditional snaking queues for all the obvious reasons already stated.

how about DMV? Remember the days of standing in line? Now you get an assigned number and you go read a book on a bench until they call you (at least in NY). so much better.

oh and Rapunzel. At the height of popularity when she met over in the old Belle's garden by the castle CMs actually implored you to have ONE person wait and have the rest of the family go somewhere else. But people resisted...lol.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

No matter how many people in your party and how many seats you hold in movie theater, movie will start at particular point, same for everyone, even if your friends still buying pop corn. Nobodys experience will be different because of them.
Dole Whip or any food line is basically per order, not per person, so this example also does not work for rides.

ah you're arguing just to argue and I could debunk both these comments easily but no matter. that's fine. there's enough that feel like you do that as already stated I follow the rules you prefer so you don't get upset needlessly: I get in line with my whole group.

 

[gator girl]

Death penalty. Watch out for bloodstains.

And what's with the "my kid just scampered ahead of me & got in line & I had noooooo control over it whatsoever so then I was forced to skip the line to catch up!!" people?!? My mom would have 1) held my hand if I was a runner in a crowd or 2) used "the Mom voice" to make sure I stuck close to her or 3) we would have packed up & left the park if I couldn't behave. Period.

I guess my family was just dumb and gullible. If someone had to pee or grab a coke or park a stroller we just all waited around for them like a bunch of chumps. And then when they were finished, we all got in the line together. I must have wasted weeks of my lifetime in unnecessary lines....

 

[HayGan]

Because most people are not as logical and rational as you. It should translate to park rides, (with the exception of the fact that many rides, like Soarin' and TSM have built queues that make it virtually impossible for the rest of the group to join the one placeholder...but that could be fixed if need be). Your Dole Whip example is a good one. Lots and lots of people have a single person wait in line, and then have the kids join them at the front when it is time to order. Happens more often than not, and it isn't viewed as cutting. The only difference with rides is the overly emotional reaction that people have. And as Mr. Spock taught us, emotion is not the best way to make decisons. Once people get over the emotional issue, they would see that the single placeholder is the best approach. The problem is, everyone has to agree to it. And unless WDW makes this park policy, (which I don't see happening), emotion will always win out. So I don't actually utilize the single placeholder strategy myself as I know people will have an emotional reaction to it. But when others move past me in line to join the rest of their party,it does not bother me because I understand the efficiency involved.

If there is 1 or 2 people trying to rejoin their party in line, I don't see what the big deal is. If there is a group of people trying to make their way thru the line then there is a problem. I don't typically try to rejoin my family but on occasion it has had to happen for valid reasons but I'm not going to make someone justify to me why they had to seperate from their group. At the end of the day, I will have had a much better time if I just let someone rejoin their family/group without even thinking about the reasons why. If I have used one second of my time thinking about the reasons (whether they be valid or invalid) then I have wasted and spoiled my time with it. As long as someone is polite and respectful, I don't get what the big deal is.

 

[JimmyV]

This doesnt seem logical to me at all. Simply because you haven't done the math. It works for concert tickets. No one has ever challenged the notion that one person can wait in line and buy 6 tickets. Where the heck are all these people going to wait There are not enough benches to accomdate the waiters. Waiting on benches was simply a visual example. Go shopping. Go get an ice cream cone. Ride the carousel if there is no line there. It doesn't really matter. Just be back in time. Then you will have the people who want to squeeze one more thing in before they would rejoin the placeholder in the Peter Pan line, holding up the line. I don't see that. If you aren't there to rejoin your placeholder,then you don't ride, or your placeholder lets others pass, which is exactly the solution that most people have to the current system--instead of the "cutters" moving up, the people they wish to join let others pass. Same thing here. And it is one thing if it a bathroom or to buy water but for me the point is to ride together or see characters together. But that is the beauty of they system. It doesn't matter what you do. What you do is your own business. Just be back in line when it is your turn. If the line for PP is 75 minutes, why would it matter if you use that 75 minutes to do something other than go to the bathroom or buy water? Who cares? Plus how am I suppose to know how many people are ahead of you, or will be rejoining you to know if the line is worth getting in or getting a FP? The same way you know now. When you see the line at PP now, how do you know how long it will take to get on? You visually estimate, and you use the "Wait Time" board as guides. This won't change. You simply have to recalibrate your visuals. If the line is 40 people long under the new system, that would be the equivalent of a 160 person line before, give or take. Your eyes would get used to it fairly quickly. Plus, the wait time boards would still be used. Should the tour group leader get in line and wait and then call over the 40 kids in his group? Should Dad hold the line while the rest of the family reunion of 20 is meeting and taking pictures with the Green Army guy who appeared outside TSMM Yes. This is how it would work. Under the current system, if you are behind a tour group of 40 kids, then you are behind a tour group of 40 kids. Under the alternate system, you are still behind the group of 40 kids. You just don't have to listen to them and watch them misbehave and fidget for 70 minutes. Haven't you EVER been in that situation and thought to yourself, "Gee. I wish those kids would get out of this line and just regroup when it is their turn?" I know I have.

I really dont know why it is so difficult to look at a wait time before you get in line and say "hmmm this is a 60 minute wait for Peter Pan" before we get in line everyone let's make a stop at the bathroom" or "let's stop at this place and get some waters bc the line is long and outside" and then enter the line together as a family. Then you would see much less people having to leave the line for potty breaks or water runs.

It is not difficult to do as you suggest in your last paragraph. It just isn't the most efficient use of time. One way is not "better" than another. They are simply alternatives that get you to the exact same place at the exact same time. My suggestion is not designed to get you on the ride any faster. It is designed to pull fidgety kids, tired legs with bulging veins and people who don't deal well with lines out of the lines until the last possible moment. For eons, WDW has allowed people in wheelchairs to join their group when the rest of the group gets to the front. No one ever complains about this. Why? Because the person is in a wheelchair? It isn't polite to complain about such things? But if an elderly person has swollen feet, or a ADHD or autistic child is having difficulty with the lines, shouldn't we do the same for them? And if we do and don't complain, aren't we acknowledging the fact that they didn't gain any advantage. They simply waited in line a little bit differently than we did. You see. We already have such a system in place for certain guests. To think that such a system could not work for all guests is illogical. Granted, some queue modifications would be needed. But from a purely theoretical standpoint, which is all that this is, the system would work, both from a mathematical and societal basis.

 

[amcc]

Honestly, after several hundred cumulative days in the various parks, this has never presented itself as a major issue. Certainly not one that would warrant 20 pages of discussion and "strategies". I don't let it get to me, as I have a different approach to the way I look at "lines".

.

Thanks for the logic Legoland actually acknowledges the wastefulness of having (at least) children wait in line. There lines snake like Disney's - and are about the size of many of Disney's Fantasyland lines. What they do is at the end of the lines, where they turn, they've put in these fenced areas that are only accessible from the line, with one entrance at the first turn, and the exit several turns down. They've stocked them with legos but Disney could come up with their own thing. Your kids play while you wind and turn, but they are within eyeshot and not driving you or anyone else crazy.

With some minor modifications, Disney could do something like this in quite a few lines instead of spending the money on something confusing in terms of line control (but adorable) like the entertainment at the beginning of the Pooh

 

[KellyNY]

Your points are good ones, and I do not expect there to ever be an "official" change. The real point of my post is to demonstrate that "cutting" is only "cutting" if it is done without the permission of the masses, and that we all have the ability to grant that permission, as we would all benefit in the end. Instead of this being a stubborn battle of wills, when each member of society grants every other member of society the right to do something that benefits everyone, we all win. When I ahead of someone as I walk into the bank, and there is someone directly behind me, I open the door and hold it to allow that other person to enter. They are now ahead of me in line to see the teller. Are they a "cutter"? No. I gave them permission. When someone is in line in front of me at the grocery store, and she spies her husband in the store with a single item in his hands and she asks if it is OK for her husband to add that item to her cart, is he a "cutter"? No. I gave him permission. People seem to lose sight of the fact that even under Disney's "no cutting" rules, someone is not a cutter if permission is granted. For whatever reason, that level of permission and courtesy are hardest to find in the Happiest Place On Earth and its progeny.

I do not expect everyone to have a phone for as long as this pleasure is still extremely expensive and I do not think many would buy it just for a trip, so it will present a problem. I do not think a sign will hold people from entering gate area and hanging in there, we all know how people block ways of FP entrance waiting for 10 min before window opens and yes, rides are simply not built for such system, I do not think they will change that.
As for being nice, I am all for that, I also do not see problem with people stepping out, not that lines actually build return friendly, but it is fine with me. I also do not understand why some people would block someone, risking confrontation, on vacation but to each its own I guess.

 

[scubamouse]

I cut to the end of this thread because I didn't want to waste time reading it. Is that allowed???

I just don't understand the big deal. Only once this trip did a large group try to meet up way in front of me. I thought WWDD (what would DIS do) and decided, to let it slide. I've had to meet up with my family a few times and had them meet up with me. Almost always people are decent about it and we're all on vacation so I just don't get what a big deal this is.

 

[KellyNY]

ah you're arguing just to argue and I could debunk both these comments easily but no matter. that's fine. there's enough that feel like you do that as already stated I follow the rules you prefer so you don't get upset needlessly: I get in line with my whole group.

What? I did not get it, why exactly you feel a need to attack me? I am not talking about rules or anything, I was showing how those examples are not relevant to what we discuss, different lines. If you can explain why it is not so, please go ahead, in civilized way of conversation but do not brush me off with " argue to argue", it is ridiculous and this kinds of comments is what causing civilized thread to be closed.

 

[JimmyV]

how about DMV? Remember the days of standing in line? Now you get an assigned number and you go read a book on a bench until they call you (at least in NY). so much better.

oh and Rapunzel. At the height of popularity when she met over in the old Belle's garden by the castle CMs actually implored you to have ONE person wait and have the rest of the family go somewhere else. But people resisted...lol.

I did not know this about Rapunzel. See? The folks at WDW understand the efficiency. It is simply general masses who get overly emotiona about this.

In the end, this is absolutely no different than the deli counter at the grocery store where you take a number. When I pull number 75 and they are serving number 34, I go shop the rest of the store. If I am not back in time, I get passed over. If I show up just in the nick of time, I have not cut in front of anyone else, and no one tries to physically restrain me. Because we have all bought in to the sytsem. If it helps the disbelievers to visualize this better, imagine that you pull a number at Peter Pan. You get number 854. They are boarding number 267. You can go do whatever you darn well please until it is your turn. Under this approach, no one would ever complain. The system that I am describing is simply the same approach, but without the need to kill trees and print out numbered slips. But if that is the way that best helps you understand how this works and the efficiencies involved, then think of it in those terms. Think of the person who is pushing through you in line as being number 756 to your 854. You don't knock them down at the deli, so why do so here. It seems to me as if people have this masochistic approach to rides where one has to suffer in line in order to be worty of riding. Heaven forbid one should suggest an alternative method whereby no one suffers. It is shocking to me that people complained about the Rapunzel situation. Truly astonsihing that so many would cut off their own noses to spite their faces.

 

[ellie05]

1. I meant when one person goes in and gets seats while another goes and gets popcorn. You don't have a problem with the seat saver do you?

2. lol, it's not that cut and dried. the whole argument is the definition of "line cutting". My view is if someone has saved a spot, it isn't cutting.

What about my Dole Whip example? you skipped that one.

That is what I was referring in the movie theater scenario. There really isn't a line there. We have been in sold out movies where there is a line waiting and no one is allowed to hold seats. They have employees making sure every seat is full. Otherwise there is always plenty of seats empty.

It seems most people take bypassing in line as line cutting even the ones that let them through.

Honestly I never seen long lines in any food place and usually the family is together, they order and then go get a table. So there is no pushing of anyone else in line.

Cutting in line, also known as line/queue jumping, butting, barging, budging, skipping, ditching, breaking, shorting, or pushing in is the act of entering a line or queue at any position other than the end

yes lots of research.

and lots of moving away from traditional snaking queues for all the obvious reasons already stated.

how about DMV? Remember the days of standing in line? Now you get an assigned number and you go read a book on a bench until they call you (at least in NY). so much better.

oh and Rapunzel. At the height of popularity when she met over in the old Belle's garden by the castle CMs actually implored you to have ONE person wait and have the rest of the family go somewhere else. But people resisted...lol.

That is how the FP system does.
Snaking or not there is still a line. I think the problem most people have is that if no one had to wait then everyone would been fine, but it is disrespectful to think you don't have to wait when others do. So if no one needed to wait then so be it, but as it is everyone needs to wait. I have not seen one queue where there is enough space for people to go by without having to push people out of the way, in most you can't even see where your party is vs character lines.

 

[JimmyV]

Thanks for the logic Legoland actually acknowledges the wastefulness of having (at least) children wait in line. There lines snake like Disney's - and are about the size of many of Disney's Fantasyland lines. What they do is at the end of the lines, where they turn, they've put in these fenced areas that are only accessible from the line, with one entrance at the first turn, and the exit several turns down. They've stocked them with legos but Disney could come up with their own thing. Your kids play while you wind and turn, but they are within eyeshot and not driving you or anyone else crazy.

With some minor modifications, Disney could do something like this in quite a few lines instead of spending the money on something confusing in terms of line control (but adorable) like the entertainment at the beginning of the Pooh

Thanks for the backup. Never been to Legoland. Sounds like they "get it".

 

[brucerob62]

life is too short to worry about a few people cutting in line..whats 30 more seconds to wait..when you have already been in line for an hour anyway.. A large group no..but a couple is ok,,dont sweat it ,, i did it once or twice..by wife and one child went ahead of me to soarin..i took other child to bathroom..i just wanted to get with them..and I thought me and my child were going to be be-headed over this,, I was like are you serious? whats the difference if i go in with them or 5 minutes later..its still my spot in line..chill!!

 

[CTDisneyfan816]

The World is full of inconsiderate jerks. Life's too short to spend your time worrying about such people. Never waste an opportunity to be nice to someone else, even if they don't deserve it.

That's my philosophy as well.

 

[GBBTomorrow]

For the most part I try very hard not to let others' behavior spoil my day. Once, though, I did get frustrated with an aggressive father trying to rejoin his family in line at Space Mountain. When he shoved me to move over, I turned to him and said, with a sad, sympathetic voice, "Gosh, that must really hurt your feelings that your family wouldn't wait for you. I'm so sorry."

He looked pretty confused. I wonder if he ever figured out my point.

 

[sandym718]

It is not difficult to do as you suggest in your last paragraph. It just isn't the most efficient use of time. One way is not "better" than another. They are simply alternatives that get you to the exact same place at the exact same time. My suggestion is not designed to get you on the ride any faster. It is designed to pull fidgety kids, tired legs with bulging veins and people who don't deal well with lines out of the lines until the last possible moment. For eons, WDW has allowed people in wheelchairs to join their group when the rest of the group gets to the front. No one ever complains about this. Why? Because the person is in a wheelchair? It isn't polite to complain about such things? But if an elderly person has swollen feet, or a ADHD or autistic child is having difficulty with the lines, shouldn't we do the same for them? And if we do and don't complain, aren't we acknowledging the fact that they didn't gain any advantage. They simply waited in line a little bit differently than we did. You see. We already have such a system in place for certain guests. To think that such a system could not work for all guests is illogical. Granted, some queue modifications would be needed. But from a purely theoretical standpoint, which is all that this is, the system would work, both from a mathematical and societal basis.

I definitely see your points. The issue I can see (other than queues and spaces not being set up for this method, at this point), is could/should there be a limit on number?

To use your examples...if one person is ordering food for a family of five, it makes no difference to me whether they stand in line alone to place that order, if they all stand in line the entire time, or if 4 of them (or 1 or 2 of them) return at the ordering point. Actually I think the last option is probably best - streamline the line, but they come help carry the food, etc.

However, I DO have a problem with it if those 4 people return at the ordering point and then all place SEPARATE orders, paying separately, etc. Because that does impact my experience in terms of waiting time, etc. I may not have chosen that line had I expected 5 people in front of me (plus any other groups) instead of that one. Another line may have been much shorter. (I have actually had this happen to me before, BTW, at Cedar Point. 1 person in front of me, after quite awhile in line already, suddenly became 4 people - all placing separate orders, digging out cash, etc. I was quite irritated, as were those behind me).

So if a ride accomodates 3 in a vehicle, assuming things are set up properly, I would not mind if for a group of 3, 2 of them waited elsewhere. But if the group size is 13 (size of our group last trip), it is a problem if only 1 person waits. People behind cannot judge accurately if they want to join the line. A group of 13 takes 5 vehicles. Multiply that by numbers of groups and a line that looks quite "short" or reasonable, very quickly becomes a VERY long line/wait.

The only solutions I could see to this - a policy that the number of people actually waiting in line has to match the number of ride vehicles needed (5, in my above example). That's not very realistic, how would it be enforced? And what if you don't KNOW how many a ride accommodates? Etc.

Or increase staffing to track group sizes and keep an ACCURATE wait time posted at all times. So no one would be looking at the "line length", just at the posted wait time, in making "wait or not" decisions. This seems more realistic, and of course would have to be done in conjunction with queue/building changes.

I have not seen the new Dumbo yet, it opened just after our last trip, but it sounds like this is along the lines of what Disney is doing? Make your decision based on wait times, there is no actual "line" to guess by.

*** I will add that because Disney is NOT set up this way now....groups should enter the line together and wait the entire line together. Only possible excuse I see would be a very small child with parent needing to leave the line for bathroom/diaper change, then rejoining. Already IN the line when the "emergency" happens. Or a baby that just starts crying their head off, I can see that too. NO reason for anyone not already IN the line to be moving ahead.

 

[Mkrop]

life is too short to worry about a few people cutting in line..whats 30 more seconds to wait..when you have already been in line for an hour anyway.. A large group no..but a couple is ok,,dont sweat it ,, i did it once or twice..by wife and one child went ahead of me to soarin..i took other child to bathroom..i just wanted to get with them..and I thought me and my child were going to be be-headed over this,, I was like are you serious? whats the difference if i go in with them or 5 minutes later..its still my spot in line..chill!!

And I would think why couldnt your wife and second child wait for you and the child you took to the bathroom and then you enter the que together. If you want to ride together then wait to enter together. Why dont you chill, and wait for the whole family to enter. It is not your spot in line, it was your wife and other child's spot. I dont need you pushing past saying excuse me. This isnt about an emergency that occurred once in the line, this is about some parts of your group not being willing to wait for everyone to enter the line. They should chill out, grab a bench outside the bathroom and then you can all enter together. Pretty simple concept. And what makes it different for you to do this with your son, vs the teens who have one person hold the place in line and now 10 of them show up.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

And I would think why couldnt your wife and second child wait for you and the child you took to the bathroom and then you enter the que together. If you want to ride together then wait to enter together. Why dont you chill, and wait for the whole family to enter. It is not your spot in line, it was your wife and other child's spot. I dont need you pushing past saying excuse me. This isnt about an emergency that occurred once in the line, this is about some parts of your group not being willing to wait for everyone to enter the line. They should chill out, grab a bench outside the bathroom and then you can all enter together. Pretty simple concept. And what makes it different for you to do this with your son, vs the teens who have one person hold the place in line and now 10 of them show up.

I can't believe how upset people get over this? I'm not even meaning you personally but is it really THAT much of a big deal? I never realized people cared this much about what other people are doing. I'm not saying 50 people should be able to jump in front of you BUT 1 or 2 people? It's not even holding you up, except for perhaps 60 seconds or less!

 

[sandym718]

I can't believe how upset people get over this? I'm not even meaning you personally but is it really THAT much of a big deal? I never realized people cared this much about what other people are doing. I'm not saying 50 people should be able to jump in front of you BUT 1 or 2 people? It's not even holding you up, except for perhaps 60 seconds or less!

I'm not the poster you quoted, but to me the response is this...it's NOT a big deal if 1 or 2 people do it. Problem is, who gets to decide who those 1 or 2 people are that are allowed to do it, say, in a 20 minute time period on an individual ride? If it's OK for some, then it's OK for all, and the whole line "procedure" falls apart.