The Duggar Family

[DawnM]

Every time a Duggar thread is started it goes this direction. I don't know why I jumped into this conversation.....

QUOTE=Evi;37669814] I can see this going nowhere very fast...[/QUOTE]

 

[Nayan]

For the record I don't think it is a message from God, or Allah, or Buddha, or whomever. I think the message is from her own body telling her that it may be time to wrap up the childbearing. The fact that she is not new to preclampsia is an even bigger warning sign. I'm not sure what kind of mother she will be on dialysis, and I know she can't be a mother if she dies. ...and with a medically fragile baby, and maybe more if she continues to carry them, she will have even less time for the many she already has.

Yes, the children are all taken care of physically, and no one relies on government assistance, but are the emotional needs of these children being satisfied? I can't imagine that one gets a lot of attention and nurturing with 18 other siblings to compete with. ...and, yes, they all seem happy and content, but is that because they just don't know anything different? Are these kids going to grow up and go out into the world and realize that they have missed out on a large chunk of their childhood? What will happen to them if and when they do?

...and on the subject of going out into the world.... I will ask again. Are these children getting higher education? Are they going to college? Are they even encouraged to? Are the girls being taught skills or given an education that will prepare them to do anything other than run a household?

I don't think anyone suggested that the mother sits on her butt and eats bon-bons while the children slave away, but from what I have seen, I, I personally, think that the older children are expected to carry too much of the responsibility for raising the younger ones.

Shoot, even Brangelina question having or adopting more children because they don't want to have a larger family than they can provide for emotionally, and they would never have to worry about being distracted by anything. They are rich enough that they would never have to work again or lift a finger to do any type of household chore! They could, literally, spend 24/7 with their children.

This . And to those who say others should 'mind their own business' about the Duggars, they are the ones who agreed to open their lives and prance their kids on television. If you put it out there people will criticize.

 

[DisneyAndRedSox]

But they don't really spend that kind of time with them. Mostly, the little ones are taken care of by the older ones. Mom may be the homeschool director, but she is NOT indivdually instructing all of them. She has said that the older ones often teach the younger ones. Just running a household that big takes up a tremendous amount of time and energy, easily as much as a 9-5. Those kids are not getting constant Mommy and Daddy time, but are being left with what amounts to childcare. It just happens to be thier older siblings doing it.

I have 1 DD6 and we get plenty of quality time, even though I work full time and she has 3 days a week of dance because I go out of my way to make sure it happens. You don't have to be with your child all day every day to be an active and involved parent, and I believe it benefits her to get out an experience some of the world outside of our home far more than it would to be shut up away from the world the way the Duggar children are.

Funny you mention this. I was watching the episode on at 8:30 last night and it was one of the boy's birthday. Michelle took him to the hospital gift shop to buy a present and then took him to lunch at the cafeteria. She commented on how they got to talk to eachother - one on one time since it was his birthday. I can't imagine not having one on one time with my child everyday!

 

[Disney Ella]

They work as a team...the older ones are NOT slaves, they joyfully give of themselves and their time to the family to help it run smooth! I don't see the older girls begrudging their time spent helping their siblings/parents. They have such helping attitudes and many hands make light work. Michelle is a wonderful mother to ALL her children, she is blessed to have a family that is so close knit and who really enjoy being a team unit and helping one another. She does not go off and eat bon bons by herself leaving the raising of her kids all to the oldest. I only see team work and everyone chipping in as much as they can (according to age/ability) to help the whole family unit! I only wish I could get my 2 kid/family unit to work as efficiently, LOL!

The "joyful" part is a requirement. In Gothard circles, acting unhappy is considered an insult to God and means you aren't thankful for your life. Putting on a happy face is what you are expected to do, whether you are actually happy or not. If you've seen any of the more recent episodes, some of the girls are slipping a little on that happy face, particularly Jinger, with her eye rolls, and poor Jana seems so miserable trapped taking care of her mother's children when she should be enjoying life as a young adult.

I don't see everyone chipping in. The girls cook, do the laundry, take care of the children, homeschool the younger children and care for younger brothers and sisters. That is not chipping in, that is taking on the entire burden of caring for the family. They never have the opportunity to spend time alone or develop their own interests or think about a life that doesn't involve church work or having multiple children with a man they barely know who is chosen for them by their parents. Not a life I would chose for my children, but then I would rather let them choose their own path and allow them time to be children before they have to be adults.

 

[Virgderon]

I'm telling you, one of these kids is going to rebel. If you have 19 kids, surely one of them is going to decide this lifestyle is not for them. Like one of the girls is going to want to wear jeans and go see the Twilight movies ( horrors!) . Let's see how the Duggars handle that.

I don't watch the show. I've seen it once, and I saw the "Say Yes to the Dress" episode where Mr. Duggar was controlling the neckline of Mrs. Duggars dress. It was already modest, and he wanted them to cover her up more. That was enough for me. I don't like a controlling man.

Nothing to do with religion, Mr. Duggar just gives me the creeps. Sorry.

 

[DaisiLou]

First, I really feel like, live and let live...

If it works for them, then great.

However, with that said, it isn't a lifestyle I'd choose for myself. I have two DD's that are 11 years apart, and I work full time. Sometimes I find it a struggle to spend quality alone time with both of them because of the age difference. I do it, but it takes effort. I can't imagine having 19 kids, of all different ages, and still being able to be with them one on one.

As far as the quiverful thing...yeah, well, I feel like God gave us the option to use birth control. And I've seen first hand how if God doesn't think you're done having kids, you won't be. A lady in my church had 4 girls, got her tubes tied, cut, burnt, etc... One night she woke up from a dream that she was going to have a son. She laughed it off...

Guess who has a little boy now too? The doctors called her a freak of nature, saying it was virtually impossible.

My point is, that God's plans happen, at least in my opinion, regardless of what you do.

 

[Nayan]

As to the poster who asked about higher education for the girls, no. Women are taught to be breeders and homemakers, men earn the living. Harsh way to put it but in reality that's the way Quiverfull works.

 

[leebee]

The "joyful" part is a requirement. In Gothard circles, acting unhappy is considered an insult to God and means you aren't thankful for your life. Putting on a happy face is what you are expected to do, whether you are actually happy or not. If you've seen any of the more recent episodes, some of the girls are slipping a little on that happy face, particularly Jinger, with her eye rolls, and poor Jana seems so miserable trapped taking care of her mother's children when she should be enjoying life as a young adult.

I don't see everyone chipping in. The girls cook, do the laundry, take care of the children, homeschool the younger children and care for younger brothers and sisters. That is not chipping in, that is taking on the entire burden of caring for the family. They never have the opportunity to spend time alone or develop their own interests or think about a life that doesn't involve church work or having multiple children with a man they barely know who is chosen for them by their parents. Not a life I would chose for my children, but then I would rather let them choose their own path and allow them time to be children before they have to be adults.

I think they are following a religious life, dictated by the doctrine of their religion. Two years of serving in Congress means that we, the taxpayers, are paying for the health insurance for Jim Bob and all his MANY dependents, and will be for quite a while. Between copays, premiums, and oop, our health insurance costs us $9000 a year before benefits kick in, and that's for a family of 3, NOT 21! I have a hard time buying the "as long as taxpayers aren't supporting them" line! (FWIW, I feel this way about all the health/pension bennies of having served in Congress).

I've read the quiverfull information and strongly disagree with their beliefs and lifestyle. I want more for myself and my child than to follow ANYTHING blindly. If you want to believe in a deity and have faith, your choice. However, I DON"T think these folks are role models for American values, at least not for all Americans!

 

[RainbowBrite]

Maybe I can offer a different point of view.

I had just turned 9 years old when my mother had my little sister. My father was putting our family through a really rough time and had just had a baby with another woman four months before my sister was born. For a long time my mother wasn't "there". She would go out to the store and be gone for hours. Suddenly I had to grow up really fast. My mother wasn't on drugs or alcohol, but she did have a nervous breakdown.

I was one of those kids with a wild imagination. I'd play in my room with my dolls for hours on end, dressing them and pretending we were going to parties. I had three dolls I took everywhere with me - Gabby, Penny and Cynthia. When my sister came along all of that had to stop. I just didn't have time to be a kid anymore. After school my mother would meet me at the door and hand my sister off to me because she had to run errands, then would be gone until dinnertime. She would just wander the neighborhood for hours talking to old friends and avoiding being at home. I stepped up to the plate. I had to. She always made sure we had food on the table, we always had clean clothes. But I was like my sister's mother. I changed the diapers, gave her the bottles, played with her, gave her baths.

Did I ever resent my sister? No, but I resented having to grow up so fast. I probably would've been one of those kids who played with Barbie dolls until they were 13. Instead I became a mother. From that point on, even though my mother got "better" I continued to take care of my sister because it was what I was used to. She's almost 18 years old now and she's much closer to me than she is our mother. They have a good relationship but it will never be like ours is. So yes, there are some advantages to those older Duggar girls raising the youngest ones (and they ARE raising them, I have seen the show) but look at the price they have to pay.

 

[DMRick]

Although the kids appear to be very happy now, I think all of this going to places, is going to come back to bite them (and this thread is the first time I ever heard that they pay their own way, even if taped..that I have a hard time believing, and I wish someone would ask that in an interview or show me where that info came from), when the girls start seeing what 'outside' life could be like as they take more and more trips (like the Dollywood trip).

I will never understand this family being on TV and the kids having to be 'on' all the time. As I've said in the past, I know some pretty religious people who go out as a family to be missionaries and spend time in the inner city sharing their religion, but they would never put their children in the spotlight like this family has (and most all of their children have gone onto college). I just hope the kids are getting to share some of the wealth and they aren't brain washed into believing it should all go in the pot (did Josh buy his house, or was that the small house his parents owned? I can't remember). I do think the kids are great kids, but then they are under such control, I wonder what will happen to some of them when they slip away, if they are ever allowed to.
While we see them praying and they share a few Bible quotes, and we hear them telling us that they will have as many children as God allows, I really don't see them sharing how to get heaven, or how to give your life up to Christ, so I don't see this as a show where they are leading people to Jesus. I see it as a show where two parents are taking in some real money, and their kids are working, not being taped playing. Just like other shows with kids.
I wonder if they have permits and adhere to the governments rules on how many hours they can work...or are they in a state that doesn't have rules?

The girls cook, do the laundry, take care of the children, homeschool the younger children and care for younger brothers and sisters. That is not chipping in, that is taking on the entire burden of caring for the family. They never have the opportunity to spend time alone or develop their own interests or think about a life that doesn't involve church work or having multiple children with a man they barely know who is chosen for them by their parents. Not a life I would chose for my children, but then I would rather let them choose their own path and allow them time to be children before they have to be adults.

 

[bettymae1121]

I think they are following a religious life, dictated by the doctrine of their religion. Two years of serving in Congress means that we, the taxpayers, are paying for the health insurance for Jim Bob and all his MANY dependents, and will be for quite a while. Between copays, premiums, and oop, our health insurance costs us $9000 a year before benefits kick in, and that's for a family of 3, NOT 21! I have a hard time buying the "as long as taxpayers aren't supporting them" line! (FWIW, I feel this way about all the health/pension bennies of having served in Congress).

I've read the quiverfull information and strongly disagree with their beliefs and lifestyle. I want more for myself and my child than to follow ANYTHING blindly. If you want to believe in a deity and have faith, your choice. However, I DON"T think these folks are role models for American values, at least not for all Americans!

Not only that but with 19 dependant deductions on the ol' 1040, you have to wonder if they pay anything in income taxes, especially since he's also declared themselves a church.

They may not be getting a government assistance check, but I doubt they pay much, if anything, into the system either.

 

[mnrose]

Not only that but with 19 dependant deductions on the ol' 1040, you have to wonder if they pay anything in income taxes, especially since he's also declared themselves a church.

They may not be getting a government assistance check, but I doubt they pay much, if anything, into the system either.

Yet, they are getting the same benefits we all get as Americans...good roads to drive on, defense of our country through our military, etc. If you aren't paying into that system (and I'm more than willing to bet that their tax bill is virtually zero), then you ARE taking money from me. I'm paying in. And, I (along with all other actual taxpayers) am paying their share...which is larger than the norm since there are so many of them. This notion they aren't "taking" from the government is pure crapola.

 

[csharpwv]

It sounds like you might be in favor of a flat or 'per head' required tax payment - is that the case?

When you look at the tax structure in America - it punishes those who pay their bills on time, those who work for a living, and those who save and invest.

I'm not a 'socialist' but America cannot - and I repeat CANNOT - continue to have a socialist leaning government - and a capitalist economy. The two cannot co-exist and allow the country to continue to function.

I'm all for social safety nets- but I am totally anti social life support. America - and all Americans need to wake up and realize that you can't get "somthin' for nuthin' "

If you make money - you pay taxes - no ifs and or buts about it! That's the only fair way to do have a 'fair' tax system.

Whether the Duggars are a church or not - I don't know - however, I'm sure there are tax and law loopholes that would allow it.

I call BULL on 'family' or 'house' churches. Every family is already a church - that is the domestic church. What it teaches is it's own business - however - if they have files a non-profit and achieved non-profit status - that's a serious problem.

I would be interested to see if the Duggars operate their business affairs as the bible would have them do so.

A little all over the place in this post - but it's so interesting as a sociological topic - that has become so political in this thread!

 

[leahjade]

I don't see how it's anyone's business how many kids they have. I've seen so many hate pages and nasty webpages for this family. They support their own - it would be different it they were living off taxpayer support like so many others in this country.

 

[tina95]

I think they are following a religious life, dictated by the doctrine of their religion. Two years of serving in Congress means that we, the taxpayers, are paying for the health insurance for Jim Bob and all his MANY dependents, and will be for quite a while. Between copays, premiums, and oop, our health insurance costs us $9000 a year before benefits kick in, and that's for a family of 3, NOT 21! I have a hard time buying the "as long as taxpayers aren't supporting them" line! (FWIW, I feel this way about all the health/pension bennies of having served in Congress).

I've read the quiverfull information and strongly disagree with their beliefs and lifestyle. I want more for myself and my child than to follow ANYTHING blindly. If you want to believe in a deity and have faith, your choice. However, I DON"T think these folks are role models for American values, at least not for all Americans!

He was a State Rep. not United States, do they receive free health for Life?

 

[tina95]

Not only that but with 19 dependant deductions on the ol' 1040, you have to wonder if they pay anything in income taxes, especially since he's also declared themselves a church.

They may not be getting a government assistance check, but I doubt they pay much, if anything, into the system either.

Most, around half of American families do not pay any income tax. A lot of them are taking money.

 

[tina95]

Not only that but with 19 dependant deductions on the ol' 1040, you have to wonder if they pay anything in income taxes, especially since he's also declared themselves a church.

They may not be getting a government assistance check, but I doubt they pay much, if anything, into the system either.

Most, around half of American families do not pay any income tax. A lot of them are taking money.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

I know a lot of big families, and have for years. I haven't seen a greater number than average of kids having having problems or issues with their childhood. truth be told, I'd say far fewer than average. Whatever works. Families are different, and most have some good and some bad.

As far as taxes, half of the people in the us don't pay them. This is no different. The benefits end at 17 for everyone, best I understand.

 

[Nayan]

I don't see how it's anyone's business how many kids they have. I've seen so many hate pages and nasty webpages for this family. They support their own - it would be different it they were living off taxpayer support like so many others in this country.

Like I said before, they chose to put their family and life on national television and by doing so open themselves to comments, both good and bad. They do get healthcare for life and he also will get a nice pension when he's eligible. So yes they are, in a sense, living off the public dole and we pay for all those kids.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

Like I said before, they chose to put their family and life on national television and by doing so open themselves to comments, both good and bad. They do get healthcare for life and he also will get a nice pension when he's eligible. So yes they are, in a sense, living off the public dole and we pay for all those kids.

Only if you live in that state, right? It is the roulette game of represtatives.Some probably have none. I guess it all comes out in the end.