Screaming children will not be tolerated!

[kaytieeldr]

And I don't believe anywhere in my post, I said, "Hey, let's argue!" But for them to not know what their kid likes to eat, they would have to have him in daycare 7 days a week. And yea, by bringing daycare into it, you did "infer" that only daycare kids scream in restaurants. But that's ok, you believe that, and I'll continue going to restaurants with my child who knows how to behave in a restaurant despite being in daycare since she was 6 months old.

Not at all. Again, auntie was simply relating a specific family dynamic of which she is aware. Nowhere did she say or imply that ALL families with children in day care are identical to this one family, or similar to other (not all) families who put their children in this one day care center all the hours the center is operating.

And, notably, no speaker/writer can 'infer' anything.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. Grocery stores would never evict a crying child, not everyone can just get a sitter. So, yes, you will have to suffer if a child starts crying and you don't want to leave.

Interesting response. Grocery shopping isn't an emergency; rarely does the need to have food in the house come as a surprise to the person reponsible for obtaining it. To say not everyone can 'just get a sitter' is a bit disingenuous. Sometimes people have to preplan for things. Arranging for someone to care for one's child/ren while one grocery shops may well be one of those things. Can't get a sitter? Run into the nearest cnnvenience store for the few things you truly can't do without.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Funny, because when they showed this on the local news this morning, it was spun as a totally restaurant vs parent of an autistic child story. The parent of the autistic child said the sign was put up to single them out, and violates the American with Disabilities Act.

I do not have any autistic children, but I would think that like any child, if they got to the point where they were not behaving appropriately for a restaurant, they should be removed until they can behave appropriately.

Doesn't ADA require only REASONABLE accomodations.

A few peeps from an autistic child would be reasonable to tolerate in a family restaurant. If we are talking disruptive behavior that prevents other diners to reasonably enjoy their meal---ADA would not apply. Even ADA has it's limits. I'm not sure how "reasonable" is defined though.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Plus, Lisa - if the sign said "[insert name of specific child patron here] will not be tolerated" or "Patrons with autism will not be tolerated", it'd be a different story. Screaming children? As someone pointed out earlier - NOT a protected class.

 

[sunnyday123]

Not at all. Again, auntie was simply relating a specific family dynamic of which she is aware. Nowhere did she say or imply that ALL families with children in day care are identical to this one family, or similar to other (not all) families who put their children in this one day care center all the hours the center is operating.

And, notably, no speaker/writer can 'infer' anything.

Then why did she bring up daycare? If not to insinuate that screaming children were a product of inferior parents who leave them in daycare all day long, what exactly did it have to do with anything on this thread??

And if you see my post, my "infer" was written "infer". I guess I can't write in sarcasm very well.

 

[Wishing on a star]

Secondly, if you look at statistics from the 50's through the 70's, you'll notice many more children were dx'd as Mentally Retarded. Back then, there were no non-verbal IQ tests. So a non-verbal (ie, frequently autistic) child would test very poorly, and be presumed to be retarded.

Now, with more diagnostic clarity, you see more children dx'd with autism, and less frequently with purely cognitive delays.

I just wanted to say WOW!!!
Somebody who is well informed and who 'gets it'!!!



Unfortunately, the latest versions of the testing today have just taken a step backwards, and non-verbal disability is, again, harder to see and diagnose. It really takes a specialists who knows how to read all the sub-tests....

My son is by NO means 'retarded'.
He does have some non-verbal learning disabilities. (NO behavioral issues AT ALL)
I once took him to a clinic to participate in one of their research trials.... This is a clinic that supposedly specialized in these types of disabilities. And after less than an hour they brought him back out after some basic preliminaries, and we were told that our son did not qualify, because he did not seem to have a non-verbal disability and that it looked more like across the board cognitive delay (mental retardation)

At that point I was like , and, ....

Now that I can look back, I am more like thinking about how this could have ever happened with so called 'specialist'.

How these kids with these disabilities were tragicly and often violently MIS-handled, just a few years ago... it's horrifying.

 

[PixieDust32]

I think it's sad that a restaurant even needs to put up a sign stating what should be common sense. Nothing worse than sitting next to a screaming kid in a restaurant.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But how many of these incidents are actually happening? Where are you people eating that a sign like this is actually necessary?

Sometimes getting involved in a Dis thread is like stepping into a parallel world. I don't see screaming, out-of-control 'snowflake' children at restaurants or grocery stores often; I read about them here a lot though.

I'm home two weeks now from a week at WDW. During six table service meals, I do NOT recall a single incident where a child was screaming and needed to be brought outside.

You know---I hardly ever experience it either. But it does happen. I had to remove my 3yo from Yachtman's back in March. I don't recall the specific issue. But it was an issue that elevated to being a disturbance and I took him out. However---he typically is a well behaved 3yo who does well in restaurants. So that moment for us was an anomaly. In that experience, the 4 or 5 tables would have known---but the rest of the restauarant would not have had a clue that he was a disturbance let alone know the reason I took him out.

Now---you spent 1 week at Disney. A place where you had he opportunity to eat sit down for 21 meals, but did so for only 6 meals. Given all the restaurants....and the seating times and the layouts of the establishments...

It isn't unfathomable that at some point during your stay---heck during each meal, that some child somewhere might have ended up with a meltdown. It might have even happened while you were dining...but due to the restaurant layout, it just didn't even come onto your radar. That doesn't mean it didn't happen at all.

I could get all mathematical on that---but that is vetting way too involves in this topic.

Like you---I haven't really encountered issues ...but if I have, usually the parent handles it properly.

 

[LilyWDW]

Then why did she bring up daycare? If not to insinuate that screaming children were a product of inferior parents who leave them in daycare all day long, what exactly did it have to do with anything on this thread??

And if you see my post, my "infer" was written "infer". I guess I can't write in sarcasm very well.

No... she brought up daycare because she was relating a personal experience. It just happened that said experience was what it was... a family that paid no attention to their child in general. The reason she knew of this situation? Through a daycare.

It would be like me saying I worked someplace where we sold furniture and I had an experience where someone who bought a sofa ended up being a horrible parent... and then someone ELSE jumped to the conclusion that I meant all parents that bought sofa's were horrible parents. Jumping to conclusions is not a good thing to do...

 

[softballmom3]

Same here. As a parent, we had well behaved children when they were younger (we're in those dreaded teenage years now LOL). I would not have hesitated to take them out of a restaurant because I wouldn't want to disturb others unnecessarily. That being said, there are times when my DH and I go out that I definitely don't want to hear a bunch of kids screaming/crying w/ parents just ignoring. It's a fact of life kids will not always behave correctly....parenting skills that are good and positive should help take care of that.

 

[LuluLovesDisney]

Then why did she bring up daycare? If not to insinuate that screaming children were a product of inferior parents who leave them in daycare all day long, what exactly did it have to do with anything on this thread??

And if you see my post, my "infer" was written "infer". I guess I can't write in sarcasm very well.

Not adding to either side's argument, just wanted to point out that the other poster said no writer can 'infer' anything because inferring is something a reader does. In your post, where you said "infer" you meant "imply". A writer/poster implies something, not infers it. Just a vocabulary thing, has nothing to do with the issue at hand. HTH.

 

[sunnyday123]

No... she brought up daycare because she was relating a personal experience. It just happened that said experience was what it was... a family that paid no attention to their child in general. The reason she knew of this situation? Through a daycare.

It would be like me saying I worked someplace where we sold furniture and I had an experience where someone who bought a sofa ended up being a horrible parent... and then someone ELSE jumped to the conclusion that I meant all parents that bought sofa's were horrible parents. Jumping to conclusions is not a good thing to do...

Right. And bringing a sofa into the discussion would make just about as much sense as the daycare issue. Neither have nothing to do with the discussion.

 

[Noah]

I think the restaurant is being polite by placing such a sign. Instead of the employees reprimanding the kids without permission, it is better that they post such a sign first to indicate such behaviors are not tolerated and will be dealt with. If an employee reprimands a child without permission from the parents, it can be rude.

It is also more polite this way for fellow customers who need to relax and enjoy their food.

 

[kaytieeldr]

.

 

[Disneyadore]

And I don't believe anywhere in my post, I said, "Hey, let's argue!" But for them to not know what their kid likes to eat, they would have to have him in daycare 7 days a week. And yea, by bringing daycare into it, you did "infer" that only daycare kids scream in restaurants. But that's ok, you believe that, and I'll continue going to restaurants with my child who knows how to behave in a restaurant despite being in daycare since she was 6 months old.

Coming from ages ago I certainly can tell you that in these days long ago when ALL moms stayed at home there were also lots and lots of special snowflakes that were spoiled rotten.
Granted you didn't see them so much as now because people stayed at home much more but yes sir those snowflakes excised then also. You could meet them at the play ground,class rooms, field trips and any public meeting for children,so nothing new.

 

[DisneyWitch]

Wow . I just spent 2 hours reading all 19 pages of this thread. I tend to do that if I want to respond intelligently and respect everyone who posted before me.

For all the parents in this thread who agree with the restaurant’s policy, I have only one thing to say:

Where the heck do you guys live, because I really want to share a restaurant with you & your family!​

I agree with the restaurant owners. It’s a shame that some people need to be reminded of acceptable public behavior. It should be about common sense and courtesy, but those two things are in very short supply nowadays. The sign is ok too – much better than “Take your screaming progeny out of our restaurant until they learn how to behave!”. After all, you don’t need a sign stating that stealing, fighting, or carnal actions are not permitted – behaving oneself in a restaurant should be a given. If I had to watch a couple playing tonsil hockey while I was trying to have dinner, I'd be just as miffed.

Look, if a child/minor harms me physically or damages my property, the parents are legally responsible for damages. How is making my eardrums bleed or keeping me from an experience I’ve paid for any different? (and to a previous post – chocolate milk on my silk dress = a discussion about restitution or a call to my lawyer)

I’m (pleasantly) surprised to see so many parents who feel so strongly about ensuring that their children behave in public. I don’t have children, but I am not a grouchy child hater either (not all of us non-parents hate kids). There is a certain level of common courtesy that should be adhered to. My home is quiet (just me and the SO), and I do not “tune the noise out” when I’m in a restaurant, nor should I have to – I’m not at an amusement park, I’m trying to eat a dinner I have paid for. If I’m not negatively affecting other diners, then I would only expect that same courtesy to be extended to me. If I was acting a fool in public, I’d hope someone would toss me out on my backside for such abysmal behavior.

When I go out to eat, I seem to be right next to the parents who believe ignoring their misbehaving kids will make the problem disappear. I understand that kids have their moments and not every day is full of pixie dust and sparkles. I will even put up with a short meltdown while a parent attempts to triage a tantrum. But once that doesn’t work, I expect the parent to take responsibility for how their child affects others and remove the little one from the situation. Yes, I’ve had to leave restaurants mid-meal due to parents who apparently were never taught how to behave in public (therefore cannot teach their own kids). It’s not fair to anyone else, adult or kid.

Please know that I don’t necessarily blame the kids – they are only doing what is tolerated by their parents. I do, however, blame the parents for allowing their child to control the situation. The parent should know their children’s thresholds, and whether or not they are capable of being in a public setting. Wonder if these parents consider how their misbehaving kids are affecting the attitudes of the kids who ARE behaving well? I mean, “Hey Mom…that kid gets to act like a dork in public, why can’t I?” and potentially undoing all the good work the parents have done.

I love eating with families and if there’s a particularly great kid around and the opportunity presents itself, I will tell the parent that they have a very well behaved family and that it is appreciated. Well behaved kids don’t usually come like that out of the box, and it takes time and patience by the parents to develop good habits – parents should be recognized for teaching their kids the correct way to interact with people in public.

PS – I also believe that adults who act like butt-ferrets in public should be removed as well. If you’re in public, especially at a family establishment, don’t act as if you’re at a strip club stag party! As an adult, if I want to hear the F bomb every 2 seconds, I’ll just turn on cable.

Thanks for listening.

 

[Mickey'snewestfan]

Coming from ages ago I certainly can tell you that in these days long ago when ALL moms stayed at home there were also lots and lots of special snowflakes that were spoiled rotten.
Granted you didn't see them so much as now because people stayed at home much more but yes sir those snowflakes excised then also. You could meet them at the play ground,class rooms, field trips and any public meeting for children,so nothing new.

When exactly what this mythical time in history?

 

[Disneyadore]

When exactly what this mythical time in history?

In the dark ages long before Internet started a virus called snowflakiness.

 

[ntsammy5]

Neither have nothing to do with the discussion.

Double negative! Exactly what did you mean?

 

[bgirldeb]

Double negative! Exactly what did you mean?

Just what are you 'infering' here ?