*Rumor* Extra Magic Hours going away

[GusGus77]

We love MK EMH nights and that is a big draw to staying onsite. I would be very sad if they went away.

 

[AquaDame]

We only ever use the mornings and then hop... but I sure would miss the mornings! I'm not sure how many are early risers like us, but it is always more quiet than the evening hours...

 

[doconeill]

Yea but they will lower the price for the onsite rooms, then charge more for EMH.

Len Testa got an official confirmation from disney that the parks will EMH in 2016 but no schedule has been put out yet.

As I expected, nothing to see here...move along...

 

[HopperFan]

Yea but they will lower the price for the onsite rooms, then charge more for EMH.

That way those that don't use EMH but stay onsite-are not being charged for something they don't use. Similar to an airline not charging a buisiness client a bag fee when he only has a brief case.



Actually I do think it should work that way-we just all know they will not lower the price to begin with.

What?

"Off-property guest could not purchase this ticket."

The first point seems to lament that off-site guests can't stay "the whole day" which suggests to me that a new E-Nights set up should include those guests. Could be reading it wrong but that's how it came off to me.

If they run it like other hard ticket events, I see no reason for them to restrict access though. Why bother? When people are waiting in three hours of traffic to stand in an hour long line to meet one villain at HS, why would they ever consider restricting a new E-Nights?

My original comment was directed at Mr.Scupper (who is a CM) who was making reference to going back to the old way which was just for onsite guests. The second poster I addressed and you are quoting from did not seem aware of what E-Nights were, and they weren't for offsite.

Yes, a whole new program could evolve but I was talking about the old E-Night that was referenced in round-a-bout.

Len Testa got an official confirmation from disney that the parks will EMH in 2016 but no schedule has been put out yet.

I think many of us are not surprised by this and tried to say at the start that a rumor started by one person (that maybe gets too much credit) does not make for fact nor even a good rumor. I did find all the followup conversation (and I plead guilty) very interesting to find what some people see as a perk for the prices they pay and how it may or may not impact their decisions to stay onsite should it go away. What was funny is the more we talked about how it impacted our stays I think the more it got a life of it's own and somewhere it became "fact."

Gossip can be so much fun to watch evolve.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

What?

Yea I think you can decipher I was kidding they would actually drop the price on onsite rooms, so those not interested in EMH are not paying for it (which they are for sure now-it's not free), and "then" charging for EMH those that actually want it.

Gossip can be so much fun to watch evolve.

Actually-I think EMH could use an overhaul. I like the discussion...I mean gossip.

Maybe 2 hours before AM, and 4 hours PM for example.

Also think FP+ during those EMH's should be scheduled above and beyond the current 3. Maybe 3 more and 60 days out deluxe, 45 mod and 30 for value. Or 4 FP+ for deluxe, 3 mod and 2 value.

 

[dinolounger]

Good for you, I'm glad they make you laugh.

I think Iger has been wonderful for everything else but Walt Disney World. Sure the parks are crowded, things are expensive, and life is all great at WDW. Short term things are fantastic.

But when you pull the curtain back and look at 3 of the parks, things aren't all that great. Prices continue to rise at the same time they lessen the customer experience. It's not as magical as it used to be.

Don't for a second think that Walt was pure imagination and wasn't after making money either though, he wanted to make as much as he could. The difference is, there was a balance between making money and imagination.

For years Disney was the company to look to for Customer Service. For years other companies sent their employees to Disney to learn the culture.

IMO, that perception has changed, its no longer a company that's about imagination, its a company about the bottom dollar.

They no longer care about how much fun their guests are having, they care about trying to get ever last penny out of them.

Thank you, these are some the truest words I have ever seen posted on this site. And ones that are not alone, even outside this forum.

And now a short related parable: I was at a business networking function earlier this week. During conversation, ESPN somehow came up (someone was interested in job opportunities there). An ex-staffer of ESPN happened to be in attendance and it was striking -- and almost frightening -- to see his visceral reaction to the mention of his prior employer's name. While I don't have the memory to quote him verbatim, here is the gist of what he said.

"ESPN used to be an open, dynamic organization that was always open to new talent and ideas. But it has now become harder to get into than Fort Knox. And that all has to do with the new bottom line, "we-don't-want-any-disruptive-idea-types-here" Iger quarter to quarter management philosophy. The Disney way now has become all about keeping your head down, your mouth shut and doing what you are told."

 

[scooter7487]

I really hope this isn't true. We got sucked into the DVC thing and every year since they take more and more away and increase the cost. Bothers me that the Magic is gone. The little things keep disappearing. Maybe it is just because my kids are older now but I just don't see the cm's making the extra effort to make someones day. We get to the park early to take advantage of emh, boys used to enjoy the fp game while my wife and I could relax. No it is plan plan plan for what 3 fp+ selections. Disney makes a ton of money and while I understand it is a business it sure likes all they care about anymore is the bottom line.

 

[polineedyan]

When I think about the cost difference between a value, a mod, and a top tier resort, they all basically would "pay" for the same feature, the emh. For someone staying value, that cost is similar to local hotels, with the benefits of being on site. But for deluxe, someone is willing to shell out 400 dollars a night for a room? their number one benefit of onsite is not emh, Im here to tell you. We stay value, we love emh. Sometimes we use it, sometimes we dodge it. If I kicked up to a mod or deluxe, I would expect a heck of a lot more than just emh.
Emh isnt going anywhere anytime soon, but something Im noticing is that the company is beginning to deal with their entities separately. They want to know the bottom line on resorts, on parks, etc. Mixing a park perk with a hotel fee messes with the books. There will be a way to get emh, and it will have its own line. The line will go with the parks, not the resorts. Maybe even add it as an optional ticket upgrade for resort stays etc.
A few years back, we used it more because it seemed to have better hours than now.

 

[Magic Fanatic]

Good for you, I'm glad they make you laugh.

Okay, so maybe it was more of a chuckle and not so much laugh out loud, you got me there!

I think Iger has been wonderful for everything else but Walt Disney World. Sure the parks are crowded, things are expensive, and life is all great at WDW. Short term things are fantastic.

Oh come on! From the day Disney first opened its gates, the parks have been expensive! Sure you could get in the park for a nominal fee, but rides required tickets and the good rides required E tickets which sold at a premium. I went for the first time 6 months after it opened and it was expensive for my own parents way back when.

I really don't think anyone here needs a lesson on what profits are and how they work. I don't think people are asking for anything free, I think what we have is a product like WDW that's very expensive. It isn't a product that you pay $5 for, the consumer in this case are literally spending thousands of dollars for the product (a WDW vacation). The earnings report comes out and usually gets posted here on The Dis and people see how much profit is actually made, and how much disney is cutting back on things while increasing prices. The excuse is always "they've got to cover their expenses", they are covering their expenses, and trust me, I don't want Disney losing money because I don't want it going away. But these moves arent made to cover expesnes that are already being covered, they are made to make more and more profit, but at what cost? I'm a little understanding as to why some people get upset with the direction things are going.

Yes WDW is a business, but a good business doesn't always try to bleed their consumer of all of their expendable income.

Overall, there have been cut backs in some areas, yet overall investment is up. Magic Bands, Avitar Land, Fantasy Land, improvements coming to Studio's. Never once have I read any official statement from Disney stating ticket prices go up for the sole purpose of covering expenses. Maybe you do need a refresher on profits and how they work. It is simple economics. Prices will rise until attendance levels out

 

[dinolounger]

Prices will rise until attendance levels out

And/or Disney starts seeing conversion rates erode.

By conversion, I mean the % of first time visitors who don't just return again at some point in the future but become recurring repeat guests (with the ultimate conversion level being DVC purchase).

Unless you and others have missed it, just about every survey Disney sends out (and I gets scads of them) at some point in the questionnaire inevitably asks how many times I've been to WDW. And that question is repeatedly there because someone in Anaheim determined it is an important performance metric (and no, they don't already have that data going back to day one. Nor for those who haven't consistently stayed on property).

The punchline to all this: maybe...just maybe....Disney will start to wake up if it sees conversion rates dropping. That should be telling them that an increasing number of guests are coming out of their introduction to the Disney park/resort experience not being impressed enough to justify becoming an "apostle."

 

[Magic Fanatic]

And/or Disney starts seeing conversion rates erode.

By conversion, I mean the % of first time visitors who don't just return again at some point in the future but become recurring repeat guests (with the ultimate conversion level being DVC purchase).

Unless you and others have missed it, just about every survey Disney sends out (and I gets scads of them) at some point in the questionnaire inevitably asks how many times I've been to WDW. And that question is repeatedly there because someone in Anaheim determined it is an important performance metric (and no, they don't already have that data going back to day one. Nor for those who haven't consistently stayed on property).

The punchline to all this: maybe...just maybe....Disney will start to wake up if it sees conversion rates dropping. That should be telling them that an increasing number of guests are coming out of their introduction to the Disney park/resort experience not being impressed enough to justify becoming an "apostle."

I agree with you there. After 16 visits (staying on property each time) in 17 years, my personal conversion rate is close to its peak. Last months stay cost me nearly $5,000 and that was staying 8 nights in the campground!!! But yet, here I am, wasting my evening on this site thinking of our next trip. Someone pour me some more Koolaid!

 

[peg110]

Last months stay cost me nearly $5,000 and that was staying 8 nights in the campground!!!

We Love the Fort!

 

[larandtra1990]

Typical overreactions without facts. Noone knows anything yet. As an AP holder for a long, long time, I dont sweat this stuff. I watch overreactions to changes WDW makes all the time and then when we go on our numerous long weekend trips or our longer once a year trip I find that my trip hasnt changed at all. I still ride what I want to when I want to using the FP+ system ( in fact it made it more convenient), eat where I want to eat because I plan out reservations well in advance, If we choose to stay on property ( which we only do about 25% of the time) we hardly even use EMHs because when you understand park flow for the time of the year you are going, get to the park at opening, leave when it gets crowded, Use FPs for the second park of the day, and just enjoy the parks. You dont stress it. Trips are supposed to be relaxing. Therefore, preplan, use the tools provided, and adapt. Complaining gets you nowhere because a company is going to do whats in the best interest of the majority or the $. Disney is no different than other companies when it comes to that. People tend to get worked up over nothing or because they dont want to adapt to change.

 

[ChipnDale79]

Oh come on! From the day Disney first opened its gates, the parks have been expensive! Sure you could get in the park for a nominal fee, but rides required tickets and the good rides required E tickets which sold at a premium. I went for the first time 6 months after it opened and it was expensive for my own parents way back when.

Who said it wasnt expensive? I didn't.

You're missing the point of what I've been saying. My point is they are making it more expensive while taking more and more things away. Luckily it sounds like the removal of magic hours isn't happening.

Overall, there have been cut backs in some areas, yet overall investment is up. Magic Bands, Avitar Land, Fantasy Land, improvements coming to Studio's. Never once have I read any official statement from Disney stating ticket prices go up for the sole purpose of covering expenses. Maybe you do need a refresher on profits and how they work. It is simple economics. Prices will rise until attendance levels out

Overall investment is up? Yeah, I think we're finally starting to see some of that. But a couple of quick notes on my opinions of some of the investments.

Magic Bands, the budget was around a billion for that, I've heard rumors that it ended up being much much higher than that. I think its a pretty neat concept, but how many on here would rather have had that billion plus invested in the parks with new attractions and rides? The whole magic bands thing was done in order to streamline business, nothing wrong with that, but me personally, that money could have been put to a lot better use.

Avatar Land, announced in 2011, expecting opening of 2017. 6 years of talk of "look, we're investing in our parks". Its going to be neat, but good lord. I'm one of the few that actually likes this, apparently a lot of people do not like this expansion and is banking on Avatar being as big of a franchises as Star Wars one day. Is it fair to say now that after the first movie has been out of the theaters for 6 years that it's not going to be?

Fantasy Land, what a waste of money. This is where Iger and company just flat out missed the boat, between magic bands and NFL, imagine what could have been done throughout the property if that money had been spent on the other parks. Don't get me wrong, MK is my favorite park without a question, but it needs the least amount of work done to it. All 3 of the other parks need help, if you look at the attendance numbers, MK grew by the largest amount while the other 3 grew a little bit, but not nearly as much. Maybe if they had spent that money on the other parks, the attendance could be spread out throughout all 4 parks and it wouldnt be so crowded at MK.

Something is going to happen at the studios, i agree with you on that. But what? We don't know, from my understanding numerous projects have been started and stopped (some of them because of the over budgeted magic bands) and I've read rumors that budgets have already been cut. Hopefully they bring out the old school disney like they did with DCA and wow us. But dont hold your breath.

I also don't think I said that I've read Disney release official statements that said they are covering expenses with the increase in prices, but I have heard on many message boards that people always use the excuse of "expenses are going up" and that's why ticket prices are going up.

You're comments to me regarding "lessons in profit" are out of line, there is zero reason to be condescending. We have a difference of opinion on the way WDW business is ran, and there is nothing wrong with that. I understand profits and profit margins as I deal with them on a daily basis, my opinion on this topic and WDW is how much of a profit margin is good for long term business and short term business. Expanding your profit margins are almost always good for a short term outlook, but on the flip side of that, its usually bad for the long term.

Right now Iger is pushing it to see how far the public will stand increasing profit margins, at some point his customer base will push back and say "enough is enough". Where is that point? I have no idea.

 

[peg110]

I think that change is just uncomfortable for people. Reality is, is that change is probably good. If Disney (or any other company for that matter) didn't "Change" things, then we would be complacent and then either just keep doing the same thing or stop going because of boredom. Why do you think they keep updating or changing attractions? Do you like the 7DMT? Well, that's another "Change" Some like it some don't. Reality is, is that change can be very good. While I don't think EMH is going away anytime soon, I still won't get upset over it. We just adapt to it and move on. That is, after all, a part of life, isn't it?

Favorite quote from my Military Days. "Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome!"

 

[TheRustyScupper]

So you are hoping or have wind of the return of E-Nights?

1) No insight, just hoping.
2) This becomes fair to everyone.

 

[dinolounger]

Reality is, is that change can be very good."

I suspect pretty much everyone else here doesn't disagree. The issue isn't about change per se, but instead the fact that many of the changes Disney is making at their core have little or nothing to do with improving the guest experience more to do with increasing margins. Yes, from a shareholder perspective, the latter is all that matters and is what good management should be focused on.

But exceptional management focuses on doing both. And therein lies the problem. Disney once had exceptional management, but those days are gone.

 

[peg110]

But exceptional management focuses on doing both. And therein lies the problem. Disney once had exceptional management, but those days are gone.

I cannot argue with this nor would I try. In fact I totally agree that exceptional management focuses on both. I will take it a step further and say that exceptional management LEANS more toward the customer because a "Happy" Customer tends to be a "Repeat" Customer and is likely to spend more money at those places that make them happy.

While the Exceptional management at Disney may be lacking (I personally don't have enough knowledge or information to argue it either way), I will also add that exceptional management ANYWHERE is getting rare to find. Too often we look at the short term instant gratitude (or profit) and don't fully appreciate that often times a bigger investment up front can yield huge returns later on. The problem with shareholders is too many of them don't care about the long term. They want the huge profits now... when it dies off, they dump it and go for the next huge profit.

 

[GoBears 1980]

Sorry I didn't read all 6 pages, but if EMH is "going away", it is to be replaced by a different early morning perk tied to Fast Pass+. I think they well know by now the importance of early admission perks to putting people in hotels.

 

[GoBears 1980]

But exceptional management focuses on doing both. And therein lies the problem. Disney once had exceptional management, but those days are gone.

Exceptional management died in 1994 in a helicopter crash.

The exceptional part of Walt was that he had vision, worked with Imagineering, but listened to Roy as well on practical matters. That vision continued on until 1994. Post 1994 it was just about the money.