re: orlando magic email rant

[aaronmckie]

I just wanted to make sure that it was out there.

 

[DVCsince02]

I just wanted to make sure that it was out there.

Oh, the years of Jennifers and Jasons.

 

[columnwest]

I know I'll probably reget this, but Pete's rant on this email kept me up all night. My posting here is not meant in any way to pass judgement on either Pete or the original emailer. But, I have to say that as Pete was reading the email, I really didn't hear it as homophobic at all. So, I thought I'd just respond to what I heard in that email. Everyone's free to have their opinion, right? So this is mine.

First off, I'm a 35 year-old gay man, recently married to my partner of 4 years. I've seen and felt my share of homophobia in my lifetime. I've had food thrown at me while I was walking down the street, and been called the F-word by idiots in passing pickup trucks in two cities. I was beaten up in high school a few times, and recently lost the legal right to marry my partner in my home state (we had to go to Canada to tie the knot).

So, bringing all that to bear, do I think the email was short-sighted? Poorly-worded? Trading in stereotypes? Yes. But homophobic? Sorry, no.

Re-listening to it, there are only three statements in the entire email that can even *begin* to be construed as "homophobic":

a) "You guys have to realize you are not the target audience for a sports team."

My reading of this is: "The members of the panel are not big sports fans." Since sports scores and stats are rarely mentioned on the show, I think the avereage listener could come away with this impression, even if it's not true in reality. But, if your understanding of this is "gay people are not big sports fans", yes that's a stereotype, but I have to tell you that in my personal experience it's been largely true. I lived in Seattle for 7 years; I had nearly 100 gay friends in my extended social network there, and I could count the number that knew anything about the Mariners (even that our baseball team was called the Mariners) on one hand, and even fewer for the Sonics. Even if you take the statement above to apply to gay people in general, I personally, can't take it as anything more than a reality-based generalization.

b) "You guys would've been all over this if it had been built for ballets, no disrespect intended."

Again, I didn't hear homophibia here. I just heard a sarchastic justaposition of two extremes. Like, if I said "I hate camping." and the other person replies "Well, I guess you'd prefer room service at the Four Seasons!" Or, "I don't like the ballet." "Of course, you'd rather watch some dumb summer action flick!" It's just going to the opposite extreme for comic effect. I read that as snarky, not homophobic.

c) "You guys got me a little fired up this week, and if I had a podcast that belittled fine cuisine, you guys would've done the same."

"Fine cuisine" is in the eye (or mouth) of the beholder. I know people who think the Olive Garden is "fancy". On the other hand, I've eaten at more Michelin-starred restaurants than I can remember. But, I have to tell you that Kevin's ("fine" or otherwise) dining reviews are, for me at least, highlights of the shows, and are often more memorable than all the rest of the talk about Disney. Again, I have to say that I simply read this statement as, "If I dissed something that you care about and talk about frequently on your show, you'd be ranting too." And in a way, Pete's response to his email proves this very point.

Pete, your rants are always heartfelt and honest, and don't ever change that. But in this case I thought there was a different understanding one could take away from the listener's comments, and I'm glad to have had the opportunity to share my understanding of them here.

-- Chris

Ps: I've never been the ballet either, though I do love the symphony.

 

[Flightman]

FIrst of all, I did not tell someone who disagreed with me to go somewhere else, I told people that have a problem with GAY PEOPLE to go somewhere else. I stand by that and will repeat it whenever the situation calls for it. If the issue at hand had been about race or gender, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, would we? Herein lies the problem.

As for it being good business - as you might have guessed listening to the show, I tend to put certain issues ahead of what's good for business. There are things more important than business sometimes, and for me, this is one of them. Is it good business for someone who owns a travel agency that specifically sells Disney vacations to criticize the product and the company? At best it would be considered counter-intuitive, yet we do it - often.

The show is an honest reflection of the opinions and attitudes of the individuals sitting behind the mic. None of it is ever run thru a "good for business' filter. If that were the case, all you would hear from us is how wonderful everything is. My comments and response to the email I received were consistent with that tenet . You should expect nothing less when you listen to the show.

Pete

Pete,

I'm glad the guy was big enough to apologise, and please keep telling it like it is! It's what makes the Podcast addictive.

Keep up the great work all of you.

Pete, no really!!!

 

[wilde_oscar]

...So, I thought I'd just respond to what I heard in that email. Everyone's free to have their opinion, right? So this is mine.

yadda, yadda, yadda

And in a way, Pete's response to his email proves this very point.

Pete, your rants are always heartfelt and honest, and don't ever change that. But in this case I thought there was a different understanding one could take away from the listener's comments, and I'm glad to have had the opportunity to share my understanding of them here.

-- Chris

Ps: I've never been the ballet either, though I do love the symphony.

Sometimes, what is said or what is written is not what is heard or what is read. Often the interpretation of the spectator is influenced by their situation, and regardless of the intent or content of the message the initial reaction of the spectator is cemented.

In listening to the letter, I heard it much the same way as Chris... this guy was trying to be funny while making the point that different strokes for different folks is what makes the world go around.

As much as I'd like to think that in this day and age, people shouldn't care as much about what makes us different and focus on what makes us all the same... My BF and I got some nasty looks at the TSM meet this weekend when we were walking holding hands, yes nasty looks from some attendees. Regardless of the message that Pete runs an operation that does not tolerate homophobia, You cannot get a leopard to change their spots.

Sometimes a joke is just a joke, no ill will, no intent of harm... and yet people can still be offended.

And my BF is an avid sports fan, considering he and the other "husbands" talked ft ball at every chance this weekend, while the "wives" did their Disney thing. I went to the Panthers Buccs monday night game and had a blast, he went to the TSM meet and the tree lighting and got to see almost all of Epcot and DHS in two days and he had a blast.

And according to experts The Orlando Magic have not been interesting since Shack left.

 

[Mouse Skywalker]

My BF and I got some nasty looks at the TSM meet this weekend when we were walking holding hands, yes nasty looks from some attendees.

Rex, I was staring at you at the TSM meet because I was picturing you in that camo bikini.

 

[wilde_oscar]

Rex, I was staring at you at the TSM meet because I was picturing you in that camo bikini.

you are so not the person i am thinking of when i say nasty look, you looked more amused than anything... and i was wearing camo... just not the bikini since it was chilly out

 

[Mouse Skywalker]

you are so not the person i am thinking of when i say nasty look, you looked more amused than anything... and i was wearing camo... just not the bikini since it was chilly out

Seriously, I didn't even see you Rex, and I wish I had. I really wanted to meet you.

 

[UrsulasShadow]

you are so not the person i am thinking of when i say nasty look, you looked more amused than anything... and i was wearing camo... just not the bikini since it was chilly out

WHO gave you a nasty look?!?!? Lemmee at 'em!

(if it was me...sorry...that's just the way my face is...)

 

[columnwest]

Sometimes, what is said or what is written is not what is heard or what is read. Often the interpretation of the spectator is influenced by their situation, and regardless of the intent or content of the message the initial reaction of the spectator is cemented.

Very true. I'm glad the emailer apologized to Pete for the misunderstanding, and I'm glad Pete apologized to the emailer for name-calling on the podcast. But, it's true that it's hard to change your inital perception, not matter how much apologizing and explaining goes on afterward. People's feelings and reactions to things are real, even if the provocation for them turns out not to be.

I think this is partly why the Iraq war still enjoys suport even though the original reasons for the war were invalidated. People's emotions about the war are real (especially if you have friends or family involved over there), regardless of how we got ourselves into the war in the first place. Pete's feelings on homophobia are real, regardless of the emailer's intent.

Personally, I've found in life that most "homophobic" comments are not born from hatred or fear of gay people, but just from ignorance. Instead of expressing outrage, I just politely say, "You know, we're not all like that." And, more often than not, people reply, "Sorry, I didn't know." and it's all okay. A true "homophobe" replies, "Whatever. You people disgust me!" and keeps on going.

It sucks that you got "the look" while holding hands. It always amazes me that the simple act of holding hands can result in a negative reaction. I think part of the problem is that the straight world (particualrly the straight male world) tends to define sexual orientation in terms of sex. I see a gay couple holding hands and think "Aw, that's sweet, they're in love." But, straight guys tend to think, "Ew, creepy, they're gonna do each other later."

I could offer 101 sociological and psychological reasons for this, but the biggest is probably the lack of any depiction of non-sexual gay affection in our culture. People see "A" and they think "Z", not realizing that most of the time the bus stops at "B". I'm not sure there's a good remedy for this, other than keep holding hands, and lead by example.

 

[dpuck1998]

And according to experts The Orlando Magic have not been interesting since Shack left.

Its Shaq and I think Dwight Howard is much more interesting than Shaq ever was!

 

[UrsulasShadow]

Its Shaq and I think Dwight Howard is much more interesting than Shaq ever was!

My DSIL used to decorate Shaq's house for Christmas.









I'm sorry, was that off-topic?

 

[JimFitz]

What's all this talk about Gays, Basketball, and Ballet??? I gotta catch up!!!! I am two weeks behind.

Another Pete rant? Did someone swim in a lake while wearing and Orlando Magic Jersey and a Tutu?

 

[Madi100]

My DSIL used to decorate Shaq's house for Christmas.









I'm sorry, was that off-topic?

Yeah, well my DSIL used to make cake for him. Okay, not really. Just trying to fit in. And, I don't think cake has been mentioned yet in this thread.

 

[wilde_oscar]

Its Shaq and I think Dwight Howard is much more interesting than Shaq ever was!

that just shows how much I know, I have been to some pro basket ball games in a pvt corporate box, and with floor seats... I was bored silly even with an open bar and a caterer.

 

[YellowMickeyPonchos]

We ate near Shaq at Jerry's Deli here in LA many years ago.

This thread could become 6 degrees of Shaq.....


(See another case of food and Shaq in the same post.... anyone else want to play? )

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

I want to play...Karl Malone almost mowed me down getting out of an elevator 15 years ago (I learned my lesson about standing too close to the door!).

 

[DVCsince02]

Yeah, well my DSIL used to make cake for him. Okay, not really. Just trying to fit in. And, I don't think cake has been mentioned yet in this thread.

 

[cathie1327]

Another Pete rant? Did someone swim in a lake while wearing and Orlando Magic Jersey and a Tutu?

 

[dpuck1998]

I ate lunch with (well right next to) Steve Young and his entire family at the airport in Hawaii. Let me tell you, they put a lot of makeup and spray on hair to get that guy looking decent on TV! His wife however....grrrrr.....