Question for owners of "dangerous" breed dogs..probable debate

[mrsv98]

Whenever there is an incident with certain breeds of dogs, i.e. pit bulls, dobermans, rottweilers, etc. the argument is always "It is the owner, not the dog" But really, isn't it also the dog? It can't be a coincidence that is is always this type of dog. I mean really, this type of thing would never happen with my labs.

Below is an accounting of a terrifying incident that occurred in our suburbs yesterday. By all accounts, the owners were good responsible owners and the dogs just snapped. One person reported that the dogs were in such a frenzy they were trying to break into houses.

Can you still justify the argument that it is the owners and not the dogs?

Pit bulls maul 6 neighbors near Cary
Boy critically hurt; dogs killed by cops

By Jason George, Carolyn Starks and Lisa Fleisher, Tribune staff reporters
Published November 6, 2005


Three pit bulls broke out of their home near Cary Saturday afternoon and attacked several people in the neighborhood, severely injuring a 10-year-old boy, before police shot and killed the dogs, police and neighbors said.

Police said it was unclear what precipitated the attacks in the unincorporated McHenry County neighborhood, but residents said the attack occurred about 4:40 p.m. when two 10-year-olds going from home to home on Hawthorne Drive came to the door of Scott Sword, 41, owner of three pit bulls.

The dogs--60-pound Good Girl, 80-pound Pete and 45-pound Stella--raced out of the house and attacked the 10-year-old children, Girl Scout Jordan Lamarre and her friend Nick Foley, witnesses said.

"The dogs were then marauding around the neighborhood chewing on people," McHenry County Sheriff Keith Nygren said.

The dogs headed south and attacked a man walking down Walnut Drive, neighbor Debby Rivera said.

"The screams were horrible," Rivera said. The dogs were "relentless, like they were possessed."

Neighbors tried to scare off the animals by banging on pots and screaming. One woman parked her SUV in the middle of the street, blaring her horn. When the dogs' owner, Scott Sword, came out to try to control them, they turned on him and attacked, biting off his thumb, police and neighbors said.

Resident Jim Malone said a man with a bleeding leg came to his door for help.

"He just said, `The dogs are biting,'" Malone said.

Malone grabbed baseball bats from his garage. He and another neighbor started trying to beat back the dogs.

"He'd hit them, they'd run, and they'd come back," Malone said. "This went on for 15 minutes."

One witness saw the dogs trying to break down the door to another house, Nygren said.

Nick Foley's father, Harold, came looking for his son and heard screaming and barking, neighbors said. He ran to his son and tried to protect him but was attacked, police and neighbors said.

One neighbor got into his pickup and, driving in reverse, herded the dogs into the open front door of Sword's house just as police arrived, Nygren said. Cary police blocked off the south half of Hawthorne Drive while sheriff's deputies were stationed at the other half. The dogs came back out and police shot one as it ran south down the street, officials said.

The deputies shot the other two, one in front of the house and one in the back. There were three dog cages inside the house, Nygren said.

Nick Foley was in critical condition and Jordan Lamarre was in serious but stable condition at Advocate Lutheran General Hospital in Park Ridge.

Sword, Harold Foley and Gerd Gerdes, 42, were taken to Centegra Hospital in McHenry and were in good condition, a hospital spokeswoman said. James Dunne, 48, was taken to Good Shepherd Hospital in Barrington and later released, a hospital spokeswoman said.

The Sword family was loved in the neighborhood, and the dogs had never been a problem, neighbors said. The family was about to install a fence for the dogs in the back yard and always kept the dogs inside, they said.

"They are wonderful, wonderful people and responsible with their dogs," Rivera said.

"These were pets," homeowners association president Mark Guerra said. When asked if they could be trained to fight, he replied, "He bred them, but no, not Scott."

Bad weather prevented medical helicopters from flying in, fire officials said.

 

[mommaU4]

I don't have much to say on the subject except that it breaks my heart everytime I hear of a child being attacked by any dog. How horrifying it must be for them.
This is why I have two cats and as much as my DD begs, we will never have a dog. Maybe a teeny one someday. You know the kind that could almost pass for a big rat.

 

[DVCLiz]

I think it's naive to assume that certain breeds would NEVER behave in this way - under the right set of circumstances, any animal with teeth or claws could be capable of an attack. My Golden/shepherd/chow mix would be much more likely to lick you to death, but I wouldn't assume she was incapable of harming someone. I thnk these breeds get reported more often, and they probably are more likely to attack, but any domestic animal has a risk associated with it that an owner can't completely predict or control.

 

[WDWFAN9]

I think one of the things about these "vicious" breeds is that they are SO strong. If they attack even an adult is hard pressed to defend themselves. As this story demonstrates, even several adults working together could not subdue the dogs. I'm not saying a 30 lb mutt couldn't bite/attack, but it is not likely that they would do as much damage. How sad and scary for all involved.

 

[Sparx]

I don't own one of these dogs, but I know animals. No animal is born "mean or violent". It is the owner. The owner taught these animals to be mean and to hurt. It is wrong to place all the blame on the animals. Certain breeds are seen as meaner, because people raise them that way. A rottie pup isn't going to just wake up one day and decide to go attack a kid. The pup has had to be taught to attack a kid, just like fighting dogs are taught to attack other dogs. jmo.

 

[Marseeya]

You mention a lab -- never even underestimate a lab. There was an attack in the Pittsburgh area involving a chocolate lab.

We have a black lab and I would never trust her around kids alone and we keep a sharp eye on her. When she's outside, she's chained up good, and when we walk her on the leash we use a head collar so she can't overpower us.

Anyone who owns a large dog needs to be aware of the damage it can cause, no matter what breed it is.

 

[Kimberly]

There are no bad dogs, just bad owners.

 

[punkin]

My mother got an amstaf (one of the three pit bull breeds) many years ago from a pound. She was 4 months old and we had no idea of her previous treatment. The pound said they usualy destroyed pit bulls because the people who wanted them (and they had 3 or 4 inquiries a day for a pit bull or pit bull mix) were not the type of people they would give a cockaroach to, let alone a dog.

Anyway, she was a very sweet and loving dog to people in the family, but very difficult to manage on a leash and downright vicious to guests. We had to enroll her in doggy training school and her behavior moderated somewhat as she got older and more used to normal family life. I do not believe she was a bad dog, but was probably abused as a puppy.

In any event she was extremely difficult to control and I would never get another one, no matter how much I loved her.

After she died, my mother got a purebred miniature poodle. He was also difficult to mange and vicioius to strangers (he let my infant daughter absolutely torture him though) but he was too small to do any serious damage.

 

[inaminute]

There is no question that t's the owner's fault.

I wonder how in the world the dogs got out? Was no one home? If someone was home, why weren't they watching the dogs? In any case, the animals were (apparently) not properly supervised, fenced, or tied. It's the owner's responsibility to ensure their pets cannot get out to hurt someone--whether they "think" their pet will attack or not.

 

[mamaprincess]

A few years ago, a highschool friend of mine lost her daughter to a Rotweiler attack, she was 3 years old. I am terrified of these dogs. I wish they were considered weapons and only used by police.

 

[Obi-Wan Pinobi]

Every rottweiler I've been around has been a big lovable slobber machine.

The only dog I've been bitten by? A dachshund.

I know, a doxie is much smaller and can do less damage than a rottie. I'm making a point that everyone has different experiences with dogs from the same breed. On the flip side, I had two neighbors with dachshunds when I was growing up and they were very friendly.

I think it's a combination between the breed and the owner. Some breeds may have more of an instinct to be dangerous, and when you pair that breed with an owner who does not understand or appreciate that instinct (or worse, feeds that instinct) and takes steps through training and socialization to control it, then you have situations like in the OP.

But basically .... it all falls on the owner. If the owner does not control the dog, then the owner should be held accountable, be it a fine or jail.

 

[marlasmom]

I have 2 rescue dogs - a German Shephard cross and a Rottweiler cross and you will never meet gentler dogs. Previously we had a full-blooded German Shephard and she was even gentler if that's possible. The German Shephard gives my 8 month old grandaughter a kiss every time she walks by.

OTOH you have to be careful. Someone gave me a beautiful German Shephard. He was delivered with one of those stakes that screws into the ground and a 6 foot chain He was wonderful with adults but would attack a child, any child for no reason. I talked to several trainers and they said there was nothing to be done. I had to get rid of the dog.

If you have a dog with agressive tendencies you have to be super careful. But mostly it's how they are raised.

 

[Toby'sFriend]

well, let me say I've owned dogs my entire life, worked with dogs my entire life, have volunteered in shelters etc I absolutely disagree with the argument there are no "bad" dogs - if by bad you mean that there are no dogs with a predisposition of agressiveness toward humans or other animals. Some breeds are more likey than others to posses these traits but all dogs have the possibility.

That isn't to say that these animals cannot be kept in human environment. People keep all kinds of dangerous animals and with proper training keep them quite safely -- cheetahs, monkeys, panthers, lions.... the difference is, to legally own of those you need a liscense.

"Pit Bulls" as they are known are highly dangerous because of the massive strength they have in their jaws, plus their genetic predisposition toward food and territory agressiveness. Honestly, I wouldn't want one in my neighborhood.

I heard that story on the news last night. It is just terrible.

 

[mrsmom]

I think some dogs do care traits for been aggressive, My dd was biten in the face by her friends rottweiler. The dog ,never shown to be aggressive and the owners had her since a puppy and and they were a lawyer and a dentist. they don't know why it just jump up and bite her in the face. But me dd will carry the scars the rest of her life. I don't trust alot of dogs anymore.
Kim

 

[DarkSideMoon]

its the owners 99.99 percent of the time. if you get the dog trained and treat it right it should pose little to no threat to anyone.

 

[Goofy05]

I own two large mixed breed dogs, one of whom is part pit bull. He is just the sweetest dog...Now! He used to be quite agressive, but has mellowed with age. Both dogs are kept under constant watch, especially around small children. Even the best trained dog can attack for no apparent reason. A smell or sound that they just don't like. Every dog owner has the responsibility to control their dogs, just as every parent should warn their children to stay away and never tease a dog, regardless of size or breed.
JMHO

 

[DawnCt1]

I guess its always a possibility that its "the owner and not the dog" but answer this question; Why do drug dealers always seem to own pitt bulls?

 

[lisajl]

I know a woman that rescues Rotts. She does not hesitate to put one to sleep if it show any sign of aggression. But, she has been around them a long time, and call tell the temperments.
She and some friends have also taken in 26 Katrina dogs. There has not been 1 mean dog in the mix.

I work for a vet and I would rather be around a big dog you can try to hold on to, than a tiny chihuahua. I really don't like those dogs. Can't tell you how many times we have been bitten by a small dog!

I think it is when the owner treats it like it is a child. They are not children, they are pets. They are members of our families, yes, but let their feet touch the ground, people!!

Thanks for letting me vent that personal "pet" peeve.

 

[DarkSideMoon]

I guess its always a possibility that its "the owner and not the dog" but answer this question; Why do drug dealers always seem to own pitt bulls?

because they could train a corgi to kill someone, but that wouldnt work as well

 

[OzFan]

A few years ago, a highschool friend of mine lost her daughter to a Rotweiler attack, she was 3 years old. I am terrified of these dogs. I wish they were considered weapons and only used by police.

My rottie will lick you to death, has NEVER shown his teeth to anyone. All of his brothers and sisters are the same way. It is the owner, NOT the breed. Socialization is the key to owning ANY kind of breed of dog.
My daughter was bitten by a cute cocker spaniel, it bit her hand and kept trying to get at her face, the dog had never been around children and was visiting my house when the attack took place. My BIL was babysitting him and thought it would be nice to bring this adorable dog around my kids. Without provocation, the dog attacked my daughter, it was the most terrifing minute of my life.