"only idiots" disagree with Kerry's healthcare plan

[jmmom80]

Originally posted by rcyannacci
Good point. http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/health_care/

I'm particularly interested in and support his position on women's health:

"Improve Women's Health

Nearly one in five women below the age of 65 lack health insurance. As the economy has lagged, states have been forced to cut Medicaid budgets and businesses have been pushed to trim health care coverage and benefits - with women disproportionately affected. John Kerry and John Edwards will ensure that women have access to affordable, quality coverage that provides specialty care and preventive services, as well as wellness check-ups for their children. And they will work to improve the economy and shore up our Social Security and Medicare programs, which predominantly serve America's women."

Just checked the Bush site and didn't note any position on women's health. (edited to add: unless you count his...interesting comments about OBGYN's the other day.)

that's simply because kerry decided he wanted to sell his pitch to women. his plan doesn't detail any specifics for women that I can find. bush also has a plan for health care, but because he doesn't specifically spell out w*o*m*e*n that means it won't help women?

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by rcyannacci


What's depressing to me is that the public seems to only to embrace this image of the silent but supportive wife but attack any other woman who speaks in a strong, improvizational public voice.

I'm not "attacking" any woman, least of all Heinz. I think it's just dandy if she wishes to debate the issues and campaign for Kerry. I take issue with the name calling.

I may not like everything I hear all the time, but I sure do love to see women using their public voices to express thier beliefs.

So do I. I sure wish she would use her considerable intelligence to utter something more profound than calling people whi disagree idiots. How about explaining the error in their position, respectfully, instead?

 

[Maleficent13]

Originally posted by rcyannacci
The point of these attacks against Teresa Heinz is to make Kerry look less macho, the image of the husband who has no control over his nagging wife (an image that's been around at least since the scenes of Noah and his wife in the cycle plays of medieval Europe). Same thing with Bill and Hillary.

Only this backfired a bit, yes? Gave Hillary enought power to become a strong female voice in the Senate.

I may not like everything I hear all the time, but I sure do love to see women using their public voices to express thier beliefs.

It never occurred to me that the point of this was to make Kerry look like less macho. But I can see that point, I suppose.

I understand if Teresa's uncomfortable speaking in public, but then she should work on that if she's going to continue doing it. She is a liability to him, as a spokesperson for his campaign, whether we like to admit that or not.

Again, I'm going to vote for Kerry whether his wife thinks before she speaks or not. I'd like her not to work against him though, by opening mouth, inserting foot.

 

[peachgirl]

bush also has a plan for health care

Care to share what it is because I haven't heard him address this issue in any detail whatsoever.

I guess it's hard to fit silly stuff like health care and the economy in when you have important messages to get out like, "vote Bush or die".....

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by peachgirl
Ok, drop the word "firm". I call someone who's voting for Bush a Bush supporter. You call it whatever you want.

I call it "sad" that these two are our ony real choices.

I also think what the wives or husbands of candidates say is of little or no importance and that those who choose to focus on such trivial matters are just looking for something to complain about.

Well, if you consider it a such a trivial issue, why are you still here debating it?

 

[Pete's Mom]

I don't have a problem with Teresa Heinz Kerry expressing her opinion, it's her delivery that needs polishing. Come on, most of us don't even allow our children to use the word "idiot". Nice role model. Very unbecoming for a possible future First Lady regardless of which party she belongs to.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by snarfer1
Come on wrevy, this is your first post, that you didn't think before making (unlike me, I seldom think). I believe on another thread you pointed out the danger of polls with poor wording. The way I think (I know it IS scary) is that a President should be graded Excellent (A), Good (B), Fair or Average (C), Poor (D) and Terrible, Horrible, Bad (No I will not type Kerry here, I am in control, I will not typer Kerry here!)

Oh, I know, and I only trust polls as far as I can throw them. I was just using it as an example to back up my rather cynical view that people, as a group, aren't very bright. There's an old saying i rather appreciate: "You know how dumb the averge person is ? Well, half of them are even worse than that."

Originally posted by snarfer1
So, being fair if only 48% think President Bush is Good (I do not know if this % includes Excellent, or not), but 51% are voting for him, it could be the other 3% find the President Average, or even poor, not necessarilay bad. Remember a D (Poor) is still passing!

Yes, and this president can certainly identify with just barely scraping by with a passing grade, can't he Heck, he's even proud of it. Again, though, I was just using it as an example.

Originally posted by snarfer1
I think history will show again that the name calling, hate mongering, and fear sowing, started with and was perfected by the Democrats. That is not denying that there has been some Republican response but if the boards here are a microcosm reflection of the outside world, then yes you (generic Democrat) are the nasty guys!

Tony

Oh, come now...I wasn't even alive during the Nixon campaign in '68, but the stories of his "dirty tricks" are legendary. This year is a perfect example...did you watch any of that trash they called a convention in New York ? It was nothing but a bash Kerry fest, start to finish. They even recruited a lunatic claiming to be a democrat to come in and join the slimy fun. It's a simple fact: this president makes a living off of slimy, mud-slinging campaigns. It's how he's managed to get elected to every office he's ever attained (though he beat Gore by drastically lowering expectations, not mud-slinging...he used all of that on McCain in the primaries). Seriously....just LOOK at the two campaigns themselves, then try to tell me that it's the Dems that are "dirty".

 

[septbride2002]

(to everyone else) This is a woman negotiating a new terrain of political life and speaking, and I think we can all see her discomfort at being placed in the fishbowl. Laura Bush has expressed a similar discomfort, and has chosen to primarily remove herself from the public's eye unless she's in a library or standing in front of one of her flower beds. And, there's nothing wrong with that. What's depressing to me is that the public seems to only to embrace this image of the silent but supportive wife but attack any other woman who speaks in a strong, improvizational public voice.

THANK YOU! I was going to try and make this point earlier in another thread but it always came off like I was insulting Laura Bush - which I wasn't trying to do- so I ended up not posting anything at all. You said it so perfectly!

Now while I don't agree with her using the term "idiot" I do like Theresa Heinz Kerry - I find her to be a bit of fresh air. She is a strong, finacially independent woman, who is not afraid to speak her mind. It is so nice to see that as a woman who is also working her way up the corporate ladder in a man's world.

~Amanda

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by Maleficent13
It never occurred to me that the point of this was to make Kerry look like less macho. But I can see that point, I suppose.

Certainly wasn't my point. Masculinity is the least of my concerns in regards to who to vote for.

 

[rcyannacci]

Originally posted by jmmom80
that's simply because kerry decided he wanted to sell his pitch to women. his plan doesn't detail any specifics for women that I can find. bush also has a plan for health care, but because he doesn't specifically spell out w*o*m*e*n that means it won't help women?

Having a position specifically on women's health is a huge step forward. In the past, women's health issues have been left behind. Most of the funding has gone toward research on illnesses that most commonly aflict men.

One of my friends lost his mother this past year- she had a heart attack. She had been to the doctor earlier that afternoon complaining that she didn't feel good. Because her symptoms didn't match the typical symptoms felt by those with heart problems, she was sent home. Turns out these are symptoms that many women with heart problems exhibit. Her death might have been prevented if this doctor had been trained to take particular notice to these key differences. Maybe not, but maybe.

There needs to be a conscious effort to address women in health care to make up for past neglect. I pay the same premiums as everyone else- I want the same access to quality care.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by jmmom80
that's simply because kerry decided he wanted to sell his pitch to women. his plan doesn't detail any specifics for women that I can find. bush also has a plan for health care, but because he doesn't specifically spell out w*o*m*e*n that means it won't help women?

lol...One question: where has that "plan" been for the past four years while the number of uninsured has skyrocketed ? He's had a republican congress for his entire term....so why has he waited until election time to announce this grand plan ?

 

[jrydberg]

rcyannacci, let me clarify...

Honestly, I don't particularly care what Mrs. Heinz-Kerry says. It's not a major factor as far as I'm concerned. She's obviously a successful woman who has a proclivity towards blunt comments. While that's not really a bad thing in my view, it is in a political campaign these days. I'm not saying she's got to sit there all prim and proper not saying a word.

But Mrs. Heinz-Kerry's comments are more than a strongly voiced opinion, just as Dick Cheney's comments are more than strongly voiced opinion. Both are more than a little insulting. Dick Cheney's are certainly more damning IMO, in that he is the VP candidate and Mrs. Heinz-Kerry is not running herself. But that doesn't make it ok to make such comments.

I guess I just didn't like the characterization that it's ok because the other side does it. Neither is ok IMO.

 

[Crankyshank]

Is this part of President Bush's "plan" ?
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2004/09/09/us_health_premiums_rise_faster_than_income/

As far as the question posed, I like Mrs Heinz-Kerry. I find her candor to be refreshing. She does need to learn to think before she speaks in many instances, but that's a lesson I'm sorely in need of as well.

Either way I greatly prefer her blunt comments to coached responses that don't seem sincere

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by Crankyshank


Either way I greatly prefer her blunt comments to coached responses that don't seem sincere

That's only because you're not one of the "idiots" that disagree with Kerry's healthcare plan.

 

[peachgirl]

Well, if you consider it a such a trivial issue, why are you still here debating it?

I'm not debating whether she should have said it, I'm debating whether or not a wife or husband's opinion matters and should be a subject for debate.

In other words, I'm debating whether or not it should be debated....


This is what happens when you get a day off with nothing to do....

I find her candor to be refreshing.

I agree! Where's the gripe? Apparently some people love Bush's so called "straight shooter" style of speaking, I think Mrs.Kerry is just the female version with a liberal twist!

 

[jmmom80]

Having a position specifically on women's health is a huge step forward.

problem is, it's not a position specifically on women's health. it's simply a position of making health care available for all of the uninsured, many of whom are women. if there is something in kerry's plan that is specifically directed to women and women only, please show me.

and the number of uninsured has skyrocketed?

 

[jmmom80]

Originally posted by Crankyshank
Is this part of President Bush's "plan" ?
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2004/09/09/us_health_premiums_rise_faster_than_income/

presidents don't set premiums, insurance companies do.

 

[Crankyshank]

Nah. Either way I'd be ok with it. I can see debating with her about issues would be like debating with my family, who are all definitely in need of tact lessons during heated discussions

 

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by tonyswife
Says Teresa Heinz, anyway. I do not wish to turn this into a healthcare debate. There are more than two sides to the healthcare debate, but for Teresa to say people who disagree are "idiots" is absolutely absurd. Can you imagine the uproar if Laura Bush said that people who disagree with Bush are "idiots. If the Kerry camp is serious, they really need to keep Teresa out of the lime light. She has a habit of sticking her foot in her mouth.

Not the kind of first lady I'd want around. But then, I wouldn't want her husband for President either.

 

[Crankyshank]

presidents don't set premiums, insurance companies do.

No but the job growth he's tooting his horn about aren't the type of jobs that pay for insurance, which increases the number of people that aren't insured.

And yes the number of uninsured has skyrocketed, if you read the article.