okw avail to everyone but not dvc!

[Kupiecb]

Can someone please explain why is it that when I called DVC to book a studio for 03/15 - 03/20 I was told we had no avail but when I go on Disney.com and tried to book a studio for the same week they have avail? Why is it that DVC members dont have first option to book?

 

[ladycop67]

I had this same problem with BWV at Christmas. I was told they have to give so much to regular quests. I called the day before our trip and finally got to add on the day I wanted. So I'm not sure if after so long they can give the unused rooms back to DVC or not. Keep calling you may get lucky.

 

[CarolAnnC]

They are two separate inventories. The cash rooms through CRO are from points members have traded out for other vacations. The points inventory are what is available to members.

 

[Sammie]

I would love to know the percentage of rooms made available to CRO by members trading out. I have a feeling it is higher than us DISers would think it is.

 

[Kupiecb]

I just think if they have a room avail we should be able to book via our points. We pay alot of money for the membership not counting our yearly dues and they wont book to us when clearly there are rooms avail? I just dont understand that.

 

[hakepb]

No, That would be "double booking" on points.
The available Disney cash reservations were already "booked" by a member who used their points to trade out.

It is possible that DVC could tweak the system a little more(giving more CRO availability to lower DVC demand periods) but this topic will generally always happen.

 

[CarolAnnC]

I would love to know the percentage of rooms made available to CRO by members trading out. I have a feeling it is higher than us DISers would think it is.

I don't think it is a percentage, it is according to the points that members trade out. I know I keep them busy cause in 2007 I traded out about 1800 points for our Med Cruise and I just traded out 2200 for the 2010 Baltic Cruise..those will cover lots and lots of reservations for cash through CRO!

 

[DebbieB]

I just think if they have a room avail we should be able to book via our points. We pay alot of money for the membership not counting our yearly dues and they wont book to us when clearly there are rooms avail? I just dont understand that.

That's not the way it works. If I trade out for the Disney Cruise, DVC has to pay the cruiseline for my trip. They get the money by sending a room to CRO to rent to the general public. If they left it in DVC inventory, where are they going to get the money to pay the cruiseline?

 

[disneynutz]

I don't think it is a percentage, it is according to the points that members trade out. I know I keep them busy cause in 2007 I traded out about 1800 points for our Med Cruise and I just traded out 2200 for the 2010 Baltic Cruise..those will cover lots and lots of reservations for cash through CRO!

Now we know who's fault it is!

 

[Lynne M]

I just think if they have a room avail we should be able to book via our points. We pay alot of money for the membership not counting our yearly dues and they wont book to us when clearly there are rooms avail? I just dont understand that.

The rooms that Disney is booking for cash aren't 'our' inventory of rooms.

There are a few ways that DVC villas get into the cash booking inventory and become available to the general public:

1. DVC retains ownership of a very small percentage (less than 10%) of points at any resort. This is so they can swap villas out of service if there's a maintenance issue. If this isn't needed, the villas are made available for cash reservations. They're not our villas. DVC owns them.
2. When members trade out of the DVC system to the Disney Collection, the Concierge Collection, etc., the non-DVC resort that the member stays in has to be paid. DVC gets the money to pay that resort by selling a comparable period of time in a comparable villa to Disney resorts. This villa, in a sense, is being used by a member, even though they're not physically there. It's being used to pay for their non-DVC vacation. This is how we're able to get stays at other resorts on our points, so it's a good thing for members.
3. At sixty days out, any villas in the member inventory that haven't been booked by members go to Disney resorts to be booked for cash. This raises money that goes back to the resort to offset our dues - it's a good thing for us. I believe that if a member does attempt to book a villa during this sixty day window, these villas can be pulled back into the member inventory.

That's a very simplified, basic explanation, but in all likelihood the villas you saw available for cash, but couldn't get through MS for points, were either never ours to begin with, or were being used to pay for a member's trade.

 

[disneynutz]

The rooms that Disney is booking for cash aren't 'our' inventory of rooms.

There are a few ways that DVC villas get into the cash booking inventory and become available to the general public:

1. DVC retains ownership of a very small percentage (less than 10%) of points at any resort. This is so they can swap villas out of service if there's a maintenance issue. If this isn't needed, the villas are made available for cash reservations. They're not our villas. DVC owns them.

1. 
   
   Does anyone verify that what we are told really happens?
   
   We have been in several rooms that should be taken out of service for maintenance and they never are. I can't believe that there are worse rooms than some of the ones that we have had. Plumbing problems, broken dish washers, broken cabinets. Every time we ask to be moved to a open room, we are told that they are sold out and nothings available.
   
   Maybe we need a Membership over-site committee.

 

[nunzia]

I don't think it is a percentage, it is according to the points that members trade out. I know I keep them busy cause in 2007 I traded out about 1800 points for our Med Cruise and I just traded out 2200 for the 2010 Baltic Cruise..those will cover lots and lots of reservations for cash through CRO!

When do they apply the traded out points? What I mean is..would they use the dates of your cruises to use the points at your resorts? Like..if the cruise was for March 10-17 would they book cash nights for those days or do they decide some other way when to use the points? Since we don't have a specified 'week' like other timeshares, how do they decide what dates go to cash for traded out points?

 

[dianeschlicht]

If you want the opportunity to trade out for a Disney cruise or to stay at non-DVC Disney resorts, then you have to accept that there will be CRO rooms that are not available for points. If you are concerned about those CRO rooms and complain, it might be that the solution would be for DVC to take away the trade options for the cruise or other Disney resorts. Be careful what you wish for!

 

[CarolA]

Because your fellow members traded points for cruises, hotel stays, Adventures by Disney, II accomodations etc. So our points were turned into CRO rooms to generate CASH to pay for these trades.

As others said you can't have it both ways..... so your options are NO trades stay at DVC only or accept that CRO will be selling rooms!

 

[crisi]

When do they apply the traded out points? What I mean is..would they use the dates of your cruises to use the points at your resorts? Like..if the cruise was for March 10-17 would they book cash nights for those days or do they decide some other way when to use the points? Since we don't have a specified 'week' like other timeshares, how do they decide what dates go to cash for traded out points?

I don't know that anyone really knows - it isn't one for one. Best guess is that Disney CRO negotiates with DVC for rooms that both think will sell - if CRO can't sell the rooms, then it doesn't do them any good to buy them from DVC - and down the line that cruise still isn't paid for - Disney is STILL out the money.

And the reason there is a large imbalance is because CRO doesn't sell 100% of the rooms - if they sell 80% of the rooms they get from DVC, then DVC needs to give them more rooms to "pay for" the unsold inventory.

 

[tjkraz]

[*]DVC retains ownership of a very small percentage (less than 10%) of points at any resort. This is so they can swap villas out of service if there's a maintenance issue. If this isn't needed, the villas are made available for cash reservations. They're not our villas. DVC owns them.

The maintenance percentage is stated as being "no less than 2 percent" of the points available at any given resort. And DVC keeps it pretty close to the 2%. My 2009 budget offers the following figures for BWV as of 12/31/07:

Total Points Available: 4,888,849
Maintenance holdings: 97,836

(That's 2.0012% for maintenance.)

I doubt that it is within DVC's power to rent rooms for cash from its maintenance allocation. These holdings are not just for extensive refurbishments--they are intended to be used for ad hoc renovations like shampooing or replacing carpets, painting, drywall repairs, plumbing fixes, tile work, etc. These tasks cannot be predicted months in advance.

One other source for cash rooms that wasn't listed in your post is unsold / reclaimed points. In 2009 DVC will be holding unsold (new) inventory at SSR (Treehouses) BLT and AKV. And they also re-acquire points via things like ROFR or loan defaults. Those points are tracked separately and it's certainly within Disney's rights to turn them into cash rooms for CRO.

As far as the process of trading out, others have described it accurately. Here's a quick illustration:

* Member calls DVC and uses 500 points for a cruise. DCL commits the cabin and other resources to the member but has absolutely no use for 500 DVC points.
* DVC takes the points and makes some balance sheet transfer to DCL. Let's say the cash rate for the cruise is $4000.
* So DVC is now out $4000 but they have 500 extra points. The only way for DVC to recover that money is by renting rooms through CRO. Using the same point charts available to members, DVC blocks out 500 points worth of rooms and sends them to CRO. Many of those rooms will undoubtedly go unbooked and some will rent lower than rack rates due to AP or other discount codes. But the goal is to recoup at least $4000 from the cash reservations.

DVC is the one who decides which rooms to pull from inventory for CRO. Some will certainly come during periods when the resorts are at max occupancy. But we cannot expect DVC to only pull rooms during slower periods. If they did that, the percentage of rooms rented to cash guests would drop and DVC would have to charge even more points for cruises and other non-DVC stays.

 

[Lexxiefern]

I understand the logic behind the availability. What I don't understand is when they will let a room sit empty instead of filling a member's waitlist. For example, I was on a waitlist for BWV 1 bedroom this past september. No availability for points, but it was available for cash (even with AP discount!). My waitlist never came through, and yes I did call every couple days. That cash room was still available the morning we checked in. So why would they rather have that room sit empty? I seriously doubt someone called that day to book that room. At what point can DVC shift the room back for points?

 

[Brian Noble]

Because it's not points inventory.

You have to think of each DVC resort as really being two resorts: the rooms that the Members own, and the rooms that Disney owns. Disney isn't going to give one of the rooms that it owns to the Members without being paid (that's a cash reservation). Likewise, the Members do not give rooms that they own to Disney unless they get paid.

There is some flexibility in this. Rooms that are not reserved by a DVC member at 60 days are considered "breakage" inventory, and are made available to CRO to rent, but can still be reserved by points---first come, first served.

 

[Lynne M]

I understand the logic behind the availability. What I don't understand is when they will let a room sit empty instead of filling a member's waitlist. For example, I was on a waitlist for BWV 1 bedroom this past september. No availability for points, but it was available for cash (even with AP discount!). My waitlist never came through, and yes I did call every couple days. That cash room was still available the morning we checked in. So why would they rather have that room sit empty? I seriously doubt someone called that day to book that room. At what point can DVC shift the room back for points?

I assume the room that was available had been sold to Disney to pay for a trade. It's gone - it's been sold to Disney, and DVC has paid the exchange property with that money. DVC doesn't 'own' it anymore. It's like saying, I sold my car to the guy down the street, why can't I get it back and use it again?

 

[mnra]

So if disney lets a room sit empty then they have no cash coming in from a member who would spend on food etc around the resort. And a happy member might decide they want to buy more points in the future. Or do they disney think they have an unlimited supply of people to buy into the best kept secret.