Not sure I'm getting why FP+ is "limiting" peoples experience.

[Robo]

Semantics. All that means, is that she probably doesn't like having to go to one ride, then find something else to do in order to "kill time"...

I called that "riding other attractions."

 

[Angel Ariel]

Semantics. All that means, is that she probably doesn't like having to go to one ride, then find something else to do in order to "kill time", so that you can go back to said ride during the FP time. If you're doing that 5 to 7 times a day, that would be annoying to me. To you it's not. Again, semantics and all in how different people view things.

I guess what I meant was that we weren't killing time in the sense that we had to find things to do that we wouldn't have done otherwise. If we got a FP for Space, we'd go ride Buzz (maybe more than once) and maybe go do the Laugh Floor or ride peoplemover. Those are things we'd do anyway, we just got a FP for Space first.

My point was that we didn't structure the day around FPs..we fit FPs in to what we were already doing. Prebooking FP+ is pretty much the opposite of that.

 

[surferdave]

FP+ is a brilliant marketing scheme targeting new families who do not know the ropes of FP-. These families come, stand in line, love WDW but hate the lines, and perhaps vow not to return.

Now, these families with small tots can choose 3 rides (1 major and 2 minor in tiered parks) and are thrilled to death that they can ride headliners that they normally would ignore because the standby lines are too long. It's a win-win for the inexperienced visitor.

And if it's a win-win for the inexperienced visitor who has fallen in love....the next step is buying DVC (a part of WDW that definitely has seen money thrown at it with the hope of great financial return). Win, win for the new visitor; win, win for WDW.

Not such a great win for families who have already figured out the ropes and love riding headliners multiple times per day, who park hop, who have figured out how to make their experience top notch in an ever expanding, totally over populated park environment.

WDW doesn't have to spend millions creating new headliners and has the opportunity to sell the DVC vision with FP+ to newbies. It's a gamble but it probably will work.

That's the best summary of the whole mess that I've seen, well done.

 

[Bullseye]

I truly don't understand the constant referring to "spending the better part of a day retrieving" FP-. Getting FPs never took up much of our time. Returning for a FP ride never took up much of our time, because we generally stayed in the near vicinity (the land the ride was in, generally) to kill time before the return time. We easily managed to get 5-7 FPs/day (at MK, b/c most other parks don't require that many to begin with).

I do actually get that 5-7 in a day is doable, but there have been FP+ opponents throwing up numbers like 10, 12, 20 in a day, which considering there's lag time before you can get another one, you're whole day would be spent running down fp.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I do actually get that 5-7 in a day is doable, but there have been FP+ opponents throwing up numbers like 10, 12, 20 in a day, which considering there's lag time between before you can get another one, you're whole day would be spent running down fp.

I'd agree at 20, but I can see how even 12 would be possible during peak season.

Take MK at peak season where operating hours for the general public are usually 8am-12am. That's 16 hours, so even at 1 FP/2hrs that's 8 FP/day.

Add in the 3 disconnected FPs that you can access any time of the day w/o affecting your ability to get connected FPs and you have 11 FPs for the day.

Factor in getting to the park and getting your first FP around RD, when return times are usually only 45 mins away, and that's an additional FP you can get w/I a 2 hr time limit which brings the total up to 12 FPs.

And yes, I can see how that wouldn't take all that much effort depending on how you circled through the park. It's not something I've personally done, because it's been a while since I could do RD to midnight, but I can see *how* it could be accomplished and I don't think it would require as much time getting FPs as one would think.

 

[Bullseye]

I'd agree at 20, but I can see how even 12 would be possible during peak season.

Take MK at peak season where operating hours for the general public are usually 8am-12am. That's 16 hours, so even at 1 FP/2hrs that's 8 FP/day.

Add in the 3 disconnected FPs that you can access any time of the day w/o affecting your ability to get connected FPs and you have 11 FPs for the day.

Factor in getting to the park and getting your first FP around RD, when return times are usually only 45 mins away, and that's an additional FP you can get w/I a 2 hr time limit which brings the total up to 12 FPs.

And yes, I can see how that wouldn't take all that much effort depending on how you circled through the park. It's not something I've personally done, because it's been a while since I could do RD to midnight, but I can see *how* it could be accomplished and I don't think it would require as much time getting FPs as one would think.

Seriously I'm not even going to try to break down your analysis. Before fp+ if you're doing 12 FP in a day, then you're basically running to get fp and return for fp all day long. How would you even fit in time for TS dining, toilets, shopping, stand by lines, shows, parades, fireworks, meet and greets, travel time back and forth between rides... sounds like a real hoot

 

[Mad Hattered]

Seriously I'm not even going to try to break down your analysis. Before fp+ if you're doing 12 FP in a day, then you're basically running to get fp and return for fp all day long. How would you even fit in time for TS dining, toilets, shopping, stand by lines, shows, parades, fireworks, meet and greets, travel time back and forth between rides... sounds like a real hoot

It was. And if we felt Disney offered a decent TS meal for the value then we would have one of those as well. While others are busy watching The Dapper Dans we would be shuffling to our next RIDE.

 

[Disneylover99]

Ah yes the early bird angle... "I'm sorry little Tommy, it's just not possible at WDW to have a birthday breakfast at Chef Mickey and still FP TSMM in the same day!" Prioritize....Earn....or..

Yup. We all have to make choices. That's life.

Now with FP+ At HS we have to choose between TSM and RNR . At Epcot we have to choose between TT and Soarin. How is that any better?

 

[gwb]

After reading all the posts I see a repeating trend that all lot of posters who say it's limiting are those who use the old FP system to the max and getting 6 plus FP a day. A common repeating post was 3 is less then 6.
Take a look at what was really happening, people who used the old FP getting the fullest amount of FP's were taking away from others who then couldn"t get the FP and then had the choice to wait in the standby line or not go on the ride. What the new lower FP numbers really means is that more people will have the opportunity to get on rides.
Yes that will be limiting in a way for some but it will be also be opening up more opportunities for others to get on rides they may not have had in the past.

 

[Bullseye]

It was. And if we felt Disney offered a decent TS meal for the value then we would have one of those as well. While others are busy watching The Dapper Dans we would be shuffling to our next RIDE.

and you're saying you we're able to do all this without the use of a single rabbit hole ... you did stop for toilet breaks right?

 

[Angel Ariel]

Seriously I'm not even going to try to break down your analysis. Before fp+ if you're doing 12 FP in a day, then you're basically running to get fp and return for fp all day long. How would you even fit in time for TS dining, toilets, shopping, stand by lines, shows, parades, fireworks, meet and greets, travel time back and forth between rides... sounds like a real hoot

:sigh: You know... it's not something I'd personally do, but I can *understand* how others would tour this way. Not everyone does TS dining or shows or parades or characters. Some people are actually mainly there for the rides, and there's nothing wrong with that.

There's no need to be snarky about it just because it's not something you'd do.

 

[mom2rtk]

After reading all the posts I see a repeating trend that all lot of posters who say it's limiting are those who use the old FP system to the max and getting 6 plus FP a day. A common repeating post was 3 is less then 6.
Take a look at what was really happening, people who used the old FP getting the fullest amount of FP's were taking away from others who then couldn"t get the FP and then had the choice to wait in the standby line or not go on the ride. What the new lower FP numbers really means is that more people will have the opportunity to get on rides.
Yes that will be limiting in a way for some but it will be also be opening up more opportunities for others to get on rides they may not have had in the past.

What was stopping everyone else from getting more fastpasses?

 

[mesaboy2]

After reading all the posts I see a repeating trend that all lot of posters who say it's limiting are those who use the old FP system to the max and getting 6 plus FP a day. A common repeating post was 3 is less then 6. Take a look at what was really happening, people who used the old FP getting the fullest amount of FP's were taking away from others who then couldn"t get the FP and then had the choice to wait in the standby line or not go on the ride. What the new lower FP numbers really means is that more people will have the opportunity to get on rides. Yes that will be limiting in a way for some but it will be also be opening up more opportunities for others to get on rides they may not have had in the past.

Uh-uh, sorry. Everyone had the same opportunity, not my problem if others chose not to learn nor take advantage of it.

 

[Angel Ariel]

After reading all the posts I see a repeating trend that all lot of posters who say it's limiting are those who use the old FP system to the max and getting 6 plus FP a day. A common repeating post was 3 is less then 6.
Take a look at what was really happening, people who used the old FP getting the fullest amount of FP's were taking away from others who then couldn"t get the FP and then had the choice to wait in the standby line or not go on the ride. What the new lower FP numbers really means is that more people will have the opportunity to get on rides.
Yes that will be limiting in a way for some but it will be also be opening up more opportunities for others to get on rides they may not have had in the past.

Getting 6 FPs/day was hardly maxing out the system or "gaming" the system in any way.

 

[Momtomouselover]

Seriously I'm not even going to try to break down your analysis. Before fp+ if you're doing 12 FP in a day, then you're basically running to get fp and return for fp all day long. How would you even fit in time for TS dining, toilets, shopping, stand by lines, shows, parades, fireworks, meet and greets, travel time back and forth between rides... sounds like a real hoot

While 12 may be a lot getting 6-10 doesn't necessarily mean you ran around like crazy. I would say 8ish is more realistic. You can walk in and grab a Mickey FP (not connected) then head over and get a Barnstormer (not connected), then a SM. If the return time on SM is less than 2 hrs then your window for another opens up sooner. You can then go ride Peoplemover, Buzz and/or the rocket thing. Then hit the FP return times for your Mickey, Barnstormer and SM should be coming due. Pick another FP before you enter SM (repeat SM, Buzz, or send someone over for Peter Pan or WP). Ride space and continue to next land. You already have pulled 4. If you do Teacups, Winnie Pooh, eat a snack, shop, etc. then pull another FP right before hitting Peter Pan or heading back to SM (or whatever you pulled a FP for next) or you might just pull the next pass at 2 hr window but have a bit more time to enjoy before next return. You are now up to 5 and still have plenty of day left to grab more. Ride a bit more and pull a headliner before lunch. After lunch ride then hit parade or headliner as you please....this is a plan with minimal criss crossing anand can easily get to 8 in a day. Plus, the FP return times will get longer later in the day so you now have a full two hours to do other activities or standby attractions. Sure you might pull a FP that it turns out you couldn't use because someone wanted to go do something else or turns out to close to an ADR but then you just give them away. If you factor in using a runner or a full day in the parks >8 is feasible without going crazy. Now, this does assume a moderate crowd day and FP into the evening AND MK. Epcot I would say 4-5 and AK 4-5, DHS more if adults or teens.

Of course we didn't tour like this everyday but on occasion or depending on the touring party we did on some days. The option was at least there and it made for a great day with lots of rides!

 

[Bullseye]

:sigh: You know... it's not something I'd personally do, but I can *understand* how others would tour this way. Not everyone does TS dining or shows or parades or characters. Some people are actually mainly there for the rides, and there's nothing wrong with that.

There's no need to be snarky about it just because it's not something you'd do.

sorry Angel if you perceived that as snark, I was just trying to play along like everyone else. I'll tell you what, I'll go spend an hour in the transportation board to punish myself.

 

[Angel Ariel]

and you're saying you we're able to do all this without the use of a single rabbit hole ... you did stop for toilet breaks right?

In my example that you didn't want to analyze, there were 2 hr long breaks between FPs in the afternoons. It doesn't take 2 hours to ride something using FP, so there'd be at least an hour and a half left to do things like dining/toilet breaks before the next FP window opened.

ETA: Having see your reply re: the snark, I apologize if this came across as snarky itself. I responded before reading that post and still was under the impression of snark

 

[Disneylover99]

After reading all the posts I see a repeating trend that all lot of posters who say it's limiting are those who use the old FP system to the max and getting 6 plus FP a day. A common repeating post was 3 is less then 6.
Take a look at what was really happening, people who used the old FP getting the fullest amount of FP's were taking away from others who then couldn"t get the FP and then had the choice to wait in the standby line or not go on the ride. What the new lower FP numbers really means is that more people will have the opportunity to get on rides.
Yes that will be limiting in a way for some but it will be also be opening up more opportunities for others to get on rides they may not have had in the past.

But that's simply not the case. We go during moderately crowded times. There is always FP availability for most attractions available even late afternoon. People choose not to use it. Maybe they don't understand it, but they have the same opportunities as everyone else.

 

[Planogirl]

My husband and I spent a week in Rome in late October/early November. I love WDW, but for me, it doesn't compare to something like Italy. I think I had gotten into the habit of WDW being the first place I would think of for vacation. All of the MB problems, not being able to ride our favorites more than once, only one park for FP+, tiering and even more than that...cutting EMH hours and taking Splash Mountain out of evening EMH has caused me to rethink that vacation strategy. I actually think it's probably good for us.
By all means...go to Italy!!

I like FP+ for the most part (have used it on two trips), and I love WDW dearly. And I still say GO TO ITALY!!!! It's amazing. If your heart's leading you there, do it.

I appreciate your recommendations. I'll just have to save a bit longer and must resist that Florida pull....

 

[rt2dz]

I do actually get that 5-7 in a day is doable, but there have been FP+ opponents throwing up numbers like 10, 12, 20 in a day, which considering there's lag time before you can get another one, you're whole day would be spent running down fp.

The only people throwing out those numbers--10, 12, 20--are those that are saying only people who are used to getting that many in a day dislike the new system. When, in fact, the majority who are complaining are using numbers under 10.

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