Kids on shoulders

[Disney_Princess83]

In Walt Disney's time, no one could probably even imagine an adult pushing a kid out of the way to watch the Mickey Mouse float go by. It just didn't happen. Now, people without kids seem to have some sort of irrational aggressiveness towards people with kids, even in places primarily designed for children. It amazes me when people go to a theme park built for the enjoyment of families and then complain about all the annoying kids. It is not even rational.

This is a ridiculous statement. There is no aggression present. If we are watching a parade, I will let little kids come and stand in front of us. However I'm not going to let anyone, adult or child, block my view when I have been standing here for 45 minutes and they come in 5 minutes before the parade or show starts. I'm helpful and thoughtful of others. I'll move over, I'll let the little ones stand in front of me. But I'm not going to miss out on seeing something for a stranger. If you (or anyone) wants your child to see, plan accordingly like we do. The world doesn't revolve around anyone in particular, we all have to coexist. We all paid admission so we are ALL entitled to see a parade, a show, fireworks. Not just the "unders 5's" (or whatever age people want to use)

 

[Luckybee]

In Walt Disney's time-parents PARENTED. Little Jimmy was not allowed to chase ducks, or swing the line chain into others. Susie stood in line for her turn. Parents did not make excuses or try and justify bad behavior. You misbehaved-you were asked to stop. If you choose not to listen-you left. You were not allowed to be a disruption to others. Now, parents encourage the bad behavior and rather than try and stop it- they record it by holding up giant screen ipads in front of others.

Absolutely correct ! And it is worst than this in the real world outside D. Im in business where I deal with a number of kids (usually teenagers) and parents. I've been in this field for 25 yrs. Only in the last 10 yrs or so have I seen an amazing amount of teenagers coming into to a professional office telling their parents what to do, and the parents not only not correcting them but actually acquiescing .
A close friend of mine is a university professor . Back in my university days when I had to get into a course that had limited enrollment and required an interview I would attend for the interview and do the best I could to get in. Students are now actually showing up with their helicopter parents in tow, and even worse the parents are showing up on their own to explain why little Suzy simply must be accepted.

For parents to act like their children are the only ones who matter at Disney isnt surprising. Parents aren't parents in many cases any more. They think of their children as their "friends " and are proud of it

And on the chasing the ducks thing...I grew up with a healthy amount of respect towards animals, birds etc. because of what I was taught as a child. I have given up counting the number of times I have seen kids chasing small birds, ducks , geese etc on beach vacations, and others. What really boggles my mind is when I see parents doing it with their kids. In Aruba last yr while sitting on the beach there was a group of kids with their parents who were constantly chasing away the birds who kept sitting right in front of dh and I. After a couple of hours of this I finally looked at the parents and said " they're really not learning to care for the birds this way". I know it wasnt my business but it was annoying the crap out of me and it wasnt fair to the birds who were minding their own business. Response by the mother "they're just having fun".

 

[MmmSuite]

Absolutely correct ! And it is worst than this in the real world outside D. Im in business where I deal with a number of kids (usually teenagers) and parents. I've been in this field for 25 yrs. Only in the last 10 yrs or so have I seen an amazing amount of teenagers coming into to a professional office telling their parents what to do, and the parents not only not correcting them but actually acquiescing . A close friend of mine is a university professor . Back in my university days when I had to get into a course that had limited enrollment and required an interview I would attend for the interview and do the best I could to get in. Students are now actually showing up with their helicopter parents in tow, and even worse the parents are showing up on their own to explain why little Suzy simply must be accepted. For parents to act like their children are the only ones who matter at Disney isnt surprising. Parents aren't parents in many cases any more. They think of their children as their "friends " and are proud of it And on the chasing the ducks thing...I grew up with a healthy amount of respect towards animals, birds etc. because of what I was taught as a child. I have given up counting the number of times I have seen kids chasing small birds, ducks , geese etc on beach vacations, and others. What really boggles my mind is when I see parents doing it with their kids. In Aruba last yr while sitting on the beach there was a group of kids with their parents who were constantly chasing away the birds who kept sitting right in front of dh and I. After a couple of hours of this I finally looked at the parents and said " they're really not learning to care for the birds this way". I know it wasnt my business but it was annoying the crap out of me and it wasnt fair to the birds who were minding their own business. Response by the mother "they're just having fun".

I was a switchboard operator at a University. I can't believe some of the things parents would call about! One yelled at me to get her to the effing person that would change her son's grade! O_O

 

[SpringSprite]

Just my two cents, but after perusing this thread...it appears to me that rude and ignorant people come to WDW with and without children. The fact is many have cited rude behavior on both parts. And they are right. I have seen many parents do ignorant inconsiderate things in all walks of life. I also have witnessed some very rude adults chose to act incredibly irrational and inappropriate to children.

Here is what I have learned going from a single young adult to a married with children park goer...
1. All children that appear to be "misbehaving" in WDW are not evil! I remember seeing kids act up (pre kids) and thinking, "I would never let my kids do that." LESSON LEARNED: WDW and all very overstimulating activities tend to bring out the best and worst moments. I don't let my son do horrible things or hurt/annoy others, and he is always required to apologize if he has interfered with someone else's enjoyment, but I can say I pick my battles! And we sometimes discuss behavior, post episode, back at the hotel.
2. Parents are sometimes so focused on kids that they zone out. I am not making excuses...well kind of...but I want to let you know, I am a nice and kind person, and sometimes I don't realize I stepped in front of you, or short stopped on you. Again, I would always say I am sorry, but if I was doing something that I didn't realize was infringing on your good time. Just ask, I always try to be considerate, but we all make mistakes.
3. Kids are not little adults. They are learning the ins and outs of good behavior and caring about more than just there own needs. Adults have 20-80+ years of practice. Give the little ones a little slack. They are not sleeping in their beds(maybe for the first time), they are in a overstimulating environment, and they are off their schedules.

Thank you so much for writing this! As to your #1 - I thought the same thing...you know how they say when you pray for patience you are given a trying situation to help you practice it? Boom - my kids. They are rambunctious, stubborn, argumentative when given any direction, you name it. Nothing gets them to good behavior when they are in the zone other than waiting it out. NOTHING.

2. Yep, you can't keep track of everything, and everyone, all the time. I get SO overwhelmed with having to keep track of the behavior of my guys that I have to lock myself in the bathroom at home to decompress. I can't imagine how that is going to be at WDW.

3. - Sometimes I have to stop myself from overparenting, because they ARE kids, and they ALL get snotty with each other on the playground. I'll reprimand and reprimand my kid, pull him aside for lectures about kindness, being careful, sharing, not waving the stick like a lunatic, whatever. I'm learning that sometimes they have to learn these things on their own, and YES YES YES sometimes the hotel is the teaching place, not the middle of the park (or the playground). That is definitely the case with my guys.

I'm scared about our upcoming trip, really. We don't put our kids on our shoulders at parades, but some of this other "bad" kid behavior - yep, we'll be dealing with it for sure. People are going to be judging the poop out of us and our parenting skills, apparently.

 

[mom2rtk]

. I am an elementary teacher and the mother of a 3yo. I find it sad and amusing that an adult that knows full well that these are paid performers in costumes is upset that a child that believes these ARE the actual characters dancing around in front of them believes they are more entitled to see this "show" than a child.

So should adults stop buying expensive tickets to see Broadway shows? After all, they KNOW those are just paid performers in costume.

They are theatrical productions. Parades too. And everyone wants to see. Nobody's wants and desires are more important than anyone else's. Or book a FP.

Yes!! Exactly!! My son talks every day about "going to Mickey's castle house!" And about how he can't wait to hug Mickey and tell Mickey that he loves him. He, like all the little kids, BELIEVE that those are the real characters they dream about, the ones we read to them about, watch on tv, ect. There is a huge difference in kids not being able to see vs adults being able to see. It's sad that people even have to debate this.

Sounds like the parade might be important for your son to see. So get there early and get a good spot.

So if kids shouldn't be allowed on shoulders unless they are in the back, does that mean that tall adults must also stand in the back?

That's different from what's being discussed here. Everyone knows your husband is tall when he gets there. If someone walks up and stands behind him, they know what they are getting. Not so with someone putting a kid on their shoulders at the last minute.

 

[2Tiggies]

That's different from what's being discussed here. Everyone knows your husband is tall when he gets there. If someone walks up and stands behind him, they know what they are getting. Not so with someone putting a kid on their shoulders at the last minute.

This is so true. Most tall adults are aware that they are tall, just like I know that I am not This means that when we watch parades and shows, we have to stop doing what we are busy with or skip/save something for later to dedicate a fair amount of time sitting and waiting in our spot. I see plenty parents with small children staking out their spots a good hour in advance. Children can and will wait if they perceive this to be a normal part of life.

 

[Mome Rath]

Absolutely correct ! And it is worst than this in the real world outside D. Im in business where I deal with a number of kids (usually teenagers) and parents. I've been in this field for 25 yrs. Only in the last 10 yrs or so have I seen an amazing amount of teenagers coming into to a professional office telling their parents what to do, and the parents not only not correcting them but actually acquiescing .
A close friend of mine is a university professor . Back in my university days when I had to get into a course that had limited enrollment and required an interview I would attend for the interview and do the best I could to get in. Students are now actually showing up with their helicopter parents in tow, and even worse the parents are showing up on their own to explain why little Suzy simply must be accepted.

For parents to act like their children are the only ones who matter at Disney isnt surprising. Parents aren't parents in many cases any more. They think of their children as their "friends " and are proud of it

We weren't allowed to go to Disney until we could behave. My parents knew we could behave, therefore we were expected to behave. It was shocking to me as a kid to see how other little kids behaved toward their parents, and to strangers. One of the biggest things I can see change over the years is the bus situation; we were taught really young that if an elderly person got on the bus, it did not matter how tired you were, you hopped your rear up and gave them a seat.

I always felt my parents rightly thought of others in regards to their children's behavior. They really really wanted us to have a good time, but never at the expense of others around us. Disney is such a good environment to teach children how to behave properly in public. I've seen excellent parents and I've seen rotten ones, and I do see it changing more with the culture. Also, you can have a 100 kids and parents doing really well, and along comes 1 kid in total meltdown, and the parent making it worse, and you remember the 1 negative thing and forget the 100 good ones; that's life too.

For me it's not even a matter of the kid being up on shoulders that's the problem, it's the thoughtlessness of the parents and their actions. Also, a parent knows their child and if that child is capable of handling Disney... I see so many little kids who obviously are uncomfortable at Disney, and perhaps the parents should have waited a bit to bring them until they were more mature and felt secure.

We learned fairly quick that the world does not revolve around us, and I do think that has made me a better adult.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I don't think any side of the argument is suggesting that it is ok for anyone, kids or adults to push out someone else to get a preferred spot to view a parade. At least, I don't think so. What this really comes down to in my eyes is that some of us feel that the parades have been designed primarily for the entertainment of the children, not the adults and that although we all realize everyone paid to get into the park, it might be a good gesture to allow a child a spot ahead of you and more than likely not even blocking your view in order to see their favorite characters. We fully recognize that you are not obligated to allow the children to watch the parade, even if it only costs you a momentary discomfort in having to scoot over. We still appreciate you humoring us with the possibility that you are a decent human being with basic common sense.

As I said earlier, I have no issue allowing children in front of me to see a parade. But as a pp said, their parent needs to be ok being a little behind them. Most people don't have an issue letting kids in front of them...its when the parent wants to get in front as well that people don't like.

 

[Angel Ariel]

This is a ridiculous statement. There is no aggression present. If we are watching a parade, I will let little kids come and stand in front of us. However I'm not going to let anyone, adult or child, block my view when I have been standing here for 45 minutes and they come in 5 minutes before the parade or show starts. I'm helpful and thoughtful of others. I'll move over, I'll let the little ones stand in front of me. But I'm not going to miss out on seeing something for a stranger. If you (or anyone) wants your child to see, plan accordingly like we do. The world doesn't revolve around anyone in particular, we all have to coexist. We all paid admission so we are ALL entitled to see a parade, a show, fireworks. Not just the "unders 5's" (or whatever age people want to use)

 

[sabresman31]

I'm okay with it sometimes. However, I'm not okay with people holding cameras/iPads really high and blocking my view.

I feel the same way. Don't the people who record a whole parade on their iPad are missing the whole thing by staring at it's screen? It's also very distracting to everybody around them.

 

[Vivianne]

As I said earlier, I have no issue allowing children in front of me to see a parade. But as a pp said, their parent needs to be ok being a little behind them. Most people don't have an issue letting kids in front of them...its when the parent wants to get in front as well that people don't like.

This was my experience I'm a short person. A woman squeezed her children in front of me...fine. But then she put her camera over my shoulder to video the parade which was in my face. Sorry, very rude behavior. My husband edged her out. Children learn by example and this woman was teaching them to be rude.

 

[Quicklabs]

As a neuropsychologist, I've seen far too many cases in which the child sustained a terrible head injury from falling from shoulders. When I see it at Disney, I'm not concerned about my view as much as I'm worried about how easy it is for a child to fall, especially with how tight the quarters are and how quickly the adult's balance can be lost.

 

[bumbershoot]

As a 5'3" person, just piggyback your kid. Cannot even tell you how easy it is. And SO much safer for that child.

In Walt Disney's time-parents PARENTED.

Actually, hearing how my parents were parented, no. They were abused and ignored. Is that parenting? When my grandmother took a car trip with her children, she drugged them all. Caused them to sleep the entire time. My dad and uncles and aunt talk about the paregoric she used to give them. My dad was an absolute hellion, and NO amount of anything she attempted to do, not physical abuse, not any sort of groundings, not ignoring or punishing, changed him. He was a horrible child and nothing much has changed. When he married my mom at 19, after convincing her to marry him despite his standing her up on their first date, his whole family knew it wasn't going to turn out well.

My mom's family had their own lives 99% of the time, expecting their 3 children to fend for themselves. It was no wonder my mom did what she had to do to get out of the house asap, and that was accomplished by marrying at 17.

Many people "raised" like that know how awful it is, and will do anything they can do to undo the damage done and do things differently.

Laughing at the idea that my grandparents did anything close to "parenting". More like being jailers. I'm truly not sure why they had kids.

 

[Angel Ariel]

While I am sorry for what your family went through, that is not what all families in that time experienced. I also realize that not all families experienced great parenting either, but the generalizations of the extremes on both sides are likely not what the average experience was like for our parents growing up.

 

[SEA333]

That's the way of the world, though. When I was a kid, people put the young, the old, the disabled first. Today, everyone puts themselves first.

We do not teach our children to look out for themselves first, by the way. I require my children to be more considerate of others. What I teach my children has basically turned them all into doormats. They are constantly asking me why they have to do x,y,z to be considerate of others when nobody has to do it for them. And frankly, I have wondered if I have set them up for failure because I am trying to raise them with the values that my parents raised me. Which are values that worked in a world where everyone was learning them, but not everyone is now. Which is evident by adults who sit on curbs 2.5 hours before the parade starts, then stand up in front of children at the start of the parade, and adults who jump into the spot a child vacated momentarily to ask their mom a question, while mom stood back behind the crowd to leave more room for other children and adults without children who really, really wanted to see the parade enough to push children out of the way. And even adults who just stand there in a group, knowing they are blocking the way of every child behind them, and not caring at all. Or my personal favorite, the one adult who saved a spot for seven, and never bothered to mention it when our kids sat down behind them, only to have the seven stand and block the view. I still require my children to just accept the disappointment as we find something else to do, but I cannot at all judge the parents who choose to put their kids on their shoulders to see the parade, because I think they are being good parents to look out for their kids in a world that no longer sees it as something we should all do.

^This!!!

I too have raised my kids to be kind, considerate, and aware of how their behavior affects others, but that means that when DS14 holds a door for several people, every single one ignores him without even as much as a nod, much less a thank you. And DD10 goes to the back of the line to wait while her fellow classmates oe teamamtes push past to be first. And DS8 TOLERATES classmate slapping him on the back because he thinks if he yells "stop it!", his teacher will get mad and DS will get in trouble for disrupting the class.

And when I complain, I get parents (and even my kids' principal, kid you not!) tell me that its their kids' right to act like jerks.

Sadly, I just had two incidences with DD10 where my actual advice to her, was seriously to act like a mean girl back to the nastiness of a bossy, snotty girl in her class and girl scout troop who yelled ar DD right in front of me AND the two leaders to "get back in line" when DD was standing to the side, but still behind the girl, to be able to see. And in tumbling class, two girls cut in front of DD because DD stepped one step to the side of the line (half in, half out) to lean back to tell me something (she had just hurt herself) and even though there were still girls waiting to go, they wouldn't let her back in. Ok, there's an argument for that, I get it, but then the girls ganged up her by trying to get all the other girls to side with them. The general unspoken rule there always is, if someone needs water or to adjust something or whatever, they can rejoin the line in the same spot. DD has always let girls do this.

In both cases, I told DD to stand up for herself, and if that means being mean about it back to those girls, then so be it. Its so sad that I even had to say that, but its the only way to not get walked all over. And the mean girls/boys have the mean parents, so appealing to them or the school does not help.

This translates to Disney. The good kids (and parents) are the ones in the back following the rules. The others are the ones who pushed their way right up front.

 

[siskaren]

It's not that anyone is *more* entitled to see characters or fireworks or parades....it is that ALL WDW guests are *just as* entitled to those experiences as the children are.

Exactly. I don't think that I'm more entitled to see characters or parades than a child is, I think I'm as entitled. Disney World is not just for children or adults with children.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

That is specific cases. Not all parents were like that. However, it does seem to be a generational thing now. It's not across the board (that would be impossible) but it's clearly present. There are good parents, bad parents and most are somewhere in the middle. However we do live in a society that is quite "me" centric. In personal experience, having spoken to someone who had a child on their shoulders, their response was "But my child can't see." We had already told him that he was blocking us from seeing the show and we had been there 30 minutes before them. He didn't care, as long as his child could see. That's rude and not necessary. Yes, he wants his child to see. But we want to see too. We all have to coexist and therefore plan appropriately.

Actually, hearing how my parents were parented, no. They were abused and ignored. Is that parenting? When my grandmother took a car trip with her children, she drugged them all. Caused them to sleep the entire time. My dad and uncles and aunt talk about the paregoric she used to give them. My dad was an absolute hellion, and NO amount of anything she attempted to do, not physical abuse, not any sort of groundings, not ignoring or punishing, changed him. He was a horrible child and nothing much has changed. When he married my mom at 19, after convincing her to marry him despite his standing her up on their first date, his whole family knew it wasn't going to turn out well.

My mom's family had their own lives 99% of the time, expecting their 3 children to fend for themselves. It was no wonder my mom did what she had to do to get out of the house asap, and that was accomplished by marrying at 17.

Many people "raised" like that know how awful it is, and will do anything they can do to undo the damage done and do things differently.

Laughing at the idea that my grandparents did anything close to "parenting". More like being jailers. I'm truly not sure why they had kids.

 

[Angel Ariel]

In both cases, I told DD to stand up for herself, and if that means being mean about it back to those girls, then so be it. Its so sad that I even had to say that, but its the only way to not get walked all over. And the mean girls/boys have the mean parents, so appealing to them or the school does not help.

You don't have to be mean to someone to stand up for yourself or prevent yourself from being walked all over.

This translates to Disney. The good kids (and parents) are the ones in the back following the rules. The others are the ones who pushed their way right up front.

So the good kids and parents are always in "the back, following the rules?" So that implies that parents or kids or adults in the front row pushed their way up there. Personally, I think there are plenty of "good kids" and "good parents" and "good adults" who are in front because they got there *early* and saved their spot - no pushing their way up front required.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

You don't have to be mean to someone to stand up for yourself or prevent yourself from being walked all over.

Sometimes you do. I start out really polite however I've had people refuse to move, despite them turning up 5 minutes before the parade/show/fireworks and we have been there for 30 minutes or more. You don't have to be mean but you need to be much more forceful and sometimes bordering on "rude"

 

[BugsDaddy]

This is a ridiculous statement. There is no aggression present. If we are watching a parade, I will let little kids come and stand in front of us. However I'm not going to let anyone, adult or child, block my view when I have been standing here for 45 minutes and they come in 5 minutes before the parade or show starts. I'm helpful and thoughtful of others. I'll move over, I'll let the little ones stand in front of me. But I'm not going to miss out on seeing something for a stranger. If you (or anyone) wants your child to see, plan accordingly like we do. The world doesn't revolve around anyone in particular, we all have to coexist. We all paid admission so we are ALL entitled to see a parade, a show, fireworks. Not just the "unders 5's" (or whatever age people want to use)

Multiple times just on this simple message board thread there have been responders who have taken aggressive, even threatening stances in order to "defend their right" to see a parade. Stories of kids hands being stepped on and one person advocating a physical confrontation if a child wasn't taken down off of shoulders. And this is while people are in the relative comfort of their own home typing on a message board. How do you think these people would be in the Florida heat, frustrated and angry? Don't pretend that there are not people out there that would push your child over to get something they think they are entitled too. Heck, watch all the videos posted on Black Friday before Christmas. People go absolutely crazy when they feel they may miss out on something they feel entitled too. It's not all as ridiculous as you are trying to make it sound.