Is the Magic in trouble??

[Tonka's Skipper]

I'm certainly no expert, and you are due to your years in the industry. And I realize that to a certain extent, like saying a Porsche looks like a Ford because they're both cars, that saying cruise ships look similar is deceptive.

That being said, to my untrained eye the Disney and HAL ships that came out of the same shipyard in the same timeframe look pretty darn similar. Remember that the double stack on Disney is for show only. And there is every bit as much woodwork on HAL as on Disney--this is one of the most striking similarities to me. They both have that wonderful teak walk-around promenade, teak on all walking surfaces on the upper decks, and shellacked handrails everywhere.

In any event, if the Disney decorating touches were all stripped away I think any cruise line could take the ships, make them their own, and they would not instantly recognizable as "the old Disney ships" when they pulled into port. Just my opinion...

Ok now Icman...........I see your point.......ships look alot like eachother to a regular cruiser........Kinda like a mid sized SUV of one make looks alot like another make!


But I still think the special style of the DCL ships , even if all the disney items were removed.......the ships would still look DISNEY.

AKK

PS that 2nd funnel has alot of machenary in it not to mention it is the air intake for alot of ventilation of the ship inself and the engine room/ engines etc....so it would be very hard to remove it........of course you can remove the outer disney styling...and put up new stuff,but it would cost !

AKK

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

But I still think the special style of the DCL ships , even if all the disney items were removed.......the ships would still look DISNEY.

I don't think the ship's exterior look Disney, but they look like the ship's that Disney designed and commissioned.

They are distinctive, and as I said above, maybe "iconic" of the DCL brand, and unique in ship design today. (And by that I mean over the last 2 decades)

The Dream and Fantasy however..... Yes they are more run of the mill churned out in their exterior design. From the side they look and great, but the bow and stern look horrible in comparison IMO.
DCL missed the mark by a long shot.

Ex Techie

 

[insureman]

I don't think the ship's exterior look Disney, but they look like the ship's that Disney designed and commissioned.

They are distinctive, and as I said above, maybe "iconic" of the DCL brand, and unique in ship design today. (And by that I mean over the last 2 decades)

The Dream and Fantasy however..... Yes they are more run of the mill churned out in their exterior design. From the side they look and great, but the bow and stern look horrible in comparison IMO.
DCL missed the mark by a long shot.

Ex Techie

I agree, with the extra top decks it makes her look a little top heavy and not like the classic designs that DCL originally did for the Magic and Wonder. I understand the need for increased capacity but they should have tried to stay within their original concept of the first two ships.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

I agree, with the extra top decks it makes her look a little top heavy and not like the classic designs that DCL originally designed for the Magic and Wonder. I understand the need for increased capacity but they should have tried to stay within their original concept of the first two ships.

!

They will eventually have to replace the Magic and Wonder.
I hope they go back to the Classic Ship design and even if they increase the capacity and then size, that they will look like they do now.

Without Eisner, I hope they revert to Walt's vision, and make any new ships in a similar design to the Classic's and avoid the need for greed, and can work around the design of the Dream class to bring back that beauty.

Ex Techie

 

[truck1]

Techie, I havent had a chance to verify this with someone very extremely intimate with the design of the Dream, but from what Ive learned from someone who also was involved, is that the Dreams design has a lot to do with shallow water stability, and the new Panama Canal locks. When I get a chance to send the email, Ill let you know.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

Techie, I havent had a chance to verify this with someone very extremely intimate with the design of the Dream, but from what Ive learned from someone who also was involved, is that the Dreams design has a lot to do with shallow water stability, and the new Panama Canal locks. When I get a chance to send the email, Ill let you know.

Please do!
I heard from someone that was on the launch crew that it was to do with clearance for the lifeboats, and a new reg.

Either way, the Dream isn't anywhere as good looking from the bow, and I prefer the design of the Classic's aft (those that have cruised on the Dream may appreciate the new layout, and space) but she isn't as nice as the Magic or Wonder IMO.

Hope they can come to a compromise on any new ships they build!

Ex Techie

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

I totally agree with you all on the last few posts.........

The classic vessels are iconic indeed........IMHO.the next class will likely be around 100,000 tons and will look more like the classics without the mushroom tops of the dream class.....but with all the new techno of the dream class.

PS and for the love of pete....bigger pools.....if for no other reasons then the endless pool threads will end...

AKK

Merry Christmas and happy holidays to All!

 

[truck1]

Please do!
I heard from someone that was on the launch crew that it was to do with clearance for the lifeboats, and a new reg.

Either way, the Dream isn't anywhere as good looking from the bow, and I prefer the design of the Classic's aft (those that have cruised on the Dream may appreciate the new layout, and space) but she isn't as nice as the Magic or Wonder IMO.

Hope they can come to a compromise on any new ships they build!

Ex Techie

I totally agree with you all on the last few posts.........

The classic vessels are iconic indeed........IMHO.the next class will likely be around 100,000 tons and will look more like the classics without the mushroom tops of the dream class.....but with all the new techno of the dream class.

PS and for the love of pete....bigger pools.....if for no other reasons then the endless pool threads will end...

AKK

Merry Christmas and happy holidays to All!

I agree about the shape. When I watched her float out, my first thought was she was beautifull. She a bigger version of the Magic class. Then I got a look from her stern and my next thought was WTH? Then I heard about the pools and my next thought was Scrooge must have been in charge of the purse strings.

From the little Ive been able to gather, the lifeboat requirement change didnt affect the cruise ship industry, though I could be wrong. The oil platform lifeboat requirement got a pretty big change regarding launching, length of time and something else. I cant see where an overhang over a lifeboat, (which would protect it from the elements) would be such a hinderance in clearance to make that much of a difference. If they can make a piston, that will stop a fighter moveing at over 100 mph on the deck of a carrier, in less then 3 seconds, someone can comeup with a better solution for the lifeboats situation. If it is true.

 

[schepp]

Don't know how accurate the info is but according to some CMs on the Wonder last week the next time the Magic goes to dry dock which should be 2013 with the 2 in 5 rule she will be in for about 2 months to be gutted and rebuilt to include possible putting in new modular cabins.

Sounds like DCL plans to keep Wonder & Magic around for a while. With the right routes they seem to have no problem keeping them full. Probably means MR will go away.

 

[taswira]

From the little Ive been able to gather, the lifeboat requirement change didnt affect the cruise ship industry, though I could be wrong. The oil platform lifeboat requirement got a pretty big change regarding launching, length of time and something else. I cant see where an overhang over a lifeboat, (which would protect it from the elements) would be such a hinderance in clearance to make that much of a difference.

I spoke with Captain Marco on the Magic about this. He said they were no longer allowed to have the lifeboats overhang (beyond the body of the ship), which is the rule for all NEW cruise ships now. He seemed to think the same of the new design as many of us, but said it's the new "law" and nothing could be done about it.

Don't know how accurate the info is but according to some CMs on the Wonder last week the next time the Magic goes to dry dock which should be 2013 with the 2 in 5 rule she will be in for about 2 months to be gutted and rebuilt to include possible putting in new modular cabins.

Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I hope they won't make them smaller like on the Dream and Fantasy!

I am one of those who long for just slightly larger versions of the classic ships, but I don't think that will ever happen.

 

[Wadekind]

They could remove all the Disney branding but I don't think they could do much with the Themed pools

 

[Iceman93]

They could remove all the Disney branding but I don't think they could do much with the Themed pools

On my cruise on the Magic they were showing an endless loop of a TV program that followed the ship through a major dry dock. Part of it was gutting the pools completely, so that's something they do anyway. It couldn't be that much harder to change the shape while they're at it...

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

They could remove all the Disney branding but I don't think they could do much with the Themed pools

As only the Mickey pool is themed, it wouldn't be too bad.
It could be made deeper depending on the space available on Deck 8.

I cant see where an overhang over a lifeboat, (which would protect it from the elements) would be such a hinderance in clearance to make that much of a difference. If they can make a piston, that will stop a fighter moveing at over 100 mph on the deck of a carrier, in less then 3 seconds, someone can comeup with a better solution for the lifeboats situation. If it is true.

Maybe it's something to do with the design of the davit's?

Ex Techie

 

[kcashner]

!

They will eventually have to replace the Magic and Wonder.
I hope they go back to the Classic Ship design and even if they increase the capacity and then size, that they will look like they do now.

Without Eisner, I hope they revert to Walt's vision, and make any new ships in a similar design to the Classic's and avoid the need for greed, and can work around the design of the Dream class to bring back that beauty.

Ex Techie

True, they will EVENTUALLY need to replace the Magic and Wonder, but I suspect we are a long way from that day. The typical lifespan of a cruise ship is about 40 years. DCL may ultimately decide that the upkeep on the classic ships isn't worth the cost, but I suspect that is also many years away. Since the immediate goal seems to be to increase the size of the fleet (they do have options on construction of 2 more ships to follow the Dream and Fantasy), I doubt that the Magic is in any immediate danger of being sold off.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

The consensus around here seem's to be 30 years or so.

We were just discussing what her future could be after say 20 year's of service.

Mickey 2000 seem's to think she is getting old now!

Plenty more years in the old girl yet, and hopefully many more as the flagship!

Ex Techie

 

[*Flower*]

I only see Disney listed once (for Salmonella) in all of those years on that CDC site, which is odd. I was on the Dream last week and there was a stomach virus going around. My son got it, and it definitely seemed like norovirus.

We did a b2b last week on the Dream and DH ended up sick also- along with the DH of one of our dining table. It could have been worse for DH, because the other fellow and his DW had to cancel to Palo ressies as a result. We went to ours... the first one was a bit dicey (DH felt a lot better but didn't eat everything, he DID make sure to finish his dessert though) but things improved the next day for him.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

I only see Disney listed once (for Salmonella) in all of those years on that CDC site, which is odd. I was on the Dream last week and there was a stomach virus going around. My son got it, and it definitely seemed like norovirus.

Why would it be odd? Why would you think salmonella would be prevalent on a cruise ship?

DCL are inspected by USPH on a regular basis and pass their test's every time, and with high scores.
The Wonder recently received a score of 99%!
The Classic's will never get 100% due to the type of floor that was laid in the galleys.

Gastroenteritis and Salmonella are completely different types of infection!

Food poisoning is different again.

Ex Techie

 

[drclaws]

OK, having just gotten back from the 12/3 sailing that was the start of this thread, let me add my observations. A bit over-dramatic in the e-mail that was sent and quoted early on.

The Magic lost power on Sunday afternoon for a duration of between 2-3 hours. The only thing we noticed was the lifts stopped working and the ship slowly dropped from moving at 16+ knots to 1-2 knots. The propulsion system obviously was not operational due to the power loss. We had power in the stateroom as far as lights and the shipboard TV. Don't know if the outlets were powered during this time.

We were on our verandah an noted a noticeable slow down and concurrent turn to the starboard. We had regular updates from the Bridge from the cruise director. Our immediate thought was that there was a medical evacuation in progress since it seemed identical to what we've experienced when that happens.

The power was restored fairly quickly, but restarting the propulsion system takes a while longer as the engineering staff had to run through start-up tests and procedures. That took 45-60 minutes it seemed. During the time of no propulsion the prevailing winds seemed to push the ship's heading more to the south from ESE. If you see the track during this time you'll see a small but noticeable jog to the south from the normal straight line track. So yes, were a bit adrift for two hours, but basically went nowhere.

We did experience fairly high winds and seas from Saturday's departure through late Sunday/early Monday. The ship was rocking but we've been on ones much worse. I think the duration was the problem. Yes, the first night's dinner was sparsely attended. We started in AP and by the time the server's show took place there were more servers in the dining room than people still eating.

All pools were closed by Sunday mid-morning and reopened sometime midday on Monday due to the swells and ship rocking and certain areas of the ship were roped off several times, mainly the area from the basketball courts forward. Winds were certainly an issue the first two days and the outside Deck 4 was pretty much uninhabitable unless you like being drenched with salt water spray.

Saying that 50% of the people were ill is a bit of an exaggeration. Yes, there were many of "green around the gills" and uncomfortable looking people, but not quite as dramatic as that.

Now, on Monday or Tuesday, we did hear of a stateroom confinement and all buffets were changed to the servers dishing up all food and manning the Deck 9 drink and soft ice cream stations.

One person was med-evac'ed from CC by a Coast Guard helicopter yesterday afternoon shortly before departure at 5:00.

I agree with some of the comments that the Magic needs it's dry dock time. There were some "rough around the edges" things that I noticed. Out verandah door was a bit loose on its track and wouldn't lock with the door handle in the lock position. The small circular lock at the top of the door had been replaced with a small (but sturdy) slide lock. It did its job, but...

Other than that it was a great cruise!

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

Thank you for taking the time to reply and give us a first hand experience of what actually happened!

Hope you had a great cruise despite the irregular happenings!

Ex Techie

 

[kcashner]

Thanks for following up.

The change in the buffets/beverage station is a precaution that DCL institutes any time there are reports of illness. We've seen it several times.

Just for explanation....
Salmonella is a specific bacterial infection which can be quite dangerous. It CAN be transmitted thru food or other means.
Novo or norovirus is a specific virus which can be transmitted rapidly in closed environments primarily thru hand to mouth transmission--thus, the best prevention is handwashing! Again, this can be diagnosed only thru specific viral identification studies, but is the commonly suspected pathogen in many self limited gastrointestinal ailments.

Gastroenteritis is a generic term for any infection involving the digestive system.
Food poisoning is a term that applies to any illness transmitted thru ingested food.

The Magic and Wonder always get top marks during their inspections...as you might guess just from observing things around the ships. As DD says, UNLIMITED hand wipes everywhere. I haven't seen any inspection reports on the Dream, but see no reason why they wouldn't be consistent with Disney's other ratings.