I think I want a divorce...

[Tiger926]

I've had an opportunity to read all of your posts, and again appreciate all of your input. I really do not believe the problem stems from depression. While he may be depressed, it is not the primary reason for his behavior. This started long before his unemployment, possibly from very early on in our relationship. I truly do believe that he is lazy. I also believe that I have been enabling him all of these years. It is partially my fault for allowing it to go. I just believed that things would change.

Some have suggested that I help him in the job hunt. Well I wrote his entire resume, and I write his cover letters. I email him jobs to apply to. Once he said that he had found a company that he wanted to apply to but couldn't because he needed a cover letter. I was too busy and told him to do it himself. Well he didn't write it. All he had to do was change a couple things on a cover letter that he had previously sent.

I don't want to write a list of chores for my husband. He is an adult. He needs to start acting like one. I am so done being his mom, I want a husband.

Well, based on this new post, it sounds like you know what you need to do. I wish you the best of luck in the road ahead. I hope that one day you find true happiness.

If he were her child, that would be an appropriate response. He is not her child, even though he acts like it.

It is not her responsibility to get him to the doctor. He is an adult and can figure out how to get himself there.

Sorry, but that's part of my job as a spouse - to be supportive and helpful. Like I said, I've had several people thank me for not giving up on them, as they more than likely would not be here if I had, so if all I have to do to save my marriage or help my spouse conquer his demons is drive to the doctor's office, then I have no problem with that.

This has been an interesting thread, and despite being on the DIS forever, I am still shocked at how some people view their role in marriage.

Tiger

 

[Hannathy]

Sorry, but that's part of my job as a spouse - to be supportive and helpful. Like I said, I've had several people thank me for not giving up on them, as they more than likely would not be here if I had, so if all I have to do to save my marriage or help my spouse conquer his demons is drive to the doctor's office, then I have no problem with that.

This has been an interesting thread, and despite being on the DIS forever, I am still shocked at how some people view their role in marriage.

Tiger

I agree. Although it shouldn't surprise me it still does amaze me how easily some people advise just walking away from a marriage. I Thank God I didn't marry one of those.

 

[goofyernmost]

I agree. Although it shouldn't surprise me it still does amaze me how easily some people advise just walking away from a marriage. I Thank God I didn't marry one of those.

That's like saying, a lot of people give up too quickly when faced with jumping off a cliff and turn around and walk away. Sometimes there is no hope in reviving anything. Sometimes there is no reason to keep pounding ones head against a wall over and over and over again.

I will agree that some effort should be made and from what I have read of the OP's post there has been a lot of effort to this point. It is not..oh, no..he sneezed let's get out of here.

We are all human, we have a need to be happy and to not have our lives dictated by something that is absolutely out of our control. If you are immersed in the situation it isn't difficult to tell when the person with the problem is struggling to get over it. You can see when they are making an effort and have a desire to fix their problem even though they may not be physically able too. On top of that, the OP has children to consider. There may not be any physical harm coming their way, but you can bet that there is a lot of mental anguish involved. They may come through it OK, but they will be much happier if the people around them have the ability to not only be happy but to be willing to participate in their own lives.

I didn't recommend and wouldn't have recommended breaking free if she would have posted that "last week my husband started acting funny, I don't think I can take it." This has a history and without his cooperation, IT WILL NOT GET BETTER!

 

[luvmy3]

I've had an opportunity to read all of your posts, and again appreciate all of your input. I really do not believe the problem stems from depression. While he may be depressed, it is not the primary reason for his behavior. This started long before his unemployment, possibly from very early on in our relationship. I truly do believe that he is lazy. I also believe that I have been enabling him all of these years. It is partially my fault for allowing it to go. I just believed that things would change.

Some have suggested that I help him in the job hunt. Well I wrote his entire resume, and I write his cover letters. I email him jobs to apply to. Once he said that he had found a company that he wanted to apply to but couldn't because he needed a cover letter. I was too busy and told him to do it himself. Well he didn't write it. All he had to do was change a couple things on a cover letter that he had previously sent.

I don't want to write a list of chores for my husband. He is an adult. He needs to start acting like one. I am so done being his mom, I want a husband.

OP I wish you luck on the road ahead.

Well, based on this new post, it sounds like you know what you need to do. I wish you the best of luck in the road ahead. I hope that one day you find true happiness.



Sorry, but that's part of my job as a spouse - to be supportive and helpful. Like I said, I've had several people thank me for not giving up on them, as they more than likely would not be here if I had, so if all I have to do to save my marriage or help my spouse conquer his demons is drive to the doctor's office, then I have no problem with that.

This has been an interesting thread, and despite being on the DIS forever, I am still shocked at how some people view their role in marriage.

Tiger

What about the dh here? He certainly isn't supportive and helpful and by the sounds of it has never been. He has given up on his marriage and his family and the OP has been the sole supporter (in all aspects). This isn't a case of just giving up, the OP has been there for years, its his turn now and clearly he isn't willing. I said it before, marriage is a partnership and it isn't fair to expect one of the partners to constantly try and hold things together both of them.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

You have to be able to discern the difference between helping someone and enabling.

OP has helped, helped, helped, helped, helped.....to the point of enabling. Enabling someone is NOT helpful.

The man would not hold a bag for her while she was gardening. He is cruel. Take off your blinders and see the relationship for what it is.

How do you know that divorcing him is what he needs to be helped. There is always the other side of the coin. You have to look at both sides even though you don't want to.

Maybe he does not want to be married to her and he does stuff to push her to divorce. Maybe he is one of those people that does not like to accept blame. If he pushes her to divorce he can blame her in the end.

 

[Wishing on a star]

you have to be able to discern the difference between helping someone and enabling.

Op has helped, helped, helped, helped, helped.....to the point of enabling. Enabling someone is not helpful.

The man would not hold a bag for her while she was gardening. He is cruel. Take off your blinders and see the relationship for what it is.

amen

 

[Lynne M]

I agree. Although it shouldn't surprise me it still does amaze me how easily some people advise just walking away from a marriage. I Thank God I didn't marry one of those.

It's pretty clear that the OP has been trying to make this marriage work for a long time. In a lot of ways. I don't think that can be called 'just walking away'.

One person can't make a marriage work all by themselves. If OP's husband isn't interested in trying to save the marriage, what can she do?

It's also clear that you have a good, strong marriage, with a partner who works with you to work things out when your relationship hits those bumps in the road that all couples experience. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a partner like that.

 

[Tiger926]

You have to be able to discern the difference between helping someone and enabling.

OP has helped, helped, helped, helped, helped.....to the point of enabling. Enabling someone is NOT helpful.

The man would not hold a bag for her while she was gardening. He is cruel. Take off your blinders and see the relationship for what it is.

How do you know that divorcing him is what he needs to be helped. There is always the other side of the coin. You have to look at both sides even though you don't want to.

Maybe he does not want to be married to her and he does stuff to push her to divorce. Maybe he is one of those people that does not like to accept blame. If he pushes her to divorce he can blame her in the end.

I think there are different definitions of help, and I wouldn't call enduring years of emotional abuse on the part of the OP, help. As I said, I've been through this, and so I realized early on that enabling hubby to laze around, as well as taking care of the house and kids was not taking care of the marriage, nor assisting hubby with his emotional issues. Those are two very distinct entities.

I felt that more could be done in regards to an actual solution focused way of looking at the problem for the OP, especially if depression is in the mix. I'm not sure when this behavoiur started though, as OP has given conflicting info about it starting about 10 years ago, but then maybe it has been there all along? Maybe he was a selfish jerk when they were dating, they why did she marry him?

I honestly thought that OP was conflicted about getting a divorce, but I now don't think that was the case. OP has been dealing with crap for years, there is no doubt, and so she is exhausted and tired of this relationship. My point though in coming to that determination is that if she has been battling the depression monster, it has made things very difficult, and I'm sure that this isn't the man whom she married. And in that, my personal belief is that support was necessary as her hubby is battling a legitimate illness with his depression. If he was a lazy, selfish jerk before they were married, why did she marry him? But if he became one after, was that because of depression? I thought it important for OP to consider the damage that depression can do to a marriage...

Regardless, she has said she doesn't want to be married to him, and he has been showing her for years that he doesn't want to be married to her, that much is evident.

OP has not described a great situation, and I wish her well in finding happiness one day, as she deserves that.

I really do wish OP well, Tiger

 

[SaraJayne]

I agree. Although it shouldn't surprise me it still does amaze me how easily some people advise just walking away from a marriage. I Thank God I didn't marry one of those.

So you feel it's all on the OP for "walking away" from her marriage? Where does her DH's responsibility as a partner come into play? From what she's said, he's never been anything more than a lazy, selfish, inconsiderate jerk.

When is enough enough?

 

[sbell111]

I agree. Although it shouldn't surprise me it still does amaze me how easily some people advise just walking away from a marriage. I Thank God I didn't marry one of those.

Agreed.

What about the dh here? He certainly isn't supportive and helpful and by the sounds of it has never been.

As I remember my vows, they didn't say for me to be a good husband unless my spouse doesn't. It says for me to do it.


It should be noted that I don't much care if the OP gets a divorce, or not. The only thing that struck me about the initial post was that she was very clear that she had changed since they had gotten married and that she was upset that he hadn't. Guess what? People often don't spontaneously change and expecting someone to change from the person that you married in order for you to be happy is a horribly flawed plan.

Get marriage counseling or get a divorce. Either way, you're not going to find the solution to your marriage problems on the Dis. The bathroom mirror is a much more likely place.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

Well, based on this new post, it sounds like you know what you need to do. I wish you the best of luck in the road ahead. I hope that one day you find true happiness.



Sorry, but that's part of my job as a spouse - to be supportive and helpful. Like I said, I've had several people thank me for not giving up on them, as they more than likely would not be here if I had, so if all I have to do to save my marriage or help my spouse conquer his demons is drive to the doctor's office, then I have no problem with that.

This has been an interesting thread, and despite being on the DIS forever, I am still shocked at how some people view their role in marriage.

Tiger

Wow, oversimplification much? If only OP had thought of that within the past 10 years -- just him to the doctor . How did she EVER miss that?! .

 

[Tiger926]

So you feel it's all on the OP for "walking away" from her marriage? Where does her DH's responsibility as a partner come into play? From what she's said, he's never been anything more than a lazy, selfish, inconsiderate jerk.

When is enough enough?

This wasn't my position, but I must then ask again: why did she marry him?

That is why I kept up on this thread - she said he started acting this way during year 5, with no mention of their courtship years, or why she married him in the first place. Now she is saying it may have started from the beginning. My point all along is that if it started after, then it may have been because of the depression.

Now she seems to be saying that he was like this from the beginning. Wish I would have known that, as it would have saved me a lot of typing...

Agreed.

As I remember my vows, they didn't say for me to be a good husband unless my spouse doesn't. It says for me to do it.


It should be noted that I don't much care if the OP gets a divorce, or not. The only thing that struck me about the initial post was that she was very clear that she had changed since they had gotten married and that she was upset that he hadn't. Guess what? People often don't spontaneously change and expecting someone to change from the person that you married in order for you to be happy is a horribly flawed plan.

Get marriage counseling or get a divorce. Either way, you're not going to find the solution to your marriage problems on the Dis. The bathroom mirror is a much more likely place.

Tiger

 

[luvmy3]

Agreed.

As I remember my vows, they didn't say for me to be a good husband unless my spouse doesn't. It says for me to do it.

My point was that the OP has been living up to her vows, and her dh hasn't and doesn't seem like he is willing to either. As I remember my dh and I both took those vows.

 

[Tiger926]

Wow, oversimplification much? If only OP had thought of that within the past 10 years -- just him to the doctor . How did she EVER miss that?! .

Why would you take a quote out of isolation, when it was placed there in direct reference to the quote proceeding it? That was in direct response to Sara's post about it being childish to drive hubby to the doctor's office if he was going to the appointment to diagnose his depression or to a counselling session. (which I have done).

I was talking about me...Tiger

 

[luvmy3]

This wasn't my position, but I must then ask again: why did she marry him?

Tiger

Maybe she loved him even for all his faults. Maybe she thought they could get through these tough times. Maybe she has no idea and is upset and ranting here on the DIS.
People change, maybe the OP was naive before and through the years she has realized she was wrong and it was a mistake to marry him. Whatever her reasons are, it doesn't matter, what matters now is why should she stay married to him.

 

[Hannathy]

This wasn't my position, but I must then ask again: why did she marry him?

That is why I kept up on this thread - she said he started acting this way during year 5, with no mention of their courtship years, or why she married him in the first place. Now she is saying it may have started from the beginning. My point all along is that if it started after, then it may have been because of the depression.

Now she seems to be saying that he was like this from the beginning. Wish I would have known that, as it would have saved me a lot of typing...





Tiger

I keep thinking that to. If he has been like this all along, why did you willingly marry him? I didn't see any mention of forced marriage.

If you willingly sign up for it, you know what you are getting. You can't call foul 15 yrs later when they are the way they were in the beginning.


It also has to be remembered we are only hearing 1 side of this story. There could be a lot of exaggeration and embellishment to the story. Like the trash bag, for all we know it was the last quarter of his favorite teams play off game. I mean why now all of a sudden? It isn't like she married him and within a year realized he wasn't going to change and broke up, she thought he was great enough to stay with for 15 yrs and have 2 not even 1 but 2 kids, so why now? Maybe her idea of a clean house is spotless and his is lived in?

Perhaps there is another interest and she is trying to make her self feel less guilty? The point is we don't know the whole story, just what she wants us to know.

 

[Tiger926]

Maybe she loved him even for all his faults. Maybe she thought they could get through these tough times. Maybe she has no idea and is upset and ranting here on the DIS.
People change, maybe the OP was naive before and through the years she has realized she was wrong and it was a mistake to marry him. Whatever her reasons are, it doesn't matter, what matters now is why should she stay married to him.

I think it does matter. OP is conflicted about certain things, so maybe if she realizes he was always a jerk, then it will make it easier for her to accept closure and go through with divorce. Just like if hubby is depressed, then it may make it easier for OP knowing she was battling that depression, but he may truly love her. Not to mention that this relationship dissect could be very helpful for future relationships.

As I said, I have several family members who are marital and family therapists, and finding this answer is one of the most important work they do in their counselling sessions.

Tiger

 

[Wishing on a star]

This wasn't my position, but I must then ask again: why did she marry him?
Tiger

WOW, so now it is even HER fault for making the mistake of marrying him.
Lovely....

She wouldn't be the only young person who went into marriage looking thru rose colored glasses.... or just simply 'young and stupid'...

I was not all that young... And I def. don't consider myself to be stupid....
But, I can sit here and say, with all certainty, that what I got when I married my husband was NOT what I thought I was getting in the package. There were issues there that, even though there may have been some signs, I never really saw coming...

And, you know what, for the early years of my marriage, I also tried to commit completely, and 'be the good wife', by compromising, looking the other way, putting him first. 'helping', meeting his needs and desires in life, with not enough consideration for my own.

Yep, I have personally, and completely, BTDT. You will find be being the LAST person to cast stones here.
Just thank goodness, we continue to work and make progress on our marriage, and it didn't come down to leaving.
And, no marriage is perfect.

However, Believe it or not, you have finally said something, and touched on something, that I agree with, and that I posted in my last post....

So, you have actually hit on the point that I, and few others, who have pointed out that she has both HELPED, and enabled, this man.... She really needs to do some soul searching, and perhaps some personal counseling, to figure out why she has, for this long, chosen to put and keep herself in this position, and have children with him, etc...

I think that this is VERY important.

Like I said in my earlier post.
The hardest part for her, right now, probably IS seeing how she, herself, has to ask about her personal responsibility.

Does that mean that I feel she has any, teeny-tiny, obligation to this marriage. No... Not at all. But I feel like she may best know which way and how to move forward in her life by determining just exactly where she is right now, and how she got there.

OP, if you are still reading.
I am sorry that this thread has gotten derailed by personal arguments with a couple of certain posters here.

I think we all hope that you do what is best for you!!!
And we wish you well.

 

[luvmy3]

I keep thinking that to. If he has been like this all along, why did you willingly marry him? I didn't see any mention of forced marriage.

If you willingly sign up for it, you know what you are getting. You can't call foul 15 yrs later when they are the way they were in the beginning.


It also has to be remembered we are only hearing 1 side of this story. There could be a lot of exaggeration and embellishment to the story. Like the trash bag, for all we know it was the last quarter of his favorite teams play off game. I mean why now all of a sudden? It isn't like she married him and within a year realized he wasn't going to change and broke up, she thought he was great enough to stay with for 15 yrs and have 2 not even 1 but 2 kids, so why now? Maybe her idea of a clean house is spotless and his is lived in?

Perhaps there is another interest and she is trying to make her self feel less guilty? The point is we don't know the whole story, just what she wants us to know.

Oh in that case, he was definitely justified in his behavior.

I doubt there is another interest, it sounds like the OP is way to busy taking care of everything to even have time for something else.

 

[luvmy3]

I think it does matter. OP is conflicted about certain things, so maybe if she realizes he was always a jerk, then it will make it easier for her to accept closure and go through with divorce. Just like if hubby is depressed, then it may make it easier for OP knowing she was battling that depression, but he may truly love her. Not to mention that this relationship dissect could be very helpful for future relationships.

As I said, I have several family members who are marital and family therapists, and finding this answer is one of the most important work they do in their counselling sessions.

Tiger

I don't disagree at all here but at some point one has to give up when trying to force something to work when its clear it isn't going to. The OP has put in 15 years of this, IMO that is enough to say I've tried, now its your turn. She can't keep being the only one responsible for trying to be married. I imagine many people would reach their breaking point even before 15 years, that is a pretty long time. They have tried counseling, he decided he didn't want to go. He stated he was depressed but he hasn't done anything to help himself. It is his turn to step up and try to save this marriage, if that is what he wants.