heard a rumor.. someone jump off Contemporary 2 hrs ago

[soniam]

Until one has actually gotten to the point that he has seriously considered, thought about, or planned suicide, then one should not judge. It's a very dark place that is unimaginable until one has been there. My heart goes out to the people involved. Hopefully, some day, mental illness will not be considered a character flaw and will be treated like a health issue.

 

[wdw4rfam]

If it is indeed a suicide, what a coward to do that at Disney with the possibility of children seeing. Smh. Hopefully no young kids witnessed it or saw the body.

No kidding. DH saw someone jump and land 10 feet in front of him 30 years ago in the military, and it still haunts him. Can you imagine a child seeing that? Then again, someone resorting to that can't be in their right mind anyways, so I guess can't be blamed. Very sad situation.

 

[Eoghann]

Until one has actually gotten to the point that he has seriously considered, thought about, or planned suicide, then one should not judge. It's a very dark place that is unimaginable until one has been there. My heart goes out to the people involved. Hopefully, some day, mental illness will not be considered a character flaw and will be treated like a health issue.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who has suffered from clinical depression at various times in my life (though never quite to the point of considering suicide), these comments about how it's selfish or cowardly or seeking attention are just monumentally ignorant.

Even if we had the facts, which we don't, we're not qualified to judge what was going through their mind or how they were processing it and evaluate their actions.

 

[jerseygal]

Prayers and thoughts for the family and friends of this very sad tragedy!

 

[Slayd]

Can we all just agree that someone committed suicide, it was a terrible tragedy, and leave it at that? Can we just ease off the judgementporn for a second? It is completely unproductive and has no positive impact in any way on any thing.

 

[loves to dive]

Can we all just agree that someone committed suicide, it was a terrible tragedy, and leave it at that? Can we just ease off the judgementporn for a second? It is completely unproductive and has no positive impact in any way on any thing.

True this.

 

[ton80]

The increase in pricing must of gotten to the person.

 

[rteetz]

This is an unfortunate situation. Yes it happened, and yes its more common than it should be but lets not make fun of the situation. If we don't remain civil I will have to close the thread.

 

[closetmickey]

This is an unfortunate situation. Yes it happened, and yes its more common than it should be but lets not make fun of the situation. If we don't remain civil I will have to close the thread.

Understood.

 

[capegirl]

God bless this poor soul. My heart goes out to those who were left behind to deal with this tragedy. Heartbreaking.

 

[manning]

The increase in pricing must of gotten to the person.

And where is the humor? A tragedy, yes. To make fun of it no.

 

[Magic Fanatic]

Wow. I hope that made you feel good responding in that way.

No excuse for comments such as these.

 

[AtlantaDisneyDreamer]

Can we all just agree that someone committed suicide, it was a terrible tragedy, and leave it at that? Can we just ease off the judgementporn for a second? It is completely unproductive and has no positive impact in any way on any thing.

I don't know about that. We teach our children about things that are selfish so we can help them. Maybe if we taught more people that suicide is a selfish thing to do we would have fewer people doing it.

Why not teach our children that suicide is a selfish thing to do? I know that in times when I have felt the lowest in my life, the thought that I would hurt my family by hurting myself (which is what my parents always taught me- they always commented that suicide is a selfish action where there is not severe, incurable pain or a terminal illness), always motivated me to find the good in life and to keep going. Even if my life didn't matter any more, my family's lives did.

Of course, there are those with mental illness who cannot see logic and reason in times when they are down and nothing might matter to them, but what if there are people who might choose not to commit suicide if they saw it as a selfish thing to do to their friends and families?

It is a very sensitive topic and certainly not something you would say to the loved ones of a person who has committed suicide. They are suffering so much and informing them that their loved one was selfish would not be productive at all. It would be very hurtful.

But I think that I intend to talk to my children about what a selfish action suicide is so that I can help them understand the impact such an action can have on everyone who loves them. If it could dissuade them from making such a permanent decision, why not?

 

[Eoghann]

I don't know about that. We teach our children about things that are selfish so we can help them. Maybe if we taught more people that suicide is a selfish thing to do we would have fewer people doing it.

Why not teach our children that suicide is a selfish thing to do? I know that in times when I have felt the lowest in my life, the thought that I would hurt my family by hurting myself (which is what my parents always taught me- they always commented that suicide is a selfish action where there is not severe, incurable pain or a terminal illness), always motivated me to find the good in life and to keep going. Even if my life didn't matter any more, my family's lives did.

Of course, there are those with mental illness who cannot see logic and reason in times when they are down and nothing might matter to them, but what if there are people who might choose not to commit suicide if they saw it as a selfish thing to do to their friends and families?

It is a very sensitive topic and certainly not something you would say to the loved ones of a person who has committed suicide. They are suffering so much and informing them that their loved one was selfish would not be productive at all. It would be very hurtful.

But I think that I intend to talk to my children about what a selfish action suicide is so that I can help them understand the impact such an action can have on everyone who loves them. If it could dissuade them from making such a permanent decision, why not?

Untreated depression is by far the most common cause of suicide. Emotional blackmail is a very poor way to handle a person suffering from depression. By spreading this notion you're basically adding to the trauma and guilt which could actually be what pushes people past their limits.

Understanding and compassion would be a much better approach than shaming.

 

[Lothlórien]

If it is indeed a suicide, what a coward to do that at Disney with the possibility of children seeing. Smh. Hopefully no young kids witnessed it or saw the body.

Have you ever known anybody who is suicidal or who has committed suicide? Going by your comment I would guess not. Be careful of judging something you do not know anything about and calling people cowards or even selfish. That is quite heartless. When people are at a place where they take their own lives, they are not in their right minds. They do not think rationally nor do they comprehend that by ending their life they are not ending pain, but they are just passing it along to those who loved them, those who found them, those who didn't see the signs and also leaving behind guilt for others. It is tragedy for everybody involved, especially the person who thought there was no other way out.

 

[ladyelizabeth]

I thought I would leave the link for the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention: http://afsp.org

Whether you want to donate, need more information, or support. Suicide should not be a taboo subject. We should educate ourselves about it so that we are better prepared to help others who are affected by it.

 

[AtlantaDisneyDreamer]

Untreated depression is by far the most common cause of suicide. Emotional blackmail is a very poor way to handle a person suffering from depression. By spreading this notion you're basically adding to the trauma and guilt which could actually be what pushes people past their limits.

Understanding and compassion would be a much better approach than shaming.

I know that depression is a very common cause of suicide. Depression is such a horrible thing to suffer with. My dad has manic depression. I truly believe that the thought of the pain he would cause his children is the one thing that has prevented his taking his own life on several occasions.

Under my proposed approach (if you can call it that), manic depressives who are still alive would not be shamed. They would be considered brave and considerate for holding on.

We know that the fear of being shamed often prevents us from doing things we should not do. Is it so bad to threaten people with being shamed if doing so would prevent them from taking their own lives? I really think I would rather my loved ones be shamed and alive than honored and gone.

I don't know that I could ever treat suicide with understanding, unless of course the person truly had no way of ever enjoying life again (as in the case with a dying elderly person or a person with a painful terminal illness). How can we understand how someone would leave his or her young children? I don't know that I could ever, no matter how hard I tried, understand the choice to permanently hurt one's own child.

 

[Eoghann]

I know that depression is a very common cause of suicide. Depression is such a horrible thing to suffer with. My dad has manic depression. I truly believe that the thought of the pain he would cause his children is the one thing that has prevented his taking his own life on several occasions.

Under my proposed approach (if you can call it that), manic depressives who are still alive would not be shamed. They would be considered brave and considerate for holding on.

We know that the fear of being shamed often prevents us from doing things we should not do. Is it so bad to threaten people with being shamed if doing so would prevent them from taking their own lives?

I don't know that I could ever treat suicide with understanding, unless of course the person truly had no way of ever enjoying life again (as in the case with a dying elderly person or a person with a painful terminal illness). How can we understand how someone would leave his or her young children? I don't know that I could ever, no matter how hard I tried, understand the choice to permanently hurt one's own child.

One can understand something even without approving of it. Empathy is a wonderful thing. I can even understand how some parents end up shaking their babies. It's wrong, they shouldn't do it, but I can follow the progression and see how they end up there.

Regardless of your intent which I assume is good, what you propose and the words you use are shaming to anyone who has ever attempted suicide or considered it. So they would have a negative effect.

Imagine this horrible scenario. Someone has stressed to their child that suicide is selfish, but through depression or some other series of life events they find themselves on the metaphorical precipice. Because they know that their parent disapproves, that they consider suicide to be selfish, that child may feel unable to talk to their parent. And yet talking to their parent is what might save them. Having someone listen without judging is more valuable than anything else to someone in that state of mind.

It's not a coincidence that suicides are more common amongst middle aged white males than any other group. These are the people who have been taught to be strong, not to cry and to stifle their emotions.

Don't take my word for it. Do the research, follow the link in the post above. Before you go doing unintentional harm learn about the subject.

 

[AtlantaDisneyDreamer]

One can understand something even without approving of it. Empathy is a wonderful thing. I can even understand how some parents end up shaking their babies. It's wrong, they shouldn't do it, but I can follow the progression and see how they end up there.

Regardless of your intent which I assume is good, what you propose and the words you use are shaming to anyone who has ever attempted suicide or considered it. So they would have a negative effect.

Imagine this horrible scenario. Someone has stressed to their child that suicide is selfish, but through depression or some other series of life events they find themselves on the metaphorical precipice. Because they know that their parent disapproves, that they consider suicide to be selfish, that child may feel unable to talk to their parent. And yet talking to their parent is what might save them. Having someone listen without judging is more valuable than anything else to someone in that state of mind.

It's not a coincidence that suicides are more common amongst middle aged white males than any other group. These are the people who have been taught to be strong, not to cry and to stifle their emotions.

Don't take my word for it. Do the research, follow the link in the post above. Before you go doing unintentional harm learn about the subject.

I am not advocating to tell everyone to just be strong and deal with their own problems. Emotional development and support is vital for everyone, even middle aged white males who may not always feel comfortable seeking it.

I think what I am trying to say that may not be coming across is this: condemn the action, not the person.



Just as when our children tell a lie, we condemn the action. We love the child. We support the child. We condemn the action.

In your hypothetical, what is the alternative to telling your child that suicide is selfish? Telling them that suicide is acceptable? Telling that that we should empathize with suicide?

Isn't it possible that treating suicide as acceptable, as something we need to treat with understanding, could also be causing unintentional harm?

This really is quite a deep discussion and I don't mean to offend you at all. I know people have different experiences and different ways of thinking. For me personally, I know that I would be (and have been) dissuaded from taking drastic action based on the idea that suicide is selfish. There must be others who that would work for as well. Maybe not all. We are all different.

 

[Slayd]

I don't know about that. We teach our children about things that are selfish so we can help them. Maybe if we taught more people that suicide is a selfish thing to do we would have fewer people doing it.

Why not teach our children that suicide is a selfish thing to do? I know that in times when I have felt the lowest in my life, the thought that I would hurt my family by hurting myself (which is what my parents always taught me- they always commented that suicide is a selfish action where there is not severe, incurable pain or a terminal illness), always motivated me to find the good in life and to keep going. Even if my life didn't matter any more, my family's lives did.

Of course, there are those with mental illness who cannot see logic and reason in times when they are down and nothing might matter to them, but what if there are people who might choose not to commit suicide if they saw it as a selfish thing to do to their friends and families?

It is a very sensitive topic and certainly not something you would say to the loved ones of a person who has committed suicide. They are suffering so much and informing them that their loved one was selfish would not be productive at all. It would be very hurtful.

But I think that I intend to talk to my children about what a selfish action suicide is so that I can help them understand the impact such an action can have on everyone who loves them. If it could dissuade them from making such a permanent decision, why not?

We'll just agree to disagree on this mentality as judging from some of your other posts, both of our individual opinions on this idea are rooted in personal experiences and unlikely to change based on a message board debate.

Regardless, obviously I'm not talking about talking to your children. There's a big difference between telling your children how you feel about people that commit suicide and jumping on a public message board to talk smack about what a coward this guy you've never met is because he couldn't handle a situation you have no idea the details of. Obviously, the pronouns in this post aren't referring to you in particular. I have seen no evidence of you making any such posts.

I just see a world full of judgement-porn and I'm not sure where it comes from. Judge and jury on the internet of who broke what law, who is innocent or guilty of a murder we didn't witness, or what kind of man/woman someone is that we have never even met. Maybe let the family and friends talk this situation over since it doesn't affect any of us. I don't see how you or I weighing in on any of this scenario improves anything...and a man neither of us know certainly doesn't deserve our shaming.