Gator grabs 2 year old at Grand Floridian?

[LSLS]

Did I actually see somebody advocate eradicating the alligator population to control the invasive Burmese pythons that typically stupid floridians bought back in the 70's and 80's and released?

Nah...that didn't happen...that would be the most "American" comment ever.

Nope...I think I'm done too. We've crossed over to the alternate universe.

"Scotty, beam me up"

If you are talking about me, not at all. I thought the link posted seemed to make it sound like pythons are able to keep gator population in check when in reality pythons are a GIANT issue for the Florida ecosystems. By the way, pythons were sold in the 70s, but also well into 2012. And the breeding population did not really arise until the late 90s/early 2000s (not that you argued any of this, just wanted to put a bit more info out on that).

 

[dlavender]

When everything is required to be idiot-proof, you end up with a nation of idiots.

We've created the expectation that we should constantly be warned and told about every possible danger, however remote or obvious, in clear and unambiguous terms, and if we aren't, and we get hurt, then others must be to blame. It's why there is literature in products that say the packaging is not a toy. It's why plastic bags have to have warnings that tell you it's not a good idea to put them over your head. It's why instruction manuals for toasters warn not to use them in water. And countless other such ridiculous things.

An ever increasing amount of warnings only teaches people that they don't have be on the lookout for danger because someone is legally required to tell them about it. If we got away from the warnings, and let consequences from actions (ours and others) be the teacher, we would be far better off in terms of intelligence and safety.

I would rather a misinformed parent be informed before harm comes to a child who does not have the chance to become informed.

Why would anyone be against that?

Do the warnings make you less on the lookout for danger? If so, that's a personal problem. Do you have any data to suggest that this is fact?

Not everyone is playing with the same deck of cards. Why not err on the side of over information?

 

[Ariel484]

A gator can't drown you with a life jacket on.

What makes you say that?! A person can drown in something like 3 tablespoons of water.

 

[dlavender]

Well in that case, I guess we should work on eliminating automobiles, since there is definitely a much greater than a one in a million chance that someone dies in one of those!

Planes too!

Swimming pools!

Bathtubs!

Can't afford to "play the odds"!

Yes, because cars are preserving an image. They serve no other purpose.

Yes, I can't think of any purpose a bathtub plays other than preserving an image.

I know you are trying. I appreciate it.

 

[mcjaco]

They were in their favor.

However, in my opinion, if there is a 1 in a million chance that someone dies, you don't play the odds.

Especially if you are only playing the odds to preserve an image.

Yeah, I'd say you need to re-read this post:

Gator grabs 2 year old at Grand Floridian?

 

[dlavender]

Yeah, I'd say you need to re-read this post:

Gator grabs 2 year old at Grand Floridian?

Perhaps you should reread my response to that post?

 

[LSLS]

They were in their favor.

However, in my opinion, if there is a 1 in a million chance that someone dies, you don't play the odds.

Especially if you are only playing the odds to preserve an image.

FYI it's far less than 1 in a million. Based on US population, you are talking 320 deaths a year from gators. We average about 1/1000 of that. If you say that over the last 8 years we have 6 deaths, you are talking WAY less than that. If you go just Disney World, 2 attacks, and they have what, 20 million visitors a year. Factor in how many more go now vs before, etc., you are talking a one in billions chance of death.

 

[dlavender]

How could anyone argue that a bathtub is the same thing as changing your signage from "no swimming" to do not enter the water due to dangerous predators? Again, bless your hearts, I feel that you are arguing just to argue at that point.
Again, see the below pictures, and tell me that only an "idiot" would think that you are allowed in the water?

 

[rteetz]

There was a post in another forum that I think had a great idea of how to better inform everyone on lake safety.... They had an example of a small retaining wall with a beach. It still looked like a beach with a great view but there was a visual element not meant to protect you but to alert you that passing towards the water wasn't a good idea... not high enough to feel safe/be a seat, but not low enough to get covered over with sand.

I think this is an excellent way to keep the charm of the beach, have a place to put some more signs.. A wall isn't going to protect anyone but it will help inform everyone to stay out of the water without an overblown eye soar...

I personally like the beaches but agree that there isn't enough visitor education on what the local wildlife is and what to do or not to do while visiting.. It's also first time in 45 years and alligators are part of the ecosystem here.. 1/3rd of the land will be a sanctuary/unused so some education is good.

While a wall could work for people, it won't for gators. They can get over that. I just don't think a wall is the answer.

 

[rteetz]

What makes you say that?! A person can drown in something like 3 tablespoons of water.

I think it's 3 inches not 3 tablespoons.

 

[mikebb]

For all the debate about active(closing beaches, fences) and passive (signs) safety measures, I'm wondering about lightning? After all, Florida is the lightning capital of the world, on average 9 people per YEAR are killed by lightning in this state, compared with less than 50 alligator fatalities in Florida in the last 50 years.

Yet every time I take my family to the parks and a storm rolls in, I see many, many people strolling obliviously around exposed outside as if Disney has some storm barrier in place. And I can't recall ever hearing a CM warning about weather safety, reading a mention in any welcome packet, or lightning sirens going off in the parks (they have them at just about every single golf course down here.) But we are from Florida, so when I start hearing rumbles I look at the radar on my weather app and start planning some indoor activities.

 

[rteetz]

How could anyone argue that a bathtub is the same thing as changing your signage from "no swimming" to do not enter the water due to dangerous predators? Again, bless your hearts, I feel that you are arguing just to argue at that point.
Again, see the below pictures, and tell me that only an "idiot" would think that you are allowed in the water?

I'm not sure when the first photo was taken but you were allowed in the water at one point.

 

[romitaz]

How could anyone argue that a bathtub is the same thing as changing your signage from "no swimming" to do not enter the water due to dangerous predators? Again, bless your hearts, I feel that you are arguing just to argue at that point.
Again, see the below pictures, and tell me that only an "idiot" would think that you are allowed in the water?

Pot, meet Kettle.

 

[Ariel484]

I think it's 3 inches not 3 tablespoons.

Whatever, the point is - people put way too much stock/trust in life jackets.

 

[Accident]

While a wall could work for people, it won't for gators. They can get over that. I just don't think a wall is the answer.

I don't think the gators should be stopped. the problem wasn't the gator in my mind, it was a family that didn't know being on the edge of the water wasn't safe..

 

[dlavender]

FYI it's far less than 1 in a million. Based on US population, you are talking 320 deaths a year from gators. We average about 1/1000 of that. If you say that over the last 8 years we have 6 deaths, you are talking WAY less than that. If you go just Disney World, 2 attacks, and they have what, 20 million visitors a year. Factor in how many more go now vs before, etc., you are talking a one in billions chance of death.

Those stats are misleading. As mentioned before, no one in Tennessee could possibly be attacked by an alligator. It's literally impossible. Including the US population is misleading. How many gator attacks in Nevada?

 

[Metalliman98]

I would rather a misinformed parent be informed before harm comes to a child who does not have the chance to become informed.

Why would anyone be against that?

Do the warnings make you less on the lookout for danger? If so, that's a personal problem. Do you have any data to suggest that this is fact?

Not everyone is playing with the same deck of cards. Why not err on the side of over information?

Well let's take it to the extreme-why not warn everyone about every possible danger on every single activity, no matter how remote the danger or how mundane the activity? More info and disclaimers are always better....until they turn society into a bunch of drooling simpletons.

You can't possibly suggest that Americans have gotten smarter over the past 50 years even as the amount of warnings and disclaimers has exploded. We've gotten dumber, because we are bombarded with info and warnings, and trained ourselves to use them as replacements for common sense.

 

[romitaz]

Those stats are misleading. As mentioned before, no one in Tennessee could possibly be attacked by an alligator. It's literally impossible. Including the US population is misleading. How many gator attacks in Nevada?

Umm, just use the stats from Disney itself and you get a MUCH higher number than one in a million. The number of visitors in the last 46 years divided by TWO. That's a rather sizable amount more than one in a million.

 

[mcjaco]

Again, bless your hearts, I feel that you are arguing just to argue at that point.

Did some one just say, Pot meet kettle????

 

[dlavender]

Well let's take it to the extreme-why not warn everyone about every possible danger on every single activity, no matter how remote the danger or how mundane the activity? More info and disclaimers are always better....until they turn society into a bunch of drooling simpletons.

You can't possibly suggest that Americans have gotten smarter over the past 50 years even as the amount of warnings and disclaimers has exploded. We've gotten dumber, because we are bombarded with info and warnings, and trained ourselves to use them as replacements for common sense.

Let's take it to the other extreme, no warnings at all. No signs.

Or, like it used to be....... We already tried your method, didn't work out.

I don't have the data to correlate the decline in intelligence to warning signs. Would love to see your data.

Or, if you see a few alligators, just let your fellow man know about it. Common courtesy?