Fastpass Enforcement coming?

[doconeill]

You just figured it out?

Hey, I actually welcome thoughtful theoretical discussions

 

[KellyNY]

Let me throw this out there: Right now, with a FP, you might walk right onto a ride... or you might end up waiting 5-10 minutes.

What if the new enforcement is because they are about to give out MORE fastpasses and want to better manage the expected wait FP users will have -- so that instead of either a walk-on or a short wait, there will always be a consistently short-ish wait.

Those extra FPs could be part of the early Xpass experiments that are probably coming, in theory.

Anyone?

IMO, they try to make every ride run on full every single moment. For example, in a morning rides often half empty but if you make people use actual window and later with xpass schedule your ride, ride will run full all the time, at least popular rides.

 

[eliza61]

Thanks for the reply eliza61.

I'm just raising awareness to the new choices that will exist because of this policy. This isn't just my style of touring. Many others, as witnessed by this thread, tour in a very similar way. (perhaps naps in the afternoon, getting FP's in the morning to use later...) Whereas before, we didn't have to choose one or the other, now we will have to decide if we take that FP and give up the other option.

Yes, the wait times are posted, but that was one of my points. You don't know that time window until you walk all the way to the ride. Wheras before, if the exact time window didn't work when I showed up, I would still get a FP if I wanted to ride that attraction later than that window. The idea of going to do something else in order to buy time and let the FP window eventually get the my preferred time window, then coming back to get a FP is something I don't want to do. I know, perhaps we have been spoiled, but I truly don't think it was causing the problems that others on here seem to think.

Regarding the comment that my FP usage (and others) clogged up the system for everyone else. Yes, that is speculation and I'm not sure it is accurate, or even why Disney is making this change. I happen to think it's needed to prepare for the new x-pass to work correctly. I'm not sold on the idea that usign FP's later than the window causes a big problem with clogging the system later in the day (when supposedly everyone uses late FP's). This goes against all the ride crowd calendars, measured and predicted, for wait times throughout the day. They all show wait times ramping up from park open and peaking between roughly 3-5 pm and then the ride times GET LESS as the evening progresses. Touringplans.com has some great charts showing this.

Also, I fail to see how stand-by wait times can get that far off, as some on here have mentioned, unless someting goes wrong. The CM's are constantly handing out those red badges to carry with you through the queue to adjust the stand-by times. I've found them to be accurate throughout the day in my experience, both in stand-by and fp lanes.

Dan

TSM stand by times are known for being "off" especially first thing in the morning and last thing at night. I think they start the stupid sign at 30 minutes immediately at opening. I posted a thread last after our trip, we usually go the last week in August. One of the reasons it was so noticeable for me is because my youngest son got a new watch at DTD. the stupid thing had a stopwatch on it nad he was driving every one crazy by timing any thing and every thing.
I know many folks who have said the actual stand by line went almost the same speed as the fp line especially at rope drop, during what I call famously "the running of the bulls", seems like the majority of folks stop at the fp que. My family and I have found this to be true. We now immediately ride standby and then on our way out get our 2nd fast pass time.

It's always hard for me to give any thing more than speculation mainly because I do have the advantage of being a dvc member so I tour so lacksadasicle (sp) generally my attitude is that if I miss a ride I know I'll be back soon, so my crystal ball is a bit skewed.

I do hope this doesn't create less enjoyment though.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

I missed this post earlier...just had to respond...

Merchandise...resort specific merchandise? Have you NOT noticed that most of the resort specific merchandise is gone, in favor of generic merchandise? Yes there is still some, but very limited. Gone are all the resort specific shirts, etc. All I can think of offhand are resort pins and cheap trinkets.

Dining - yes, most of it is unique, but there are various other things that are generic. Most kids meals are generic, including those dog-awful chicken nuggets that even my chicken-nugget-luvin' DDs won't touch. And when I was at the Poly and had what I thought was a unique "Pina Colava" drink one night...then the next night, lo and behold it's available at Boma...and then at the Dawa Bar at AK...and at the resort bar at Beach Club...and at CR...

ahhhhhh come on.....

Resort specific merch is there and now you know that. so is ride specific stuff.

as for the drinks...geeze come on....I can get a Screwdriver or a beer everywhere too...does that give me a reason to bash Disney guest relations and whine about the downfall of WDW the way some do?

As for chicken nuggets...dunno about your DD....by my DD was digging the ones from Electric Umbrella. yes indeed. Come to think it...the burger we had from there wasn't half bad either. but I already conceded those were homogenized...I mean just how many ways can you make a deep fried piece of chicken?

Respectfully,
M&R+5

 

[KellyNY]

Hey, I actually welcome thoughtful theoretical discussions

Me too, good break from "stroller" discussions.

 

[psac]

The article says they will give a 5 minute early and a 15 minute late cushion. Stuff happens - a ride goes down and you get stuck in line or get poor service in a restaurant. I think they should give more of a late cushion, maybe 1 or 2 hours.

I think in general if they enforced the end time, they should expend the window to two hours from the current one hour.

 

[doconeill]

IMO, they try to make every ride run on full every single moment. For example, in a morning rides often half empty but if you make people use actual window and later with xpass schedule your ride, ride will run full all the time, at least popular rides.

Yes, the goal would be 100% utilization, but I'm not sure less than that in the couple hours after opening is due to early FPs not getting used. Remember for the first 30-60 minutes, there are no FPs to be used - FP return times don't start immediately. Then it depends on the crowd levels and the park, is it EMH, etc.

I rarely see the true E-ticket attractions less than 100% utilized even in the mornings though.

 

[MrToad_at_BLT]

Now, let's say that 3 groups of the FP users at noon instead show up at 2pm:
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12--------1---------2---------3
FF1****2**FFFFF**3**FFFFFFFF*4


[/FONT]

I loved the visual guide that this provided, but the only thing I see that it doesn't account for are the people who originally had fastpasses for 2 - 3 who end up being delayed because they are in the fastpass queue behind the extra people in the fastpass line who had earlier return times.

Again, I don't have an issue with people using the system they were provided with, but I think these people who did return on time might even feel more of an effect that the standby lines.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Could you please tell your space lizard buddies to come here and put me out of my misery? I'm ready to retire...

But , it's only just begun. eek:

Well, I'll be a space lizard's uncle...they actually listened? Just took several years...

So, there's hope for the Villians Store and Tinkerbell's and the Hummels and Engel Puppens and the food will return to Eisner's days and....

Our, uh..gripes and complaints are being heard?

 

[KellyNY]

ahhhhhh come on.....

Resort specific merch is there and now you know that. so is ride specific stuff.

as for the drinks...geeze come on....I can get a Screwdriver or a beer everywhere too...does that give me a reason to bash Disney guest relations and whine about the downfall of WDW the way some do?

As for chicken nuggets...dunno about your DD....by my DD was digging the ones from Electric Umbrella. yes indeed. Come to think it...the burger we had from there wasn't half bad either. but I already conceded those were homogenized...I mean just how many ways can you make a deep fried piece of chicken?

Respectfully,
M&R+5

OK, but can I bash Disney all the way for their coffee?

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

Actually, we visit WDW, approximately 2-3 times a year.. and have done so, over 30 years. Yes, there have been many changes in these areas. There is a whole " big, long thread" on this subject. So, I'm NOT alone in this opinion

there is opinion...which of course you are entitled too ("I think CMs are rude")

and there is fact ("merch is homogenized" "flowers are dead")...and here you are indeed 100% wrong

and there is just flat out complaining like a 2 year old ("I don't like wear and tear on paint and I don't like them putting tarps up to fix it either" and "I don't like broken rides and I don't like them closing for refurbs either")

sorry to take my rant out on you... in this thread no less which is really about FPs...I'm sure you are a nice gal or fella...I just get sick and tired of all the bellyaching about how bad Disney is....

Plus I swear I would never read that other thread again and I have stuck to that vow!

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

OK, but can I bash Disney all the way for their coffee?

Yes! HAHA!

 

[doconeill]

ahhhhhh come on.....

Resort specific merch is there and now you know that. so is ride specific stuff.

as for the drinks...geeze come on....I can get a Screwdriver or a beer everywhere too...does that give me a reason to bash Disney guest relations and whine about the downfall of WDW the way some do?

Geez...ok, I hereby apologize to you for not knowing that JUST RECENTLY they began reintroducing resort-specific merchandise that they had taken away several years ago.

But I am not talking about ordering a screwdriver, which I'd expect to be able to order at any bar anywhere (except, apparently, at the private luau at Universal I was at last Fall where it was like one of those portable setups and "we can make one of those drinks on the menu, or a Bud Light..."). I mean each and every bar we went to on that trip had the same bar menu of "premium drinks".

Maybe Disney is trying to undo the homogenization that they have been implementing much to the dismay of guests over the past several years...

 

[MrToad_at_BLT]

I think in general if they enforced the end time, they should expend the window to two hours from the current one hour.

I think that as long as the end time is being enforced, there will always be a reason that someone can say that it's inconvenient. With the built in buffers the new windows would be an hour and twenty minutes.

If they expanded it to two hours, people would still want buffers, which would make it two hours and twenty minutes, that just seems like too big a block of time if one of the ideas behind this is to move towards scheduling X-Pass blocks.

 

[larryz]

I agree on both points.



Honestly, I couldn't care less about the whining. It's par for the course on the disboards (and every other message board in existence.) The thing that bothers me is the stunning amount of logical fallacies.

Or, perhaps, illogical truths.

 

[KellyNY]

Yes, the goal would be 100% utilization, but I'm not sure less than that in the couple hours after opening is due to early FPs not getting used. Remember for the first 30-60 minutes, there are no FPs to be used - FP return times don't start immediately. Then it depends on the crowd levels and the park, is it EMH, etc.

I rarely see the true E-ticket attractions less than 100% utilized even in the mornings though.

But it happens. On our last trip on actual Labor Day we were at DHS. Park was half empty except TSM. We took FP for TOT but when we returned there was no line. We went on RnR and it was 10 min wait, literally just walk on with still empty seats. My DD decided to ride it again right away and wait was 30 min. I am not going to speculate that some late FP triggered this time change but it is possible that they were late, just 10 min late and those empty seats on a first ride were their seats. I know it all makes sence at the end of the day but unless it is scheduled, rides will have periods of empty and full due to different reasons including late FPs.

 

[nytimez]

Conceivable, but doubtful in my mind. Adding Fastpasses means "taking away" standby slots - in the sense that the standby line will have longer waits.

Also, if in theory the FP line always has priority, and always has a some sort of dwell time such that it is never really empty, then the standby line stagnates indefinitely. We already get angry standby people...can't imagine making it worse...

That makes sense to some degree... but wouldn't each extra person with a FP theoretically be one less person who needs to wait in the standby line in the first place -- especially if they've developed alternate ways to distribute those FPs so you don't have to be in the park early to get passes for the most popular rides? In other words... one possible iteration Xpass?

And what if on some level they've decided that they don't care how long the standby lines get if they can squeeze more people in the FP queue -- for two reasons:

1) They're trying to sell people in the standby line on the benefits of FP or Xpass or whatever, especially if you have to pay cash or stay deluxe to get the new benefits.

2) People already wait 120, 150, 180 minutes and more for the most popular rides on busy days. They've proven they can wait -- so let them wait. Perhaps?

Obviously, there's a reason they will start enforcing FP return times and just as obviously it's not because late returners are screwing up wait times. So... what are the other reasons for enforcing FP wait times, if not the above?

And I mean that -- the above may or may not be the reason. I'd like to know what the other possible reasons are.

 

[larryz]

I'd like to know what the other possible reasons are.

If, all of a sudden, you're selling (or perking) half or more of the available FP slots at a ride, you'd want to make DARN SURE your "perky" guests can access the ride when you say they can (or sell them a slot).

 

[ekatiel]

Ridemax posted a video of how the change may impact wait times: http://www.ridemax.com/blog/disney-fastpass-changes/

According to their plans, even on busy days, it only added 10 minutes to the wait times of their sample plans. The walking time was increased by a couple of minutes on one plan, and none at all on another. Honestly, I thought it would make a bigger difference. On a side note, I bet RideMax is patting itself on the back right now for including the option to either turn off or on late FP returns in their program. What a nightmare it would have been for them if they had only developed the program utilizing the late return option! --Katie

 

[mattsdragon]

I love FP threads, and I'm not starting in on my semantics thing.

We have a saying in the military "we fear change". But change happens, and there will be initial griping and belly aching. There will be the standard "I used to be able to. . ." rants to the poor CM's . Let's not forget they will be the ones on the short end of the stick, not those of us on vacation.

Some people may even stop going to the parks (which will also help shorten the lines. . .), which I don't believe anyway, and others will like the changes and come more often (so much for the shortened lines).

But you know what, after a year or so, people will stop complaining, and almost forget that there ever was a time when FP's could be used after the allotted time.

Don't forget, once upon a time, there was no FP, nobody wants to go back to that do they?

We can file complaints, but until Disney sees the bottom line, our complaints will not matter. So buck up, stiff upper lip, pip pip, keep your pecker (it means nose) up, Bob's your uncle. . .I'm running out of "Queen's English" cliches. . .oooh, one more. . .the Barrister who was a Bobby in the Lorry. . . ok, I"m done (Mary Poppins would be so proud).

Lost my train of thought. . .

Oh yeah, the coffee does $uck. . .badly.

That is all.