DVC T &C Personal Use - Only Thread to Discuss.

[Sandisw]

So if i have 3000 points and my dues are 30k, I can rent 1428 points at 21 a point to cover those dues and not be commercially renting? I disagree. That I’m paying my dues means nothing, the IRS doesn’t consider dues an offset when I pay taxes on my rental income, do they?

Yes, you can absolutely offset your rental income by the cost of dues.

The standard in the contract that DVC is supposed to use is that your renting to the degree that you can reasonably be seen as in it for commercial purpose…meaning they can reasonably say your motive is to turn it into a commercial enterprise.

That is standard that those who owners, especially those with pre RIV, are entitled to have.

Obviously, it’s up to DVC to decide if it is reasonable for them to say if someone’s net profit that is close to $0 means it’s a business.

 

[lowlight]

Plenty of people here have a different position than you that are not renting there points.

We don’t have to agree but please do not apply motives to others that may not exist. .

Kind of like how at least four different users have said anyone crying about rentals is a point miser who can only rent AKV value rooms?

I just want people to be honest and not lie about their motivations, which is clearly happening frequently in this thread.

 

[Sandisw]

Basically you are saying that if I rent 100 points at $30 (spec renting at best) and use the funds to pay the dues on my 300 points then it’s commercial?

Sorry but I disagree. You would need to rent more to be a commercial enterprise.

I think they were saying the opposite…if, after dues, your net profit appears to be something evidence that your motive is not personal use, then DVC should consider that commercial purpose.

 

[Mouseforward]

So if i have 3000 points and my dues are 30k, I can rent 1428 points at 21 a point to cover those dues and not be commercially renting? I disagree. That I’m paying my dues means nothing, the IRS doesn’t consider dues an offset when I pay taxes on my rental income, do they?

As a side note the IRS does consider maintenance fees as an offset of what it taxes as income from a rental. And on top of federal your still have to pay your home state income tax, + Florida sales tax and TOT ( even though timeshare use by the owner does not incur TOT renting it to other does) So you have to rent a lot more than you think to pay all of your MF.

 

[Sandisw]

Kind of like how at least four different users have said anyone crying about rentals is a point miser who can only rent AKV value rooms?

I just want people to be honest and not lie about their motivations, which is clearly happening frequently in this thread.

There are extremes on both sides. But I’d say 99% of posters are very honest in their opinions.

The difference is we have a vast variety of opinions on what metrics would be reasonable to apply.

Your hope is that DVC sets the metric very low and others want a higher one.

Be honest.., If DVC said, renting frequently and regularly will be defined as an owner who has reservations in the names of others every month, or has them clustered over the course of several months, within the year, and this happens year after year, would you agree that was reasonable?

 

[Cyberc1978]

Kind of like how at least four different users have said anyone crying about rentals is a point miser who can only rent AKV value rooms?

I just want people to be honest and not lie about their motivations, which is clearly happening frequently in this thread.

Who is not being honest? I will be honest and say yes I rent my points - some years more than others.

I’ll also be honest and say I definitely use my points. Just got home yesterday from a 10 days stay at BWV - in a standard view I may add - booked from scratch less than 60 days out.

But I will still be one of those saying that some members cry about not being able to book that value room. With 5 available it’s difficult no matter how you play it.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I think they were saying the opposite…if, after dues, your net profit appears to be something evidence that your motive is not personal use, then DVC should consider that commercial purpose.

May i misunderstood but are you referring to DVC or the poster @JOLT ? I’m referring to the latter.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I think DVC would consider the using of a commercial site to rent your points as a violation. When DVC was created the internet really didn't exist. DVC probably thought that owners would rent points to just family and or friends since there really wasn't another feasible option at the time to reach a mass market at the time.

As years heck even days go by the internet is evolving so DVC have to too.

A commercial site I understand as a rental broker like our our sponser. But what about Facebook it’s not a commercial but still a lot of rentals is happening.

 

[Sandisw]

May i misunderstood but are you referring to DVC or the poster @JOLT ? I’m referring to the latter.

The poster…based on other posts, it appear to me they support a reasonable definition would use level of profit as a metric…

 

[muppets3d]

As years heck even days go by the internet is evolving so DVC have to too.

A commercial site I understand as a rental broker like our our sponser. But what about Facebook it’s not a commercial but still a lot of rentals is happening.

I don't think the venue of the rental advertisement (board sponsor, facebook, word of mouth, you name it) determines whether or not it's a commercial enterprise.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I don't think the venue of the rental advertisement (board sponsor, facebook, word of mouth, you name it) determines whether or not it's a commercial enterprise.

I agree that was the point I was trying to make. Maybe it was a poor attempt

 

[Sandisw]

No. It won't. Because timeshares are sold, not bought, and most prospects no little more than DVC exists---and probably not even that. The sales arm will easily find a way to take advantage of the pixie-dust moment that most prospects have while on tour. This is going to be marginal.

At best.

In fact, I suspect it will help. If the ready supply of DVC rentals for "a Deluxe room at Moderate prices" dries up, that makes sales' job even easier.

I just think that the notion that DVC is going to go to extremes in this is not supported by what they have said recently.

The condo meetings are tomorrow so let’s see if we get any further insight at those. I can’t imagine it won’t come up.

 

[Galun]

What is the difference between taking the 10k you make renting extra points and using it to pay for a Disney vacation or taking the 10k you make renting extra points and paying off your car loan? Renting more for free vacations is just a euphemism for “profiting” in that sense.

The difference is simple. In the first case, disney makes that extra $10k of disposable income from you, instead of whoever made your car.

That’s why Disney sets the interpretation of personal use as intentionally vague. They want discretion to interpret and enforce.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I just think that the notion that DVC is going to go to extremes in this is not supported by what they have said recently.

The condo meetings are tomorrow so let’s see if we get any further insight at those. I can’t imagine it won’t come up.

Is anyone here going?

@pkrieger2287 are you going?

 

[Sandisw]

I think DVC would consider the using of a commercial site to rent your points as a violation. When DVC was created the internet really didn't exist. DVC probably thought that owners would rent points to just family and or friends since there really wasn't another feasible option at the time to reach a mass market at the time.

In the RIV and beyond resorts they included regular use of a rental site as a potential criteria…

But, I think they added the world regular for a reason and that would be because owners have the right to rent.

They are not supposed to make rules so strict that they pretty much make renting impossible.

CFW went even farther with language that is more restricting.

This is why I would be surprised to ever see an outright ban on it….but, I could also see it being used in conjunction with other metrics.

 

[Mouseforward]

I don't think the venue of the rental advertisement (board sponsor, facebook, word of mouth, you name it) determines whether or not it's a commercial enterprise.

In narrow cases, it would, for example, if you built a website for the sole purpose of renting your own points. That may lead them to think that it’s a commercial enterprise.

Now using a third-party website has its own issues. I’m not buying the third-party website as the innocent intermediary broker argument. They’re tacking on eight dollars a point and then covering their eyes and ears and not paying any transient occupancy tax on that rental. So if you rent your points through them at $20, you’re potentially still paying a TOT of $28 a point since you pay TOT tax and sales tax on the total amount of the transaction with no deductions. I feel like they should be at least responsible for the taxes on the eight dollars they added on it. It’s going in their pocket. I’m sure they’re paying their business income tax, but they’re really sticking the person using their service with the majority of the taxes.

 

[WilsonFlyer]

You guys keep speaking of 'profit margin' as a metric for determination. Just exactly how is anyone privy to said profit margin on any rental?

 

[Mouseforward]

You guys keep speaking of 'profit margin' as a metric for determination. Just exactly how is anyone privy to said profit margin on any rental?

I would say profit is one of the measures used to determine if something is commercial.

However, I feel that works in the occasional renters favor. Anyone who’s only occasionally rented points and pays taxes knows you would the better off going out cutting lawns as a commercial enterprise, then renting your points to make money.

 

[JOLT]

You guys keep speaking of 'profit margin' as a metric for determination. Just exactly how is anyone privy to said profit margin on any rental?

Disney could use a base of what they charge for OTUP.

 

[FrancisK7]

In 2026 I was going to rent all my points to 1. pay dues and 2. use the leftover profits to pay for most of our DCL Treasure cruise next May. It's not a direct swap, so on paper, I made a profit, even though I'm dumping it all back in the Disney ecosystem.

We loved cruising so much last year that the idea of being able to alternate between a DCL cruise and a WDW vacation each year offered such great flexibility.

I don't mind having to sell if it comes down to it and downsize by half if the crackdown is hard, it's just such a terrible timing for a Canadian to sell anything in the US right now, with the proposed increased withholding tax, political climate and all... it would easier to keep a positive outlook if our next trip into the Disney bubble wasn't a year away from now, but my hopium will carry on.