Do you think Disney will require vaccinations for Covid to board?

[icc2515]

Personally, I would never go on a cruise ship with these restrictions. Safety issues aside, it's just not worth the money. You want a family to spend $5,000+ for a "vacation" where masks are mandated whenever you walk outside your cabin in Caribbean heat, everything is soaked 24/7 with bleach, your temperature checked multiple times a day, limited to no entertainment, PLUS have a vaccine required, and then somehow find a way to have a good time? Heck, for that kind of money, I'm going to somewhere else. A million places to go where you don't have to go through Bio Level 4 decontamination to walk outside. The cruise industry is going to die if they are going to do this route.

I agree with you that the thought of cruising with all these restrictions makes it very unappealing. That's why the cruise industry may go the route of requiring vaccines. If they do, the CDC and foreign countries may relax their restrictions. If they know that everybody onboard is vaccinated.

 

[WillAustin]

Requiring vaccines will discriminate against those who cannot take a vaccine due to allergy or other illness. Not sure they will ultimately be able to require it.

 

[sethschroeder]

would make the current requirements for masks and social distancing unnecessary

Except it's not 100% effective, people could still pass infection, and DCL would be viewed as not taking what is considered standard precautions for really no legitimate reason.

Also it just furthers the point of letting people take personal risk without a vaccination as long as testing is occurring before boarding.

Higher chance of infection 100% but simple masking and distancing is considered baseline protection for the time being.

So if no removal of restrictions occurs do you still think they force a vaccination?

We'll see how far this gets. Mandatory vaccinations was a very, very controversial issue even before COVID-19. The debate is going to get super-heated in 2021. And if you thought the mask debate was ugly.....you've seen nothing yet as polls show half the country say they will not get the vaccine.

To clarify typically polls will show; 40% will get it immediately, 25% will get it fairly soon, 25% will get it eventually, 10% will never get it.

Now with mandating a vaccine that typically will come down to roughly 40-50% being okay with a mandate and 50-60% of people being opposed to mandated vaccines.

There is a major difference and the masking and vaccine debate are completely non-related in many peoples eyes.

 

[sethschroeder]

Requiring vaccines will discriminate against those who cannot take a vaccine due to allergy or other illness. Not sure they will ultimately be able to require it.

If DCL was hell bent on it they likely could. Most US laws will not apply to them. They could also basically require while not requiring it making it so difficult to sail without it people just pass on the idea.

Now I don't think they will do that just saying I suspect they could require it.

 

[jane01jp]

Disney is a private company. The Bahamas is a sovereign nation. Both are examples where the rights of an individual do not supersede the right of the entity. This has been a point of contention for some people since this pandemic began.

In the US, no one is losing the right not to get a vaccine, not to wear a mask, or to freak out about either of those things. However, the choices people make have implications. Don’t want to wear a mask? Well, there is a long list of places you are not welcome to go including Disney property. Don’t want a vaccine? Ok, you don’t have to get one, but there will be places that are off limits to you. Most of the “rights” people I think you are referring to seem confused by the fact that they can always retain their Constitutional rights, but it does not mean retaining an excuse from consequences.

The "long list of places" in my state is any business. So, it's either wear the mask, shop online, or break the rule.

 

[TestingH2O]

In other words....wear you mask and take the shot or else live homeless. That's pretty much your point of view. Can't get food, have a job, or travel without the vaccine.....but you aren't "forced."

No, actually, that’s not at all what I said. However, if a person chooses not to wear shoes, then that person will not be allowed to eat in restaurants. That’s not requiring anyone to be homeless or starve, but they will need to eat at home because they chose not to follow the rules set forth by the health department. The mask restrictions are currently the same. If you prefer to not wear them, then dine at home. Or order groceries in. Or...

Traveling, especially international travel, is not guaranteed to anyone. There are already vaccine requirements to travel to some countries. The list of countries requiring certain vaccines might be longer. If the country you want to visit requires a vaccine, then you’ll need to get one. The laws of the country govern those who visit that country. The rules to travel different places can be very strict: China, Russia, and Cuba all have particular restrictions. Almost all foreign travel requires a passport. Those are requirements by the countries you want to visit and if they upset you or you don’t want to adhere to them, you don’t go. No amount of kicking, screaming, or Orwell quotes are going to get you past those laws.

I’m not sure where you got anything about not being allowed to have a job.

 

[jerry557]

I agree with you that the thought of cruising with all these restrictions makes it very unappealing. That's why the cruise industry may go the route of requiring vaccines. If they do, the CDC and foreign countries may relax their restrictions. If they know that everybody onboard is vaccinated.

That's not what the CDC is saying so far. They seem to be saying that even with vaccinations, masks, social distancing, and other restrictions will have to continue because we have no idea how effective and for how long the vaccine lasts or if it works against all variant strains.

The CDC is never going to recommend ending masks or social distancing until the cases are near zero. And that wont be for a long, long time. The cruise industry will be crippled for YEARS. And the industry is likely going to be radically changed if it survives at all.

 

[icc2515]

So if no removal of restrictions occurs do you still think they force a vaccination?

No, I don't think that they will run cruises with distancing restrictions in place. Distancing restrictions are a real problem for cruise lines. Watch a video of the sail away party or pirate party or fireworks on a DCL. Now imagine social distancing in place. 75% of the people would be left out that would lead to horrible guest satisfaction and even some asking for refunds. How about the broadway quality shows. Are they gonna run those 6 times per day for the distancing requirements? Seating in the restaurants maybe 4 or 5 seatings a day? Disney reservation system for getting a deck chair with 75% of them gone. Nobody is going to take cruise where they have to stay in their room the whole time like a prisoner. And Disney is not going to set sail at 25-30% capacity. If they cannot contribute to the bottom line, then they will not sail. It has already been said by other cruise lines that they have to run at near 100% capacity to make money, I can't imagine that Disney is any different.

 

[icc2515]

That's not what the CDC is saying so far.

"So far" being the key words.

 

[icc2515]

Requiring vaccines will discriminate against those who cannot take a vaccine due to allergy or other illness. Not sure they will ultimately be able to require it.

WDW is requiring masks for all people no medical exemptions at all. I feel that if they require vaccinations it will be the same. By time it hits the courts 5 years later, it will be a moot point and thrown out as the requirement will be gone.

 

[jerry557]

No, I don't think that they will run cruises with distancing restrictions in place. Distancing restrictions are a real problem for cruise lines. Watch a video of the sail away party or pirate party or fireworks on a DCL. Now imagine social distancing in place. 75% of the people would be left out that would lead to horrible guest satisfaction and even some asking for refunds. How about the broadway quality shows. Are they gonna run those 6 times per day for the distancing requirements? Seating in the restaurants maybe 4 or 5 seatings a day? Disney reservation system for getting a deck chair with 75% of them gone. Nobody is going to take cruise where they have to stay in their room the whole time like a prisoner. And Disney is not going to set sail at 25-30% capacity. If they cannot contribute to the bottom line, then they will not sail. It has already been said by other cruise lines that they have to run at near 100% capacity to make money, I can't imagine that Disney is any different.

Not only that but they are trying to sell these cruises at the same prices as if there was no pandemic. That's not going to work. If they think they can run these cruises at the same prices, with a ton of restrictions and reduced entertainment, they are in for a surprise.

Already WDW has gotten an earful from ticked off AP holders who are paying the same price for APs but now with reduced entertainment, no fireworks, and no park hopper. (So now Disney is being forced to allow some park hopping, but I don't think it will go over very well from what I've read.)

 

[sethschroeder]

No, I don't think that they will run cruises with distancing restrictions in place. Distancing restrictions are a real problem for cruise lines. Watch a video of the sail away party or pirate party or fireworks on a DCL. Now imagine social distancing in place. 75% of the people would be left out that would lead to horrible guest satisfaction and even some asking for refunds. How about the broadway quality shows. Are they gonna run those 6 times per day for the distancing requirements? Seating in the restaurants maybe 4 or 5 seatings a day? Disney reservation system for getting a deck chair with 75% of them gone. Nobody is going to take cruise where they have to stay in their room the whole time like a prisoner. And Disney is not going to set sail at 25-30% capacity. If they cannot contribute to the bottom line, then they will not sail. It has already been said by other cruise lines that they have to run at near 100% capacity to make money, I can't imagine that Disney is any different.

There is a difference between strict 6ft everywhere and extra precaution especially on the main deck outdoors.

Sail away and Pirates as an example could be held at two or three separate times based on your dinner seating allowing for additional spread among those attending. They could also be modified in a certain extent and possibly even have a separate viewing of a new show type in the theatre.

I can't see DCL expecting to not have restrictions in place unless they are planning on not running the ships until 2022.

I also think its a pretty big assumption that Disney would not cruise with 25-30% or 50% or 75% capacity. Disney has the numbers and knows what they can run to breakeven on cruises. DCL has a huge profit margin.

 

[sethschroeder]

If they think they can run these cruises at the same prices, with a ton of restrictions and reduced entertainment, they are in for a surprise.

What surprise? If they need to run ships at a reduced capacity pricing in that manner may actually work.

No one would go to WDW either with restrictions right? I am not saying is a guarantee but Disney does seem to have a pretty good feel for things. Anyone booking right now has to be thinking there is going to be restrictions. I know I figure there will be restrictions in December.

 

[jerry557]

What surprise? If they need to run ships at a reduced capacity pricing in that manner may actually work.

No one would go to WDW either with restrictions right? I am not saying is a guarantee but Disney does seem to have a pretty good feel for things. Anyone booking right now has to be thinking there is going to be restrictions. I know I figure there will be restrictions in December.

From what's been said they can't turn a profit with severely reduced capacity on a cruise ship. Social distancing is a big problem on a ship. In a theme park, you can snake any line all over the place. You can't do that on a cruise ship. Can you image the nightmare at Cabannas? Are you going to snake the line down the stairs?

Yeah, WDW is open with 35% capacity. But there are a lot of people who will not go right now.

 

[sethschroeder]

From what's been said they can't turn a profit with severely reduced capacity on a cruise ship. Social distancing is a big problem on a ship. In a theme park, you can snake any line all over the place. You can't do that on a cruise ship. Can you image the nightmare at Cabannas? Are you going to snake the line down the stairs?

Yeah, WDW is open with 35% capacity. But there are a lot of people who will not go right now.

There is a point in which running the ships will have them lose less money than not running the ships.

I brought it up in April when certain people didn't think WDW would open with severe park capacity restrictions. Disney doesn't need to make money its about not losing as much.

As for their ability to make a profit who knows in 2019 I think the numbers shows all up roughly about 25% profit but thats all up for DCL so that is not likely to be 1:1 to ship capacity profitability.

 

[jerry557]

I also don't think you can say that DCL will fill up without any problems by pointing to WDW. Other than masks, distancing, and some reduced experiences, there really isn't much difference at WDW. Even if people didn't go to the parks, they can still enjoy the resorts and the pools. They could go to Disney Springs. There are options there.

COVID restrictions on a cruise ship are likely to be VERY significant and overbearing on the experience, likely far more restrictive than what you get at WDW. Some of the stuff being talked about here and in other cruise forums like "reservations" just to go on the pool deck or anywhere else on the ship. No shows. No lounges. No shore excursions. Reduced food options. Masks everywhere, even on the open decks. No socializing at all, (which is the prime reason a lot of people like cruising to begin with.) Mandatory testing. Temperature checks multiple times a day. And now we are talking about mandatory vaccinations.

People are going to pay full price for this? Really? I mean people can spend their money however they want....but that's insane. How is this a vacation? I'd rather sit home for a week to be honest with you. There is no way in hell I'd pay thousands of dollars for this. With the way so many people and many government and companies have literally lost their minds over this virus....I will not go cruising again until the pandemic is over and all COVID restrictions are gone. If that never happens, I'll find other vacation options.

 

[jane01jp]

I also don't think you can say that DCL will fill up without any problems by pointing to WDW. Other than masks, distancing, and some reduced experiences, there really isn't much difference at WDW. Even if people didn't go to the parks, they can still enjoy the resorts and the pools. They could go to Disney Springs. There are options there.

COVID restrictions on a cruise ship are likely to be VERY significant and overbearing on the experience, likely far more restrictive than what you get at WDW. Some of the stuff being talked about here and in other cruise forums like "reservations" just to go on the pool deck or anywhere else on the ship. No shows. No lounges. No shore excursions. Reduced food options. Masks everywhere, even on the open decks. No socializing at all, (which is the prime reason a lot of people like cruising to begin with.) Mandatory testing. Temperature checks multiple times a day. And now we are talking about mandatory vaccinations.

People are going to pay full price for this? Really? I mean people can spend their money however they want....but that's insane. How is this a vacation? I'd rather sit home for a week to be honest with you. There is no way in hell I'd pay thousands of dollars for this. With the way so many people and many government and companies have literally lost their minds over this virus....I will not go cruising again until the pandemic is over and all COVID restrictions are gone. If that never happens, I'll find other vacation options.

I agree with all of your points. Without all of the shows, amenities, shipboard activities, etc., what you are left with is a floating hotel with very little to do but watch the water pass by. That is very relaxing, and enough for a lot of people who just want to read a book on their balconies. But, kids would absolutely hate it.

 

[Husker Mike]

COVID restrictions on a cruise ship are likely to be VERY significant and overbearing on the experience, likely far more restrictive than what you get at WDW. Some of the stuff being talked about here and in other cruise forums like "reservations" just to go on the pool deck or anywhere else on the ship. No shows. No lounges. No shore excursions. Reduced food options. Masks everywhere, even on the open decks. No socializing at all, (which is the prime reason a lot of people like cruising to begin with.) Mandatory testing. Temperature checks multiple times a day. And now we are talking about mandatory vaccinations.

People are going to pay full price for this? Really? I mean people can spend their money however they want....but that's insane. How is this a vacation? I'd rather sit home for a week to be honest with you. There is no way in hell I'd pay thousands of dollars for this. With the way so many people and many government and companies have literally lost their minds over this virus....I will not go cruising again until the pandemic is over and all COVID restrictions are gone. If that never happens, I'll find other vacation options.

I don't believe that COVID restrictions will be like a light switch, where it's either on or off. Instead, each specific restriction will be evaluated and reviewed differently as time goes on, and some will be relaxed sooner than others. Social distancing will gradually be relaxed as the disease wanes; you many not even realize it still exists at the end. (Disney's accountants may be the only ones who know for sure.) Mask requirements probably will be the outlier; I suspect you will be asked to wear a mask to fly for a long time to come; in fact, I think it's entirely possible that it'll become a permanent aspect on board. "Full service" buffets may never go away, because even if COVID is controlled, Norovirus isn't. Mandatory testing before you board? Very likely to continue for a while, because you don't know if the pandemic is contained if you aren't testing for it. Shows will gradually return; might not even go away at resumption. Lounges will reopen. Temperature checks don't have much of a scientific basis for COVID, so that probably won't happen when cruising resumes. Mandatory vaccinations? Probably not, but proof of vaccination may earn you something akin to a Fastpass to allow you to bypass some restrictions.

 

[mmackeymouse]

To clarify typically polls will show; 40% will get it immediately, 25% will get it fairly soon, 25% will get it eventually, 10% will never get it.

Now with mandating a vaccine that typically will come down to roughly 40-50% being okay with a mandate and 50-60% of people being opposed to mandated vaccines.

There is a major difference and the masking and vaccine debate are completely non-related in many peoples eyes.

Yes, they are different, but the similarity I think is a big one, and I think something you can't gauge from a poll...and even if you could, you couldn't because people don't always reveal their true thoughts.

I think something you see and will see in both the mask AND vaccine situation is.....there are people who are all talk. Or, on a lesser scale...people who are a bit more impressionable about it than they would admit. People who say they won't do something....or are opposed to something....

BUT

If it starts to affect their lives, and what *they* want to do....ultimately, they are going to do what they have to do to make life easier for them. Go to the store. Or go to a college graduation. Or go on the vacations they had planned.

We saw it with masks....people who were opposed to stores requiring masks, and saying they were boycotting, and this, that, or the other....ultimately, most people wore the stupid mask and sucked it up, Buttercup. On the WDW side, we saw people who vehemently said, if WDW requires masks, they are NOT going....and ultimately....they had a change of heart.

I think you will see the same thing with vaccine...Of the 50-60% of people opposed to vaccines that you mentioned, there is likely a chunk, and I don't know how big a chunk, of people who would be persuaded to do it, if it benefits them. Which is where DCL comes in. I think there is a population of people who are opposed to a vaccine, but would still do it in order to keep their cruise.

And, again...like I said, it is impossible to quantify. But, I think it is also an important thing to keep in mind.

If DCL was hell bent on it they likely could. Most US laws will not apply to them. They could also basically require while not requiring it making it so difficult to sail without it people just pass on the idea.

Now I don't think they will do that just saying I suspect they could require it.

I tend to agree with you that they will come up with something that will make it very difficult for someone to get on the ship unvaccinated.

What I envisioned was a mandatory 14 day quarantine prior to the cruise.....maybe even at a WDW hotel, so that they can keep track of Magic Band location and usage. Followed by testing, of course. Most people are not going to have the luxury of being able to take off work 14 days PLUS the cruise time, and most people aren't going to want or be able to pay for a WDW room for 2 weeks...even at a discounted rate.

Or maybe have a certificate of liability they sign that says that any outbreak that is contact traced back to them....that person is responsible for all monetary damages and medical bills that incur.....So, if a cruise gets cancelled bc of an outbreak? If someone gets helicoptered off the ship and it comes back that the unvaccinated person was the spreader? Those are some high numbers, and I just don't think a lot of people would want to assume that financial risk.

 

[eMoneyBug]

I’m guessing yes