Do you allow your kids' underage friends to drink at your house?

[luvsJack]

Yep you're right they're not stupid. Kids have been sneaking booze in front of the parents and teachers since ancient Romans starting stomping the first grapes into wine.

And since in NJ, that one "brain surgeon" kid who does manage to get a drink pass the all seeing eyes of these parents could make the parents criminally and financially liable. Lemonade all around folks.

And since you say they will be responsible enough not to drink, they won't mind having soda any way. And if a 18 year should be able to follow the rules, then a 45 year old uncle should be able to enjoy a barbeque without a brew.

I'm just a gal that likes to make my life easier. No booze, no worries about underage kids breaking the law on my premises.

What's funny is I've got 2 prospective freshmen files on my desk now. The kids came to Rowan for an open house (with their parents, I might add) and asked their parents could they go to a popular student hangout by themselves, long story short some one was hosting an event with beer and they decided to help themselves to a cup, got busted for underage drinking Now before they even are registered (they now have what is called an conditional offer) they've got a "disciplinary hearing". What I find so interesting that the first thing out of both sets of parents mouth was how normally "responsible" these kids were, how they were straight A students.
All Rowan sees now are two potential on campus problems.

The bolded part is what makes your story different from the group of kids at the OP's bbq. As I said, I have had adult/teen parties and we have had coolers with beer/wine coolers and coolers full of soft drinks for the under 21. We have NEVER had an issue. We have done this at my home and we have been at the lake with people coming and going and riding in the boat etc, lots of kids and lots of adults. NEVER have we had a teen even try to sneak a beer. Now, when they left our area they may have drank, I don't know. Unless its my kid, when they leave me they stop being my responsibility. I am only aware of what they did when they were at my get together, bbq, party, whatever. I never smelt alcohol on them when/if they returned or I would have taken their keys and called thier mom.

I don't think they are going to turn into "crazy people that cannot control their urge".

The big deal is if even just one under age kid somehow does have even just one drink, and then leaves, driving their car, and they are stopped for some reason, if they just recently had that one drink, a cop would smell it. And when the kid says he got the drink at the op's house, guess where the police are going next?

The kid doesn't have to be drunk, but even one drink for them is illegal. And I can guarantee you the cop will ask where the kid got the alcohol.

So you never have alcohol in your house at all? There is forever at least a 12 pack in my fridge--I don't drink but dh does. Two sons grew up in this house with their multitude of friends in and out. They were told--do NOT touch it. And lo and behold,they didn't. Did they drink somewhere else? Maybe. I don't kid myself into thinking I have perfect kids, but they didn't touch the beer here.

Wouldn't this be a similar situation to what you have just described:

It is a normal, typical day. 16 y/o has a few friends over to play video games. Parents are home but they are busy doing things around the house. One of the friends spots a beer in the fridge and guzzles it. He leaves and gets pulled over like your scenario above. He tells the officer that he got the beer at his friend's house.

In both situations, the parents did not willingly serve the teen. He helped himself without anyone's knowledge.

Are the parents still responsible? If the answer to that is yes, what is the solution? Do I really need to buy a lock for my refrigerator because some teen might try and drink a beer when I am not looking?

I just think it is ridiculous to not have faith in teens especially when there are plenty of adult eyes around. If the party in question would only have the college kids and the high school kids, no adults and booze, my answer would be different. It is a backyard BBQ with plenty of adults and some teens that seem to be good kids based on the OP'er experience. It isn't a wet T-shirt contest, strip poker playing, keg party.

I agree completely. It is absolutly silly to think that adults can NEVER drink around their teens because they might sneak a beer. There will be adult supervision, she's not leaving them to their own accord.

 

[luvsJack]

Went back and read the thread. Just a few more things to think about.......

A couple of posters mentioned "good" kids, athletes who'd never drink. As someone who did their fair share of drinking in high school I can tell you that the kids who played sports, the band geeks and the honor students all did more than their fair share of drinking. They might not have been experimenting with drugs but alcohol was a whole other story.

Its not really about "good" kids, its about the kids being supervised. And this not being a teen party.

And things haven't changed much since then. The one instance that I know of this year in our district where a parent was charged with providing alcohol to minors was after the homecoming dance. The Dad allowed the kids to have beer at the house, no one was to drive, an altercation broke out and one of the teens called 911. Want to know who those kids were? Football players and the girls on the homecoming court.

The parent in your story was knowinly serving alcohol. The OP will not be serving the underage crowd.

Something else to think about. Party crashers. With high schoolers and grad. parties there are always a lot of kids dropping by going from party to party, so while you may know a lot about your child's core group of friends, there's a very good chance you don't know much about every kid who drops by your house that day.

She is having a large bbq with mostly family. She is not having some wild party that all the kids are going to be clamoring to get to.

There's also nothing to say that any of those kids won't sneak their own flask of alcohol into your party or be drunk before they get there. And while you wouldn't be criminally liable for that, if your house is the last place that kid goes to and then they have an accident and parents who need someone to blame other than own child, you could very well end up spending lots of money in legal fees proving your own innocence.

That can very well happen whether she has alcohol at her part or not.

Which leads to the civil liability in all of this. Criminal charges are one thing but leaving that aside, if you have the alcohol there, you do leave yourself open to civil liability.

Yes, it puts a damper on the fun but that's the reality. Yes, 99% of the underage kids attending might be really good, rule following kids with understanding parents but all it takes is one kid, one act of stupidity, one sue-happy parent.

I can also tell you that as much as I might love a cold beer on a hot day during a picnic I would never have an issue and completely understand why a host would choose not to serve alcohol with underage kids in attendance.

Again, you don't have alcohol at your house? All of this liablity everyone keeps mentioning is IF YOU SERVE ALCOHOL TO MINORS. She isn't doing that. She is only planning to have it in the same area where they are. If you serve wine at dinner for you and your dh, and teens are at your table, you are doing the same thing the OP is planning!

I am really amazed at how some of you are answering this. We have beer at bbq's. We have teens at bbq's. Older ds is 29, dd is 13--we have been/will be doing this a long time. I would never think twice about having it around them. They know they can't drink it. I have stuff for them. I just don't see how its a big deal.

 

[tlbwriter]

Jill--have your open house, it won't turn into a drunken brawl like some here seem to think.

I don't think anybody expects a drunken brawl, just that an underage person might end up with a drink, and that could have serious consequences for the OP.

Again, you don't have alcohol at your house? All of this liablity everyone keeps mentioning is IF YOU SERVE ALCOHOL TO MINORS. She isn't doing that. She is only planning to have it in the same area where they are. If you serve wine at dinner for you and your dh, and teens are at your table, you are doing the same thing the OP is planning!

I think you're underestimating the OP's potential liability here. Sure, she's not going to SERVE alcohol to minors. But if she invites minors to a party, and alcohol is available, and someone gets even ONE drink and is stopped by the police later... it's going to get ugly. Is law enforcement really going to believe she didn't actually provide alcohol for minors, especially if they show up when the party is still going on and see that cooler of beer and a bunch of teens in the back yard with it? Maybe, if she goes overboard on the alcohol security, they'll believe she didn't make it available (and that's why I suggested a sign and different colors of drinks and clear cups and all that). But sticking her head in the sand and saying "Oh, they're all GOOD KIDS, and there's ADULT SUPERVISION, so I'm sure they'll be FINE" has the potential to put her in a very bad situation.

One tipsy teen is all it takes. Not a yard full of staggering drunks.

 

[Tink888]

Again, you don't have alcohol at your house? All of this liablity everyone keeps mentioning is IF YOU SERVE ALCOHOL TO MINORS. She isn't doing that. She is only planning to have it in the same area where they are. If you serve wine at dinner for you and your dh, and teens are at your table, you are doing the same thing the OP is planning!

Maybe, but when I serve wine at my table and teens are there, I can see EXACTLY where my wine is and EXACTLY what those teens are doing. As the number of people increases, my ability to monitor things decreases.

I am really amazed at how some of you are answering this. We have beer at bbq's. We have teens at bbq's. Older ds is 29, dd is 13--we have been/will be doing this a long time. I would never think twice about having it around them. They know they can't drink it. I have stuff for them. I just don't see how its a big deal.

My opinion isn't a judgment against those who would serve alcohol. Your party, have it as you like. It comes from years of working for attorneys and seeing the lawsuits that come about from those situations, the legal fees people have incurred from defending those suits (regardless of outcome) and the very real civil judgments that occur. 99% of the time, nothing happens and all is fine. It's that 1% that puts you at risk and there is no denying that the risk is there.

It doesn't matter whether or not you knowingly served alcohol to a minor, if you provide it and a minor drinks it and something happens, you CAN be held liable, both criminally and civilly.

Alcohol at a graduation party, where kids of various ages, who I may or may not know, are coming and going is not a risk that I personally am willing to take. I work to hard for my money and the risk to me, however small, isn't worth it.

 

[Rafiki31]

In my home state some parents were charged after an underage teen was drinking and then killed someone while driving home. I do not know how it ended, but it was all over the news that the kids were drinking in their basement while they were asleep. The parents claimed they had no knowledge of the drinking, but they were still charged. I think as an accessory? I do not remember all the details, but I remember wondering if they parents DID or DID NOT know if they kids were drinking.

 

[luvsJack]

Most of the case that you all keep quoting are cases where the adults were KNOWINGLY serving minors. This is completely different.

So, I am guessing that all of you either never had alcohol at family bbq's or outings where there are teen's present? Whether you call it a party or the family in the backyard--if there are teens and alcohol present all the things you all seem to think can happen can still happen.

The OP stated that it is a bbq/party with mostly family. Doesn't sound like the adults are going to get drunk and not be able to monitor the coolers with adult beverages in them. She doesn't have a bar set up where they can sneak a drink in a plastic cup. She will have bottles of beer and hard lemonade.

It just seems to me that you are all blowing the chances of these things happening way out of proportion.

No one said she should just turn a blind eye and assume there is no chance. Just saying there is no reason to not serve beer to the adults present.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Do you allow your kids' underage friends to drink at your house? ....

Back when it was a concern when the kids were at those ages, no, we did not. And when we were at other families' parties (grad parties mostly) back then, and if those parents allowed it, we were on guard the whole time at the party to monitor our two. And more than once, I did pass on my feelings to those other parents.

Have a good time, Jill. And congratulations to all.

 

[Jeafl]

OK, someone's got to ask...


Is your MIL coming to the party and will she bear gifts?????
This is the BIGGER question...

I can;t wait to hear what the 2 graduates are receiving from grandma! And congrats to you, Jill! All these DIS kids are growing up before our very eyes!!

Hi Brenda! As a matter of fact, my MIL and her husband will be driving down from Michigan to attend this party. I am fairly certain that she will be bringing the kids gifts as well. It should be interesting, that's for sure. I will report back if they get anything good!

 

[ols386]

The bolded part is what makes your story different from the group of kids at the OP's bbq. As I said, I have had adult/teen parties and we have had coolers with beer/wine coolers and coolers full of soft drinks for the under 21. We have NEVER had an issue. We have done this at my home and we have been at the lake with people coming and going and riding in the boat etc, lots of kids and lots of adults. NEVER have we had a teen even try to sneak a beer. Now, when they left our area they may have drank, I don't know. Unless its my kid, when they leave me they stop being my responsibility. I am only aware of what they did when they were at my get together, bbq, party, whatever. I never smelt alcohol on them when/if they returned or I would have taken their keys and called thier mom.

So you never have alcohol in your house at all? There is forever at least a 12 pack in my fridge--I don't drink but dh does. Two sons grew up in this house with their multitude of friends in and out. They were told--do NOT touch it. And lo and behold,they didn't. Did they drink somewhere else? Maybe. I don't kid myself into thinking I have perfect kids, but they didn't touch the beer here.

I agree completely. It is absolutly silly to think that adults can NEVER drink around their teens because they might sneak a beer. There will be adult supervision, she's not leaving them to their own accord.

Just because you never had an issue with under-age drinking at any of your get-togethers, doesn't mean there is not the potential for there to be a issue.

I just think in this particular situation, with it being a graduation party for both high school and college, there is going to be a mixture of age groups there, and the op is not going to be able to keep an eye on everyone all the time, even with other adults there. I envision that there will be a lot of people there, coming and going throughout the party.

 

[luvmy3]

Most of the case that you all keep quoting are cases where the adults were KNOWINGLY serving minors. This is completely different.

So, I am guessing that all of you either never had alcohol at family bbq's or outings where there are teen's present? Whether you call it a party or the family in the backyard--if there are teens and alcohol present all the things you all seem to think can happen can still happen.

The OP stated that it is a bbq/party with mostly family. Doesn't sound like the adults are going to get drunk and not be able to monitor the coolers with adult beverages in them. She doesn't have a bar set up where they can sneak a drink in a plastic cup. She will have bottles of beer and hard lemonade.

It just seems to me that you are all blowing the chances of these things happening way out of proportion.

No one said she should just turn a blind eye and assume there is no chance. Just saying there is no reason to not serve beer to the adults present.

 

[luvsJack]

Just because you never had an issue with under-age drinking at any of your get-togethers, doesn't mean there is not the potential for there to be a issue.

I just think in this particular situation, with it being a graduation party for both high school and college, there is going to be a mixture of age groups there, and the op is not going to be able to keep an eye on everyone all the time, even with other adults there. I envision that there will be a lot of people there, coming and going throughout the party.

How is this situation different? We had a boat at the lake. Several different families. Teens, young adults, older adults and kids. They were coming and going. Calling it a "party" doesn't make it more likely to happen. Its not as hard to monitor as you all are thinking it is.

 

[krcit]

Actually, in many states this is the case. In many states it is legal for minors to drink in bars/restaurants if they are with their parents too.

Jill--have your open house, it won't turn into a drunken brawl like some here seem to think. Put a sign on the coolers and have a great day!!

I didn't see anyone saying there would be a drunken brawl. I see posters concerned that the OP would be held liable for any underage drinking if some kids decide to sneak a drink and then have some sort of incident. It is not far-fetched to think that some teens will sneak a drink. Especially in a mixed age crowd where you might not know who is who. I don't get why some people seem to be taking it personally when some of us say that some teens may sneak a drink it's not an attack on anyone parenting or on the kid. It's just a part of growing up for some kids....making mistakes and doing stupid things.

My best friend just went to a seminar on 'hosting laws'. She told me that a lawyer there told them that in NY, if soeone underage drinks in your house, you are liable whether you knew that they were drinking or not.

 

[luvsJack]

I didn't see anyone saying there would be a drunken brawl. I see posters concerned that the OP would be held liable for any underage drinking if some kids decide to sneak a drink and then have some sort of incident. It is not far-fetched to think that some teens will sneak a drink. Especially in a mixed age crowd where you might not know who is who. I don't get why some people seem to be taking it personally when some of us say that some teens may sneak a drink it's not an attack on anyone parenting or on the kid. It's just a part of growing up for some kids....making mistakes and doing stupid things.

My best friend just went to a seminar on 'hosting laws'. She told me that a lawyer there told them that in NY, if soeone underage drinks in your house, you are liable whether you knew that they were drinking or not.

and that can happen whether you are having a party or not.

You monitor the situation. You do what the OP is planning and have bottles not cups that can have things hidden in them. You have the coolers with alcohol in them in a central location that can be easily seen by a lot of adults. And most of all, you make an announcement to the teens "underage drinking will NOT be tolerated. you are not allowed into these coolers"

Of course you have to take precautions.

 

[tlbwriter]

Most of the case that you all keep quoting are cases where the adults were KNOWINGLY serving minors. This is completely different.

Not in the eyes of the law. Not in every state. And of course that assumes you will be believed when you say you were not knowingly serving minors.

 

[luvsJack]

Not in the eyes of the law. Not in every state. And of course that assumes you will be believed when you say you were not knowingly serving minors.

Ok, I am done.

Some seem determined to live their lives in fear of what "might" happen or how it "could" turn out.

You live in fear--I will be over here at my big family bbq with a wine cooler and enjoying the day with my perfectly sober teens.

 

[tlbwriter]

Ok, I am done.

Some seem determined to live their lives in fear of what "might" happen or how it "could" turn out.

You live in fear--I will be over here at my big family bbq with a wine cooler and enjoying the day with my perfectly sober teens.

"Live in fear?" No, I call it "using common sense." And I don't see how a family BBQ even compares to a come-and-go graduation party, but I understand you're using that as an example because you think it supports your argument. Trust me, it doesn't.

 

[luvsJack]

"Live in fear?" No, I call it "using common sense." And I don't see how a family BBQ even compares to a come-and-go graduation party, but I understand you're using that as an example because you think it supports your argument. Trust me, it doesn't.

For the tenth time--HUGE bbq's with family and friends and lots of teens coming and going--two sons and now a daughter, and sometimes most of their class at school will come by at one point or another during the day. At my home and at the lake. I am not talking about 5-10 people here.

So yes it does compare to a come and go grad party. And yes, if you are going to go as far as "if they believe you", you are working on fear.

I have common sense and so do my teens. I give them a small amount of credit. I have enough common sense to know that I am quite able to monitor what goes on at my own party. I know that if I set up some coolers with alcohol in them and say "don't touch"; they don't touch. Do I hide the coolers behind the bushes so that they are tempted to try? No. But I don't sit on the thing either. All it takes is a little common sense to make sure they are not "served" any alcohol.

 

[tlbwriter]

Aw, I thought you said you were done.

 

[LisaR]

Not in the eyes of the law. Not in every state. And of course that assumes you will be believed when you say you were not knowingly serving minors.

You seem very concerned that something *might* happen. Assuming you have kids, have you taken precautions? Is your house dry? If not, do you padlock your refrigerator?

Anything *could* happen. I take precautions in my house. I don't leave booze lying out on my counters just like I wouldn't leave a loaded gun on my counter. But, I didn't throw out all our alcohol just because we had kids just like I didn't throw out our kitchen knives because some kid *could* hurt themselves.

 

[tlbwriter]

You seem very concerned that something *might* happen. Assuming you have kids, have you taken precautions? Is your house dry? If not, do you padlock your refrigerator?

Anything *could* happen. I take precautions in my house. I don't leave booze lying out on my counters just like I wouldn't leave a loaded gun on my counter. But, I didn't throw out all our alcohol just because we had kids just like I didn't throw out our kitchen knives because some kid *could* hurt themselves.

Why does my daily life have to be to the same standards as a big party? Yes, I have a child, and I have alcohol in my house. Does that mean that if I invite a bunch of 17 and 18 yr olds to my house, knowing that they might bring other 17 and 18 and 19 and 20 yr olds that I don't know, that I'm going to leave a cooler of beer in the vicinity and not pay really close attention to it? No, it does not. It doesn't mean I live in fear. It means I take reasonable precautions. And you know what else? I might leave a $20 bill sitting on the coffee table at home, but I'm not going to do that if I'm having a party with people I don't know (or barely know) coming and going. Oh my gawd, I'm paranoid!!!!!!

ETA... the OP was concerned with the legal ramifications. It's naive or ignorant to pretend there are none.