Covid And The Rest of Us

[NFLDERS]

The impact on individuals and businesses is very sad. I do wonder if business would have been down enough to still cause harm without restrictions though. It's also possible that COVID numbers would have been even higher. I guess that there is no way to know.

Nothing seems to work except being an island.

I prefer to think in Covid19 that every man is an island.

 

[NFLDERS]

An acronym you use frequently. How do you personally pick and choose which part of what the "officials" tell you that you willing to accept? While contact tracing everywhere has gotten quite overwhelmed, both the provincial and local municipal governments here have not entirely thrown in the towel. When they make a statement I take it at face value.

I prefer it over just saying.

As Niagara residents and people swarming here, contract tracing did not work. Visitors were outright lying about their identities. Then Niagara adopted a residents only to dine in that worked much better.

My roots from the most eastern part of Canada where life is a history of tragedy, and relatives there expressing their dismay at the carry on as they call it of fellow Canadians with covid restrictions ie.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I've read of one superspreader in a Belgian nursing home. They had a Sinterklaas celebration, and the son of one of the people living in the nursing home went by all the rooms to give a gift. No celebration in a common room, just one guy who turned out to be extremely contagious afterwards.

I'm sorry if I've lost track were masks still something needed to be worn in NL? If so would that have been a setting that a visitor would have been told to wear one or not? How sad that the son was just trying to be kind I'm sure giving gifts

 

[Karin1984]

I'm sorry if I've lost track were masks still something needed to be worn in NL? If so would that have been a setting that a visitor would have been told to wear one or not? How sad that the son was just trying to be kind I'm sure giving gifts

Yes, masks are mandatory inside since 1 December in the Netherlands. Compliance is okay. Here and there you read some stories about people going crazy, or shop holders not enforcing. But overall when I go to a store, the majority is compliant. Today there was supposed to be a protest, but it was cancelled by the organization (and denied access by the mayor) as they were going to protest in the city center (It's in the Bible Belt of the Netherlands, which is a very religious area)

But since the 1st our figures are going up. A lot of the infections are in schools. So several high schools have announced to go fully online. The government decided against extending the Christmas holidays by a week, because children are getting behind.
Amsterdam, Rotterdam and other big cities were extremely busy today according to the news.

The superspreader was in Belgium, I'm not 100% sure what the rules are in Belgium. But as the son was a common visitor due to his father living there, they decided it was okay (he was dressed up as Sinterklaas, like dressing up as Santa).
I've just googled the latest update.
They say now that it was in the common room and not in individual rooms. 57 people got infected, but it's unclear how many are inhabitants and how many are caretakers. The nursing home house about 150 people and there were no cases before. The nursing home says that the son dressed as Sinterklaas did wear a mask and didn't hand presents. Whatever happened, it totally sucks, for the people living there, the caretakers, the family who cannot visit now.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Yes, masks are mandatory inside since 1 December in the Netherlands. Compliance is okay. Here and there you read some stories about people going crazy, or shop holders not enforcing. But overall when I go to a store, the majority is compliant. Today there was supposed to be a protest, but it was cancelled by the organization (and denied access by the mayor) as they were going to protest in the city center (It's in the Bible Belt of the Netherlands, which is a very religious area)

But since the 1st our figures are going up. A lot of the infections are in schools. So several high schools have announced to go fully online. The government decided against extending the Christmas holidays by a week, because children are getting behind.
Amsterdam, Rotterdam and other big cities were extremely busy today according to the news.

The superspreader was in Belgium, I'm not 100% sure what the rules are in Belgium. But as the son was a common visitor due to his father living there, they decided it was okay (he was dressed up as Sinterklaas, like dressing up as Santa).
I've just googled the latest update.
They say now that it was in the common room and not in individual rooms. 57 people got infected, but it's unclear how many are inhabitants and how many are caretakers. The nursing home house about 150 people and there were no cases before. The nursing home says that the son dressed as Sinterklaas did wear a mask and didn't hand presents. Whatever happened, it totally sucks, for the people living there, the caretakers, the family who cannot visit now.

Sorry in my mind I got confused on where the nursing home superspreader event happened even though it was clear as day you said Belgium . Yipes you're right whatever occurred it's not a good outcome though masks worn/not worn is such a sticking point here in the States the news stories would probably be hyperfocused on that part if that happened here. I know places in my area have gone back and forth on allowing visitors to not including the long-term care and hospitals. I couldn't blame a place after a superspreader event tightening up and not allowing any visitors; sad but understandable.

So back to NL--The school thing is something that I've been watching; the older kids are the ones who appear to be more the worry/concern over spread. It's good to hear that compliance with masks is generally good. Are there any figures done on the children getting behind part? I would love a global study to be done on the educational impacts (honestly ALL the impacts) if money and time was no object. I never want to go through something like this again but gosh darnnit if I have to I feel like we need to be able to make informed policies. I know a lot of people discuss the 1918 Flu Pandemic but our lives are just nowhere near what they were 100 years ago it's hard to make policies based on a time that resembles virtually nothing of today.

 

[Karin1984]

Sorry in my mind I got confused on where the nursing home superspreader event happened even though it was clear as day you said Belgium . Yipes you're right whatever occurred it's not a good outcome though masks worn/not worn is such a sticking point here in the States the news stories would probably be hyperfocused on that part if that happened here. I know places in my area have gone back and forth on allowing visitors to not including the long-term care and hospitals. I couldn't blame a place after a superspreader event tightening up and not allowing any visitors; sad but understandable.

So back to NL--The school thing is something that I've been watching; the older kids are the ones who appear to be more the worry/concern over spread. It's good to hear that compliance with masks is generally good. Are there any figures done on the children getting behind part? I would love a global study to be done on the educational impacts (honestly ALL the impacts) if money and time was no object. I never want to go through something like this again but gosh darnnit if I have to I feel like we need to be able to make informed policies. I know a lot of people discuss the 1918 Flu Pandemic but our lives are just nowhere near what they were 100 years ago it's hard to make policies based on a time that resembles virtually nothing of today.

In NL our government deliberately chose to allow visitors to nursing homes now. As during the first wave the lack of human contact and basically being locked up did more harm than the actual deaths/infections. It's hard to put into figures what is better. Someone having a chance of dying sooner due to Covid, but being able to visit and be there when needed, or keeping the elderly locked up. There is no good answer.

For the superspreader, the nursing home released a statement stating that they have to make the same hard choices to make like everyone else. They chose mental health over physical health, and they chose wrong in this case.

1918 is such a bad example to compare today to, except that it was a pandemic. There were no options to work from home, there was no ventilation etc. and a lot of kids would be lucky to be in school.

The problem in schools is that children have to rely much more on their parents to help. Children of parents who are 'low-educated' (not sure if this is the term in English), are the kids for who this crisis is the most problematic. Also these parents do not have the highest income, which sucks when it comes to laptops/computers/wifi at home. Schools have options and funds to loan laptops, but in every way these kids pay the price more than the ones from privileged families.
I read one article about a school, where about 50% of the children needs some form of extra guidance, now that's at 75% also due to stress, loneliness etc. Grades going down. The government has given each school 50.000 euro to use to keep students on track, but the school says it's not enough.

 

[lisaviolet]

Am I correct that you live alone? Here our restrictions completely prohibit social contact with anyone outside our immediate household either indoors or out, in public or private settings. BUT people who live alone are permitted to designate two others as "essential personal contacts" and are able to meet with them (i.e. your sister). Is it the same in Ontario? I'm also curious about your comment regarding "travelling nonsense". What exactly did you mean? Is there a curfew or limited distances you can be away from your home? Did you do anything wrong?

I do live alone Annette.

In the first lockdown there were no provisions for single households. It wasn't pleasant but it wasn't that great of a sacrifice either, I am forever bowing to those who came before us. And with looking after my mother I was both used to the idea of having to stay indoors at times (though we were very active) and a lack of in person vocal communication some days, as my mom was mute for her last two years (another was in and out of the home so I had in person contact).


Off topic but I found myself talking out loud to a commerical the other day - hysterical lockdown madness. This guy was introduced as Hector. I heard myself say, "Boy Hector, you're one good looking man". And then it got better I later followed the story of the commercial and added "Oh crap you're married".

Poor advertising team, I didn't even notice the product/company highlighted.

So yes they have allowed single households in Ontario to team up with one household over this lockdown, with one family - for our own mental stability.

They are highlighting that ability mainly for Christmas. So I will stay slightly ignorant on purpose. With my sister I saw her in car, with masks most of the time. I will keep options open for Christmas or at the minimum Christmas season. It can not be that sister, she will not come here so I can cook for her and my niece (long story).

No I didn't do anything wrong. But I am probably going to stretch it one day before or on Christmas. Once. So that was probably on my mind while writing. I will be at the minimum dropping off presents to my grandnephews and niece. Typing that makes me feel old!

My travelling nonsense was twofold. One, I can't be highlighting everyone filling the streets and parking lots there when I was as well. It is hypocritical. Although I went in one place for essentials.

And two, her area borders Toronto proper. So I suspect it was packed due to those in lockdown setting themselves free to have a shopping frenzy, by visiting their municipal neighbours.

This is how whack it is for businesses. Those areas neighbouring lockdowns must be making a killing in profits.

--------

My niece is another neighbouring community and just went into lockdown. So changes are coming. I suspect being a neighbouring community to our constant lockdowns contributed to the unfortunate rise in their numbers.

 

[NFLDERS]

Thought I'd put this out here. The last 100 or so years have seen life expectancy go from 37 years of age, to where we are now in part because of eradication of disease by vaccination.

My avatar is of our schools Polio epidemic era, and subsequent vaccinations.

My wish is for all here to be able, and willing to receive your vaccination in due course.

In the meantime, and after being vaccinated 'Stay Safe.'

 

[NFLDERS]

I do live alone Annette.

In the first lockdown there were no provisions for single households. It wasn't pleasant but it wasn't that great of a sacrifice either, I am forever bowing to those who came before us. And with looking after my mother I was both used to the idea of having to stay indoors at times (though we were very active) and a lack of in person vocal communication some days, as my mom was mute for her last two years (another was in and out of the home so I had in person contact).


Off topic but I found myself talking out loud to a commerical the other day - hysterical lockdown madness. This guy was introduced as Hector. I heard myself say, "Boy Hector, you're one good looking man". And then it got better I later followed the story of the commercial and added "Oh crap you're married".

Poor advertising team, I didn't even notice the product/company highlighted.

So yes they have allowed single households in Ontario to team up with one household over this lockdown, with one family - for our own mental stability.

They are highlighting that ability mainly for Christmas. So I will stay slightly ignorant on purpose. With my sister I saw her in car, with masks most of the time. I will keep options open for Christmas or at the minimum Christmas season. It can not be that sister, she will not come here so I can cook for her and my niece (long story).

No I didn't do anything wrong. But I am probably going to stretch it one day before or on Christmas. Once. So that was probably on my mind while writing. I will be at the minimum dropping off presents to my grandnephews and niece. Typing that makes me feel old!

My travelling nonsense was twofold. One, I can't be highlighting everyone filling the streets and parking lots there when I was as well. It is hypocritical. Although I went in one place for essentials.

And two, her area borders Toronto proper. So I suspect it was packed due to those in lockdown setting themselves free to have a shopping frenzy, by visiting their municipal neighbours.

This is how whack it is for businesses. Those areas neighbouring lockdowns must be making a killing in profits.

--------

My niece is another neighbouring community and just went into lockdown. So changes are coming. I suspect being a neighbouring community to our constant lockdowns contributed to the unfortunate rise in their numbers.

We are in Niagara area of Ontario. We are advised to spend the holidays with members of our own household only. If someone lives alone they are allowed as a single person to spend time with one other household during the holidays.

My hometown of Hamilton I suspect will not fare well during the holiday period because they were not moved into lockdown. The reason was although their numbers were equal (being part of the GTA Toronto and surrounding areas) they simply have more hospital rooms available... sigh.

 

[lisaviolet]

If someone lives alone they are allowed another single person to be with them during the holidays.

Now of course I could have heard incorrectly, but I believe a single person can be with one other household during the holiday. Is Niagara different on the verbiage?

 

[mommasita]

S

 

[elphaba91]

So Victoria officially has cases - (hopefully!) safely locked away in hotel quarantine though. Even though it was definitely to be expected, there are some people who are panicking unnecessarily.

On a personal level, my cousin and his wife, who live in Uganda, are in quarantine after being exposed to a positive case. They went to a farewell party for a friend who was moving overseas. At some point during travel (I’m not sure which end) the friend tested positive. The big problem is my cousin’s wife is pregnant and was scheduled for a c-section on the 21st. The hospital is a couple of hours away in Kampala and they were going to be travelling there next weekend to get settled into the apartment they are staying at. The baby could come as late as the 30th but they aren’t sure what they’re going to do. Apparently over their they are also asking for family to care for patients instead of nurses at the moment, which her mother was going to do, but now they are worried about exposing her. They also have to pay for testing out of pocket; my aunt is happy to pay for it, but it would no doubt be impossible for many of there, and it’s even difficult for them to decide when to get tested. It’s a very tricky situation.

They also haven’t done their Christmas shopping for their other two kids or for their other daughter’s birthday on the 28th and online shopping isn’t really an option there (and the Aussie side of the family is just sending money this year so there’s no gifts from us either!).

 

[lisaviolet]

NL our government deliberately chose to allow visitors to nursing homes now. As during the first wave the lack of human contact and basically being locked up did more harm than the actual deaths/infections.

I am not sure if I mentioned this on this thread -

A senior in a retirement home here applied for a medically assisted death and was granted it after her second attempt.

She was a very active senior who asked for it because she was unwilling to go through another lockdown.

Her family said she was always going to apply for a medically assisted death but her physical and mental decline during Covid hastened her choice. Regardless it was difficult to take in - I had a myriad of feelings and thoughts about her choice. And about the government's choices.

My sister has her place in Tremblant, but she is working on 2 movies being filmed downtown, which for some reason are not shut down

That is what I forgot to mention! I have a massive, the word is not dramatic, shoot going on in my neighbourhood. While we are in lockdown. Some days I pass a couple of hundred cars parked in two parking lots and trailers for Covid testing.

I bike in the exact area where they are filming. It is a very popular area in general and during Covid, because it is at the lake. We all use it to unwind. I bug the hell out of them by jockeying for position, when security cars take other cars, trucks and vans in and out of a cut off filming area. They have to go slow, I don't. I am sure they think the cold is going to clear their way, from all of us. It is not.

I *think* it is a Jason Momoa shoot - Possibly See, season 2?

. The big problem is my cousin’s wife is pregnant and was scheduled for a c-section on the 21st. The hospital is a couple of hours away in Kampala and they were going to be travelling there next weekend to get settled into the apartment they are staying at. The baby could come as late as the 30th but they aren’t sure what they’re going to do. Apparently over their they are also asking for family to care for patients instead of nurses at the moment, which her mother was going to do, but now they are worried about exposing her. They also have to pay for testing out of pocket; my aunt is happy to pay for it, but it would no doubt be impossible for many of there, and it’s even difficult for them to decide when to get tested. It’s a very tricky situation.

Sigh to all the difficult decisions and God bless.

 

[mommasita]

So Victoria officially has cases - (hopefully!) safely locked away in hotel quarantine though. Even though it was definitely to be expected, there are some people who are panicking unnecessarily.

On a personal level, my cousin and his wife, who live in Uganda, are in quarantine after being exposed to a positive case. They went to a farewell party for a friend who was moving overseas. At some point during travel (I’m not sure which end) the friend tested positive. The big problem is my cousin’s wife is pregnant and was scheduled for a c-section on the 21st. The hospital is a couple of hours away in Kampala and they were going to be travelling there next weekend to get settled into the apartment they are staying at. The baby could come as late as the 30th but they aren’t sure what they’re going to do. Apparently over their they are also asking for family to care for patients instead of nurses at the moment, which her mother was going to do, but now they are worried about exposing her. They also have to pay for testing out of pocket; my aunt is happy to pay for it, but it would no doubt be impossible for many of there, and it’s even difficult for them to decide when to get tested. It’s a very tricky situation.

They also haven’t done their Christmas shopping for their other two kids or for their other daughter’s birthday on the 28th and online shopping isn’t really an option there (and the Aussie side of the family is just sending money this year so there’s no gifts from us either!).

oh golly, I hope and pray for a positive outcome for everyone

 

[mommasita]

S

 

[ronandannette]

I am not sure if I mentioned this on this thread -

A senior in a retirement home here applied for a medically assisted death and was granted it after her second attempt.

She was a very active senior who asked for it because she was unwilling to go through another lockdown.

Her family said she was always going to apply for a medically assisted death but her physical and mental decline during Covid hastened her choice. Regardless it was difficult to take in - I had a myriad of feelings and thoughts about her choice. And about the government's choices.

This is like something out a dystopian horror movie.

 

[lisaviolet]

....Greek Resto nearby, (fabulous food!) and we order at least once a week, we Love the owners as well. I call it in, and she tells me 7 HOURS!

Holy crap!

Did you tell her you'll fly to Greece instead?

 

[lisaviolet]

This is like something out a dystopian horror movie.

Yes, it was very uncomfortable to hear. And read. But her intention was firm.

I take it you are morally against assisted death Annette? Beyond the conditions imposed on her freedom and health. (Obviously if that is too personal, ignore me)

 

[mommasita]

[s

 

[ronandannette]

Yes, it was very uncomfortable to hear. And read. But her intention was firm.

I take it you are morally against assisted death Annette? Beyond the conditions imposed on her freedom and health. (Obviously if that is too personal, ignore me)

I am morally (if that's the right word) opposed to death by despair. Morally opposed to people with loved ones and resources feeling so desperate that their lives aren't worth living. Medically assisted death is suicide, no matter how you parse it and that anyone gets to the point where they feel that is their best option is spiritually and emotionally horrifying to me.