Circumcision may stop millions of HIV deaths-study

[Tinijocaro]

I guess my point is, since circumcision removes a healthy, functional body part of someone who hasn't agreed to it, will it be the right decision for your son? Doesn't matter if it is the right decision for you or your family. It's not your body part or your family's body part that is being removed. It belongs to the man that your son will become.

But yes, since it is legal, it is your choice.

 

[MickeyMouseGal]

EXACTLY!!!

Thank you!

 

[BuckNaked]

I guess my point is, since circumcision removes a healthy, functional body part of someone who hasn't agreed to it, will it be the right decision for your son?

At 10 days old, my son didn't get to make decisons. Actually, at 10 years old, there are lots of decisions he doesn't get to make. Since DH is circed, I spoke with our pediatrician and he recommended. That was good enough for me.

Doesn't matter if it is the right decision for you or your family.

Yes, it does.

It's not your body part or your family's body part that is being removed. It belongs to the man that your son will become.

If his father is any indication my son will be no less of a man because he is missing a small piece of skin on his *****.

What I don't get is why you are so concerned with what other people do with their sons? Do what you want with your kids, and leave us to do what we think is right for ours. Sound fair?

 

[MickeyMouseGal]

Until they are adults, I am the advocate for my childrens' health.
Most children would choose not to be vaccinated, as they are unable to see the benefits of the vaccines at their age.
Just like vaccines, I believe there is a benefit to circumcision and will do so to protect them.

 

[BuckNaked]

Most children would choose not to be vaccinated, as they are unable to see the benefits of the vaccines at their age.

Again, exactly! I went 10 rounds with my 12 yo DD a few days ago about the HPV vaccine. Explained everything about it, why I believed it was important for her to get it, etc. Her response? "I hate shots, I'd rather take my chances with cancer." I told her I was very sorry if I had given her the impression that she had a say in this, but that she is getting the vaccine.

 

[MickeyMouseGal]

From that same Pediatrics website:

Increase of male urinary tract infections as circumcision rates decline.
"As the number of circumcised boys decreased (with a resultant increase in the total number of boys with infection), the male to female ratio of urinary tract infections during the first 3 months of life reversed, reflecting a movement toward a male predominance for infection in early infancy. "

"Properly performed newborn circumcision prevents phimosis, paraphimosis, and balanoposthitis and has been shown to decrease the incidence of cancer of the ***** among US men. It may result in a decreased incidence of urinary tract infection. However, in the absence of well-designed prospective studies, conclusions regarding the relationship of urinary tract infection to circumcision are tentative. An increased incidence of cancer of the cervix has been found in sexual partners of uncircumcised men infected with human papillomavirus. Evidence concerning the association of sexually transmitted diseases and circumcision is conflicting. Newborn circumcision is a rapid and generally safe procedure when performed by an experienced operator."

Etc., etc., etc....

Like I said before... several times actually... I believe there are benefits and I support circumcision for my children.

 

[JennyMominRI]

Again, exactly! I went 10 rounds with my 12 yo DD a few days ago about the HPV vaccine. Explained everything about it, why I believed it was important for her to get it, etc. Her response? "I hate shots, I'd rather take my chances with cancer." I told her I was very sorry if I had given her the impression that she had a say in this, but that she is getting the vaccine.

See,this is another one of those things where I can see both sides.. Some people see some benefits, especially with the HIV info.. On the other hand I'd love to see some stats comparing us to Europe,about circumcision.. I just like to see people making educated decsions..I made an uneducated decision with my oldest son..I did it because everyone else I knew did it.. I also had no idea that RIC's were usually done without any anesthesia..If people look at all the facts available and come to an educated decision about it that's a good thing.. I felt very guilty because of the circ complications my DS had and felt guilty about it.. I'd rather see parents not end up feeling guilty(either way they decide)like I did.

 

[MickeyMouseGal]

Again, exactly! I went 10 rounds with my 12 yo DD a few days ago about the HPV vaccine. Explained everything about it, why I believed it was important for her to get it, etc. Her response? "I hate shots, I'd rather take my chances with cancer." I told her I was very sorry if I had given her the impression that she had a say in this, but that she is getting the vaccine.

Wow, we're in total agreement!
Am I going to stress monogomy to my children? Yes.
Am I going to protect them in any way possible if they are not? Absolutely.

 

[BuckNaked]

Wow, we're in total agreement!
Am I going to stress monogomy to my children? Yes.
Am I going to protect them in any way possible if they are not? Absolutely.

Same here. And even being monogamous may not be enough - what if her one and only partner is infected? Sorry, not taking that chance if it can be avoided.

 

[JennyMominRI]

Same here. And even being monogamous may not be enough - what if her one and only partner is infected? Sorry, not taking that chance if it can be avoided.

:X....Yeah..Monogamy didn't work well for me

 

[VSL]

Well, I don't know how all our European men are dealing with not being circ'd. It's just not something that comes up here unless
- Judaism is a factor
- the boy or man needs one for medical reasons

The vast majority of our male population still have their foreskin, and I doubt* that the rate of infections or whatnot here is any higher overall than it is in the US.


*I haven't researched this, but I'm pretty sure that we would have heard something if being circ'd had so many potential benefits.

 

[snowwite]

See,this is another one of those things where I can see both sides.. Some people see some benefits, especially with the HIV info.. On the other hand I'd love to see some stats comparing us to Europe,about circumcision.. I just like to see people making educated decsions..I made an uneducated decision with my oldest son..I did it because everyone else I knew did it.. I also had no idea that RIC's were usually done without any anesthesia..If people look at all the facts available and come to an educated decision about it that's a good thing.. I felt very guilty because of the circ complications my DS had and felt guilty about it.. I'd rather see parents not end up feeling guilty(either way they decide)like I did.

I agree with your posts. But then I am probably consisered radical by patients/parents who chose to blindly follow western medicine and physicians who are more interested in making money from "routine" surgeries and testing. When I had my kids I did a lot of research and changed physicians twice. We had a birth plan as well as a back up plan. I learned that the US rates for routine circumcision(that is not done for a medical reason) is very high. Ther rates for cesearean section were also quite high at 25% when my last child was born. Episiotomies are also done extensively when more often than not the perineum can be stretched with massage and warm oil avoiding the need for one at all. Most of the procedures done to make the natural process of birth into a medical procedure were concocted my male physicians so that they can control the process. I am not advacating anyone who truly requires an urgent c-section or episiotomy not have one but I am saying that you should educate yourself before you or your family go under the knife. My kids were delivered by midwives and our family physician is a homeopathic MD. I am an RN with over 20 years experience. I now consult for an insurance company. Some HMO plans are adding languauge to only cover circumcision that is deemed medically necessary due to phymosis,hypospadius and other medical conditions which the doctor would need to prove. My mom worked nursey for 20 years and when I was working float pool I occassionally worked there. The doctor strapped the baby to a papoose board,binding thier arms and legs. He did not administer any anestetic or pain medicine. He cut off the foreskin or used a bell clamp where a metal clamp was closed over the end until it fell off a few days later. Let me tell you these babies feel horrific pain. They just cannot say so. When I said something to the doctor he responded well,he wont remember it on his wedding day! and actually laughed. When my precious son was born I could not bring myself to do it to him. I understand that most people do have it done. I am just trying to educate people who have not made a decision yet so that maybe those little boys can go through life whole and intact.

 

[Galahad]

Most of the procedures done to make the natural process of birth into a medical procedure were concocted my male physicians so that they can control the process.

To each his own - rather than bullet point your post, I just want to state the opinion that the above is hooeey. My female DW, MFM OB has a personal c-section rate of over 90%. (flame away) She sees only high risk patients. The goal is to send a healthy baby and a healthy mother home - preferably on the same day. Any other goal is superfluous. (but apparently she's only in it for the money......)

 

[BuckNaked]

To each his own - rather than bullet point your post, I just want to state the opinion that the above is hooeey. My female DW, MFM OB has a personal c-section rate of over 90%. (flame away) She sees only high risk patients. The goal is to send a healthy baby and a healthy mother home - preferably on the same day. Any other goal is superfluous. (but apparently she's only in it for the money......)

Yep - bad, bad wife!!

I understand that most people do have it done. I am just trying to educate people who have not made a decision yet so that maybe those little boys can go through life whole and intact.

And here's the question that I still haven't had answered - why do YOU care what other families choose to do with THEIR sons? Why is it a goal of yours that boys other than your own go through life "...whole and intact..."? What difference does it make to YOUR life whether or not someone else's foreskin is in place?

 

[MzDiz]

And here's the question that I still haven't had answered - why do YOU care what other families choose to do with THEIR sons? Why is it a goal of yours that boys other than your own go through life "...whole and intact..."? What difference does it make to YOUR life whether or not someone else's foreskin is in place?

Why do we care about the horrors in other countries? Why should we care that girls in North Africa are mutilated? Why should we care if our neighbor beats his kids? Doesn't make a difference in our lives, right?

 

[BuckNaked]

Why do we care about the horrors in other countries? Why should we care that girls in North Africa are mutilated? Why should we care if our neighbor beats his kids? Doesn't make a difference in our lives, right?

Ah, now I see...circumcision is the equivalent of North African mutilations and child abuse...

Like I said in the other thread, this will be the great new "cause".

 

[JennyMominRI]

Ah, now I see...circumcision is the equivalent of North African mutilations and child abuse...

Like I said in the other thread, this will be the great new "cause".

This has been a hot topic on lots of perentings boards that I have posted on for the last 9 years or so... IT's so hot that some have even created seperate boards just for the circ debate.

 

[chobie]

Ah, now I see...circumcision is the equivalent of North African mutilations and child abuse...

Like I said in the other thread, this will be the great new "cause".

Actually, this debate has been going on in society and the medical community for quite some time. And the numbers of people who chose not to cut are going up, though in some areas more than others. I doubt it will ever be the next "big" thing, but will slowly become the norm. First though, we will have to conitnue to endure people defensive of the procedure ridiculing little boys who have not had this done as being "aardvarks" and "unlcean."

Though I don't consider female genital mutilation and male circumcision to be analagous, I do find it intersting that they use degrogatory names to shame little girls who have not FGM into having the procedure. Those girls will all attest that they are glad they had it done so they would not be different from the others.

 

[BuckNaked]

This has been a hot topic on lots of perentings boards that I have posted on for the last 9 years or so... IT's so hot that some have even created seperate boards just for the circ debate.

Oh, I have no doubt that there are people that actually believe such nonsense.

 

[BuckNaked]

First though, we will have to conitnue to endure people defensive of the procedure ridiculing little boys who have not had this done as being "aardvarks" and "unlcean."

I would never ridicule a little boy, but then again, I have no reason to be seeing what little boys have or haven't had done. My personal experience was that I found the "uncut version" to be repugnant and a complete turnoff, but that's just me. YMMV.