Bombshell Obama Pastor Video

[chris1gill]

I keep my smilie use to a minimum and use it only when warranted. The ridiculous attempt to spin his speech into one that all some people get out of it is an imagined insult to his grandmother deserves all the smilies it gets, imho.

OK, this deserves it

 

[SwedishMeatball]

Really? Is that how you see it? He didn't have to do anything, as the firestorm a lot of you Cons have prayed for has not occured. He wrote the speech and decided to give it against his advisor's advice. Hardly something that had to be done from any strategic standpoint. Again, just wishful thinking from his opponents.

Absolutely!! I don't even believe that he was advised not to give the speech. He had no choice but to address this issue when things didn't quiet down after making the interview rounds the other day. It has nothing to do with wishful thinking. When this first hit I, along with many of his supporters, agreed that he needed to come forth and talk about it. My point is that he chose to initially lie, when what he should have done is taken the approach he did in this speech. Does that mean that some would have still been against him?? Yep. It doesn't change the fact though that he lied and that can't be reversed. Some people won't get over that, and if you're not objective enough to realize that, then far be it from me to convince you otherwise.

 

[chris1gill]

So "controversial" and "incendiary hate language" equal the same thing to you? And we're the ones who spin???? And you might just want to read the second sentence of the first statement you bolded.

Uh, I have to agree with you eclectics, they're trying to spin anything they can

I believe there is a large difference between the new uses of language, but that's just to my trained eye

 

[LuvDuke]

Here is what he said Friday on Countdown:



This is what was said today in his speech:


Spin that.

No spin necessary. Read what you posted. Might as well: everyone else is.

 

[lovetomow]

Uh, I have to agree with you eclectics, they're trying to spin anything they can

I believe there is a large difference between the new uses of language, but that's just to my trained eye

Nope, it's the fact Obama followers refuse to even consider that the man could actually do something wrong. It's really kinda funny in a sad way!

 

[MyManGoofy!]

Perception is reality people. The perception is that he changed what he said from Friday to today.

Whatever. You all seem to want to just be rude and childish with the snarky little icons and argue semantics. Fine.

 

[punkin]

Here is what he said Friday on Countdown:



This is what was said today in his speech:


Spin that.

Well I guess you and I are reading the same words as the Obama supporters, but they seem to mean something entirely different to them. There is no way to win this argument. The voters (and the superdelegates) will decide.

 

[eclectics]

Absolutely!! I don't even believe that he was advised not to give the speech. He had no choice but to address this issue when things didn't quiet down after making the interview rounds the other day. It has nothing to do with wishful thinking. When this first hit I, along with many of his supporters, agreed that he needed to come forth and talk about it. My point is that he chose to initially lie, when what he should have done is taken the approach he did in this speech. Does that mean that some would have still been against him?? Yep. It doesn't change the fact though that he lied and that can't be reversed. Some people won't get over that, and if you're not objective enough to realize that, then far be it from me to convince you otherwise.

That about says it all.

How can anyone be expected to debate with someone who is going to dismiss the other with claims that their side's points are merely lies?

 

[agentpleakley]

Well I guess you and I are reading the same words as the Obama supporters, but they seem to mean something entirely different to them. There is no way to win this argument. The voters (and the superdelegates) will decide.

Absolutely.

 

[Duckfan-in-Chicago]

Perception is reality people. The perception is that he changed what he said from Friday to today.

Whatever. You all seem to want to just be rude and childish with the snarky little icons and argue semantics. Fine.

Well I guess you and I are reading the same words as the Obama supporters, but they seem to mean something entirely different to them. There is no way to win this argument. The voters (and the superdelegates) will decide.

Yep. Ultimately I don't see a whole new bunch of people over on this thread defending him since this speech wowed everyone. Same old, same old as yesterday. He felt he had to make it and it didn't seem to change many people's views at least on here.

We'll have to wait and see how the next few states vote.

 

[eclectics]

Perception is reality people. The perception is that he changed what he said from Friday to today.

Whatever. You all seem to want to just be rude and childish with the snarky little icons and argue semantics. Fine.

If someone had a strong, legitimate argument with viable proof then they wouldn't let a few smilies get in the way. JMHO

 

[LuvDuke]

Nope, it's the fact Obama followers refuse to even consider that the man could actually do something wrong. It's really kinda funny in a sad way!

What's really funny is that 3 people have been asked to back up their statement and one comes up with something that disproves what he's trying to say.

Just admit you have no idea what those controversial statements are and the wishing and hoping it was the "GD America" speech wasn't the one.

At least be honest with yourself.

 

[LuvDuke]

If someone had a strong, legitimate argument with viable proof then they wouldn't let a few smilies get in the way. JMHO

Amen.

If someone has a strong legitimate argument with viable proof, they present it.

If they don't have a strong legitimate argument and no viable proof, they preach to the choir hoping no one notices.

 

[OceanAnnie]

What's really funny is that 3 people have been asked to back up their statement and one comes up with something that disproves what he's trying to say.

Just admit you have no idea what those controversial statements are and the wishing and hoping it was the "GD America" speech wasn't the one.

At least be honest with yourself.

I think, "GD America", is controversial. Why is it not? ETA- To you.

 

[disneyfan67]

I think the conversations taking place on this board is a good example of how this issue will just further divide people in our country.

I have to agree and I've been thinking a lot lately about the upcoming election and how it may be a no win for the American people. If a Democrat wins the WH in 08, I just can't see the right wing simply forgetting about the last 8 years of what's been done to President Bush. Some of it was justified and earned by Bush, some of it wasn't and was over the top. Obama will have a short honeymoon period before the attacks begin, if it's Hillary expect it from the get go. She manages to bring out the absolute worst in her rivals/opponents. There's times I think that woman could make Republican nun swear, if there is such a thing.

If John McCain wins the WH, the I think a majority or good portion of Democrats will see it as an extension or continuation of the current WH administration. There will be no healing of the current division and much of the anger will be just transferred on to him. I doubt a majority of Americans are going to put up with the Iraq situation much longer and it's like a weight or anchor on the American people. People are in the mood for change, whether that change will be any good, only time will tell.

Then there's one thing that could make it even worse for both sides, more so for the Republicans. If we were to have a repeat of the 2000 election fiasco and the indication of fraud was present. I couldn't imagine how angry Democrats would be if Obama was denied the WH by the same margin that Gore was in 2000 and with same results of incomptency, fraud, etc. It would be bad. Period. I pray who ever wins, does so by a large margin and leaves no doubt.

Not a lot to look forward to, IMO, and I just don't see us fellow Americans playing nice with each other and get along. Just my two cents.

 

[LuvDuke]

I think, "GD America", is controversial. Why is it not?

It's extremely controversial. No one said it wasn't. The argument here is whether or not that was the controversial remarks Obama was referring to here:

For some, nagging questions remain: Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in the church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely, just as I'm sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests or rabbis with which you strongly disagree.

Several here would like to argue (and wishing and hoping) "GD America" was the controversial remark Obama heard while sitting in the pew, but offer no proof.

And that's where we are now.

 

[OceanAnnie]

It's extremely controversial. No one said it wasn't. The argument here is whether or not that was the controversial remarks Obama was referring to here:



Several here would like to argue (and wishing and hoping) "GD America" was the controversial remark Obama heard while sitting in the pew, but offer no proof.

And that's where we are now.

Thanks. I've been checking in now and then and fell behind.

I think that wasn't the only time the preacher stated those things. One could speculate as to whether or not Obama was present for something along the same lines over the course of time. I would say it is a high probability it's been said in many ways, as the minister came across as having very strong beliefs and a strong voice in conveying it.

Similar sentiments were stated by Michele Obama about not being proud to be an American in her adult life (something along those lines). There seems to be a coorelation to me. It is unsettling to me.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

That about says it all.

How can anyone be expected to debate with someone who is going to dismiss the other with claims that their side's points are merely lies?

I know you're more cynical than to buy into what political advisors put out there. Unless of course you think they're all splinters off the true wooden cross.

 

[LuvDuke]

Thanks. I've been checking in now and then and fell behind.

I think that wasn't the only time the preacher stated those things. One could speculate as to whether or not Obama was present for something along the same lines over the course of time. I would say it is a high probability it's been said in many ways, as the minister came across as having very strong beliefs and a strong voice in conveying it.

Similar sentiments were stated by Michele Obama about not being proud to be an American in her adult life (something along those lines). There seems to be a coorelation to me. It is unsettling to me.

It really is all speculation. The NYT ran a Bill Kristol opinion piece that said he had proof that Obama was in the congregation during the "GD America" speech. Bill Kristol had to retract that accusation:

In this column, I cite a report that Sen. Obama had attended services at Trinity Church on July 22, 2007. The Obama campaign has provided information showing that Senator Obama did not attend Trinity that day. I regret the error.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/17/o...?em&ex=1205985600&en=de9d6b3b3cf39e55&ei=5087

As for Michelle Obama, this is what she said:

"For the first time in my adult life, I am really proud of my country because it feels like hope is finally making a comeback."

She has a right to state her feelings and everyone else has a right their opinion as to what she meant. But, honestly, I'm so sick and tired of watching these political campaigns degenerate into nitpicking and accusations and on and on and on.

We've all said stupid things. We've all said things that have come out wrong and were not meant the way they sounded. I don't know if Michelle Obama fits into that group. Maybe she meant exactly what she said. I can't say for certain and neither can anyone else. Nevertheless, we are entitled to our opinions.

 

[OceanAnnie]

As for Michelle Obama, this is what she said:

"For the first time in my adult life, I am really proud of my country because it feels like hope is finally making a comeback."

She has a right to state her feelings and everyone else has a right their opinion as to what she meant. But, honestly, I'm so sick and tired of watching these political campaigns degenerate into nitpicking and accusations and on and on and on.

We've all said stupid things. We've all said things that have come out wrong and were not meant the way they sounded. I don't know if Michelle Obama fits into that group. Maybe she meant exactly what she said. I can't say for certain and neither can anyone else. Nevertheless, we are entitled to our opinions.

That's what I'm wondering. Was it just something stupid she said, or was it common ground she holds with the preacher. I don't think it would be a stretch to see it either way. Unless and until there is more information put forth, we may never know for sure.

ETA- It was a disturbing message from the preacher. At this point, I'm thinking it was said from common ground. My opinion.