Bargains

[Jen D]

As Dean has stated and as has come up before, setting prices is a group is called price fixing and is probably illegal, although I don't know that the Jusitice Department is about to go after people on the DisBoard (although it would certainly be easy now that all threads are archived.)

I don't see why it should offend anyone that a buyer is trying to get the lowest price possible, anymore than it offends me when a seller asks what I consider is too high. It is the nature of a business transaction. If you don't want to sell for 8 a point, than don't do it. But if there is a renter out there able to snag $8 pp, well, more power to them. Everyone here congratulates eachother when you are able to find a low-priced resale-- why should it surprise you when renters are looking for bargains? You can always say no. Most people here testify that when they stick to their guns on $10pp (and the points are not expiring soon) they get the price. But of course people will offer less. That is the nature of a business transaction.

I have also often seen the argument come up that renters shouldn't even know about or talk about points, and that they don't understand a thing about them. What's that about? Knowing the point value of a vacation you need is simple to look up on the point calculator, and it's a simple way to conduct a transaction. Any renter who has done their homework knows that a week in a studio is worth a different amount at different times of year, and they know that in the DVC system this worth is determined by points. Knowing the point value is invaluable in knowing why a studio costs more Christmas week than in the middle of September. Knowing the exact amount you need is a good starting point to know if the person you are renting from can meet your needs at all, before you make them do your homework for you.

For the record, I think $10 pp for non-distressed points is fair, and I'm much too shy to try to talk someone down who has already set their price. That's just me, though. What am I but a smoking in the non-smoking section, leaving my trash in the hall, destroying the property, noisy, thieving renter (I don't know why you're so sure that "renters" -- who are surely a tiny percentage of overall people on dvc property any time-- are responsible for these behaviors that the 60,000 dvc members are so innocent of).

oops, my clear-headed post got not so clear-headed there for a moment. On edit, I saw Captain Midnight's post and it sort of irritated me, I'll admit.

 

[golfnut1264]

do you have any examples of renters treating the room differentl than members...a question to the renters on the board..do youwant to be known as someone who does not take care of the property becuase you are not a member....i dont think so..to me that is very shallow thinking..to think someone will not treat the room the same because they are not a member...i play golf at alot of country clubs that i do not belong to and i would never treat the course differently because i am not member..renting points or selling vacations is good for everyone involved..dvc banks on members renting their points for additional revenue for them and disney as a whole..you think memebrs dont smoke in nonsoking rooms only guests..i enjoy my vacation..i

 

[golfnut1264]

for the record i am an owner not a renter..but renters should not be characterized like they were..i have sold many vacations and i am never worried about somone leaving out the garbage..

 

[DVCPAT]

If DVC put a note on there website about the abuse of resorts/rooms and hinted it could possibly be due to non members, I would see a problem with renting points. I dont think thats the case.

We have such great vacations at Disney, we like to turn other people on to it ( and hope they enjoy it ). Our neighbor took in our dog for two weeks while we were at WDW. It would have cost us a couple hundered dollars to put her in a kennel, we found out they were going to visit FL so we gave them a couple days in a one bedroom.

A co worker continually questioned me why we go to WDW every year. I ended up renting him points and now he's interested in buying a DVC resale ( helps the resale market ).

I think "most" people conform to there surroundings. Thats why the theme parks stay so clean. Just because someone can afford DVC, it does not make them neat and cosiderate. Sometimes just the opposite.

 

[CaptainMidnight]

... I don't know why you're so sure that "renters" -- who are surely a tiny percentage of overall people on dvc property any time-- are responsible for these behaviors that the 60,000 dvc members are so innocent of....

I'm not sure, my humble unsupported opinion is that these behaviors are less likely from someone who has invested $15,000 or much more (2x, 3x, 4x), pays yearly dues for resort upkeep with the potential for them increasing yearly and have made a 40 year commitment. Certainly this does not apply to all renters, and is not intended to. Probably a DVC member stole our belongings at Vero Beach, not a non-member, we don't have any way of knowing.

My opinion is a little renting by members recovering the value of their points is probably a good thing, too much renting by members renting DVC points as a pseudo business venture on a regular basis I don't think is a good thing, but I'm not advocating any sanctions, limitations or otherwise towards those business type ventures, regardless of whether the contract does or doesn't have limitations on renting, just sharing my opinion that it is not in the best interest of DVC members using DVC for family/friend vacations, since the question was raised.

 

[DeeP]

I have never rented my points nor have I ever rented pts from anyone else and I hope I never have to rent my points. I bought my DVC membership to use for my family and friends and we have no problems using all our points every year.
But I must say I agree somewhat with what CaptainMidnight posted. I also do not like the fact that there appears to be some members that seem to have bought their memberships for the purpose of renting out pts and making money from their memberships. That is not what a DVC membership is supposed to be for, it is supposed to be for family and friend vacations, not to be a way to make money.
I also agree with the statement that some, NOT all renters, will not take care of the DVC units the way the members will. I know there are many that rent points that take very good care of the units but there are also those that do not. A DVC member has a vested interest in DVC, a renter does not. Just as there are those that rent a house and do not take care of it the way the owner of a house will. Talk to any landlord and you will be surprised at some of the horror stories you will hear. When something is yours and you own it and have spent a lot of $ on it you tend to take very good care of it vs someone who is there once and will never be back. Again, I am not saying all renters do this but the potential for this happening is greater with someone who is just renting pts vs someone who has put out many thousands of $ to own a membership and continues to put out money every year on dues. If renting of DVC pts increases so does the potential of the above happening also increase.
BTW, I do not understand why any member would say to rent the points for $4.00 but since he did, I want to be on the list of those that will gladly rent pts for that price! That would be $32.00 a night for a studio, $64.00 for a 1 BR, $88.00 for a 2 BR and $144.00 for a GV at OKW during Adventure season (Sun-Thurs) and slightly more for a standard view at the BWV (with the exception of the GV) ! Now, that is a bargain!

 

[alisbarc]

Hello All,

I have been a DVC member since 1998. When I discovered that I could rent points I purchased way more than I could use on the secondary market. Why? I wanted to give them to my kids down the road and knew (or believed) they would be harder to come by later. So, I rent my points very often. To date I have rented to over 10 different individuals. By doing so I have met some very nice people. Even helped one by DVC points himself.

I am not offended at all if someone asks if I will take less. Heck, I shopped around for months before purchasing my DVC resales and I did not offer asking price. Have bought 4 homes in my lifetime and never offered or payed asking price. Seems like the American way to me. I think anything in the $9 - $11 range is fair for both sides. I rent larger point ressies for less per point than smaller point ressies. Takes me the same amount of effort to rent 45 points as it does 345 points. I'd rather rent one 300 point ressie than 5 60 point ressies so I offer a little better price for more points. Just my logic.

In the end, if both renter and rentee are happy with the arrangement than its a winner regardless of what the price per point was.

As for me, I'm just thankful that I can afford to be a DVC member and that this board allows us a venue to rent excess points.

TTFN

PS will be posting 900 more points for rent in 2 - 3 weeks.

 

[CarolMN]

Originally posted by Richyams
Renting DVC points for a non-DVC resort will never be a good deal.

I wouldn't mind the rental rate to fall to dues. $4 per point. People that rent often enough to be angry about the price and offers are probably violating the spirit of the contract they signed when joining. I have no simpathy for them.

I say "Tough luck, and I hope the rental price gets even lower."

I think several of you are missing the point of Rich's post. Those of you who have been around for awhile will know that he has always been against renting points. IIRC, he believes that most owners who rent points make reservationsand rent for only the weekdays and thus "threaten the current point structure". If the price to rent points fell to the cost of dues, no one would make money renting and the practice would stop.

My apologies to Rich if I am the one who missed his point.

 

[CaptainMidnight]

... most owners who rent points make reservationsand rent for only the weekdays and thus "threaten the current point structure".....

Yes, this is consistent with the point I was making in response to a specific inquiry:

Captain - I'm curious. What difference does it make who stays in a DVC room - your family, your friends, my family, my friends, renters, CRO cash customers, etc. Why do you think renting points is not beneficial to members.

It has the potential to threaten the current weekend vs weekday point structure and thus resort accomodation availability for those who have purchased points based on thier predicted vacation patterns.

 

[DeeP]

Carol,
I understood what he meant but he says the same things about DVC members that stay at DVC resorts only on weekdays. Some things will never change, some will never be happy.
But, he made the $4.00 per point suggestion and I am sticking to it. A nice 2 week stay in a 2 BR in Sept at $4.00 per pt would fit in very nicely with my planned Sept trip, and we would stay the weekends also. ONLY KIDDING!!!!!!!!

 

[Disney Doll]

This seems to be a long drawn out discussion for what is a very simple transaction. You are a renter, I am an owner. You want points, I have them. I tell you my price per point and you decide whether or not you can/want to pay that. If you can/want to pay that, we have a deal. If you can't/don't want to pay that, then we don't have a deal. I am certainly not going to try and convince you to pay more for your vacation than you want to, nor do I expect you to try and convince me to charge less for my points than I feel they are worth. It's a business transaction, not a personal one.

 

[CarolMN]

Captain - Thanks for explaining your reasons. I appreciate the time it took to type out those long posts. Can't say I agree with any of your assumptions and since no one has more than anecdotal evidence or opinion to back up his/her opinion (including me), my mind isn't going to change. In God I trust - all others must bring data! (Don't expect you to change your mind either, of course and that's OK with me. Hope it's OK with you, too).

The reason I personally don't believe that renting "threatens the weekday/weekend point structure" is based on my assumption that a large percentage of DVC members also avoid weekends - just like the majority of renters do. Since there are way, way more members than renters, I just can't believe renting makes a significant difference in the DVC usage patterns. One should also keep in mind that CRO charges the same $$ for weekends as weekdays and that weekends are much more popular with the cash paying public than are weekdays.

IMHO, it all balances out and is actually good for those members who like to use their points for non-DVC options. A significant number of members do not want to use their points for weekends and most of the cash paying guests (who make the non-DVC options possible) want to stay weekends. Seems like a good match to me!

Best wishes - Carol

 

[Deb & Bill]

Maybe some of the perceived problems with renters could be resolved with a little education by the owners before they rent. Like making sure the renter has the correct sized unit before making the reservation for them. And filling them in on the trash disposal. And reminding them that if there is any damage to the unit, they will be held responsible. Things like that. Would that be tough to do?

I kind of wish that only owners would get DVC Member on their room key. Unless you show your DVC membership card, you don't get DVC member on your room key. According to DVC documentation, if you rent your points for cash, the renter is not supposed to get DVC Member on their room key. However, if you give your points away and no currency is exchanged, your guest can get DVC Member on the room key.

 

[CaptainMidnight]

....Hope it's OK with you, too....

I'm sorry it's not OK, please change your mind immediately!

 

[CarolMN]

Originally posted by CaptainMidnight
I'm sorry it's not OK, please change your mind immediately!

Please send your supporting data to PayPal. After they have confirmed receipt, I will promptly change my mind!

 

[CaptainMidnight]

CarolMN, nicely done, got a good chuckle out of that one.

 

[fkj2]

I was going to stay out of this one too, but here's my two cents.

Firstly, what people do with their points is their business.


Secondly, my "issue" with potential rentees looking for $8 or less $$$ per point is often the tone of the post; I am frequently left with the feeling after reading some of them that I should subisdize their vacation at WDW.

It seems ridiculous to say that you can "only afford" less than $8 a point; you're going to WaltDisneyWorld, for goodness' sake. There isn't any really "cheap" vacation there unless you don't plan to buy an admission to the theme parks or eat. If money is that tight, many far more affordable hotels are available just off-property.

Just when I decide I won't rent points again, some really nice person contacts me and then I really try to help them out. It's just refreshing that at a time when I can't use my own points, someone sounds thrilled to get the vacation they want at the resort they want at the time they want. To lose that availability, is that worth that extra $1-2/point? Must be.

 

[DBorges]

Hog wash!!!!!!!!!!

My points

My price

My right

The END


25.50 per point firm lmao

 

[CaptainMidnight]

Hog wash.

 

[Deb & Bill]

fkj2 - You said it. That's what bugs me about some of the people wanting to rent points. They want a budget vacation, but they don't even want to think about staying at the All-Stars which they probably could afford with their budget needs. Or some place off site.

When they say, "I want to pay $7 or $8.", I want to laugh. Especially when they are looking at Christmas week or Easter week.

They want all the perks of DVC without making the investment.