airline seat assignments

[ducklite]

We have 4 window seats and 1 middle seat. Do you think it will be easier to trade with that? We only need 2 and 3 together. We're not even going to expect 5 together. Although that would be nice since we are family and booked our airfare back in Sept. 05 and had seats straight across one row.

You can probably get the window next to your center to change for one of the other windows. The others might be harder. The problem is that a high percentage of people traveling in and out of MCO are families and they aren't going to want to be split up either.

Anne

 

[delilah]

Personally, if it were a matter of paying a little more to get seat assignments that were "family friendly", I would do so. Back years ago, when we were first married, airfare to Florida was about $600 for first class, and we didn't pay that much less for coach than what we do now--about $100 per person. Quite frankly, my husband and I earn enough money that $1500-2000 for three tickets isn't going to break us, or make us not take a vacation. But, we might drive instead. Driving takes about 4 days per trip, since we live about a 23 hr drive or so from Florida, depending on where we are going--19 hours to Gainesville, 25 hours to Ft. Myers, where my family lives. We are limited more by needing to extend our vacation by four days than by money. However, for first class tickets on the specific plane we are taking, fare is about $1300 per person, which I am totally unwilling to pay. My hospital wouldn't even reimburse me if I paid that much. For a CME trip I am taking in August, my hospital wanted us to take the absolute cheapest airfare available (which I am not doing--they can reimburse the lesser amount, but, I am paying the difference). So, business travelers are as much to blame as the poor families trying to economically take a vacation, since businesses are not even willing to pay higher airfares for their employees to travel.

 

[ducklite]

There are actually 5 seats to a row. AB are on one side, DEF are on the other. We have two aisle seats and one window seat. Don't expect to get three across. I intend to put my son in 18B, for example, I would sit in 18F. Would see if 18E wouldn't mind switching with 18B (a middle seat for an aisle). Or if 18E is another child close to my son's age (which has happened before), they could sit next to each other. 18B and 18D are directly across the aisle from each other. If 18D wanted to switch for 18F, that would be fine. If nobody wants to trade, then I would take 19B, and let dad take 18F.. (I am much more attentive to my son than dad is. He tends to sleep the entire flight).

Ah! Yes, With two aisles to play with you should be able to do some switching and get at least really close if not right next to each other.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

And if you said something like that to me about my kid, there'd be police coming to break it up.

And hauling YOU off to jail for interfering with the operation of an aircraft. My making a comment like that is not illegal--and no more rude than someone purposely getting their kids worked up because they have to sit a few feet from mommy for a few hours. If your reaction warranted the police to be called, let's just say your vacation would be very ruined--not to mention it would be setting a really nice example for your kids.

Anne

 

[jodifla]

And hauling YOU off to jail for interfering with the operation of an aircraft. My making a comment like that is not illegal--and no more rude than someone purposely getting their kids worked up because they have to sit a few feet from mommy for a few hours. If your reaction warranted the police to be called, let's just say your vacation would be very ruined--not to mention it would be setting a really nice example for your kids.

Anne

You read, and yet you fail to comprehend. You say something that heartless to me on an airplane, and you will get the full force of my words of rage. Does free speech work only for you? Would you want to be next to my sobbing child calling "mommy" for 2 or 3 hours? He's 4, for heaven's sake. He is also developmentally delayed. NO WAY is he not sitting next to me at this age. I don't care if there is some frequent flier who thinks they deserve the best because they fly all the time.

And I don't take Southwest, or Air Tran, now, because of their lack of seat assignments (although I'll take them when I'm traveling alone).

Edited to clarify: I would only get this ticked off if I asked you to move, and you replied, "It sucks being you" as you stated in your earlier statement.

By the way, I practice what I preach. I gave up my aisle seat for a middle seat on an international flight so a mom with a newborn could sit next to her mom.

 

[bicker]

First of all, you don't know me. I would never put anything, even money, before my children. So implying this is horrible.

I'm sorry for the confusion, but I wasn't implying anything. I asked a question. It was a sincere question, since you brought up the issue of the cost.

Second, it's not our fault.

It isn't your personal fault -- very true. If we have to assign "fault" then I suppose it is the fault of price-conscious consumers-in-general. However, I prefer not to assign fault, but just say things are the way they are, and we need to live within the confines of that reality.

This is the reason we went through a TA so we didn't have to worry about everything. I spoke to a manager yesterday at the TAgency and she basicly told me that it was my TA's fault this happened.

Again, that's assuming that there is fault. I would expect that a TA would constantly be looking out for my best interests, but I don't use TAs because I have had very few experiences with them where that was the case.

All I wanted in this thread was some words of encouragement. Now I'm getting things like "Putting safety of your children last".

I'm sorry you were upset by the discussion.

It stinks that this happens but it's not the airline's fault. They are a business and their main goal is to make a profit. A lot of times they downsize flights or change planes to best accommodate travel routes and fuel conservation. People want to pay less for more and it is impossible for the airlines to offer that with the rising cost of everything. Therefore the airlines provide a seat on a plane, but not necessarily the seat of your choice. They will get you to your destination and that is what you are paying for.

Very well said!

 

[ducklite]

You read, and yet you fail to comprehend. You say something that heartless to me on an airplane, and you will get the full force of my words of rage. Does free speech work only for you? Would you want to be next to my sobbing child calling "mommy" for 2 or 3 hours? He's 4, for heaven's sake. He is also developmentally delayed. NO WAY is he not sitting next to me at this age. I don't care if there is some frequent flier who thinks they deserve the best because they fly all the time.

And I don't take Southwest, or Air Tran, now, because of their lack of seat assignments (although I'll take them when I'm traveling alone).

You said the police would be coming to break it up. Wrong, because I'd be ignoring you, and if you made a scene, you would be the one hauled off.

My child has disabilities as well, and the one time that our seats were changed and they couldn't put one of us next to DS, we took the next flight instead. No biggie.

If you can't deal with air travel, you always have the option of driving.

And as a FF, yes, I do deserve the best seats, because frankly if it wasn't for those of us who fly alot, you leisure travelers would be spending a lot more on your tickets.

Anne

 

[jodifla]

And as a FF, yes, I do deserve the best seats, because frankly if it wasn't for those of us who fly alot, you leisure travelers would be spending a lot more on your tickets.

Anne

Well, this says it all, doesn't it! You're superior to all us mere mortals traveling with small children.

 

[ducklite]

Well, this says it all, doesn't it! You're superior to all us mere mortals traveling with small children.

Not what I said at all.

Along the same lines, frequent stay program guests in many hotel chains who achieve a certain status get free upgrades/meals. Do you have a problem with having to pay for your breakfast when someone else might get theirs free?

How about the Disney Best Guest program? They get special incentives--free shipping, special disounts, etc. because they spent more--obviously those costs are passed long to everyone--I suppose you think that's not fair either...

Anne

 

[bicker]

Well, this says it all, doesn't it! You're superior to all us mere mortals traveling with small children.

That's not what Anne said. She said that frequent flyers do deserve the best seats. They do. I'm not a frequent flyer. I don't deserve the best seats. It's that simple.

I am a frequent book purchaser. I deserve the best discounts for purchasing books. I deserve preview sales, where I can buy a book before it is made available to the general public. I deserve these things because my business is more critical to the bookseller's profitability than the average customer. They recognize this, and treat me accordingly. It's prefectly natural. There is no "superiority" involved, no elitism. It is simple business. A business is required to do what will best support its fiduciary responsibilities.

 

[jodifla]

Not what I said at all.

Along the same lines, frequent stay program guests in many hotel chains who achieve a certain status get free upgrades/meals. Do you have a problem with having to pay for your breakfast when someone else might get theirs free?

How about the Disney Best Guest program? They get special incentives--free shipping, special disounts, etc. because they spent more--obviously those costs are passed long to everyone--I suppose you think that's not fair either...

Anne

I would be mad if a hotel told me..."See that guest over there? She's getting your breakfast, because she comes here all the time, even though you paid a pretty penny for your room, too." Or, "We're sorry. That guest gets a bed, because she's a frequent customer. You're over here, on the floor, unworthy one."



Didn't know Disney had a Best Guest program, so wasn't able to be offended about that....

 

[jodifla]

That's not what Anne said. She said that frequent flyers do deserve the best seats. They do. I'm not a frequent flyer. I don't deserve the best seats. It's that simple.

I am a frequent book purchaser. I deserve the best discounts for purchasing books. I deserve preview sales, where I can buy a book before it is made available to the general public. I deserve these things because my business is more critical to the bookseller's profitability than the average customer. They recognize this, and treat me accordingly. It's prefectly natural. There is no "superiority" involved, no elitism. It is simple business. A business is required to do what will best support its fiduciary responsibilities.

Guess what? It's good business to keep small children sitting next to their parents, too.

Or do you want your business rates to skyrocket even more because families stop traveling because of their poor treatment on airlines?

And at my company, NO ONE takes business rates. They make everyone take leisure rates.

 

[ducklite]

I would be mad if a hotel told me..."See that guest over there? She's getting your breakfast, because she comes here all the time, even though you paid a pretty penny for your room, too." Or, "We're sorry. That guest gets a bed, because she's a frequent customer. You're over here, on the floor, unworthy one."

First of all, the airlines are NOT saying to you--that person gets to keep their seat as an inconvenience to you because they fly alot. Frankly the reason someone gets to keep a seat is none of your business--for all you know they are an air marshall REQUIRED to be in an aisle seat.

As far as brand loyalty--

I can with 48 hours notice bump you out of your room at any Hilton property because of my status with them. So I get an upgraded room and free breakfast, along with my guaranteed reservation, and other perks. That's why I stay with them instead of Marriott when I've got the choice. And it's a good business practice for them. They earn many thousands of dollars from me every year.

Did you know that if a flight is oversold, the frequent fliers are the last to be bumped off, even if it means they walked up and bought their ticket an hour before the flight was leaving. So yea, in fact if you bought your tickets six months earlier, they were oversold, and there were no volunteers or non-revs, and you had the cheapest tickets, you are off, like it or not. It's jsut good business practice to take care of those who take care of you by being loyal.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

Guess what? It's good business to keep small children sitting next to their parents, too.

Or do you want your business rates to skyrocket even more because families stop traveling because of their poor treatment on airlines?

And at my company, NO ONE takes business rates. They make everyone take leisure rates.

Trust me, leisure travelers with little kids who fly once every other year on super discounted rates don't have a measurable affect on a carriers bottom line, so your arguement is moot.

Unless you are talking about business or first class, there is no "business rate versus leisure rate". There are a limited number of seats at any price point on any flight. Leisure travelers snap up the ultra low $3.99 fares nine months out when they are first published, because business travelers rarely know their travel plans that far in advance. Business travelers pull from the same rate pool as leisure travelers, but generally as flights get fuller the less expensive tickets are gone, so the business traveler ends up paying a higer fare by default. It doesn't mean they are getting a higher level of accomodation. That is a reward for being a frequent flier. I fly usually twice a month, and it's almost always "leisure" travel. My choice, my dime. I can fly whoever I want, and I choose to fly US Airways 90% of the time. It's most certainly to their advantage to keep me happy. In the case of a business traveler, it's not just their business, but potentially their entire company's business.

Anne

 

[jodifla]

Trust me, leisure travelers with little kids who fly once every other year on super discounted rates don't have a measurable affect on a carriers bottom line, so your arguement is moot.

Unless you are talking about business or first class, there is no "business rate versus leisure rate". There are a limited number of seats at any price point on any flight. Leisure travelers snap up the ultra low $3.99 fares nine months out when they are first published, because business travelers rarely know their travel plans that far in advance. Business travelers pull from the same rate pool as leisure travelers, but generally as flights get fuller the less expensive tickets are gone, so the business traveler ends up paying a higer fare by default. It doesn't mean they are getting a higher level of accomodation. That is a reward for being a frequent flier. I fly usually twice a month, and it's almost always "leisure" travel. My choice, my dime. I can fly whoever I want, and I choose to fly US Airways 90% of the time. It's most certainly to their advantage to keep me happy. In the case of a business traveler, it's not just their business, but potentially their entire company's business.

Anne

Yeah, airlines did so well after 9/11 with just you business travelers flying!!! Hotels were thriving, too, i hear!

And, I am not asking for the best seats in the house. I of course, would like the ones orginally booked, but in the back next to the bathroom would be OK with me, as long as I am next to my child.

 

[bicker]

Guess what? It's good business to keep small children sitting next to their parents, too.

Where's the data that shows that implication? I'm being a bit fascitious -- I know you don't have the data. My point, therefore, is that the airlines do know what is really important to their business, and they do the most they can with their available resources. That evidently does not include disrupting the seat assignments of other passengers to give some sort of priority to "parents with small children".

Or do you want your business rates to skyrocket even more because families stop traveling because of their poor treatment on airlines?

That's a red herring, because poor treatment for discount passengers has been standard practice for many years, and families haven't stopped traveling. Leisure travelers care almost exclusively about low fares.

 

[bicker]

Yeah, airlines did so well after 9/11 with just you business travelers flying!!! Hotels were thriving, too, i hear!

I'm utterly mystified as to what the point being made here was. Could you please clarify what you meant? Thanks.

 

[Lewisc]

That depends on the airline. Some airlines include the fare category or elite status in determining priority in an oversold situation but other airlines base it on the time time you get your BP or the time you show up at the gate.

I'm not 100% sure but I think Delta is one of the carriers that doesn't look at the fare category.

There is actually a logical argument to be made favoring the leisure traveler that's flying on a restricted ticket. That passenger has significant penalties if they don't make their flight so the airline doesn't have as much reason to overbook as a business traveler flying on a fully refundable fare.

I'm lost as to what the argument is over. The poster complaining has a 4 year old and I'm pretty sure most airlines will do whatever is necessary to make sure at least one parent sits next to a passenger under age 5.

This issue comes up with older children who're capable of sitting by themselves.

Did you know that if a flight is oversold, the frequent fliers are the last to be bumped off, even if it means they walked up and bought their ticket an hour before the flight was leaving. So yea, in fact if you bought your tickets six months earlier, they were oversold, and there were no volunteers or non-revs, and you had the cheapest tickets, you are off, like it or not. It's jsut good business practice to take care of those who take care of you by being loyal.

Anne

 

[jodifla]

I'm utterly mystified as to what the point being made here was. Could you please clarify what you meant? Thanks.

I was being sarcastic. Airlines and hotels suffered mightily when the lowly leisure passenger wasn't traveling and only business travelers were left to sustain them.

Remember those good deals at Disney hotels back then?

 

[Lewisc]

I was being sarcastic. Airlines and hotels suffered mightily when the lowly leisure passenger wasn't traveling and only business travelers were left to sustain them.

Remember those good deals at Disney hotels back then?

Actually business travel went way down after 9-11. The great deals at Disney hotels was because the leisure passengers weren't flying.

Disney went so far as to mothball entire resorts, they found even offering deep discounts wasn't enough to fill the resorts.

Some of the financial problems airlines are facing now is the over-reliance on business travelers willingness to pay sky high fares.