what to tell Matron of Honor?

[mjkacmom]

This is to my best understanding of the history behind this: A shower is entirely about gifts. The whole point is to get together and give the bride (in this case) gifts. The bride herself or the MOB can't host because that is asking for gifts for themselves (I guess the MOB is an extension of the bride). A friend, bridesmaid, or more distant relative can host and ask for gifts because they're asking for everyone to get together and give gifts to their friend, niece, cousin, etc. The distance (even if it's slight) matters.

But these days, most of the time the bride to be isn't still living at home with her parents at the time of the shower, so I don't see how having mom pay for the shower is any more if a gift grab than an aunt. A lot of these traditions came about when brides left their parents house fir the first time, and moved in with their husbands. That is no longer the norm.

 

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

I had to give my father in law a cow and a egg laying chicken for my wife. I guess that is what is customary in our region.

 

[nkereina]

I see, but IMO that only makes sense if the bride and groom were going to live with the parents and share all the gifts. It is what it is for sure but I would never think "gift grab" if I got an invite to a shower hosted by the bride's mom, I's just see it for what it is, an invite to the shower that everyone expects her to have anyway.

As PP put it, a shower is meant for people to come together and shower the new bride with gifts. A mother asking everyone to shower their kid with gifts is just as bad.

 

[maddiel]

I have to laugh reading these.

For context, I come from a small town in Canada (in Cape Breton, which will probably only mean something to my fellow Canadians) We will have been married 25 years next month.

It was a long, long standing tradition in my hometown that the family of the bride throws a hall shower or the bride. I grew up being invited to those things. They took place on Sunday afternoon or evening in one of the church halls. Sandwiches and sweets. Card games and perhaps even Bingo with tissue wrapped prizes. Most of them invited half of the women in town, whether they were invited to the wedding or not.

When I got engaged and started delving into wedding culture, I was surprised to learn that these showers were a violation of all the ettiquette ever written. So I said I would not have one. But every weekend I went down to visit, some little old lady who had known me since I was a toddler would see me at the mall or at church or at the grocery store and ask me when my shower was. And they eventually wore me down - how could I disappoint all these little old ladies who looked forward to their plate of sweets and their card games?

So we compromised and scaled it down. My mom and some friends did most of the work, while my MOH (who was from another province and treated he whole thing like an amusing anthropological adventure) and my sister who was my bridesmaid technechally hosted. We invited many of my grandmother's friends and the ladies from church who were not invited to the wedding but who really wanted to come to the shower. We had enough crustless egg sandwiches and lemon squares to feed an army. And I gratefully received lots of small kitchen things (as well as a few rather peculiar gifts....)

One definition of ettiqutte is "the customary code of polite behavior in society or among members of a particular profession or group." We may not have followed the rules as delineated by Emily Post, but we did what the society I was a part of considered customary. And I cared more about the little old ladies' opinions than Emily Post's.

OP - talk to your daughter and to her MOH. Be clear about what your limitations are. I'm sure both of them will appreciate the honesty, becasue misunderstandings about stuff like this help no-one. I'm sure once the MOH understands your position, she'll be able to make appropiate decisions that she can't if she has inappropriate expectations about your contribution.


M.

 

[Pkltm]

Sorry if this has been mentioned, but isn't tradition for the bridesmaids/MOH to throw the shower? In other words, they foot the bill? I've been a bridesmaid twice and a MOH once, and this is how we've always done it. The mother and mother in law didn't contribute financially, but they did make food and baskets for door prizes. The bride also should never contribute OR have a say in the planning - a shower is meant to be put on for you and to "shower" the bride with gifts. The bridesmaids and MOH should plan a shower that fits all the girls' budgets. We had ours at a lovely park lodge, we all made dishes and ordered a sub tray, and we all made baskets as giveaways and I think we each spent about $200.

I am also from Canada and I have never been involved in a wedding that the Bridesmaids paid for the shower unless they are part of the family. The cost just to be in a wedding party are insane. I am a bridesmaid right now and the costs for us are actually fairly low but here is how it is breaking down now:

Dress $85 (thanks goodness)
Shoes $115
Hair and makeup $150
Earrings $35
Mani pedi $75
Shower gift $100
Bachelorette party $250
Wedding gift $400 (have 4 people in my family attending)

Plus we all contributed a dish to the shower (about 35 people) but that was out of kindness not due to expectation.

 

[design_mom]

I really am not trying to get this thread off topic but people keep bringing up the "pay for your plate" concept.

For those used to much more simple weddings, you too are probably effectively paying for your plate. The bride and groom may be spending substantially less to host the event (say in a church hall with no alcohol than an catered 4 course sit down meal with open bar and live band) but the value of the gift seem to go down dramatically as well. It isn't like many people give $250/couple to attend a wedding in a church hall, at least from what I keep reading here.

I am not from a cover-your-plate area. The amount we (me and most people I know, probably not everyone) give has more to do with our relationship to the couple than to the cost of the wedding. I am invited to two weddings in the next few months. In both, my cousins' sons are the grooms. One is likely to be a much fancier/more expensive wedding than the other. I will give the same amount to both couples. My gift is not tied to the cost of the wedding.

 

[Wendy31]

That's pretty rude. Wedding traditions here in the NYC area have remained pretty much unchanged for decades, and many were brought over from previous generations from Italy, Ireland, etc., and have been done the same way longer than most other regions in this country. To call how other cultures celebrate big (and often religious) events tacky is just ignorant.

Hmm... Well, I'll agree that I what I said may not have been very gracious, so I'll apologize. However, I don't think I'm ignorant. I'm well aware (& not ignorant) of how other cultures & subsets of the northeast celebrate big events. I'm not saying that huge, lavish affairs are tacky or rude at all - I've seen some gorgeous weddings & receptions!

What I am saying, however, is that the expectations of some that are hosting (& paying for) some of these events is rude from what I infer from reading some of these many wedding posts on the DIS. Hosting a wedding & expecting your guests to cover the costs is rude. If a guest wants to give a $200-$500 gift, that's absolutely fine & wonderful, but expecting it & thinking the guest is rude if he/she doesn't "pay for the plate" is rude.

Additionally, regardless of whom you ask or consult, it is considered ill-advised & poor manners for the MOB to host her daughter's shower. And I know that many are saying the bride's parents don't host, they finance - But, still, in a way, isn't that saying, "Well, the hostesses can't afford to give my daughter the shower we want her to have, so we'll give them a couple of thousand so the shower will be better & more what she deserves!" Shouldn't the bride be gracious & appreciative of any shower that's given to her & not expect a huge, expensive affair if the hostesses can't afford it?

I understand that some showers are huge w/ many guests, & that's fine. And some are catered events at restaurants, & that's fine too. But, if the hostesses can't afford such an event, that should be fine too.

Lynne, I am not disagreeing with you, maybe your shower experiences have been quite different. I was just stating my own and how long they have been going on and where I attended the showers to give an idea. But also I want to point out that for ME and the people I know, the showers have crossed many ethnicity, mainly Irish, Italian and Polish, and mainly Catholic. these have been in Philly, the Philly suburbs, to NEPA and South Jersey. And the SIL who did not want the shower we all see is as traditional in our family is Jewish so maybe amongst her group it wasnt the norm but it did take all of us by surprise when she said she didnt want one.

I also dont understand how one poster said that our traditions like the moms helping to pay is a gift grab, yet she listed several showers as her experience, why is one a gift grab yet her multiple showers are not. I dont like the name calling of others traditions. If your showers are lower key affairs and that is what works for you and yours then so be it. If they are more elaborate affairs in restaurants then so be it as well.

I say find out what the bride wants, we respected my SIL's wishes even if there was some awkwardness amongst the family and friends...and it all worked out

If you read my post, I said that the guests were different for each shower - except for myself, my mother, & my sister.

In our area/region/whatever you want to call it, it is customary for 2-3 ladies of the church to host a shower for the bride, &, typically (as it was the case in both of my showers), the guests are the other ladies & girls from the church. So I had 2 church showers - one at the church where I grew up & one at the church where my DH grew up. Both were in the fellowship hall of each church, & cake, nuts, mints, & punch were served. At the time I got married, I worked in a small Human Resources Department at a local community college, & I had invited my coworkers (5 other women) to the wedding. I did not ask for a work shower & did not expect one, but one of the women hosted a shower at her home. She served dinner that she had prepared for the 6 of us plus my mother. My coworkers went together & got some of my china, if I remember correctly, a couple of place settings plus a serving dish. My dad's sister & sister-in-law hosted a very small family shower for me at my grandfather's house - seriously very small, it was more like an "aunts & cousins" get together than it was a shower - my 2 aunts, 2 female cousins, my mom, my sister, & my grandfather... LOL! Oh, & my friend (& one of my bridesmaids) hosted a small shower w/ friends at her mother's house. The guest lists didn't cross, &, w/ the exception of the 2 church showers, they were relatively small & low-key. I knew I'd be having a church shower, because, after having grown up in the church, I knew that's what's done, but the other showers (even the one at my DH's church) weren't expected. My mother & I weren't consulted on the planning of any of them, but I did bring a small hostess gift for the hostesses at each.

Additionally, at the time I got married, if you had attended a shower w/ a gift, you didn't necessarily bring a gift to the wedding as well. Some people did, but it wasn't expected. The shower gift was your gift. That's changing a little now.

We had around 250 guests at our wedding. And we didn't leave our wedding w/ thousands of dollars. If we're going by the "pay for your plate" concept, many attended our wedding for free. LOL!

I don't recall reading any post that suggested that having a more modest shower was a breach of etiquette.

Hosting an event within your means is never bad manners. Hosting an event you can't afford and having the cost covered by guests is poor etiquette. And, many would argue (and I personally agree) that the MOB hosting the shower is also poor manners, as it looks like a gift grab. But nowhere does proper etiquette dictate that you must have a $3K shower.

I agree w/ this.

Please. I live in the Northeast and can assure you some of the things I've read in this thread are NOT regional traditions. There's a lot of money in the Northeast (CT, NYC, Long Island, etc) and some of the things I've read suggest some of these showers are part of lavish weddings well beyond a traditional middle class shower. 100 women at a shower? 4 course meals? Thousands of dollars for the shower alone? Unheard of where I live in the Northeast. We're used to park lodge bridal showers, hosted and paid for by the bridesmaids, for $500 or less. But if these people have the money to burn on excessive showers, then more power to them!

Well, that's good to know!

And some of these weddings I've seen are gorgeous! I'm a particular fan of the Viennese Table & wish that particular tradition would be picked up in the South!

 

[mjkacmom]

I am not from a cover-your-plate area. The amount we (me and most people I know, probably not everyone) give has more to do with our relationship to the couple than to the cost of the wedding. I am invited to two weddings in the next few months. In both, my cousins' sons are the grooms. One is likely to be a much fancier/more expensive wedding than the other. I will give the same amount to both couples. My gift is not tied to the cost of the wedding.

Of course the amount has to do with your relationship, even in the tri-state area. I'd give more to my nephew than a co-worker, regardless of the venue. I think most people have an average starting price point for gifts for different celebrations (birthdays, religious sacraments, anniversaries, showers), and then personalize the amount based on your relationship with the person. I'm guessing you are probably giving more than $5, less than $500? That you usually give a particular amount to nieces/nephews?

 

[Dizlvr]

As PP put it, a shower is meant for people to come together and shower the new bride with gifts. A mother asking everyone to shower their kid with gifts is just as bad.

That is your opinion, but its not mine. I don't think it matters who is asking, its all the same to me, but I'm not easily offended.

 

[mjkacmom]

Hmm... Well, I'll agree that I what I said may not have been very gracious, so I'll apologize. However, I don't think I'm ignorant. I'm well aware (& not ignorant) of how other cultures & subsets of the northeast celebrate big events. I'm not saying that huge, lavish affairs are tacky or rude at all - I've seen some gorgeous weddings & receptions!

What I am saying, however, is that the expectations of some that are hosting (& paying for) some of these events is rude from what I infer from reading some of these many wedding posts on the DIS. Hosting a wedding & expecting your guests to cover the costs is rude. If a guest wants to give a $200-$500 gift, that's absolutely fine & wonderful, but expecting it & thinking the guest is rude if he/she doesn't "pay for the plate" is rude.

Additionally, regardless of whom you ask or consult, it is considered ill-advised & poor manners for the MOB to host her daughter's shower. And I know that many are saying the bride's parents don't host, they finance - But, still, in a way, isn't that saying, "Well, the hostesses can't afford to give my daughter the shower we want her to have, so we'll give them a couple of thousand so the shower will be better & more what she deserves!" Shouldn't the bride be gracious & appreciative of any shower that's given to her & not expect a huge, expensive affair if the hostesses can't afford it?

I understand that some showers are huge w/ many guests, & that's fine. And some are catered events at restaurants, & that's fine too. But, if the hostesses can't afford such an event, that should be fine too.

No one expects a certain amount. Well, maybe those in other areas who try to throw a NYC wedding, and don't understand the culture. And trust me, bridesmaids are THRILLED when the MOB offers to cover the cost of the shower! There are so many expenses involved as it is at these weddings. Since showers are typically somewhat expensive events to hold, it stands to reason that most know the bridal party did not cover the whole cost, and that's fine for all involved. I can't understand why someone not even involved in these showers (as a host, participant, or guest) would have an issue with how things work here.

If someone hosted a shower, and offered up only cake and punch, it would be considered a bit odd here, but if that's the norm elsewhere, so be it. For many decades, before the internet, there were people who had no idea that weddings were so lavish some places, and people had no idea that weddings were so simple other places. MYOB. As an outsider looking it, it's rude to judge what is the norm for certain cultures, especially if it hurts no one.

 

[rwdavis2]

I don't think I've ever heard of a shower with that many people invited.

Or held in a restaurant. For all the showers my wife has attended or held $500 could pay for 2 or more events. The whole thing sounds out of hand.

 

[NewRVLady]

Can we talk bachelor and bachelorettes?
My son and his bride to be each are flying to theirs- another cost

 

[shoney]

Can we talk bachelor and bachelorettes?
My son and his bride to be each are flying to theirs- another cost

My niece is 27 and has been a bridesmaid twice recently. The bachelorette parties were trips to Cancun.

 

[Mkrop]

Additionally, regardless of whom you ask or consult, it is considered ill-advised & poor manners for the MOB to host her daughter's shower. And I know that many are saying the bride's parents don't host, they finance - But, still, in a way, isn't that saying, "Well, the hostesses can't afford to give my daughter the shower we want her to have, so we'll give them a couple of thousand so the shower will be better & more what she deserves!" Shouldn't the bride be gracious & appreciative of any shower that's given to her & not expect a huge, expensive affair if the hostesses can't afford it?

I understand that some showers are huge w/ many guests, & that's fine. And some are catered events at restaurants, & that's fine too. But, if the hostesses can't afford such an event, that should be fine too.




!

I tried to quote the part where you said many of the guests didnt overlap, and with mine only a few guests overlapped and those did not bring a second gift. My bridesmaid attended both and gave us one gift at shower #1. But once again I dont understand how it is a gift grab, whether it is 4 showers of 25 people let's say with different people or one shower with 100.

And what may be considered ill advised and poor manners is just not the case around here, minus a few other posters experiences. I had a two showers 20 years ago that my mom helped finance and the other my MIL paid for with her family and friends. All the weddings I have been a bridesmaid in including one last month, included the moms chipping in to cover the cost of the venue since so many of the girls were young and just starting out. This is quite the norm around here that I am aware and since you are usually bringing together two different families you would think if this was such an ill advised practice that many of the family members would have balked.

I just dont like the name calling of different practices as poor manners/gift grabs/money to burn etc. As many posted here it is quite acceptable and therefore should not be scrutinized. You can share your differences without criticizing the other.

 

[Wendy31]

No one expects a certain amount. Well, maybe those in other areas who try to throw a NYC wedding, and don't understand the culture. And trust me, bridesmaids are THRILLED when the MOB offers to cover the cost of the shower! There are so many expenses involved as it is at these weddings. Since showers are typically somewhat expensive events to hold, it stands to reason that most know the bridal party did not cover the whole cost, and that's fine for all involved. I can't understand why someone not even involved in these showers (as a host, participant, or guest) would have an issue with how things work here.

If someone hosted a shower, and offered up only cake and punch, it would be considered a bit odd here, but if that's the norm elsewhere, so be it. For many decades, before the internet, there were people who had no idea that weddings were so lavish some places, and people had no idea that weddings were so simple other places. MYOB. As an outsider looking it, it's rude to judge what is the norm for certain cultures, especially if it hurts no one.

I'm sure the bridesmaids *are* thrilled when the MOB offers to cover the cost of the shower! LOL!

I'm not judging the norm. If you read my post, I said that I've seen some gorgeous lavish weddings & have no problem w/ huge weddings or showers. I stand by my opinion, however, that expecting your guests to cover the costs of these huge events is not nice. And, if you consult any wedding etiquette expert, the MOB should not host a shower.

But thanks for the polite MYOB. I feel properly chastised.

 

[Mkrop]

So I guess all of us over here have no etiquette...who knew lol sigh!

I think the OP should sit down with the MOH and see what the thoughts are, despite the norm of having it in a restaurant, country club etc around here if it was held at someone's home with some finger foods and cake, I would not blink an eye. I am hoping they are all doing what they can afford. My SIL's was nice although cramped, but bc of what the norm for our family and friends was, my mom stepped up and offered to have it at a different location or offered to host a second shower. It was declined. Now her and her friends seemed to have an issue with it and when I mentioned it to my own MIL she was shocked as well (NEPA) so maybe for some of them it was a generational thing where they invite all the woman esp ones who have invited them to their children's showers in the past. And my mom has been to tons of showers bridal and baby for her friends' kids.

 

[mjkacmom]

I'm sure the bridesmaids *are* thrilled when the MOB offers to cover the cost of the shower! LOL!

I'm not judging the norm. If you read my post, I said that I've seen some gorgeous lavish weddings & have no problem w/ huge weddings or showers. I stand by my opinion, however, that expecting your guests to cover the costs of these huge events is not nice. And, if you consult any wedding etiquette expert, the MOB should not host a shower.

But thanks for the polite MYOB. I feel properly chastised.

Shay you are clearly not understanding is that no one expects guests to cover the cost of anything - not all all! I don't know of anyone who used the gifts received to pay for the bill for the party. Most folks host events they can afford, and could give a rats butt who gives what.this is something made up by outsiders.

 

[Wendy31]

I tried to quote the part where you said many of the guests didnt overlap, and with mine only a few guests overlapped and those did not bring a second gift. My bridesmaid attended both and gave us one gift at shower #1. But once again I dont understand how it is a gift grab, whether it is 4 showers of 25 people let's say with different people or one shower with 100.

And what may be considered ill advised and poor manners is just not the case around here, minus a few other posters experiences. I had a two showers 20 years ago that my mom helped finance and the other my MIL paid for with her family and friends. All the weddings I have been a bridesmaid in including one last month, included the moms chipping in to cover the cost of the venue since so many of the girls were young and just starting out. This is quite the norm around here that I am aware and since you are usually bringing together two different families you would think if this was such an ill advised practice that many of the family members would have balked.

I just dont like the name calling of different practices as poor manners/gift grabs/money to burn etc. As many posted here it is quite acceptable and therefore should not be scrutinized. You can share your differences without criticizing the other.

I understand what you're saying.

I will say that, when these wedding & shower threads come up as they do on the DIS, the cake & punch showers (& even weddings) in the fellowship halls have been criticized as well & some have said, "That would be considered very tacky here." So it goes both ways.

And maybe we should all agree to disagree.

Huge showers are the norm in some areas, & that's fine. But, if the hostesses can't afford the huge shower w/ a sit-down meal, that should be fine too. Back to the OP, the MOB should not be expected to finance her daughter's shower. It appears that the MOH is planning a large shower for 75-100 people at a restaurant, & we don't know whether or not she is expecting funds from the MOB or not and/or whether or not she (along w/ the other bridesmaids) can afford the shower she's planning - the OP is not clear herself on those details. All I'm saying is that, as the hostess of a shower, I think you should plan the event you can afford & that the bride should be appreciative of that.

If you also read my initial post, I suggested that, since the OP (the MOB) has not contributed to the cost of the wedding yet, if she wanted, she could offer the $500 to either her DD for the wedding or to the MOH for the shower.

 

[Mkrop]

I understand what you're saying.

I will say that, when these wedding & shower threads come up as they do on the DIS, the cake & punch showers (& even weddings) in the fellowship halls have been criticized as well & some have said, "That would be considered very tacky here." So it goes both ways.

And maybe we should all agree to disagree.

Huge showers are the norm in some areas, & that's fine. But, if the hostesses can't afford the huge shower w/ a sit-down meal, that should be fine too. Back to the OP, the MOB should not be expected to finance her daughter's shower. It appears that the MOH is planning a large shower for 75-100 people at a restaurant, & we don't know whether or not she is expecting funds from the MOB or not and/or whether or not she (along w/ the other bridesmaids) can afford the shower she's planning - the OP is not clear herself on those details. All I'm saying is that, as the hostess of a shower, I think you should plan the event you can afford & that the bride should be appreciative of that.

If you also read my initial post, I suggested that, since the OP (the MOB) has not contributed to the cost of the wedding yet, if she wanted, she could offer the $500 to either her DD for the wedding or to the MOH for the shower.

I would point out the different way we have weddings here vs there but I would never call their celebration tacky. I will repeat, because I dont care if it goes both ways, it doesnt make it right, I dont like the name calling of gift grab etc. It is more rude to criticize the differences than a MOB helping to pay for an event IMHO.

 

[nkereina]

I am also from Canada and I have never been involved in a wedding that the Bridesmaids paid for the shower unless they are part of the family. The cost just to be in a wedding party are insane. I am a bridesmaid right now and the costs for us are actually fairly low but here is how it is breaking down now:

Dress $85 (thanks goodness)
Shoes $115
Hair and makeup $150
Earrings $35
Mani pedi $75
Shower gift $100
Bachelorette party $250
Wedding gift $400 (have 4 people in my family attending)

Plus we all contributed a dish to the shower (about 35 people) but that was out of kindness not due to expectation.

Must be a Canadian thing then. Weddings ARE expensive, and here in the US, it should include chipping in on the cost of the shower as well. Something to consider before saying yes to being a bridesmaid. Must be differing country customs.

That is your opinion, but its not mine. I don't think it matters who is asking, its all the same to me, but I'm not easily offended.

It's not my opinion though, it's proper etiquette. If you check traditions and etiquette in any wedding book or any wedding web site, it will in fact say it's bad form for the MOB to pay for and host the shower. I probably wouldn't be offended as a guest either. But as a bride, I also wouldn't want to be walking the line of proper etiquette.

At a minimum, have the bridesmaids host and organize the shower but maybe have mom pick up the tab behind the scenes if the bridesmaids can't afford it. It for sure shouldn't be outwardly hosted by MOB though.